Need a new daily driver <$25k

[DisgruntledVirus]

My car (2005 Dodge Neon that I got for $10k new) is finally getting to the point of needing replaced after 7 years of faithful service. I don't follow the car market much anymore so I'm looking for some direction. Here is what I'm looking for:

Price: <$25k
Transmission: Manual only (autos are boring and paddle/sport type autos suck too IMHO except in some situations)
MPG: I like current of 33 combined city/highway and would like to stay in that ballpark, but nothing below 20.
Performance: I'm a male. More is good. But at the same time I just need something to get me to and from places, and cars are horrible investments so would rather keep payments lower than have a high performance car.
2/4 door: Prefer 4 door, but not a requirement

I'm open to any suggestion, however am biased to Honda/VW based on friends and family. I can however get a GM employee price on any GM vehicle. Most likely same with Ford.

Some cars I've liked in the past (2008/9 looked into trading in and did test driving then): Civic, Civic Si, Accord, Mazda 3/6, Mazdaspeed3, Golf GTI, and Jetta. Models I'm looking into now in addition to those: Focus ST, Jetta GDI, Lancer (although wasn't huge on it in 2009 on test drives), and Impreza WRX. I know that basically all of these are the "sport" models, but that is not a requirement. Just hard to find manual transmissions anymore except in the cheap packages which don't offer some of the options I would like (sunroof, bluetooth, etc).

Updating to add list of cars to look at, URL link is to my test drive review and the blacked out is stuff I've removed from consideration:
Civic Si
Mazdaspeed3
Focus ST
Focus Titanium
VW GTI
Impreza WRX
Genesis Coupe

Not for me
Subaru BRZ
VW Jetta GLI

Spoiler

Veloster/Turbo

Spoiler

Elantra Coupe/GT

Spoiler

Sonic

Spoiler

GTI

Spoiler

CR-Z

Spoiler

Civic EX

Spoiler

Accord

Update 10/20: After thinking about cars some more and getting a nice little raise, I think I've eliminated a few from what I want. The Accord and Sonic are out due to not being for me (family has Accord and it's too "old man" for me), while the Sonic is meh at best. The Veloster is out because I dislike the looks. I think the CR-Z is out for performance reasons. I might test it just because of it's price point. The GTI is out solely for the plaid interior. I refuse to drive that. Elantra coupe/GT is out due to looks and performance.

I plan on test driving the Si, Speed3, and ST again but I want to knock out some others that I hadn't really been considering in all honesty. Like the BRZ, Impreza, Jetta GLI, Genesis Coupe (really not sure with all options with this one which trim I'd be interested in), and the Scion FRS could be added although it's just a Toyota BRZ.

Update 10/22: The GTI impressed the hell out of me. It is without question a serious contender now, and I think it'll end up being the Focus ST, VW GTI, or Speed3. The Si is ok, but I kind of think it's out now. The Si and Titanium are still in because it was enjoyable and are on the cheaper side of things. So it will end up being the Si/Titanium in the conservative side of financially responsible vs the GTI/Speed3/ST on the still financially responsible just more than I wanted to spend on monthly payments (after looking at what I think my downpayment+trade in total will be).

My Excel sheet for this that I've created

Update 11/26: I know this is a bit old to bump, but here it is.

I'm still looking. I've not had much free time so this has still been on the back burner for a bit. I'm also playing around with numbers to see what makes the most financial sense for me at my age as it relates to student loans. And until I resolve that (i.e. do I forego a car for a year hoping mine makes it so I can pay off about 1/3 of my student loans, OR do I get the car since I am not sure mine will make it) the car is kind of on hold. Although I was planning on getting it in Dec anyways so now is kind of that time frame to get that taken care of.

I've been looking for GTI's used on CL/autotrader/etc just to see what's out there, and last night I found a great one potentially. It's a 2010 with the sun/conv type package that I wanted, 30k miles, and under warranty still for $19k. That would take about $6k off the invoice pricing on the GTI I'd be looking at and reduce payments by a significant amount obviously ($75/mo or so). It's basically fresh off lease according to the owners. Their email reply though threw up a few questions that others might be able to make sense of who have more experience. Here is the summary:

We are selling it because the wife least it new. She was the primary driver and bought it prior to the end of the lease. We had two choices, one to walk away from it with nothing or we could buy it and resell it. So we decided to do the second option. We have leased a new car already FWIW (a '12 Civic SI).

