No activation XP Home??

[RebateMonger]

Dooyas,

While it's nice of you to reply, I suggest you do some more reading about Microsoft's policies regarding activation of major-brand OEM XP and why, in this case, changing the Key won't help.

Any attempt to ACTIVATE a major-brand OEM version of XP will result in a telephone call to Microsoft. At that point, it's Microsoft's decision to allow or deny the Activation.

BestBuy likely used the eMachine version of XP on this (now) Gateway motherboard, which is why it failed and required Telephone Activation.

If BestBuy had used a Gateway version of XP on the (new) Gateway motherboard, it wouldn't have required Activation.

This repaired PC needs one of these three things:
1) Microsoft to allow the activation
2) A Gateway OEM version of XP to be installed
3) A brand-new Retail or "Generic" OEM version of XP to be installed

 

[Dooyas]

I think you need to reread my post.

On the bottom of his computer is a sticker from MS, that is his product key. I can pretty much assure you this key has never been activated. Reason why is because all the companies do is use Nortons Ghost to image over the drive with the same generic CD key. If he activates that cd key, which by the OEM rules states can only be used on 1 system, then he is fine. Because that key has never been activated.

Why do I know this? Because about 3-4 times a week I do that. I do it for a living, I know what the OEM rules are about this, and it states the OEM key can only be used on 1 system. That OEM key has never been used.

As for tatooing, it is a legit process sponsered by MS and HP and Compaq, I am unsure if Gateways and Emachines have the tool and instructions for thier systems to do it. I am not talking about hacking anything or cheating MS, this is something both companies allow us to do. Otherwise we would not have the instructions from both companies to do it.

 

[Panther505]

Originally posted by: Dooyas
I think you need to reread my post.

On the bottom of his computer is a sticker from MS, that is his product key. I can pretty much assure you this key has never been activated. Reason why is because all the companies do is use Nortons Ghost to image over the drive with the same generic CD key. If he activates that cd key, which by the OEM rules states can only be used on 1 system, then he is fine. Because that key has never been activated.

Why do I know this? Because about 3-4 times a week I do that. I do it for a living, I know what the OEM rules are about this, and it states the OEM key can only be used on 1 system. That OEM key has never been used.

As for tatooing, it is a legit process sponsered by MS and HP and Compaq, I am unsure if Gateways and Emachines have the tool and instructions for thier systems to do it. I am not talking about hacking anything or cheating MS, this is something both companies allow us to do. Otherwise we would not have the instructions from both companies to do it.

The DUH part that you are missing is that MS disallows the keys that are on the OEM stickers that go on systems. So that sticker does not even have the "one" activation that you think it does on it, which is why calling in and talking to MS doesn't work either way. as they are saying that it should be actived by SLP (the BIOS locking install process) and it is not.

Panther505

 

[bsobel]

Originally posted by: pcgeek11

If he gets the same type of motherboard, absolutely. But a completely newwer one is an upgrade, what else would you call it?

To clear this up once again...
The motherboard was replaced by the OEM Service Center with a motherboard Deemed by the OEM as a replacement for the original that is not available anymore. This is in keeping with the agreement of the OEM EULA as set down in writing by microsoft.

Quoted from MS System Builders

"If the motherboard is replaced because it is defective, you do NOT need to acquire a new operating system license for the PC. The replacement motherboard must be the same make/model or the same manufacturer?s replacement/equivalent."

It should be honored by Microsoft and activated.

pcgeek11

Pcgeek11, I'm sorry I think I confused the topic more than I meant to. My comments where directed at Stonesoldier and the situation he referenced. In your case it's clear this should be allowed and its annoying to see that its not happening smoother for your friend.

Sorry if you thought my comment was directed at your situation.

Bill

 

[Dooyas]

Well in the experiance I have had with MS and the vendors over the last 6 months is this....

We install a new motherboard, re-tatoo the set up to match that board AS PER INSTRUCTIONS FROM MS AND VENDORS, and the system works again.

But that is when using the same motherboard. If it is not the same motherboard then install using an OEM version and the key on the bottom of the the system, that OEM key has been licensed to E-Machines which is carried over to Gateway who owns the motherboard.

Which should have been done before the system was given back to the customer from the Geek Squad.

This is in the SOP and training guide in Canada. I am fairly certain that it is the same as in the States.

The system I assume out of manufacturer warrenty, and chances are he has the extended warrenty, which means the Geek Squad should have given the system back to him in working order. If they can not figure out how to activate the copy of Windows, then they should be supplying the new one.

As per SOP, Standard Operation Procedures of the geek Squad and the PSP warrenty of Best Buy.

Now if he purchased the motherboard and had them install it, he is responsible unless they charged him the OS install.

