My Swedish friends think I'm a "gun nut"

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berzerker60

Golden Member
Jul 18, 2012
1,233
1
0
In the US at least, any sort of violent uprising is pretty much completely impossible already. Since 9/11 our local police forces have been overwhelmingly militarized, given grants to buy heavy weapons, riot gear, SWAT teams, tanks, and now military drones. Considering they also have the support of basically every other police unit in the area, and eventually the national guard if it came to that, I can't see the right to have shotguns making any difference whatsoever.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
72,722
6,201
126
Government doesn't give a damn, since they got the guns and I don't. They're quite happy with how things have turned out really. They have the gun. And a professional army (no longer national service either). They have their "war on guns" (akin to the "war on drugs"), I guess.

edit: I think I'll go sleep now, g'night.

Fuck, they always go to sleep when I'm hot to argue. Hope you were drinking Bloody Marys and a tomato worm eats you in your sleep.
 

UberNeuman

Lifer
Nov 4, 1999
16,937
3,087
126
Blaming other countries? Ultimately, it's entirely the fault of the Swedes, they should know better and not be as gullible.

No, I'm not blaming you. I'm warning you. Good night.

Warn as you will - however - deeds not words...

...I look forward to your drive to empower those like you of the same mind...

\or shall you continue to whine on the internet.....
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
72,722
6,201
126
Guess your Government is right.... Perhaps you should form a movement for gun ownership instead of blaming others countries for your lack of testicular fortitude...

It's just penis envy like women sometimes get because they don't have one. You could always put tomato worm killer in a squirt bottle and carry it on your belt. Or just take some pride in the fact that your country invented IKEA. The meat balls are great but stay away from the fries and catsup. You know what's in the catsup, I'm sure.
 

MrMuppet

Senior member
Jun 26, 2012
474
0
0
Nothing wrong with being different or having another viewpoint.... until it veers into being obnoxious... which I may add - you're doing in spades.....
Basically, you're saying, there IS something wrong with being different or having another viewpoint. :thumbsup:
 

MrMuppet

Senior member
Jun 26, 2012
474
0
0
In the US at least, any sort of violent uprising is pretty much completely impossible already. Since 9/11 our local police forces have been overwhelmingly militarized, given grants to buy heavy weapons, riot gear, SWAT teams, tanks, and now military drones. Considering they also have the support of basically every other police unit in the area, and eventually the national guard if it came to that, I can't see the right to have shotguns making any difference whatsoever.
I wouldn't count on their prolonged support during a prolonged occupation where they not only shoot, but get shot at by, other Americans.

Why are you talking about shotguns? Aren't they more for like defending your store? And shooting pheasant?
 

MrMuppet

Senior member
Jun 26, 2012
474
0
0
The meat balls are great but stay away from the fries and catsup. You know what's in the catsup, I'm sure.
You're doing it wrong. It should be with potatoes, brown sauce, and lingonberries.

Oh, and I'm sure there's gargantuan tomato worms. All minced into a fine spread, helping them divide and conquer.
 

MrMuppet

Senior member
Jun 26, 2012
474
0
0
So, you're going to shoot the people who piss you off. Please explain how this isn't a violation of the rights you claim to protect.
First they need to piss me off. Like really piss me off. Such as violating the very rights I claim to protect.

These things are all just different shades of people getting pissed of. If none got pissed off at assaults, rapes, robberies, etc. none would go after the assailants, rapists, robbers, etc.

It's all about pissing off the wrong people. Pissed off people with access to guns, or at least other people with access to guns.

Now, if you don't have a gun yourself, you better not exercise your free speech or otherwise you might just piss those people off. And again, they do have guns. As do the criminals.
 
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sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,131
5,658
126
What Tyranny are you afraid of?

As for a Militia, these types of Armed Forces are not very effective against a Standing professional Military. They lack discipline and training.
 

MrMuppet

Senior member
Jun 26, 2012
474
0
0
What Tyranny are you afraid of?

As for a Militia, these types of Armed Forces are not very effective against a Standing professional Military. They lack discipline and training.
Reinstituting freedom of speech would be a good start. There's more, but that's hardly the point.
 

MrMuppet

Senior member
Jun 26, 2012
474
0
0
Then what is the point?
An armed populace. It's a general principle. The specifics of the tyranny may vary. Oh, and I think *reinstating free speech would be a very good idea indeed.

If the rulers trusted me, why won't they let me bear arms?
If the rulers don't trust me, why should I trust them?
 
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sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,131
5,658
126
An armed populace. It's a general principle. The specifics of the tyranny may vary. Oh, and I think re-instituting free speech would be a very good idea indeed.

If the rulers trusted me, why won't they let me bear arms?
If the rulers don't trust me, why should I trust them?

You assume this is a Government vs Citizen issue. By and large Gun Control schemes are brought about because Citizens are tired of other Citizens shooting people. The Government does trust you, it gives you a Vote. It is your fellow Citizens that don't trust you.

The idea that Governments behave better when the Citizen is Armed doesn't bear out in practice.
 

PingviN

Golden Member
Nov 3, 2009
1,848
13
81
If the rulers trusted me, why won't they let me bear arms?
If the rulers don't trust me, why should I trust them?

Wtf? You do understand that you are not the only one living in Sweden, right? Just because you might be trustworthy, the remaining 9 million might not be. Why in the fuck would you want people armed?

