New AMD CPU Architecture Announced!

[imported_Questar]

read it all here:
http://news.com.com/AMD+unveils+archite.../2100-1006_3-6072742.html?tag=nefd.top

 

[Stoneburner]

Ehh. this sounds like k8L. They flat out say its not a new architecture.

 

[Regs]

It's vague to say the least besides from what we all ready know about the K8L. Lower power consumption and more room for multi-core processors on the 65nm SOI process. Other than that, for all we know the extra performance it will provide is coming from Mars as we yet know nothing new about the CPU.

And I would just love to know what AMD's conception on the "big picture" is. If he is going to get philosophical, at least explain himself.

 

[JEDIYoda]

AMD just grasping at straws!

 

[Hard Ball]

And More sources:

http://www.reed-electronics.com/article/CA6335326.html
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2006/05/16/amd_next_gen/
http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=31761

Demerjian seems to think a lot of it:

First, it has a shared expandable L3 cache, necessary because it is a native quad-core design. The one massive enhancement to the mix is that AMD finally has the ability to independently change core voltages for power savings. It now can also change the north bridge voltage independently of the cores. This is a huge win, we are told voltage differentials and problems with them were one of the main scaling headaches of the K8 core to this point.


Next is memory. The new core will support 48-bit addressing and 1GB pages. Cray and SGI will be very happy with this, until they hit that memory wall again. There is also official co-processor support, strongly hinted to be on a HTX card. The key here will be the platform is aware of them vs having to hack them in.

The other whopper Chuck dropped was that DDR2 is coming and DDR3 is in the wings when the spec 'settles down'. Old news, FB-DIMMs are the future, right? AMD has said they are supporting them, but the big news is that they are not forcing support. Unlike Intel's approach, Blackford supports only FBD, AMD will let you choose. This seems to strongly suggest that the controller on the later gens will be quite flexible indeed.

Next up is RAS, another area where AMD is sorely lacking. It is addressing the major sore points with support for memory mirroring, data poisoning support, and HT retry. It looks like it is following the IBM roadmap more than the Intel one here.

IPC is also going up in a big way. It is doing the obvious doubling of SSE/FP resources, old news now, but it goes a lot deeper than that. There are a bunch of added instructions, starting with the bit manipulation instructions LZCNT and POPCNT. It also added SSE extensions EXTRQ/INSERTQ and MOVNTSD/MOVNTSS. No word on SSE4 though.

The last bit is much more aggressive prefetch to 'feed the beast'. It has gone from 16B to 32B, an obvious step with the added SSE number crunching power. On top of this, it has out of order loads, and other tweaks to use the available bandwidth in a much more efficient manner.

For those who thought K8L was more or less a tweaked K8, you are wrong. It looks like no part of the core has been left unmolested by the elves working the CAD stations. It looks like AMD will have a credible response to the Intel MCW architecture after all. 2007 will be a fight after all. µ

 

[imported_Questar]

For those who thought K8L was more or less a tweaked K8, you are wrong. It looks like no part of the core has been left unmolested by the elves working the CAD stations. It looks like AMD will have a credible response to the Intel MCW architecture after all. 2007 will be a fight after all. µ

Hehe, The Inq is wrong again. Whoda thought?

 

[Hard Ball]

Originally posted by: Questar

For those who thought K8L was more or less a tweaked K8, you are wrong. It looks like no part of the core has been left unmolested by the elves working the CAD stations. It looks like AMD will have a credible response to the Intel MCW architecture after all. 2007 will be a fight after all. µ

Hehe, The Inq is wrong again. Whoda thought?

Do you have something worthwhile to say, or are you just trolling?

 

[Regs]

There was no doubt in my mind that the K8L would be considerably different than the original K8. However, in my mind, that still states its a tweaked K8.

The Inq is factually right on a few key features but as always they add a lot of spin on their wording. Nothing wrong with that. From what I see so far it looks like 07' will be a good year bringing in new hardware and new games.

HOPEFULLY!!

 

[zephyrprime]

Having out of order loads will be interesting if it really has it.

 

[Amaroque]

Originally posted by: Regs
There was no doubt in my mind that the K8L would be considerably different than the original K8. However, in my mind, that still states its a tweaked K8.

By your above quoted statement, that would make a Conroe/Merom a tweaked P6...