But as I have stated, Best Buy is an official service depot for HP and Compaq, as such has access to certain tools and procedures off of HP's website that details how to reactivate a copy of OEM XP onto a system in this exact case. I am certain there is a same procedure for Gateway, but as I have not seen it then I can not be certain.

Point is, when it comes to manufacturers, they have a little more leverage with OEM liscenses. MS is not going to charge them every time they have to replace the motherboard, because when you get down to it, with laptops at any given time just in 1 store there is about 15-30 motherboards being replaced.

I know you will disagree with this, that is fine. This is just the way it works at service centres.

 

[VirtualLarry]

Originally posted by: pcgeek11

If he gets the same type of motherboard, absolutely. But a completely newwer one is an upgrade, what else would you call it?

To clear this up once again...
The motherboard was replaced by the OEM Service Center with a motherboard Deemed by the OEM as a replacement for the original that is not available anymore. This is in keeping with the agreement of the OEM EULA as set down in writing by microsoft.

Quoted from MS System Builders

"If the motherboard is replaced because it is defective, you do NOT need to acquire a new operating system license for the PC. The replacement motherboard must be the same make/model or the same manufacturer?s replacement/equivalent."

It should be honored by Microsoft and activated.

pcgeek11

Suing MS for a breach-of-contract might be an interesting twist to all of this.

 

[John]

Originally posted by: VirtualLarry
Suing MS for a breach-of-contract might be an interesting twist to all of this.

In this particular case it's the OEM system builders responsibility and not MS.

 

[RebateMonger]

I'm thinking about the "re-tatooing" operation.

In this case, you'd need to flash the Gateway BIOS with the name "eMachine". Then, you could use the original eMachine BIOS-locked version of XP. Of course, none of the system drivers would be correct. You'd have to install many of the special (for a laptop) drivers.

Once you flash the BIOS with the "special" BIOS, you could likely never flash it again, since eMachine's flashes would not be correct for the Gateway motherboard, and Gateway's flashes would be refused since this is now an "eMachine" PC.

 

[pcgeek11]

bsobel,

It's cool It seems a lot of people are confused as to the exact circumstances and jumping off the track. I understand Microsofts view point exactly in this case with the SLP install... What I don't understand is the tech center where the laptop was repaired giving it back in that condition. Don't they boot it and test it after a MB swap... it is obvious at least they didn't this time or they would have seen the problem.

Dooyas,

I don't want to stir you up dude, but hell reworking the BIOS to think it is an eMachine would create more confusion and isn't a real fix anyway. Best Buy should have just coughed up a new OEM license to begin with. Quick and easy.

I hope to find out something this week??? They are slow. When I do I'll post back up.

pcgeek11

 

[Dooyas]

No where did I say you needed to mess with the Bios.

The HP procedure is a simple fix that happens in windows that takes about 4-5 mins. Heck it may even work in the Gateway laptop.

Procedures are to test the system before calling the customer, usually we will update the system and do a quick diagnostic on it. Of course some times things fall through the cracks, and certain things get missed.

But basically from my understanding of the procedures other OEM's and MS have put into place, if a repair depot does the replacement then the OEM liscense stays in tacked.

My advice, take it back to BestBuy and just tell them, fix it. If they say no, ask to use the phone and call either the 1-800-BestBuy or 1-800-Geek-Squad numbers while they stand there. No point in yelling or other things, we tend to just turn those customers away.

 

[pcgeek11]

No where did I say you needed to mess with the Bios.

Dooyas,

What do you think re-tatooing is anyway? It is writing into the BIOS the identification data for the SLP installation. So the installation of the OS recognises the motherboard as a Gateway, HP or ...

pcgeek11

 

[Shawn]

Keep calling back until you find a rep that'll activate it.

 

[pcgeek11]

Well the latest update to this fiasco is... The laptop came back from the Service Center Exactly like it left " Not Activated ". Believe it of not.

Finally the local service manager ( that must have been evry bit of 20 years old ) said if he couldn't get it in the next two days he would give the owner a new Windows XP Home License. Finally the voice of reason comes through.

All I have to say is I wouldn't recommend Best Buy extended warranty to anyone... Under any circumstances... ever.

pcgeek11

 

[RebateMonger]

Originally posted by: pcgeek11
Finally the local service manager ( that must have been evry bit of 20 years old ) said if he couldn't get it in the next two days he would give the owner a new Windows XP Home License. Finally the voice of reason comes through.

Wow. That's ridiculous. Best Buy should have handed the laptop owner a new Retail copy of XP Home at the first sign of trouble. Any other action is WAY too costly for Best Buy's Service Department and, of course, in terms of Customer Satisfaction.

