No Country for Old Men

[Syringer]

I did a search for "No country" but don't see any recent threads on the movie, so I figure I'd revisit the topic...

I'd been pretty excited to see this for a while now, and finally got a chance to get into the mindset to do so today--and in the end I was left somewhat satisfied but mostly disappointed.

I'll start with the obvious good points...the characters were all interesting in their own ways, the dialogue was pretty unique, and overall the film was done very very well from a production and director's stand point.

The rest of it though definitely left a sour taste in my mouth..

Maybe it was my fault for going into it with the expectation that this movie was supposed to be "deep" and not just your typical mindless action flick, but ultimately I found that it tried too hard to be the former, and ended up being just the latter.

To me it was basically two movies, the prototypical cat/mouse action flick between Brolin and Bardem, and what amounts to be soliloquies by Tommy Lee Jones' character. Jones' character was entirely worthless in the plot as he was basically a lazy cop that had no influence between Brolin/Bardem.

The Brolin/Bardem part of the story then, if it were separated as its own movie would at best be a "quality" B-level action flick. I feel like I've watched that same plot 2 million times before: dude finds money, bad guy wants money back, bad guy chases guy down Tom and Jerry style for a few hours and kills some random Mexicans along the way just because he can, bad guy fails for a while so he threatens to hunt down the helpless wife, etc.

Even then, Brolin's character was just so boring that I really didn't care or rooted for him in anyway. So he's an "all-american" rugged guy who's a Vietnam vet (as they had to mention twice in the movie) who doesn't care for his wife and somehow we're supposed to care if he lives or not? I suppose we don't, since he dies anyway..

The wife then that maybe we're supposed to care for was your typical passive, submissive woman who obeyed her husband's every word, and isn't the last bit curious as to what he does--yeah I didn't care for her either.

Bardem's character was probably the one redeemable point in the movie as the indestructible badass, but he was too fictitious in a Terminiator/Freddy Kreuger/Jason kind of way for me to take him, or this movie seriously.

That brings me back to TLJ's character again then, it feels like all his scenes were forced into there to make the movie's point that "violence/morals are bad in today's" world through his elongated, drawn-out dialogues which had no bearing on the plot whatsoever. He was an awful, lazy cop who seemed like he'd rather talk to the younger cop about life than to actually take action himself--and again I ask, we're supposed to feel something for his retirement, which happened in the midst of a cold blooded killer loose out there?

Without him we'd have a mindless action flick, but with him in there the story just dragged while we waited for the mindless action.

Woody Harrelson's character = even more worthless, lazy, and stupid

The action scenes then were just as cartoonish as any Friday the 13th movie I'd ever seen--Brolin actually out ran a pickup truck after being shot, jumped into a river with a dog chasing him and outswims him until he finally shoots it?

Plus the "coin flip" scenes at the gas station and with Brolin's wife at the end, more attempts at symbolic crap that actually don't mean anything.

Not that I expect action scenes in any movie to be realistic in any sense, but please..

Finally, I won't say too much about the ending, but I feel like your average movie goer will "accept" it just because it was different and since the rest of the movie was put together so well that the ending became acceptable.

I don't care what the intent to it was, it's a movie, give me an ending--don't Sopranos/Syringer me at the end.

 

[SoulAssassin]

Ok, there's been like 400 threads on this and you are a little late to the dance but I'll bite and reply. First things first, I didn't like it. Sucked ass. The info below (with SPOILER warning) helps but the movie still sucked.

"NO COUNTRY FOR OLD MEN is an ALLEGORY.

The title is from the first line of Sailing to Byzantium by William Butler Yeats, a poet classically trained and considered by many to be the greatest 20th Century poet.

Death is Anton Chigurh. His hair style (hood-ish, shroud-ish) and black clothing suggest Death. Death kills the innocent as well as the guilty and has his own set of rules. When the witness to the high-rise killing asks, "Are you going to kill me?" Death answers, "It depends. Do you see me?" When the kids on the bicycles help him after the car accident he tells them, "You didn't see me." If you see Death, you die; if not, you may live. Chigurh seems to come and go at will and seems to know where Moss is without trying very hard. His rules are his rules and they seem arbitrary and random. He is referred to by the sheriff as a "ghost" and he seems to be able to go wherever he pleases.