Go live in the states if you wanna bear arms in protection against the goverment with your friends in tinfoil hats.
 

MrMuppet

Senior member
Jun 26, 2012
474
0
0
You assume this is a Government vs Citizen issue. By and large Gun Control schemes are brought about because Citizens are tired of other Citizens shooting people. The Government does trust you, it gives you a Vote. It is your fellow Citizens that don't trust you.

The idea that Governments behave better when the Citizen is Armed doesn't bear out in practice.
In other words, you would've preferred:

Free people have the right to bear arms and defend their liberty. It's a general principle. The specifics of the tyranny may vary. Oh, and I think *reinstating free speech would be a great start indeed. That is, when my "fellow citizens that don't trust me" come shooting at me for exercising my free speech, I get to shoot back.

If my fellow citizens trusted me, why won't they let me bear arms?
If my fellow citizens don't trust me, why should I trust them?

Sure, democracy and mob rule's great, I'm sure the famed SIX MILLION can attest to its merits. They were the minority. We're about to become one. I guess it takes a conspiracy nut to acknowledge the possibility of history repeating itself, sooner or later.

Basically, "your fellow citizens want you to be one, so shut up, slave". Democracy <3
 
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sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,131
5,658
126
In other words, you would've preferred:

Free people have the right to bear arms and defend their liberty. It's a general principle. The specifics of the tyranny may vary. Oh, and I think re-instituting free speech would be a very good point indeed. That is, when my "fellow citizens that don't trust me" come shooting at me for exercising my free speech, I get to shoot back.

If my fellow citizens trusted me, why won't they let me bear arms?
If my fellow citizens don't trust me, why should I trust them?

Sure, democracy and mob rule's great, I'm sure the famed SIX MILLION can attest to its merits. They were the minority. We're about to become one. I guess it takes a conspiracy nut to acknowledge the possibility of history repeating itself, sooner or later.

Basically, "your fellow citizens want you to be one, so shut up, slave". Democracy <3

What Tyranny are you under?
 

MrMuppet

Senior member
Jun 26, 2012
474
0
0
Wtf? You do understand that you are not the only one living in Sweden, right? Just because you might be trustworthy, the remaining 9 million might not be. Why in the fuck would you want people armed?

Go live in the states if you wanna bear arms in protection against the goverment with your friends in tinfoil hats.
They want to disarm the states too.

You are advocating collective punishment.
 

MrMuppet

Senior member
Jun 26, 2012
474
0
0
Not being able to bear arms is not a punishment. You think speeding limits are violating your freedom too?
If they're on my roads, then yes.

You said:
"Just because you might be trustworthy, the remaining 9 million might not be."

Translated: Just because that other guy is/did X, we're gonna take your liberty away by force too (=punishment). That's collective punishment.

edit: Oh, and being punished for bearing arms is a punishment.
 
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PingviN

Golden Member
Nov 3, 2009
1,848
13
81
If they're on my roads, then yes.

You are allowed to own and keep a gun. You need a license, just like you need a license to drive your car. Is it violating your freedoms not being able to drive without a license?

You said:
"Just because you might be trustworthy, the remaining 9 million might not be."

Translated: Just because that other guy is/did X, we're gonna take your liberty away by force too (=punishment). That's collective punishment.

It's not a liberty to bear arms in public in Sweden. In the states, it is a right granted by the constitution. That is not the case in Sweden and the constitution has never granted us the right to bear arms. You look at US and say "well obviously we should be able to bear arms, 'cause they can!". Get this: Sweden is not the USA. If you wanna bear arms, you're free to leave here any time.

edit: Oh, and being punished for bearing arms is a punishment.

Got a problem being punished for speeding or driving without a license? Is that violating your rights?
 

MrMuppet

Senior member
Jun 26, 2012
474
0
0
You are allowed to own and keep a gun. You need a license, just like you need a license to drive your car. Is it violating your freedoms not being able to drive without a license?
You can't get a license for assault rifles.

You can't get a license at all if you don't have a "need" for it (according to them) or if you're considered "unsuitable" (by them). If you say it's for your own protection, you won't get one. You need to be a hunter or something like that (and only specific weapons, lots of restrictions, etc.).

I would not get a permit, sadly. So no, I am not allowed to own and keep a gun. Unless I wanted to lie and deceive a lot and jump through a whole lot of hoops.

It is violating my freedoms if I'm prohibited to drive my own private vehicle on my own personal property without a license, yes.

It's not a liberty to bear arms in public in Sweden. In the states, it is a right granted by the constitution. That is not the case in Sweden and the constitution has never granted us the right to bear arms. You look at US and say "well obviously we should be able to bear arms, 'cause they can!". Get this: Sweden is not the USA. If you wanna bear arms, you're free to leave here any time.
You're confusing liberties with privileges. This is not about the constitution, the second amendment only recognizes the fundamental self-evident right, or liberty, of free people to keep and bear arms.

A disarmed person is not a free person.

Got a problem being punished for speeding or driving without a license? Is that violating your rights?
Yes, if I'm driving my own car on my own property. I already answered this in my last post.
 
Apr 27, 2012
10,086
58
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Uh, what? There's a lot of rape here. Sweden is the rape capital of Europe. However it's not Swedes that are responsible, it's immigrants (mostly Araboids and Negroids).

Some say it's because they're Muslim, but I'm not so sure.

There are actual muslim rape gangs that are going around and targeting mainly non muslims but because of PC we cant do anything
 
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