My software vendor tech support is telling me virtual memory = total system memory.

[cjchaps]

At work I help support a really expensive reporting software package. If I don't know the answer, we can call up the software vendors because we pay for their support. We are having issues dealing with memory, and here is a quote from one of the emails they sent me on this subject:

Virtual Memory is the total amount of memory on a machine (it includes the physical Memory RAM as well as the Page File).

Oh well, don't you just love tech support.

 

[pulse8]

How can it be virtual if it's physical?

 

[cjchaps]

I'll have to ask them that next time I talk to them.

Originally posted by: pulse8
How can it be virtual if it's physical?

 

[Argo]

Technically he's right, he just could've put it better. Virtual memory is total memory available to your programs, it's the total of physical memory and your page file.

 

[pulse8]

Originally posted by: Argo
Technically he's right, he just could've put it better. Virtual memory is total memory available to your programs, it's the total of physical memory and your page file.

I was under the impression that the pagefile and virtual memory are one in the same.

When I change the virtual memory setting in XP, it has nothing to do with physical RAM.

If you have physical RAM it's no longer virtual memory because it's actual memory.

 

[Mookow]

They are getting paid big bucks to tell me this.

More likely you are paying someone big money to hire them to tell you that. Most tech support doesnt get good $$ at all.

 

[Argo]

Originally posted by: pulse8

Originally posted by: Argo
Technically he's right, he just could've put it better. Virtual memory is total memory available to your programs, it's the total of physical memory and your page file.

I was under the impression that the pagefile and virtual memory are one in the same.

When I change the virtual memory setting in XP, it has nothing to do with physical RAM.

If you have physical RAM it's no longer virtual memory because it's actual memory.

Nope, virtual memory is everything. Page file is part of virtual memory. All programs work with virtual memory. Windows determines whether the data is stored in pagefile or in physical memory. Think of it that way - memory accessible by programs is on page file, and RAM is used as cache, where most frequently accessed pages are held.

 

[pulse8]

Originally posted by: Argo

Originally posted by: pulse8

Originally posted by: Argo
Technically he's right, he just could've put it better. Virtual memory is total memory available to your programs, it's the total of physical memory and your page file.

I was under the impression that the pagefile and virtual memory are one in the same.

When I change the virtual memory setting in XP, it has nothing to do with physical RAM.

If you have physical RAM it's no longer virtual memory because it's actual memory.

Nope, virtual memory is everything. Page file is part of virtual memory. All programs work with virtual memory. Windows determines whether the data is stored in pagefile or in physical memory. Think of it that way - memory accessible by programs is on page file, and RAM is used as cache, where most frequently accessed pages are held.

I still think you're wrong.

 

[Argo]

Originally posted by: pulse8

Originally posted by: Argo

Originally posted by: pulse8

Originally posted by: Argo
Technically he's right, he just could've put it better. Virtual memory is total memory available to your programs, it's the total of physical memory and your page file.

I was under the impression that the pagefile and virtual memory are one in the same.

When I change the virtual memory setting in XP, it has nothing to do with physical RAM.

If you have physical RAM it's no longer virtual memory because it's actual memory.

Nope, virtual memory is everything. Page file is part of virtual memory. All programs work with virtual memory. Windows determines whether the data is stored in pagefile or in physical memory. Think of it that way - memory accessible by programs is on page file, and RAM is used as cache, where most frequently accessed pages are held.

I still think you're wrong.

In what way? I took OS design class in college and this is what they taught us.

 

[PingSpike]

Originally posted by: Argo

Originally posted by: pulse8

Originally posted by: Argo
Technically he's right, he just could've put it better. Virtual memory is total memory available to your programs, it's the total of physical memory and your page file.

I was under the impression that the pagefile and virtual memory are one in the same.

When I change the virtual memory setting in XP, it has nothing to do with physical RAM.

If you have physical RAM it's no longer virtual memory because it's actual memory.

Nope, virtual memory is everything. Page file is part of virtual memory. All programs work with virtual memory. Windows determines whether the data is stored in pagefile or in physical memory. Think of it that way - memory accessible by programs is on page file, and RAM is used as cache, where most frequently accessed pages are held.

I think thats total memory or something. Virtual memory, by definition can't include actual memory. But then again, we are dealing with the industry that thought 4 colors was enough to call their new adaptor the Color Graphics Adaptor.

 

[dighn]

All virtual memory means is an virtual address space as opposed to a physical address space. It's simply a way of mapping memory addresses. So it does include physical memory and paged memory. This is the true technical meaning.

but I suppose the other meaning is accepted as well

 

[CPA]

So, did the OP get pwned? I'm quit lost in this discussion.