 

[pcgeek11]

Update Information:

Best Buy made the amazing discovery that the service center installed the wrong mother board... Wow it's a Gateway instead of an eMachines. They sent it back once again to have a new motherboard installed. This Notebook has more air time flying back to the service center than a SAC Bomber during the cold war. I for one am shocked at how screwed up BBs service department has become.

pcgeek11

 

[SoundTheSurrender]

I've reactivated my OEM verson of Windows XP home on many upgrades, then when I stopped using that pc I transferred it to my laptop and I didn't deal with any problems there.

 

[Whoaru99]

Originally posted by: Panther505

Originally posted by: Dooyas
I think you need to reread my post.

On the bottom of his computer is a sticker from MS, that is his product key. I can pretty much assure you this key has never been activated. Reason why is because all the companies do is use Nortons Ghost to image over the drive with the same generic CD key. If he activates that cd key, which by the OEM rules states can only be used on 1 system, then he is fine. Because that key has never been activated.

Why do I know this? Because about 3-4 times a week I do that. I do it for a living, I know what the OEM rules are about this, and it states the OEM key can only be used on 1 system. That OEM key has never been used.

As for tatooing, it is a legit process sponsered by MS and HP and Compaq, I am unsure if Gateways and Emachines have the tool and instructions for thier systems to do it. I am not talking about hacking anything or cheating MS, this is something both companies allow us to do. Otherwise we would not have the instructions from both companies to do it.

The DUH part that you are missing is that MS disallows the keys that are on the OEM stickers that go on systems. So that sticker does not even have the "one" activation that you think it does on it, which is why calling in and talking to MS doesn't work either way. as they are saying that it should be actived by SLP (the BIOS locking install process) and it is not.

Panther505

Uh, evidently not in all cases they don't.

I was given a dead eMachines box that had the OEM license key decal on it. I also had a copy of a Dell OEM XP Home disk from another dead computer.

Just for fun, I loaded this DELL OEM disk onto a new build using a Gigabyte mobo and a new, blank HD.

When I went on-line to activate the install, the hidden DELL OEM key didn't work, so I just typed in the key number off the eMachine decal and it went right though with no problems.

 

[Dooyas]

Sorry for the trouble with BestBuy pcgeek.

From the point of view at our location we do have hiccups now and then, but to be honest more often then not if a customer buys an extended warrenty on a computer they will get thier money's worth.

Today I installed a new harddrive into a laptop that was 3 weeks out of manufacture warrenty, they would not cover the cost the customer had to. It was 55 weeks old, cost $1200 to begin with, and an extra warrenty would have cost $250 extra. She would have had to pay $130 for a HD, $89 for a data back up and $59 for the OS install. (I was nice and only charged her for the HD, which I will most likely get in trouble for later) So, her warrenty cost would have been made back in that one problem, plus she would have had 2 more years coverage if anything else went wrong.

I understand not everyone likes warrenties, and for the most part misunderstand a lot of fine points on it. But for the average user that is not able to rip apart computers and rebuild them, I do recommend one. Even though I would not buy one myself.

But I did mention earlier that Bestbuy should be fixing this, one way or the other. The extended warrenty would be covering it. (And it would have been figured out before you even knew it was back in the store if I was doing it. )

 

[pcgeek11]

From 12/28/2006 until 02/03/2007. That is how long it took for BB to finally get his laptop back to him in a working condition after they screwed the pooch on a motherboard replacement under warranty which took two weeks to do prior to this mess.

Final results = They replaced the motherboard again using an eMachine Motherboard M6810 is the model number I think. It activated without any further issues. 8 weeks total time lost on a simple MB replacement. Stay far away from BB " Tech Support " IMO anyway.

pcgeek11

 

[JEDIYoda]

you say--Gateway bought eMachine, That makes Gateway the OEM, the EULA allows the OEM to replace the motherboard with the same or THEIR Equivalent as quoted from the system builder information at microsoft..

The problem is simple it doesn`t matter that Gateway now owns emachine. That has no bearing. When the machine was bought eMachines had not sold out yet!!

 

[Shawn]

Ok, I just reread through this thread and Dooyas is 100% correct! In order for Microsoft to have allowed you to activate you would have had to reinstall Windows. The version of Windows that comes with OEM computers comes with a key that is NOT the same as the one on the bottom. Basically the OEM version checks the bios to make sure it's the right motherboard. That way they can just use a CD image to install windows on every computer they sell without needing to enter a product key for each one.

HOWEVER, you can reformat using a GENERIC OEM XP cd (like the kind you can buy from Newegg) and enter the Product ID at the bottom to install it. This key has never been used before and may or may not allow you to activate online. When I reformatted both of my parents Dell laptops using a generic OEM cd, I used the key at the bottom and it wouldn't activate online. All I had to do was call them, talk to a rep, and explain that it was a reformat of a Dell computer and that it was the only computer I used the key on and they activated the key for me.