Now to me that sounds fishy. Buying a car at the end of the lease seems like a traditionally bad idea. Am I wrong? I'm completely uneducated as it comes to leasing and how that works (I get the basics and math but don't have a practical understanding of it from experience with it). So thoughts?

Final update 1/3/13: Bought a car last night. A 2012 Honda Civic Si Sedan. Got a good end of year deal on it that saved about $4k off a GTI and OTD price <$20k. I'll throw up some pics here in the next few days.

 

[jlee]

Mazdaspeed3, Focus ST, Mustang V6 or lightly used GT, WRX.

 

[saratoga172]

As much as I hate to say it with as many good cars as there are now but look seriously into the Civic SI. It's manual, very good gas mileage for a sporty car, not the most powerful but it's got a 200hp engine that's decent for the size of car. Oh and shall I mention reliable.

Otherwise look at the Mazdaspeed 3 for better performance with a slight mpg dropoff. But man oh man will it pull and the hatchback is very handy. Can be had new for right at $25k.

Are you looking for new or used?

 

[Arkaign]

WRX, or perhaps WRX. Seriously, drive one of those first.

 

[mmntech]

Friends don't let friends get Volkswagens. I'll give that the Jettas are peppy but ugh, everything about them just feels cheap. Always had problems with them. Same goes with the Golf.

Have you looked at the Hyundai Genesis Coupe? 274hp 2.0L Turbocharged engine. For Honda, you've got your SI of course. There's also the CR-Z if you want something sporty but are willing to trade power for economy. Though it's not much better than my seventh gen Civic in terms of fuel economy. Which is sad when you think about it. The Civic is a bigger car.

 

[Dr. Detroit]

DV - how important is MPG?

You are getting 33mpg combined on regular unleaded in the Neon with low repair costs. Are you OK with getting a 6spd manual trans Turbo Focus ST or Mazdaspeed 3 that will average 24mpg on premium fuel for $25- $27K?

 

[Doppel]

FYI your current car is rated at 25/32 for 28 combined.

 

[DisgruntledVirus]

As much as I hate to say it with as many good cars as there are now but look seriously into the Civic SI. It's manual, very good gas mileage for a sporty car, not the most powerful but it's got a 200hp engine that's decent for the size of car. Oh and shall I mention reliable.

Otherwise look at the Mazdaspeed 3 for better performance with a slight mpg dropoff. But man oh man will it pull and the hatchback is very handy. Can be had new for right at $25k.

Are you looking for new or used?

I'm not sure on new vs used. I like new, but also am becoming more and more of a cheap bastard which means a 1-2 year old used car would make more sense financially.

WRX, or perhaps WRX. Seriously, drive one of those first.

I wasn't huge on them last time, but am willing to give it a second go.

DV - how important is MPG?

You are getting 33mpg combined on regular unleaded in the Neon with low repair costs. Are you OK with getting a 6spd manual trans Turbo Focus ST or Mazdaspeed 3 that will average 24mpg on premium fuel for $25- $27K?

I assume you mean by low repair costs that parts are cheap for it? Lately it has been getting close to the payments I was making on it in repairs.

As for you second question that is something I've been thinking about. I like the good MPG with the cheap gas, but I can't seem to find a replacement for it. Yeah I can get regular civic in manual for example, but it's only the base two trim levels. So if I want stuff like say a sun/moon roof, or bluetooth integration (without the aftermarket head unit route which is what I did with this car), but still have a manual transmission then I have to go into the "sports" models it seems.

 

[DisgruntledVirus]

I have been looking at the sedan versions of cars, which is why I can't seem to find manuals potentially. I just took a look at the Civic EX coupe and it priced out to $21k vs the Si 4 door at $23,500 with the options I'd want. So for $2500 more base price I'd get a lot more fun out of the car I think. Is there a place to check into what kind of repair costs there would be between the two?

Also does the Si require premium or is it a "you only get this HP if you use premium, otherwise regular will work find just at reduced engine performance"?

 

[DisgruntledVirus]

FYI your current car is rated at 25/32 for 28 combined.

Correct, however in my typical driving situations (i.e. 70/30 highway/city) I typically see 31-33 through a full tank.

That's why I'm not too concerned with the fuel economy of the sports type editions as they are rated pretty closely to what mine was, albeit slightly lower at like 23/28. The only concern is in the premium gas and if that is "required" or just "required for advertised performance"? Would it harm the engine to run regular through it?

EDIT: Also took a look at the Genesis Coupe. With comparable options to the Si or EX Civic's it would be $29,500 which is out of the price range I'm going for.