 

[pulse8]

Originally posted by: Argo

Originally posted by: pulse8

Originally posted by: Argo

Originally posted by: pulse8

Originally posted by: Argo
Technically he's right, he just could've put it better. Virtual memory is total memory available to your programs, it's the total of physical memory and your page file.

I was under the impression that the pagefile and virtual memory are one in the same.

When I change the virtual memory setting in XP, it has nothing to do with physical RAM.

If you have physical RAM it's no longer virtual memory because it's actual memory.

Nope, virtual memory is everything. Page file is part of virtual memory. All programs work with virtual memory. Windows determines whether the data is stored in pagefile or in physical memory. Think of it that way - memory accessible by programs is on page file, and RAM is used as cache, where most frequently accessed pages are held.

I still think you're wrong.

In what way? I took OS design class in college and this is what they taught us.

By definition, virtual memory can't be a physical memory. You have virtual memory (paging file because it acts like RAM) and physical memory.

I also stand by my comment that no where in Windows does it lump the two together. When you go to the virtual memory box in advanced tab of the performance settings it mentions NOTHING of physical memory, but only virtual memory and a paging file.

 

[pulse8]

Originally posted by: dighn
All virtual memory means is an virtual address space as opposed to a physical address space. It's simply a way of mapping memory addresses. So it does include physical memory and paged memory. This is the true technical meaning.

So in a way, we're both right.

Although, I base my definition on Windows' definition.

 

[dighn]

Originally posted by: pulse8

Originally posted by: dighn
All virtual memory means is an virtual address space as opposed to a physical address space. It's simply a way of mapping memory addresses. So it does include physical memory and paged memory. This is the true technical meaning.

So in a way, we're both right.

Although, I base my definition on Windows' definition.

yeah I guess it's just one of those things... like kilobyte = 1000 and 1024

 

[skace]

As far as Windows is concerned you can set "Virtual Memory" to 0 and still run off of physical memory. So if the vendor is referring to Windows, he is on crack.

 

[LordSnailz]

I believe Argo is right -- virtual memory includes the RAM and HD memory. Virtual memory is called virtual because each program sees the total RAM and HD memory to them, no one else is using the memory, but in reality the amt. of available memory is a lot less, hence virtual memory.

 

[Argo]

Originally posted by: skace
As far as Windows is concerned you can set "Virtual Memory" to 0 and still run off of physical memory. So if the vendor is referring to Windows, he is on crack.

I think in windows you're controlling size of the page file, as opposed to virtual memory. They use the term virtual memory on the tab, but that's incorrect.

 

[skace]

Originally posted by: LordSnailz
I believe Argo is right -- virtual memory includes the RAM and HD memory. Virtual memory is called virtual because each program sees the total RAM and HD memory to them, no one else is using the memory, but in reality the amt. of available memory is a lot less, hence virtual memory.

Yes, but speaking strictly windows, I can view the exact ammount of virtual memory an application is using as well as the ammount of physical memory. And I can tell virtual memory isn't a total because my virtual memory useage on several applications is actually lower than my physical memory useage.

 

[skace]

Originally posted by: Argo

Originally posted by: skace
As far as Windows is concerned you can set "Virtual Memory" to 0 and still run off of physical memory. So if the vendor is referring to Windows, he is on crack.

I think in windows you're controlling size of the page file, as opposed to virtual memory. They use the term virtual memory on the tab, but that's incorrect.

Yes but if you are discussing windows with a vendor and they start talking about virtual memory then they should know what they are referring to. If they are referring to total possible memory, why wouldn't they state total memory?

Windows calls it both the paging file(s) and virtual memory. Virtual Memory, in windows case, would be the sum of the paging files.

 

[Cattlegod]

each program in windows gets 2^32 bits of virtual memory. now, that memory can be stored in ram on on the HD

 

[skace]

Oooh, I was wrong to a degree. *hides*

 

[Mr.IncrediblyBored]

Given the amount of discussion in this very thread, it appears your tech support folks are partially absolved of their ignorance. It seems like an easily confused subject. Even the definition in the Windows help isn't very clear.

Temporary storage used by a computer to run programs that need more memory than it has. For example, programs could have access to 4 gigabytes of virtual memory on a computer's hard drive, even if the computer has only 32 megabytes of RAM. The program data that does not currently fit in the computer's memory is saved into paging files.

See also paging file; RAM.

 

[cjchaps]

The tech support folks are working with Windows 2000 here, so I still consider them in the wrong

 

[Chadder007]

http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=virtual+memory