Need sealed PC building advice for friend deploying to Bagram AFB!

Rogue

Banned
Jan 28, 2000
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After having read some information available on Bagram Air Force Base where my best friend is deploying to at the beginning of the year, I need the esteemed help of anyone here willing to give it. It seems that Afghanistan is a very dry, dusty environment and that most computers don't last very long over there due to the dust. So my question is this, has anyone here ever built a completely sealed, air tight PC before? I would like this to be some sort of campaign to bring environment resistent PCs to our troops over there.

My thoughts on how to do this would be to start with an EPIA board from VIA. The main issue is cooling afterall, and I've heard these run very cool and do not require a fan to cool things down. With an aluminum case acting as a large heat spreader to the whole system, would this be sufficient to keep things inside cool without any air moving in or out of the case itself? I need more ideas and how to build an air tight PC that runs Windows or even Linux. Any cooling system that anyone else comes up with shouldn't be too complex (ie.-water cooling). Any help would be greatly appreciated.
 

Fox2k

Member
May 25, 2002
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All of the cooling solutions available today don't decrease the ammoutnof heat produced, they merely disprese it with greater efficiency. Sealing a case means no heat can escape except through convection, and I don't think there's any way that that would work. Unless perhaps you used external water cooling, like the new koolance water cooling kit that site on top of the case, and sealed around the tubes.
even then though..damn..that's a lot of heat building p inside
:/
 

Rogue

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Jan 28, 2000
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That's the problem too Budman, even the laptops are getting chewed up and spit out there. Laptops have cooling vents and fans inside too that attract the talcum powder like dust that is 2-4 inches thick on everything. There has to be a way to use the external housing of the case to conduct heat from the inside effectively while keeping the system sealed from the elements. Buying a Panasonic Toughbook is too damn expensive too. Thank you for your suggestions thus far, but there has to be a way. People are building PCs in stuffed ETs and toaster ovens and Playstation housings for god's sake!
 

Woodchuck2000

Golden Member
Jan 20, 2002
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The biggest problem is going to be finding a sealed PSU. I've never seen one before and modding one to be sealed would be tricky to say the least...

Your best bet for cooling the other components it probably watercooling - you could have a large external radiator to dissipate heat.
 

Rogue

Banned
Jan 28, 2000
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I've done some more thinking on the matter and I'm thinking that totally sealed my in fact not be "reasonable" (although I'm not ruling it out entirely either). Perhaps simply a "blow out" cooling system would be effective also whereby the hot air inside is sucked out at a high rate of speed by a large fan of some kind at the rear of the case. My thinking is that if air is constantly blowing out, then it won't be getting "IN" if you will. Anyone with any other ideas?

Also, does anyone know of any fanless power supplies maybe in the 120W to 200W range?
 

Rogue

Banned
Jan 28, 2000
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JKing, are you talking like a power brick that plugs into the wall? Where can I find one that I can adapt to an ATX power connector or a converter of some kind?
 

bigshooter

Platinum Member
Oct 12, 1999
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71
If you make a case taht is sealed to the point where no air gets in, and you have a fun that's blowing air out, you won't be cooling anything. technically it could form a vacuum. Air has to get in in order for it to be blown out.
 

jamison

Platinum Member
Mar 7, 2001
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I would have to go for air filters at every fan location PLUS a large box shaped filter to entirely enclose the system. Inconvenient - yes, but it would definitly prolong the life of the system.

When I say filters, I mean some very good ones, probably expensive, but needed in this case.
 

mrzed

Senior member
Jan 29, 2001
811
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If you're really handy, the best I can think is moving all the heatsinks to the outside of the box. You would have to mod the power supply though, so it could be a nasty bit of work. If you used very large heatsinks that expose only to the outside air, I think it would work. The other components should be fine stuck in the box, assuming you are using integrated or low-end video, and reasonably coold HDD.

If you decide not to seal completely, the rule used in darkrooms is to pump air in to create positive pressure on the inside. If you do this, dust will tend to be pushed out.
 

medic

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 1999
5,160
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A few ideas:

Use a cool running non-overclocked cpu/MB combo as you mentioned with a smaller atx case.
Seal the mating surfaces of the panels with the thinnest 1/4" weatherstripping before closing, make sure the back panel has blanks inserted into any free slots and also make sure any vents in the front bezel are sealed.
Use the lowest rated P.S. you can find that will reliably run the system without crashes and get someone who is aware of the electrical dangers, disconnect the built in fan from it.
Have a 80mm fan installed in the side of the case about 1 inch below the line of the CPU and install a filter box above it. You can also build a filter box by extending the 4 machine screws with a steel dowel and having 4 large washers under the 4 bolts raised about one inch above the fan housing.
Go buy a three pack of good quality furnace filters and cut them to a square, slightly larger than the 4 dowels rising above the side fan. Insert one filter over the fan and run a few elastics under the washers to hold the filter tight. You may need a small grate or fan shield, mesh ect. to keep the filter away from the blades.
You can change them as needed and you wil get 50 plus out of a few furnace filters.
The secret here is to let the 80mm fan (120mm if needed, or even two 80's) keep a positive "filtered" pressure in the system. At the same time they will exit nearly all air out through the P.S. keeping it cooled.
 