 

[OILFIELDTRASH]

I bought my wife a new civic in 08. We both still love the car. When its time to replace it there isn't even a question about it we are going back to the Honda dealer and buying another civic. Gas mileage is fantastic and maintenance has been a brake caliper replacement in nearly 70,000 miles and of course regularly scheduled maintenance.
Get the leather package. They make some high quality leather seats that might look better today than they did in 08. It really makes the civic interior go from Meh to nice.

 

[NAC]

You already listed most of the cars I would think of. Two of my votes would be GTI or Mazda 3.

I'd also recommend you test drive a Miata. You didn't describe the need for practicality. Obviously you'll sacrifice a lot with a Miata. But I've never seen a Miata owner who didn't love the car. Just a joy to drive. And everyone should own a convertible once in his/her life. A while back I was considering several used cars, including a Neon. Yawn. I sat in a Miata and it was love at first sit.

 

[stag3]

mazdaspeed3, i miss mine

 

[JCH13]

Mazdaspeed3, Focus ST, Civic Si, in that order.

Part of the reason is that Mazda dealers seem to be more negotiable than other dealers.

 

[vshah]

I love my SI sedan. seats 4, 35mpg on the highway, great shifter and engine note. I've had it for 5 years / 70k miles and no repairs needed yet. Replaced brake pads and did oil changes, that's it. And I don't baby the car, it is autocrossed regularly. More power would be nice of course, but the new 2.4 liter has a good bit more low end grunt. Not nearly as much as the boosted competition though.

My model year (2007) requires premium. Not sure about the new engine, although its basically the tsx engine so it wouldn't surprise me.

 

[Pandora's Box]

take a look at the Hyundai Elantra

 

[vi edit]

If you get GM discounts, look at the Sonic with the turbo. By most accounts it's a very fun to drive, highly economical little car.

 

[Zargon]

Correct, however in my typical driving situations (i.e. 70/30 highway/city) I typically see 31-33 through a full tank.

That's why I'm not too concerned with the fuel economy of the sports type editions as they are rated pretty closely to what mine was, albeit slightly lower at like 23/28. The only concern is in the premium gas and if that is "required" or just "required for advertised performance"? Would it harm the engine to run regular through it?

EDIT: Also took a look at the Genesis Coupe. With comparable options to the Si or EX Civic's it would be $29,500 which is out of the price range I'm going for.

if you want a genny go for 1-3 year old used and save some serious coin

alot of them you could put in regular, but then what is the point of paying for more HP and not getting it? sometimes they get crummy mileage when you do that too

 

[exar333]

I love the MS3 and WRX, but neither will get you above 25 MPGs combined. If your shooting for 33, the GTI is by far the best choice.

7th/8th geb Civic Si is a waste of money, avoid at all costs.

 

[nerp]

Too bad you won't consider auto trannys. It opens a whole range of choices that are better than every car listed here. There are 300hp 4-door sedans that get 33mpg on the highway on 87 gas. But whatever.

 

[jlee]

Too bad you won't consider auto trannys. It opens a whole range of choices that are better than every car listed here. There are 300hp 4-door sedans that get 33mpg on the highway on 87 gas. But whatever.

If someone wants a manual transmission, a car with an auto is by default *not better.*

 

[JCH13]

I love the MS3 and WRX, but neither will get you above 25 MPGs combined. If your shooting for 33, the GTI is by far the best choice.

7th/8th geb Civic Si is a waste of money, avoid at all costs.

I routinely get 25-28mpg combined in my MS3 and can get up to 33mpg on the interstate. Granted I'm not slogging through stoplight after stoplight on a regular basis, but it is possible. FWIW I run a bit higher than standard tire pressures.

 

[DisgruntledVirus]

Too bad you won't consider auto trannys. It opens a whole range of choices that are better than every car listed here. There are 300hp 4-door sedans that get 33mpg on the highway on 87 gas. But whatever.

Like?

I think autos are boring to drive personally, but if the car is enjoyable and what I want in other regards I'd consider an auto.

 

[DisgruntledVirus]

The Sonic has been added to look at. Thanks!

 

[Viper GTS]

If you're willing to look at the sonic (which is godawful, and I had high hopes for it) have you considered the CR-Z?

I enjoyed driving the CR-Z far more than the Sonic, and it's better specced (IMO). HIDs and NAV for under your asking price, & it's at least interesting to look at.

The big drawback of course is it's not that quick, but if you're looking at the Sonic it should be on your list.

Viper GTS