 

[Regs]

Originally posted by: Amaroque

Originally posted by: Regs
There was no doubt in my mind that the K8L would be considerably different than the original K8. However, in my mind, that still states its a tweaked K8.

By your above quoted statement, that would make a Conroe/Merom a tweaked P6...

Good point.

 

[firewolfsm]

Originally posted by: Regs
There was no doubt in my mind that the K8L would be considerably different than the original K8. However, in my mind, that still states its a tweaked K8.

The Inq is factually right on a few key features but as always they add a lot of spin on their wording. Nothing wrong with that. From what I see so far it looks like 07' will be a good year bringing in new hardware and new games.

HOPEFULLY!!

Tweaking can bring a huge performance increase, if you understood all of that you'd realize that this could probably make up for the Core advantage and more.

 

[TejTrescent]

Out of order loads.. just quickly, that's like Conroe's got, isn't it? Or am I like, misunderstanding what they mean by that?

If that article's got a lot of truth to it, the upcoming memory controller sounds like a beast that'll be very very useful.

The independant and shared cache together thing sounds useful, too. ; I dunno.

Can't wait to find out, though.

 

[Amaroque]

Originally posted by: Regs

Originally posted by: Amaroque

Originally posted by: Regs
There was no doubt in my mind that the K8L would be considerably different than the original K8. However, in my mind, that still states its a tweaked K8.

By your above quoted statement, that would make a Conroe/Merom a tweaked P6...

Good point.

Personally, I think the P6 (PPro, PII, P!!! + mobile variants) and the K7 (Athlon, A64, AX2) based cores are the best cores that have been made to date.

I've never liked the 'Netburst' architecture, and I'm very glad to see Intel drop it.

I truly hope the competition is fierce in '07. That would keep prices down, and performance up. :thumbsup:

 

[F1shF4t]

Now only if they produced them in the socket 939 variant

 

[Hard Ball]

Originally posted by: Hard Ball

Originally posted by: Questar

For those who thought K8L was more or less a tweaked K8, you are wrong. It looks like no part of the core has been left unmolested by the elves working the CAD stations. It looks like AMD will have a credible response to the Intel MCW architecture after all. 2007 will be a fight after all. µ

Hehe, The Inq is wrong again. Whoda thought?

Do you have something worthwhile to say, or are you just trolling?

In case anyone didn't understand this; this was a joke,
Not an attack on Questar

 

[F1shF4t]

Originally posted by: Amaroque

Originally posted by: Regs

Originally posted by: Amaroque

Originally posted by: Regs
There was no doubt in my mind that the K8L would be considerably different than the original K8. However, in my mind, that still states its a tweaked K8.

By your above quoted statement, that would make a Conroe/Merom a tweaked P6...

Good point.

Personally, I think the P6 (PPro, PII, P!!! + mobile variants) and the K7 (Athlon, A64, AX2) based cores are the best cores that have been made to date.

I've never liked the 'Netburst' architecture, and I'm very glad to see Intel drop it.

I truly hope the competition is fierce in '07. That would keep prices down, and performance up. :thumbsup:

Darn, and now the forums will be filled with k8L vs conroe, just great, i've already had enough of these conroe vs X2 threads U will see people saying dont buy conroe wait for k8L. LOL :laugh:

 

[Amaroque]

Originally posted by: Dark Cupcake

Darn, and now the forums will be filled with k8L vs conroe, just great, i've already had enough of these conroe vs X2 threads U will see people saying dont buy conroe wait for k8L. LOL :laugh:

Strong competition between AMD, and Intel is good for consumers. But, it will mean strong competition in any computer related forum. That's just a fact of life.

Now the hard part is keeping the discussions productive, and keeping the 'fanbois' at bay. :evil:

 

[MDme]

Now the problem is.....

Do I buy Conroe or wait for K8L? (sigh)

I originally wanted to upgrade my S754 Athlon64 @2.6 Ghz to an X2 939...but then AM2 made me wait....but seems like AM2 is not worth it so Conroe seemed like a good idea since it's coming out soon.....but now this??? So do I wait for 2007? when is it coming out?? 1H, 2H? aaaarrgh!!!

 

[Amaroque]

There will always be something better around the corner.

Conroe will be out much sooner then K8L. Unless you feel like waiting another year (guesstimate), your best bet would be Conroe.