Death kills with a cattle stun gun, almost like a member of the clergy administering a cross to the forehead of a parishoner. Death is often portrayed as a hooded figure with a scythe; in this case he's a "hooded" figure with a cattle stun gun.

Man is Llewellen Moss, part sinner, part saint. He is offered a deal with Death when Death offers to ignore his wife but take him. Instead, Llewellen challenges Death and chooses declines the offer. This is straight Faustian bargaining. By declining Death's "This is the best deal you're gonna get" Moss signs not only his own death warrant but his wife's, too.

Llewellen challenges Death to a showdown and when his wife tells the sheriff, "He won't quit, neither. Never has." the audience expects a later showdown because we've been trained to see the protagonist take on the antagonist at the climax of a story ? but before that can happen life's randomness gets in the way and the Mexicans kill him. This is the major turn in the movie and the one that takes the sail out of the audience, which has been cheering for Man in his struggle against Death without realizing it.

Free Will is Carla Jean. She chooses at the end of the film not to allow Death to be random. She has a 50% chance of saving herself but chooses not to avail herself of the opportunity. She is the bravest of the lot, choosing to die by her own decision and not the randomness of Death.

The sheriff is the philosopher trying to understand the universe. He cannot and is defeated by Death in his attempt. At the movie's end the Sheriff bemoans the fact that God never entered his life. One of God's creatures, Death, was in the Sheriff's life but he didn't realize it (see "Scene with Sheriff" below). The story is the Sheriff's, his quest to understand Life, and the dream he tells at the end of the movie explains that his own father, long dead, has gone before him into the darkness of death and awaits him.

Interesting parallel ? Moss pays money for a coat as he crosses into Mexico; Chigurh pays the kids money for a shirt after his accident. What is meant by that? Cannot be a coincidence.

Chigurh walking away from the accident at the end shows that Death cannot be stopped. It will always walk the streets. It is a part of our existence forever.

Scene with the Sheriff and Death at the same hotel room at the same time but the Sheriff does not see Death. This scene is vital ? it solidifies the allegory. The Sheriff enters the room but does not see Death and so he does not die. Death sees the sheriff but chooses not to kill him because he's not seen in return. This scene is the "supernatural" scene which signals that we've watching an allegory, that what we've been watching is more than it appears.

 

[TheShiz]

twas an excellent flick. the atmosphere of the thing alone had me transfixed.

 

[destrekor]

the whole movie was meant to be very different. It was more or less just extra content to prove the title, and the ending is essentially a tie up with the real main character. It's really more of a shallow movie than I expected, but was enjoyable. Not really one I'll be purchasing though. Seeing it once satisfied me.

 

[gorcorps]

I thought it was a pretty shitty movie, actually most of the movies from last year that got all sorts of hype I thought were shitty such as:
No Country for Old Men
There Will Be Blood
Michael Clayton

 

[AccruedExpenditure]

The movie was an allegory
-AE

 

[LS21]

Originally posted by: TheShiz
twas an excellent flick. the atmosphere of the thing alone had me transfixed.

word

 

[Locut0s]

Fantastic film and like most of the best of films not for everyone.

 

[Deeko]

I hated the last half hour. It wasn't the filmmakers fault though, they did a great job. They were just sticking to the book's story - I have beef with that. Good movie, dumb story.

 

[Syringer]

Originally posted by: AccruedExpenditure
The movie was an allegory
-AE

Wtf are you doing on AT in Vegas? Epic fail.

 

[evident]

Originally posted by: Syringer

Originally posted by: AccruedExpenditure
The movie was an allegory
-AE

Wtf are you doing on AT in Vegas? Epic fail.

srsly.

http://antonsduckhunt.ytmnd.com/

 

[zinfamous]

2nd greatest film of the year, next to TWBB. easily.