 

[pcgeek11]

Originally posted by: Shawn
Ok, I just reread through this thread and Dooyas is 100% correct! In order for Microsoft to have allowed you to activate you would have had to reinstall Windows. The version of Windows that comes with OEM computers comes with a key that is NOT the same as the one on the bottom. Basically the OEM version checks the bios to make sure it's the right motherboard. That way they can just use a CD image to install windows on every computer they sell without needing to enter a product key for each one.

HOWEVER, you can reformat using a GENERIC OEM XP cd (like the kind you can buy from Newegg) and enter the Product ID at the bottom to install it. This key has never been used before and may or may not allow you to activate online. When I reformatted both of my parents Dell laptops using a generic OEM cd, I used the key at the bottom and it wouldn't activate online. All I had to do was call them, talk to a rep, and explain that it was a reformat of a Dell computer and that it was the only computer I used the key on and they activated the key for me.

You obviously didn't read the entire thread.

1. His PC was working when the MB Burned.
2. It was under BB Warranty.
3. They installed a replacement MB under warranty.
4. It was a Gateway MB they installed. Wrong MB was stupid.
5. He received it back wanting an activation ( due to a Gateway MB vice eMachine ).
6. When Gateway bought eMachine they also assume all Liability of eMachine.
7. It wouldn't activate online due to an SLP installation (eMachine ).
8. Microsoft wouldn't activate over the phone either with the key it was installed with or the key on the COA Label. That is trying numerous times.
9. It should have NEVER come back to the customer in this condition.
10. The customer shouldn't ever have to purchase a new OS license to get through a warranty problem.
11. It shouldn't ever take 8 weeks to repair / replace a motherboard.

XP was restored as eMachines do not provide customers with an installation disk, and the customer shouldn't have to buy a copy to get the warranty work completed. BB refused to provide him a new license and disk.

Believe me I know how activation works with OEM, SLP, BIOS Checks etc... This was BB screwing a paying customer over from the start and trying to take shortcuts to just get by, and it bit them in the @ss this time.

So tell me again how Dooyas is right? Be specific please, I'm all ears.

pcgeek11

 

[tcsenter]

XP was restored as eMachines do not provide customers with an installation disk, and the customer shouldn't have to buy a copy to get the warranty work completed. BB refused to provide him a new license and disk.

Its not BB responsibility to, they are not the OEM who has the licensing contract with MS. That would be Gateway's responsibility. In fact, the reseller never bothers with activation issues. Assisting the customer with activation issues is a really nice thing to do, but legally activation and licensing issues are between the OEM and the purchaser. BB probably didn't even perform the repair but sent it out to an authorized service depot.

Believe me I know how activation works with OEM, SLP, BIOS Checks etc... This was BB screwing a paying customer over from the start and trying to take shortcuts to just get by, and it bit them in the @ss this time.

Did you manually input the Product Key into the activation screen or use the 'change key' feature?

A possible reason that MS wouldn't permit the activation is because the Product Key you provided to them over the phone did not correlate with the INSTALLATION ID that you provided, because it was generated from a generic Product Key used by eMachines in its roll-out images.

 

[RebateMonger]

pcgeek11 is totally correct in his conclusions. Best Buy took somebody's money to assume an extended warranty. When the PC broke, Best Buy repaired it incorrectly, used the wrong motheboard, and handed back a useless computer. So, for eight weeks, the client had an ususable computer because Best Buy wouldn't admit it'd made a mistake.

Microsoft's OEM licensing rules are a mess, but Best Buy should understand the rules and know how to follow them.

 

[tcsenter]

You can't have it both ways. Either BB (via its contracted repair service) caused the activation problem by installing the wrong motherboard, or the correct motherboard was installed and the problem was Gateway's.

BB (via its contracted repair service) made a mistake and then corrected that mistake. There is no issue other than the time it took to sort things out.

Since BB doesn't do motherboard replacements on laptops, but uses manufacturer authorized or approved service/repair centers, it is questionable whether BB was ever at fault in the first place, but it deserves credit for discovering the real problem. According to his own words:

"Best Buy made the amazing discovery that the service center installed the wrong mother board...."

Microsoft's OEM licensing rules are a mess, but Best Buy should understand the rules and know how to follow them.

Best Buy did nothing wrong or improper WRT licensing rules. The reseller or service center NEVER bothers with activation or licensing issues. That is between the OEM and the customer.

The correct course of action here, according to Microsoft, would have been for the customer to contact Gateway and obtain another license. It is a nice thing for the reseller to do on the customer's behalf, but it has no responsibility to do so legally or contractually.