 

[Regs]

Originally posted by: firewolfsm

Originally posted by: Regs
There was no doubt in my mind that the K8L would be considerably different than the original K8. However, in my mind, that still states its a tweaked K8.

The Inq is factually right on a few key features but as always they add a lot of spin on their wording. Nothing wrong with that. From what I see so far it looks like 07' will be a good year bringing in new hardware and new games.

HOPEFULLY!!

Tweaking can bring a huge performance increase, if you understood all of that you'd realize that this could probably make up for the Core advantage and more.

Yes, I know. My point, or better yet Amaroque point, was that just because it's based off a older core does not just mean its a tweaked model. Even so, you're right. It will bring a considerable amount of fire power to the competition.

 

[Viditor]

Originally posted by: JEDIYoda
AMD just grasping at straws!

I seem to remember exactly this quote about Conroe in Feb...

 

[Regs]

Originally posted by: Viditor

Originally posted by: JEDIYoda
AMD just grasping at straws!

I seem to remember exactly this quote about Conroe in Feb...

This is a sour apple I wish dearly not to bite into.

 

[Fox5]

Originally posted by: Hard Ball
And More sources:

http://www.reed-electronics.com/article/CA6335326.html
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2006/05/16/amd_next_gen/
http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=31761

Demerjian seems to think a lot of it:

First, it has a shared expandable L3 cache, necessary because it is a native quad-core design. The one massive enhancement to the mix is that AMD finally has the ability to independently change core voltages for power savings. It now can also change the north bridge voltage independently of the cores. This is a huge win, we are told voltage differentials and problems with them were one of the main scaling headaches of the K8 core to this point.


Next is memory. The new core will support 48-bit addressing and 1GB pages. Cray and SGI will be very happy with this, until they hit that memory wall again. There is also official co-processor support, strongly hinted to be on a HTX card. The key here will be the platform is aware of them vs having to hack them in.

The other whopper Chuck dropped was that DDR2 is coming and DDR3 is in the wings when the spec 'settles down'. Old news, FB-DIMMs are the future, right? AMD has said they are supporting them, but the big news is that they are not forcing support. Unlike Intel's approach, Blackford supports only FBD, AMD will let you choose. This seems to strongly suggest that the controller on the later gens will be quite flexible indeed.

Next up is RAS, another area where AMD is sorely lacking. It is addressing the major sore points with support for memory mirroring, data poisoning support, and HT retry. It looks like it is following the IBM roadmap more than the Intel one here.

IPC is also going up in a big way. It is doing the obvious doubling of SSE/FP resources, old news now, but it goes a lot deeper than that. There are a bunch of added instructions, starting with the bit manipulation instructions LZCNT and POPCNT. It also added SSE extensions EXTRQ/INSERTQ and MOVNTSD/MOVNTSS. No word on SSE4 though.

The last bit is much more aggressive prefetch to 'feed the beast'. It has gone from 16B to 32B, an obvious step with the added SSE number crunching power. On top of this, it has out of order loads, and other tweaks to use the available bandwidth in a much more efficient manner.

For those who thought K8L was more or less a tweaked K8, you are wrong. It looks like no part of the core has been left unmolested by the elves working the CAD stations. It looks like AMD will have a credible response to the Intel MCW architecture after all. 2007 will be a fight after all. µ

Too bad SGI is pretty much defunct at this point....
When does AMD's next server chip come out? Socket L or whatever.
The SSE instructions.....are they part of SSE4, but just not the whole SSE4, or are they not even part of SSE spec?
Out of order loads...is that the same thing conroe has?

Will first gen Am2 motherboards support K8L?

 

[cmrmrc]

Originally posted by: MDme
Now the problem is.....

Do I buy Conroe or wait for K8L? (sigh)

I originally wanted to upgrade my S754 Athlon64 @2.6 Ghz to an X2 939...but then AM2 made me wait....but seems like AM2 is not worth it so Conroe seemed like a good idea since it's coming out soon.....but now this??? So do I wait for 2007? when is it coming out?? 1H, 2H? aaaarrgh!!!

you will always wait if you think of it this way...thing is don't wait until something good is not on the horizon so that you can buy a system...buy the system that fits you at that moment and be happy with it

when you'll wait for K8L...you'll probably gonna be hearing details about intel's new core nehalem..and then if you wait again..k10 may be leaked...and so on..