And yeah, there are far too many threads explaining why. Taste is one thing, but actually thinking that this was a "shitty film" or "stupid" is asinine. It's fine if people prefer Vin Diesel and shit, but realize that your appreciation of those type of flicks exclusively precludes one from an objective opinion about what makes film good. Opinion = taste. But believing something (especially without trying to justify that belief) that runs counter to the consensus doesn't make it so.

anyhoo...OP: first time I saw NCFOM, I hated the ending. pissed me off. Then I saw it again. Once you realize that Tommy Lee Jones is the main character, you may think as differently as I have.

 

[zinfamous]

Originally posted by: Deeko
I hated the last half hour. It wasn't the filmmakers fault though, they did a great job. They were just sticking to the book's story - I have beef with that. Good movie, dumb story.

That's exactly what I thought at first. Then I changed my mind. It really does work and is necessary....considering that the ending is this story.

 

[Red Dawn]

It might have been the best Movie of that year but overall it's a forgettable movie much like "There will be Blood". 5 years from now nobody will even mention it when they talk about good movies of the past.

 

[Mucho]

For a movie so many people did not like seems it spawn like 400 threads which has to be a record. The movie reminds me of Bergman The Seventh Veil except instead of a game of chess its a gunfight.

 

[destrekor]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn
It might have been the best Movie of that year but overall it's a forgettable movie much like "There will be Blood". 5 years from now nobody will even mention it when they talk about good movies of the past.

No Country might just be spared that due to it being the Coen brothers. Their stuff tends to live on with a cult-like following.

 

[0roo0roo]

if it weren't made by the coen brothers people wouldn't be bending over backwards to defend it.

 

[AccruedExpenditure]

Originally posted by: Syringer

Originally posted by: AccruedExpenditure
The movie was an allegory
-AE

Wtf are you doing on AT in Vegas? Epic fail.

Seeing as I just got home I think no.
-AE

 

[Buck Armstrong]

I saw it at the theater, and was a bit disappointed as well. But when I watched it again at home (HD OnDemand), I loved it. Many of the Cohen Bros. movies are like that; the first time I saw Miller's Crossing, my brain hurt from trying to figure out all the angles. Watching it again convinced me it was one of the best mobster movies ever made, and to this day I love everything about it, from the soundtrack to the dialogue.

There are two main things that I wish No Country had included:

1. The last conversation between Llewelyn and Chigurh seems to be setting up an epic confrontation. Chigurh makes it clear that even if he hands over the money, its too late to save himself, and Llewelyn, who already told the Col. "maybe he should be afraid of me...", responds with "I'm going to make you a special project of mine". So why didn't we get to see the fucking thing? Even though the story makes it impossible (see below), we could have at least seen a Tommy Lee vs. Chigurh fight.

2. Skipping the showdown between Llewelyn and the Mexicans is just plain bullshit. You can tell by the bodies laying around and the wounded Mexican crawling away that it was quite a shoot-out, and that Llewlyn took several of them with him. This could have been the best scene in the movie, and the fact that the main character (who I really found myself cheering for) is suddenly removed from the story off-screen just fucking sucks.

 

[UnatcoAgent]

Amazing movie, one of the best from last year.

 

[Deeko]

Originally posted by: Buck Armstrong
I saw it at the theater, and was a bit disappointed as well. But when I watched it again at home (HD OnDemand), I loved it. Many of the Cohen Bros. movies are like that; the first time I saw Miller's Crossing, my brain hurt from trying to figure out all the angles. Watching it again convinced me it was one of the best mobster movies ever made, and to this day I love everything about it, from the soundtrack to the dialogue.

There are two main things that I wish No Country had included:

1. The last conversation between Llewelyn and Chigurh seems to be setting up an epic confrontation. Chigurh makes it clear that even if he hands over the money, its too late to save himself, and Llewelyn, who already told the Col. "maybe he should be afraid of me...", responds with "I'm going to make you a special project of mine". So why didn't we get to see the fucking thing? Even though the story makes it impossible (see below), we could have at least seen a Tommy Lee vs. Chigurh fight.

