My Response to AT&T Data Caps

Golgatha

Lifer
Jul 18, 2003
12,685
1,606
126
Congressman Cleaver,

I would like to draw your attention to the following article.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/josh-levy/atts-desperate-shot-at-ne_b_837162.html

In summary, AT&T is going to begin capping Internet usage on their U-Verse network to 250GB of total bandwidth per month. This is in line with what Comcast has already done, and what Time Warner Cable (the only other competitor to U-Verse in my neighborhood) is most likely thinking about doing. I dropped my Time Warner Cable service because they were using traffic shaping technologies which interfered with my legal usage of the Internet (e.g. using an embedded Bittorrent client to download the files needed to install the game Starcraft 2, which was legally digitally purchased from Blizzard's B.Net service), which is essentially in conflict with the term net neutrality we have been hearing a lot about lately.

I am one of the 98% of users AT&T claims this bandwidth capping will not effect, as I typically do not currently use 250GB worth of bandwidth per month. However, my concern is these bandwidth caps will stifle innovation on the Internet and give AT&T a virtual monopoly in the pushed content industry. If HD streaming of video takes off, companies like Netflix and other successful entrepreneurs (e.g. Hulu, YouTube, etc) will be at a severe competitive disadvantage when compared to AT&T, even though the Netflix subscriber has already paid for the privilege of sending data across AT&T's network. A Bluray quality movie, if streamed digitally, can eat up anywhere between 10-50GB of bandwidth in an hour for example. However, I am certain AT&T's video on demand service, which utilizes the exact same network and protocols, will be "duty free" so to speak when streaming this video across AT&T's network because it is a "video" application (again let's not forget it's all just data streaming via the TCP/IP protocol). I am also sure the music services, etc. will all be "duty free" if purchased as part of AT&T's U-Verse IPTV packages.

As a consumer these data caps don't necessarily make me want to subscribe to U-Verse, as my wife and I don't watch much TV, and we don't want 100 channels we will never watch just to get a few that we might for $100+ a month. However, streaming individual shows in an on-demand type of setup is very convenient and currently a cheaper a'la carte option our household budget can afford. I am currently also not a Netflix subscriber, and if these data caps are put into place I likely never will be due to the added charges associated with the increased bandwidth usage, as I also purchase full games through a service called Steam (steampowered.com) and streaming video content added onto the bandwidth required for Online gaming and downloading legally purchased games would put even me over the limits AT&T et. al. are imposing.

Congressman Cleaver, I ask that you take my arguments against imposing bandwidth caps on consumers very seriously, as the health of our economy and the limitation of consumer choices for high bandwidth Online applications are at stake in the future if action is not taken now. If bandwidth caps, which don't cost AT&T hardly anything to remove as the physical infrastructure is already in place (and subsidized by the Universal Service Fund no less), are put in place, the only winner will be AT&T and basically everyone else (you, me, and all your constituents) lose.


I think it's about high time all us tech savy people started taking action. I want my kids to enjoy the "full Internet" when they're my age, and this type of BS needs to stop!
 

Nebor

Lifer
Jun 24, 2003
29,582
12
76
If you think your representative is going to understand even the vaguest idea about what you're trying to say, you're wrong. I'm guessing none of his staff will either.
 

JTsyo

Lifer
Nov 18, 2007
11,774
919
126
Think the key point is that the cable providers are setting themselves up to be ahead of the game for streaming media. It's kind of like vertical integration for production, they are using their position in one industry (internet provider) to provide an advantage in another (TV).
 

airdata

Diamond Member
Jul 11, 2010
4,987
0
0
Devils advocate : From a business stand point, it makes sense to have tiered billing. 250gb is far from the end of the world. Unless you're online 24/7 downloading torrents and streaming stuff.

I know they love the people who use next to no bandwidth but still pay the same monthly fees. My parents for example have the same 30Mbps/30Mbps connection I do. They only check email and surf the internet though.

/devils advocate

Having said that... it actually doesn't make too much sense to meter stuff since there are likely a ton of people like my parents who pay for identical packages and yet use no bandwidth. it evens out between users to some extent.
 

Ninjahedge

Diamond Member
Mar 2, 2005
4,149
1
91
One of two things need to be done, in all fairness.

Either a usage fee for subscribed services is imposed on things like Netflix and Hulu, both high BW services that make money off of that usage, or reasonable fees imposed bast that bandwidth that would apply to ALL services used.

IOW, if you (me as well) want to avoid paying $50 a month for a bunch of channels you never use and decide to start streaming on more than a casual basis, then we should pay for that increased usage through a public pay structure.

