lol--Have you guys seen TH's forum that he is now linking in his profile? It looks like he is an admin, and it is batshit insane as you might expect. It makes JohnConnor's forums look like a gathering of Mensa members (and remember--that was with 2 people making all of the posts)
I guess Tuglife didn't work out, so now it is Countrylife.
Stop lying.Politicians flip sides all the time. I mean take the wall for example. Most Democrats for for a wall before they were againdst it. Take John McCain. He stuck his finger in the wind to see the political wind before making statements. So meh. Bottom line is eliminating the EC is a bad idea.
I mean take the wall for example. Most Democrats for for a wall before they were againdst it. .
No, the states wouldn’t matter, it would just be total votes by all the people represented by the office. This is how we elect literally every other position in the country and it works fine. Regardless, the system we have now just makes it so a few medium population states decide the election.
Eliminating the electoral college achieves one simple goal that we should all support: since the president represents all citizens the president should be the person that the most citizens select to be president.
This is incorrect, an extreme majority is not required, just states with 51% of electoral votes agreeing to it.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Popular_Vote_Interstate_Compact
You're arguing for the abolition of representative democracy here, which I would not support. What I am arguing for is making the presidency actual representative democracy instead of a weighted parlor game.
Wanted to single out these two points for ridicule. They're objectively false.
To start, exit poll data from 2016 shows that a person's lack of education actually dictated just the opposite of what you claim. If you were an uneducated white person, you were more likely to vote for Trump; if you were an educated white person or a minority of any education level, the level of Trump support dropped dramatically. (Slightly more educated white people still voted for Trump, showing that race still played a factor.)
And on the other point, two things. First, while exit poll data shows that more people making under $50K did vote for Clinton than Trump, the gap wasn't cavernous (53% versus 41%). Moreover, it doesn't tell the whole story. If you're making under $50K, that doesn't mean you're poor or uneducated; you may be a student or a recent grad with an entry-level job. Given that people under 30 were far more likely to vote for Clinton than Trump, it's reasonable to presume that many of those lower-income voters were young, not necessarily poor.
Also, it's rather ironic that you're complaining about voting based on emotion when you support a President who campaigned primarily on fear, hatred and mindless jingoism. You want leadership based on logic and reason? You're much more likely to get that out of the Democrat candidate in 2020 than Trump.
and yet the EC elected donald trump, basically proving that the EC as practiced doesn't give a shit about foreign intervention or the "whim" of the masses.The Founding Fathers rightfully feared foreign intervention in our elections, did not trust the whims of the masses and also needed to secure the support of the smaller states by assuring a balance to counter the larger states. The electoral system preserves that intent. As I said earlier in the thread, Democrats certainly didn’t have a concern over the electoral college when they won the White House.
lol--Have you guys seen TH's forum that he is now linking in his profile? It looks like he is an admin, and it is batshit insane as you might expect. It makes JohnConnor's forums look like a gathering of Mensa members (and remember--that was with 2 people making all of the posts)
I guess Tuglife didn't work out, so now it is Countrylife.
In other words, just a couple of counties in the nation will elect all future presidents?
The founding fathers never wanted a democracy.
Silly idea. Imagine the Florida recount fiasco but now for the entire country. Candidates would camp out in New York and L.A. and would rarely venture a few miles inland.
"This is how we elect literally every other position in the country and it works fine."
Really? All other elected officials are per-state, right?
This one is done differently because it *IS* different!
You don't want to give any states a reason to secede from the union. If they don't have an equal interest in all federal matters, they probably won't be happy remaining in the union.
You know that a "state" is a country, right?
In some regards, Trump’s victory achieved the very outcome the Founding Fathers sought to enable, in that it allowed a geographically neglected smaller part of the country to assert itself against the popular vote. It’s just unfortunate that the candidate in tune to them was the wrong candidate for many reasons.and yet the EC elected donald trump, basically proving that the EC as practiced doesn't give a shit about foreign intervention or the "whim" of the masses.
That's an easy one. Your vote counts as a single vote, exactly the same as every other vote in your state. The president is elected by the states, not by the people.96 posts in, and I've yet to read an explanation on why my single vote should count for less than another person's single vote.
Silly idea. Imagine the Florida recount fiasco but now for the entire country. Candidates would camp out in New York and L.A. and would rarely venture a few miles inland.
Ha! Have you really thought about it?A state is not a country
Oh. Let's not give the STATES an equal bearing on the presidential election then!... and states already don’t have an equal interest in all federal matters.
Except you missed the post mortem of the election where the overwhelming majority of Clinton's campaign message was that "Trump is bad and I'm good". Clinton ran a lazy and emotionally centered campaign and she lost bigly.
https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/3/8/14848636/hillary-clinton-tv-ads
It was a complacent campaign to be sure, but at the same time, she actually had experience, competence and fleshed-out policies to back things up. There's literally zero doubt that Trump's campaign was based purely on emotion. "Make America Great Again! A total ban on Muslim immigration! Lock her up!" His goal was to keep you scared, mindlessly patriotic and blind to his own corruption, and gullible people like you fell for it.
Interesting that this article was written long before Trump's election
It does sound like a flawed system. What is the reason for this tendency to believe everything long-dead guys came up with must be unimprovable? Surely they intended things to evolve with increasing knowledge? Seems to me they were, really, just stumbling around in the dark. Yet somehow its gotten a bit ossified since.
I find it quite funny that the original intention was for whoever came second in the Presidential election to become Vice-President. So it would currently be VP Hillary with President Trump? Sounds like the plot of a sitcom.
https://www.huffingtonpost.com/eric-black/10-reasons-why-the-electo_b_1971020.html
Emotions matter though. Voters have them, not much mileage in just telling them they are wrong to do so.
Politicians flip sides all the time. I mean take the wall for example. Most Democrats for for a wall before they were againdst it. Take John McCain. He stuck his finger in the wind to see the political wind before making statements. So meh. Bottom line is eliminating the EC is a bad idea.
Silly idea. Imagine the Florida recount fiasco but now for the entire country. Candidates would camp out in New York and L.A. and would rarely venture a few miles inland.
That's an easy one. Your vote counts as a single vote, exactly the same as every other vote in your state. The president is elected by the states, not by the people.
As I said earlier in the thread, Democrats certainly didn’t have a concern over the electoral college when they won the White House.
Funny how Americans didn't want a monarch, yet instead some of them worship some long dead guys as if they possessed the divine right of kings, coupled with magical powers to foresee the future.
Politicians flip sides all the time. I mean take the wall for example. Most Democrats for for a wall before they were againdst it. Take John McCain. He stuck his finger in the wind to see the political wind before making statements. So meh. Bottom line is eliminating the EC is a bad idea.