2. Skipping the showdown between Llewelyn and the Mexicans is just plain bullshit. You can tell by the bodies laying around and the wounded Mexican crawling away that it was quite a shoot-out, and that Llewlyn took several of them with him. This could have been the best scene in the movie, and the fact that the main character (who I really found myself cheering for) is suddenly removed from the story off-screen just fucking sucks.

I didn't even realize it was him at first - I saw the body and thought it was a Mexican. I had to rewind and look at his shirt to realize it was him. Really stupid.

*cue the "omgz you dont understand!!! its soooo deep lol! he wasn't even really the main character GOD why can't you understand the beauty lol!11!!!11" responses*

 

[zinfamous]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn
It might have been the best Movie of that year but overall it's a forgettable movie much like "There will be Blood". 5 years from now nobody will even mention it when they talk about good movies of the past.

I disagree. TWBB, esp, will be talked about for some time to come. It's probably going to become more an more popular, esp if the overall quality of American film continues its decline.

PT Anderson is the next Kubrick. Even Boogie Nights is still highly regarded among the critics and you here it being cited from time to time. Magnolia moreso.

 

[zinfamous]

Originally posted by: Mucho
For a movie so many people did not like seems it spawn like 400 threads which has to be a record. The movie reminds me of Bergman The Seventh Veil except instead of a game of chess its a gunfight.

The Seventh Seal?

Or is that a direct translation from Dutch?

 

[zinfamous]

Originally posted by: Deeko

Originally posted by: Buck Armstrong
I saw it at the theater, and was a bit disappointed as well. But when I watched it again at home (HD OnDemand), I loved it. Many of the Cohen Bros. movies are like that; the first time I saw Miller's Crossing, my brain hurt from trying to figure out all the angles. Watching it again convinced me it was one of the best mobster movies ever made, and to this day I love everything about it, from the soundtrack to the dialogue.

There are two main things that I wish No Country had included:

1. The last conversation between Llewelyn and Chigurh seems to be setting up an epic confrontation. Chigurh makes it clear that even if he hands over the money, its too late to save himself, and Llewelyn, who already told the Col. "maybe he should be afraid of me...", responds with "I'm going to make you a special project of mine". So why didn't we get to see the fucking thing? Even though the story makes it impossible (see below), we could have at least seen a Tommy Lee vs. Chigurh fight.

2. Skipping the showdown between Llewelyn and the Mexicans is just plain bullshit. You can tell by the bodies laying around and the wounded Mexican crawling away that it was quite a shoot-out, and that Llewlyn took several of them with him. This could have been the best scene in the movie, and the fact that the main character (who I really found myself cheering for) is suddenly removed from the story off-screen just fucking sucks.

I didn't even realize it was him at first - I saw the body and thought it was a Mexican. I had to rewind and look at his shirt to realize it was him. Really stupid.

*cue the "omgz you dont understand!!! its soooo deep lol! he wasn't even really the main character GOD why can't you understand the beauty lol!11!!!11" responses*

I think the simple fact that his death pisses so many people off is what makes it effective. I felt cheated at first, as there was a setup for a showdown. And you don't even have to put any deepness into this to figure it out--as TLJ says, "I don't want to go out there and face something I can't understand."

You can expect the typical to occur here after being set up for it, but it just isn't going to happen. I don't see Cigurgh's actions being random in any way. He's highly motivated, and has a serious order to what he does. I think simply characterizing him as death is a bit short-sighted. He's simply some other reality. Out of place (haircut, dress, accent...etc). Thrown into this land that already understands violence, his is some form altogether unreal.

In this situation, you can't expect the "typical violence" and rules to apply. Frustration is expected...

 

[LS21]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn
It might have been the best Movie of that year but overall it's a forgettable movie much like "There will be Blood". 5 years from now nobody will even mention it when they talk about good movies of the past.

well, of the past 5 years, its one of the best movies ive seen... so....