Either Netflix starts paying the backbon provider (hard to do on their end because they will be streaming over several) OR the provider charges everyone regardless of whether it is in house or not.

I do not like the fact that this will probably mean more $$ out of my pocket for the same stuff, but it seems like the easiest fair way of doing this would be to put the ATT/Verizon streaming in the same paid boat as Hulu/Netflix....
 

rudder

Lifer
Nov 9, 2000
19,441
86
91
I am leaving AT&T anyway.... bastards silently changed my plan upload speed to 512kbps.
 

Macamus Prime

Diamond Member
Feb 24, 2011
3,108
0
0
In the end, it's about how much money a corportation in the USA can make. And, if it means you have to pay for every little think in your life,... so be it.

America is a Plutocracy, not a Democracy.
 
Oct 20, 2005
10,978
44
91
Congressman Cleaver,

I would like to draw your attention to the following article.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/josh-levy/atts-desperate-shot-at-ne_b_837162.html

In summary, AT&T is going to begin capping Internet usage on their U-Verse network to 250GB of total bandwidth per month. This is in line with what Comcast has already done, and what Time Warner Cable (the only other competitor to U-Verse in my neighborhood) is most likely thinking about doing. I dropped my Time Warner Cable service because they were using traffic shaping technologies which interfered with my legal usage of the Internet (e.g. using an embedded Bittorrent client to download the files needed to install the game Starcraft 2, which was legally digitally purchased from Blizzard's B.Net service), which is essentially in conflict with the term net neutrality we have been hearing a lot about lately.

I am one of the 98% of users AT&T claims this bandwidth capping will not effect, as I typically do not currently use 250GB worth of bandwidth per month. However, my concern is these bandwidth caps will stifle innovation on the Internet and give AT&T a virtual monopoly in the pushed content industry. If HD streaming of video takes off, companies like Netflix and other successful entrepreneurs (e.g. Hulu, YouTube, etc) will be at a severe competitive disadvantage when compared to AT&T, even though the Netflix subscriber has already paid for the privilege of sending data across AT&T's network. A Bluray quality movie, if streamed digitally, can eat up anywhere between 10-50GB of bandwidth in an hour for example. However, I am certain AT&T's video on demand service, which utilizes the exact same network and protocols, will be "duty free" so to speak when streaming this video across AT&T's network because it is a "video" application (again let's not forget it's all just data streaming via the TCP/IP protocol). I am also sure the music services, etc. will all be "duty free" if purchased as part of AT&T's U-Verse IPTV packages.

As a consumer these data caps don't necessarily make me want to subscribe to U-Verse, as my wife and I don't watch much TV, and we don't want 100 channels we will never watch just to get a few that we might for $100+ a month. However, streaming individual shows in an on-demand type of setup is very convenient and currently a cheaper a'la carte option our household budget can afford. I am currently also not a Netflix subscriber, and if these data caps are put into place I likely never will be due to the added charges associated with the increased bandwidth usage, as I also purchase full games through a service called Steam (steampowered.com) and streaming video content added onto the bandwidth required for Online gaming and downloading legally purchased games would put even me over the limits AT&T et. al. are imposing.

Congressman Cleaver, I ask that you take my arguments against imposing bandwidth caps on consumers very seriously, as the health of our economy and the limitation of consumer choices for high bandwidth Online applications are at stake in the future if action is not taken now. If bandwidth caps, which don't cost AT&T hardly anything to remove as the physical infrastructure is already in place (and subsidized by the Universal Service Fund no less), are put in place, the only winner will be AT&T and basically everyone else (you, me, and all your constituents) lose.


I think it's about high time all us tech savy people started taking action. I want my kids to enjoy the "full Internet" when they're my age, and this type of BS needs to stop!

Bad grammar there. Consider rephrasing it. I'm talking about the double "which" fragments.
 

brandonb

Diamond Member
Oct 17, 2006
3,731
2
0
What does a congressman who serves the public have anything to do with a private business?
 

rcpratt

Lifer
Jul 2, 2009
10,433
110
116
My response to AT&T's data caps is: Suck on my unlimited Verizon 4G LTE for $30/mo, bitches.
 

Nebor

Lifer
Jun 24, 2003
29,582
12
76
In the end, it's about how much money a corportation in the USA can make. And, if it means you have to pay for every little think in your life,... so be it.

America is a Plutocracy, not a Democracy.

Nothing in life is free. Grow up.
 

BurnItDwn

Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
26,127
1,604
126
Devils advocate : From a business stand point, it makes sense to have tiered billing. 250gb is far from the end of the world. Unless you're online 24/7 downloading torrents and streaming stuff.

