New Hercules 3D Prophet 4500 with Kyro 2 ............ !

[Hanky]

Daemon_UK

Fortunately I don't need Babelfish to read your link...anyway the Mitrax-Review is not about the Kyro2, just like you said.

 

[Daemon_UK]

Hank, I know the review is not about the KYRO II, i never said it was!!

What I am trying to say, is the KYRO does 5234, but the KYRO II is reported to do 5225
with 3D MARK 2000 1.1

 

[powervr2]

this topic should be in top of this forum

 

[powervr2]

the new kyro answer to the 3dmark is:

lol

hey 3dmark guys please Build a decent benchmark...

 

[Hanky]

Daemon_UK,

OK, sorry. I misunderstood you!

Btw: 3D Mark2000 sucks anyway.

 

[Hanky]

I doesn't make sense to discuss PREview benchmarks of the Kyro2 and compare them to other reviews anyway. Let's just wait for some real Kyro2 review.
But right now, what you observed is really strange, Daemon_UK...there must be something wrong or just a simple explanation.

 

[powervr2]

what !!!
is this true?
kyro 2 web site
16 bit kyro 2 better than 32 bits geforce ?

 

[powervr2]

I am to much pro kyro right now, that I didn´t noticed that they are comparing 16 bpp kyro II with 16 bpp geforce sorry

 

[Hanky]

Do you mean picture quality or speed? The latter wouldn't make sense...

 

[powervr2]

I mean picture quality...
and also speed in complex scenes...

 

[powervr2]

:|
well I navigate in all the 3d forums and here is a post that tells what kyro 2 could mean...

by the way he is talking aboy the old kyro


Geese says that :

" Being a long time fan of deferred rendering, I couldn't help purchasing one of these and throwing my GForce 2 in the bin 9Well, not quite).
Answers for you;
1. Generally speaking, how do Unreal/UT engine games play on the Kyro1?
Unreal and UT play quite well on the Kyro. Colour claity is very good for 16bit, which is what I play in.
One thing to note about the Kyro and its benchmarks is that they are not accurate records of how the card performs in games.

Benchmarks are an *average* of the card/system performance.

By saying that I mean that in some sections of the benchmark a standard card may be displaying 400 FPS (due to its fillrate), whilst the Kyro will only do 200FPS (due to its fillrate. Yet in other very complex scenes, the Kyro will outperform the other card due to its use of deferred rendering.
The benchmark is made of an average of FPS, so the other card will perform better than the Kyro, even through the Kyro may (at a set resolution) play at a perfectly acceptable frame rate.
For example, Kyro scores around 70 frames in timedemo 1 on Quake 3, yet plays as good in-game as it does on my GF2 at 1024. Furthermore, the Kyro in most cases can keep a more consistent framerate and not slow down in complex scenes as it employs deferred rendering.
A sore point for the card are games that use alot of transparency though. This eats the fillrate and the Kyro can hit a wall in some sections of games and drop FPS. This is usually only a quick experience though.
"

 

[nortexoid]

Check out the Kyro2 urinating on the geforce 2 MX and keeping up w/ a 64MB GTS Prophet II...

here

 

[Hanky]

<< keeping up w/ a 64MB GTS Prophet II... >>



While the GTS had just an Athlon 800 as support and the 4500 ran on a 1.2gig system...a good article nevertheless, but it's just like they said: between MX and GTS level...doesn't that mean Geforce1 DDR by the way?

 

[nortexoid]

that's true...but it would definitely beat a geforce ddr...it's probably between a geforce ddr and 32MB GTS...

nonetheless, a decent card for the price...

 

[powervr2]

I dn't want to repeat myself but...

well ...
I think the old benchmarking should end !!!
they must give us the average frame rate and the lower frame rate achieved....
what would this new kyro achieve in the LOWER FRAME RATE ????
I think better than even geforce 2 gts... or even better... (tile rendering is great in complex scenes lots of overdraw)
even kyro I is doing great in these department...

what good is 200 fps frame rate if you get 15 fps in some scenes ?????
all the benchmark in this world sohuld give us the lower frame rate !!!! ONLY !!!!

if the fps doesn´t get lower than 30 fps you will not be able to distingish from 300 fps and 60 fps average ...

 

[Soccerman]

C'mon Anandtech we need a good article on this card (and info on what it really is!)..

please!

 

[nortexoid]

agreed.

 

[DARRIN]

Kyro Syrup??

hehehe

 

[Teatowel]

Well, the Anandtech review speaks for itself. I'm just unhappy that I bought an MX recently

 

[RoboTECH]

thank goodness I didn't buy that GTS-U after all

it'd be a shame to waste $350 on a card that only marginally outperforms (and in some cases gets BESTED by) a card that is less than half as expensive.

 

[Alfred]

I am going to sell my geforce mx to somebody and get that kick-ass graphic card.


Alfred

 

[pidge]

Well, not to play devils advocate but I would wait for a report from other users about quality drivers. Tile based rendering is very hard to make drivers for that can actually pass Microsoft's WHQL certification. And several game developers were against NVIDIA going to tile based rendering when they bought 3dfx's patents. This card looks good so far...very good. Much better deal than the Radeon IMHO. Just wait a while if you want. Some people go out and buy a card and get so frustrated that they sell it before the drivers are given a chance to mature a bit. I am tempted to buy it. Probably will for fun. Who knows.

 

[miniMUNCH]

But Pidge...the game developers don't want to spend money refactoring their POS game engines. Hell, most decent games of 2000/2001 run off one of about three or four engines. They think they have it bad, what about all the hardware companies who have to support 95, 98, ME, 2000, NT4, Linux, and now XP. Especially the graphics card companies themselves, have to support OpenGL and DirectX too...programmable vertex shaders here, 8 texture multipass rendering there.

AS A MATTER OF FACT, THOSE GAME COMPANIES CAN SHUT THE #@$% UP AND GIVE US SOME TILE RENDERING GOODNESS!!

oh man...got stop posting when I'm drunk.:Q

Edit: Microsoft can't make OS that passes WHQL testing and DirectX equals POS Object-Oriented Mess.

 

[powervr2]

yap if they supported (software companies) tile rendering in the old days (pcx2) powervr cards we would get an even better priced kyro now... (less transistors) why???
because the translation from traditional rendering to infinite planes (infinite planes are what the kyro internaly is working) are done on fly by some of the kyro transistores...
I was one of the guys who buyed the pcx2 in the wold days of voodoo1 vs pcx2...
those cards (pcx2) required those software companies to programe on infinite planes (they didn't want this infinite planes aproach to win because they had to learn another way to do 3d games...)the required translation could be done via software (drivers) but that would kill some frames... I think that was what gave the low fps on directx games...(and some of the problems)

what was the response of the powervr (kyro) side ???
well they build a chip for sega that actually hide from the developers this complicated infinite planes ....
this card from the outside is not different from the others...
did you think that if it was different it could achieve better fps in games that was programmed for nvidia's cards?
nop...
the problem maybe a driver issue. I don´t know, cause when in monster truck outside the benchmark routine all goes well...
read more carefully the article...

sorry about my english...
if you want some of this powervr information go to a powervr site they are out there...
http://www.pvr-net.com/links.html

sorry about my english...

 

[powervr2]

hum...
I was thinking...
and if the developers start to optimize their games for kyro 2 ?

i.e. start not DOING the removal of some of the overdraw via software? what is the use to do that if the card do that in hardware ???? (waste cpu cycles that is)

I think not do something is easy to do ... don't you think ???

we will get even better numbers FOR SURE !!!
let's hope that kyro II will not get forgotten like the rest of the others players...