New BTX system

[TheGeek]

I am selling my current PC and am going to upgrade to the new Intel "Alderwood" CPU. I was wondering if I shoud go for a new BTX motherboard, or stick with ATX.

 

[Todd33]

Ya, get in your silver Dalorian and use the flux capacitor, go get one. Pick up a Nvidia 6900U while you are "there".

 

[Hyperlite]

erm and when are you going to do this? are you conveniently intimate with the heads of Intel, a case manufacturer, and a mobo manufacturer? you DO realize that none of that stuff will be availible for several months...right?

 

[skace]

Originally posted by: Todd33
Ya, get in your silver Dalorian and use the flux capacitor, go get one. Pick up a Nvidia 6900U while you are "there".

lol

 

[Zebo]

lol

 

[DeeKnow]

I personally wouldn't bother... ATX works well, and will continue to be the mainstream for years

 

[Insane3D]

LMAO!

 

[Bassyhead]

i would stick with ATX for a little while longer also

 

[Nebor]

You'll need a BTX compatible motherboard too.

 

[azndelite6983]

Originally posted by: PsychoYoda
I am selling my current PC and am going to upgrade to the new Intel "Alderwood" CPU. I was wondering if I shoud go for a new BTX motherboard, or stick with ATX.

As far as I know, Alderwood is a mainboard chipset and not a cpu - you're probably talking about the new presscotts due out?

If you need to upgrade now, you really have to ignore BTX. But it might be worth waiting for another month or so fo a top of the line pci express system.

 

[imported_dualblade]

maybe someone can help me out because i don't really understand the push for btx, or even the design reasons for it's creation. now looking at the pc world, a solid percentage of computers are in tower format (as opposed to desktop). this being said, motherboards are being mounted vertically. why would you change the design of a motherboard so that the cpu socket is towards the bottom and away from the rear?

in the current atx format, when the heat rises, it gets pulled through the power supply fan on the inside of the case (which most power supplies seem to have now) and out. granted, this does put a bit more heat through the power supply but i dont' think we've been having massive power supply failures up to now so apparently it's not an issue.

also, the position of the cpu socket on atx makes it very easy to duct hot air and have the rear case fan exhaust it. if you've even been inside a dell machine, they have these plastic ducts to help keep the case cool. seems like the btx cpu position makes it harder to duct air out, seeing as the cpu is more towards the middle of the case. are we going to be seeing side case fans (in the door) from oem's soon, as that seems to be the simplest way of getting rid of hot cpu air?

thanks for any info that can be provided, as right now i'm just seeing this change as counterintuitive. seems like the atx cpu position was really well thought out.

 

[3chordcharlie]

In theory, BTX helps control heat problems, makes sure your IDE cables are never too short to reach your drive bays, guarantees that a 'btx-designed' expansion card will fit in your case (stupid long-pci!), solves world hunger, and brings peace to the middle-east.

In practice... don't hold your breath waiting for stores o be flooded with this form factor.

 

[Carbonadium4]

So there should be ATX PCI Express mobo release soon right ?

 

[oldfart]

BTX offers MUCH better/quieter cooling than the ancient ATX which has been around since socket 7 days. BTX has a dedicated heatpath from the front of the case to the rear for the CPU. This is not (easily) possible with ATX design. The CPU heat is is dealt with in a separate thermal zone/path instead of a big heat plenum like ATX is. Its not here yet, so you will have to stay with ATX unless you want to wait for awhile.
BTX pic
BTX pic2
You can see the dedicated airflow path

 

[Insane3D]

Wow, thanks for the pics oldfart. I had only done some cursory reading on the new BTX standard to this point, but those pics have made me want to know more. I really like the airpath, as well as the fact the AGP card will be core up...very interesting.

 

[3chordcharlie]

I'd agree that the heat path seems well thought-out...

However, even ignoring the lack of current availability, BTX is not a 'great' standard. It is very focused on the CPU, and my guess is by the time it achieves any kind of market penetration, we will be using Pentium-M / athlon-64 style chips, hopefully with power consumption returning to 25-40 watts. If not, my next PC may be an sff with a via chip in it!