I know they love the people who use next to no bandwidth but still pay the same monthly fees. My parents for example have the same 30Mbps/30Mbps connection I do. They only check email and surf the internet though.

/devils advocate

Having said that... it actually doesn't make too much sense to meter stuff since there are likely a ton of people like my parents who pay for identical packages and yet use no bandwidth. it evens out between users to some extent.

Actually, with an 18mbit line, you download at about 1.8megabytes per sec, that means you can burn through 250gb in 38 hours. 720 hours in a month.

so no, not "24/7 downloading"
More like downloading 5% of the time at max speed.

Unless you think 5% is the same as 100%.....
 

nboy22

Diamond Member
Jul 18, 2002
3,304
1
81
I'm willing to bet that if you were to get a response, it'd probably go a little something like this, "The internet is a series of tubes. If the data caps are set too high, we will clog the tubes and the internet will get stuck. The internet is not just something you throw stuff into."
 

Eos

Diamond Member
Jun 14, 2000
3,473
16
81
Devils advocate : From a business stand point, it makes sense to have tiered billing. 250gb is far from the end of the world. Unless you're online 24/7 downloading torrents and streaming stuff.

I know they love the people who use next to no bandwidth but still pay the same monthly fees. My parents for example have the same 30Mbps/30Mbps connection I do. They only check email and surf the internet though.

/devils advocate

Having said that... it actually doesn't make too much sense to meter stuff since there are likely a ton of people like my parents who pay for identical packages and yet use no bandwidth. it evens out between users to some extent.

Doesn't ATT&T state that 2% of their users consume 60% of the bandwidth?

There's got to be a way (with math) to show that the 2% aren't ruining the experience for the other 98%.
 

OCGuy

Lifer
Jul 12, 2000
27,227
36
91
I have 2 avid gamers in the house, my woman streams Netflix to her iPad, and I stream TV shows from Netflix to my Wii and Xbox on a regular basis. I also download Steam games when the AAA titles pop up. I have never even gotten close to 250GB.

250B most likely means you are stealing somebody's IP, sorry.


Maybe for those people who feel the need to download 1TB for the same price I use 100GB/mo....they could allow packet sniffing by the ISPs to see what they are up to. Somehow I doubt the pirates want that though.
 

Squisher

Lifer
Aug 17, 2000
21,207
66
91
If you think your representative is going to understand even the vaguest idea about what you're trying to say, you're wrong. I'm guessing none of his staff will either.
Yeah, if you could quantify it by the number of porn videos they'll be limited to a day it might be easier to digest.
 

Phanuel

Platinum Member
Apr 25, 2008
2,304
2
0
I'm willing to bet that if you were to get a response, it'd probably go a little something like this, "The internet is a series of tubes. If the data caps are set too high, we will clog the tubes and the internet will get stuck. The internet is not just something you throw stuff into."

Yes, but if we do enough horse race betting we can clear up those pipes no problem.
 
Oct 19, 2000
17,861
4
81
I don't particularly have a problem with these large bandwidth limits since they are absurdly high and any normal user will never hit them. My problem comes with the thought that this is just the beginning and that, in the future, these companies will start to slowly come down on these caps until they do become an issue.
 

spidey07

No Lifer
Aug 4, 2000
65,469
5
76
I don't particularly have a problem with these large bandwidth limits since they are absurdly high and any normal user will never hit them. My problem comes with the thought that this is just the beginning and that, in the future, these companies will start to slowly come down on these caps until they do become an issue.

The plan is to get you accustomed to caps and a pay for use model. Once acclimated to this we can then increase revenue from usage as customers try to avoid the costs of "free" video. Eitherway, we'll get that money because we know you just can't live without your precious internet. What are you going to do? Put an antenna on your TV? HAH! We know you can't live like that and simply must have your "free" on-demand video.

Good thing is we've got plenty of lobbyists working hard in the capital with tons of face time with lawmakers. We've convinced them this is necessary to prevent broadband costs from increasing. You know what? They bought it!
 

jacc1234

Senior member
Sep 3, 2005
392
0
0
One of two things need to be done, in all fairness.
Either Netflix starts paying the backbon provider (hard to do on their end because they will be streaming over several) OR the provider charges everyone regardless of whether it is in house or not.

You realize that Netflix and others already do this by contracting out to CDN's like level3 right? The data gets dropped basically at the ISP's doorstep and they just handle last mile delivery.
 

FuzzyDunlop

Diamond Member
Jan 30, 2008
3,261
12
81
If you think your representative is going to understand even the vaguest idea about what you're trying to say, you're wrong. I'm guessing none of his staff will either.

Agreed. You need a summary of your summary.
 
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