Rogue

Banned
Jan 28, 2000
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Thanks medic, a great idea that I will strongly consider. BTW, for those that haven't seen it, here's a link to the environment I'm building for.

http://www.njnavy.com/Bagram.ppt

It's a Powerpoint file, so anyone without the app or the viewer app are SOL! Sorry.
 

L3Guy

Senior member
Apr 19, 2001
282
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I know this will not help, but I had a 3com 3station that was sealed.
On board video, on board ethernet, 8 Mhz 286, no HD or floppy.
Set to network boot.


Doug
 

Bovinicus

Diamond Member
Aug 8, 2001
3,145
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You could try submerging the aluminum case in mineral oil. Actually, you don't even need a case if you do this. You need some sort of refrigiration unit to keep the mineral oil at low temps. I saw someone do this on a tweak site years ago. It is risky, but it should work if you know what you're doing. Any liquid that retains cold well and doesn't conduct electricity at all should work. Again, this is risky, so don't blame me if things go wrong. =P
 

Bluefront

Golden Member
Apr 20, 2002
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Here's a repost of my solution to a clean case....you could go further by sealing around the cards with silicone rubber, same thing around the drives. The front door of the case would help alot. The fan filters could be replaced often....maybe even improved.


If you're overclocked, or run hot internal devices, this case is probably not for you. I'm running a celeron 2.0 on a Gigabyte 8PE667 Ultra and I don't do much if any gaming. I've got a bad dust problem in this room (living room). Two large parrots....dusty, fly around, etc. I've got a large HEPA fan going 24/7, but there's still plenty of dust. Here's my solution....

Most cases aren't configured for a positive pressure setup....this one is. Antec SLK2600AMV, available at CompUSA with an Antec smartpower 300watt P/S for about $70. It's rather heavy, steel, with a rear port for an 80mm fan, and the same size front intake. It also has a tight-fitting front door that covers the drive bays.

The one thing that makes this case so special is the room around the fan ports. There is enough room to fit good intake filters. I use pleated paper filters designed for lawn-mowers...they trap dust much better than those thin foam filters you usually see. (Briggs and Sratten #5028) I attach the filters to the case with carefully fitted double-sided tape. Both these fans blow into the case (positive pressure). Only the P/S fan blows out. The two case fans and the CPU fan are thermally controlled 1500/4000rpm PCToys CrystalMax. Their speed/noise is minimal....usually run around 2000/2500rpm. Of course under load, their speeds go up.

The case requires just a few mods...no cutting. I closed off all the vent holes from the inside using duct tape.....except the two case fan ports of course. I lined every accessable place with acoustic foam....including the rear of the front case door. Very little/no air enters this case without passing through the two case filters. The weight of the setup, the acoustic foam, the variable speed fans, and the very tight fit of this case, make the whole setup very quiet. The positive pressure and the good filters make it very clean.

I'm pleased with the final result. It's a pretty medium grey metalic.....I've made no external mods. It looks stock. At an ambient temp of 22.9C with the computer idling the CPU temp stays around 32C. Under a severe load the temp has gone up to 42C...never seen it higher.

CPU....Celeron2.0
M/B....Gigabyte 8PE667 Ultra
Ram..512mb samsung pc2600
CPU fan/heatsink.... PCToys QuietMax 5700 using a CrystalMax Thermally controlled variable speed fan...With a scoop that faces the rear intake fan.
Two maxtor 7500rpm hard drives.
PCToys rounded cables
ATI Radeon AIW 7500
Scsi card
Pci modem
Firewire card

Making a clean/quiet running computer is not difficult....but you need the right case to start with.

One more thing.....I installed a DigitalDoc 5 (with 8 temp sensors). Amazingly the hottest internal part of this setup is the master hard-drive, which is at the bottom of the case with the front intake fan blowing on it. It usually runs hotter than the CPU......I put a small fan right over it that turns on at 37C(controlled by the DigitalDoc). It always turns on when the system is under load.

Here's a sample of the eight measured temps after the system has idled for two hours....ambient 20.9.

CPU...................31.4
Ram chip...........33.3
Chipset.............33.6
P/S output........29.8
Video card........31.5
Case temp........29.9
H/D master.......36.9
H/D slave..........29.0





 

heartsurgeon

Diamond Member
Aug 18, 2001
4,260
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do a Google search for "sealed computer" and feast your eyes on the commercially available solutions to your situation.
 

GoodRevrnd

Diamond Member
Dec 27, 2001
6,803
581
126
Line the inside of the aluminum case w/ peltiers. Just make sure you have "CAUTION! HOT SURFACE!" stickers plastered all over it.



EDIT: Actually there's a guy on this forum somewhere who attempts to do the quietest running pc's possible and underclocks. You should seek his advice.
 

mikable

Senior member
Sep 23, 2000
303
0
0
I was gona sugjest a google search too!

Or instead of all the fancy seals and weatherstriping

A hepa air filter large enough in size to cover the hole. and the highest CFM fan you can find that can be mounted on the side of the case. Like this one

cut hole in case side
mount fan to suck air into case
mount hepa filter on outside of case over fan intake hole


With 100CFM powering in you have just created a filtered positive airflow into your case preventing any air from entering from the other openings. The hepa filters get just about everything out of the air, and all the other holes are if fact nessesary to let all that air out! Plus all that air flow is good for the heat too. You can, if you desire cover some of the other fan holes to provide a higher preasure inside the case, just don't cover the power supply exaust, that one is fairly nessesary.

 
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