Providing a good heat path may help a little, but my biggest complaint about ATX is the noise level, and as long as we have PCs that consume 200-300 watts of power on an ongoing basis... keeping them quiet will remain difficult and costly.

 

[imported_dualblade]

wow, thanks for the pics. i had not envisioned a direct duct like that but it seems like it will be pretty effective

 

[Regs]

Originally posted by: oldfart
BTX offers MUCH better/quieter cooling than the ancient ATX which has been around since socket 7 days. BTX has a dedicated heatpath from the front of the case to the rear for the CPU. This is not (easily) possible with ATX design. The CPU heat is is dealt with in a separate thermal zone/path instead of a big heat plenum like ATX is. Its not here yet, so you will have to stay with ATX unless you want to wait for awhile.
BTX pic
BTX pic2
You can see the dedicated airflow path

Yes, for Intel it's good as always. AMD, no.

 

[oldfart]

Its a better airflow design period. It doesn't matter what the CPU is. Why would a more efficient, direct, quiet airflow system be bad for any CPU?

 

[Macro2]

It may be a better design to cool the CPU but the rest of the box suffers.

 

[azndelite6983]

Originally posted by: Macro2
It may be a better design to cool the CPU but the rest of the box suffers.

This is true. However, the cpu is still the main contributor of heat to the inside of your system because almost all other elements (psu, gpu) can exhaust the air outside of the case and the HD's usually have their own intake cooling path.

And although today the cpu may not be the most expensive part ($500 gpu's) it is usually the hardest to replace and the most unstable. A moderate oc can dramatically increase cpu temps, while the same on a vid card doesn't really do too much.

This problem can be fixed in today's ATX systems by adding intakes in the side panel and a blowhole on top, but I think the point of BTX is to make the heat a non-issue for the casual (=cheap) pc (cough* dells).

 

[tch65721]

Originally posted by: oldfart
Its a better airflow design period. It doesn't matter what the CPU is. Why would a more efficient, direct, quiet airflow system be bad for any CPU?

It wouldn't, but BTX hasn't been proven to be any of those those admirable things. However it is guaranteed to be costly. I don't know about you but I tend to buy quality cases and power supplies and I reuse them. I''ll reserve judgement but I'm not eager to absorb a major expense for what I see as a meager gain.

 

[Macro2]

RE:"but I think the point of BTX is to make the heat a non-issue for the casual (=cheap) pc (cough* dells)."


The point was to cool the spaceheater known as the Prescott. Since Dell is Intel only, I expect Dell to adopt it. Down the line, when BTX is a joke and Intel is elling Pentium Ms on the desktop, Dells will look aweful proprietary again.

Put BTX is the category with RAMBUS. Another failed attempt by Intel.

 

[oldfart]

Originally posted by: tch65721

Originally posted by: oldfart
Its a better airflow design period. It doesn't matter what the CPU is. Why would a more efficient, direct, quiet airflow system be bad for any CPU?

It wouldn't, but BTX hasn't been proven to be any of those those admirable things. However it is guaranteed to be costly. I don't know about you but I tend to buy quality cases and power supplies and I reuse them. I''ll reserve judgement but I'm not eager to absorb a major expense for what I see as a meager gain.

Haven't seen pricing yet. I dont see why it would be costly. Maybe at first like anything new, but once the aftermarket mfgs are cranking out cases, they should be no more than an ATX case. Same with the mobos. If it is a little extra, the benefits are worth it anyway.

 

[DerwenArtos12]

Originally posted by: oldfart
BTX offers MUCH better/quieter cooling than the ancient ATX which has been around since socket 7 days. BTX has a dedicated heatpath from the front of the case to the rear for the CPU. This is not (easily) possible with ATX design. The CPU heat is is dealt with in a separate thermal zone/path instead of a big heat plenum like ATX is. Its not here yet, so you will have to stay with ATX unless you want to wait for awhile.
BTX pic
BTX pic2
You can see the dedicated airflow path

That isn't BTX, its an inverted ATX design. With BTX on that side of the case the expansion slots would have to be at the bottom. Anandtech BTX article with picture of BTX case

I like the case for ATX though. The separate heat channel over the ram, cpu and probably the north-bridge, would be nice.