Nokia's Resurgence

[corkyg]

Looks like Nokia's partnership with Microsoft is paying off.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-...-after-handset-profit-beats-its-estimate.html

More competition in this market is great.

 

[PricklyPete]

Good for them ... Not sure I would call it anything impressive just yet though. I would be very happy to see MS/ Nokia emerge as a true 3rd alternative.

 

[pantsaregood]

I think it may be too soon to call, but I would love to see Nokia and Windows Phone take off. I'm certainly no hater of either - I use a Lumia 920. My previous two devices were an HTC HD7 and HTC Titan.

Windows Phone marketshare has, in general, been increasing. The increase is, however, quite slow. The platform is slowly clawing to significance.

On this article specifically, I do believe that sales of Nokia's Lumia line would've been higher had Nokia been able to meet demand for the handset. Outside of America, the Lumia 920 and 820 have been plagued with availability issues. From what I understand, they were simply not capable of producing enough handsets to meet demand. Perhaps these figures were just as surprising to them?

EDIT: Also, I do believe it is significant that Nokia has become profitable. HTC is on the verge of not being profitable, as far as I'm aware.

 

[TuxDave]

Good to hear. I've always had a soft spot for Nokia.

 

[Dulanic]

Good to hear. I've always had a soft spot for Nokia.

Nokia's were always the best quality phones I had in the past... but that was pre smartphone.

 

[BladeVenom]

Looks like Nokia's partnership with Microsoft is paying off.

I wouldn't say it's paying off. Nokia use to be the number one phone maker before they partnered with MS. Now Samsung is selling more than ten times as many Android phones as Nokia sells Windows phones. Nokia has gone from number one to being a bit player. Partnering with MS has almost destroyed them.

They sold 9.3 million Asha smartphones. So why not say Asha is paying off? They still sold 2.2 million Symbian phones last quarter, and they are trying to kill off Symbian.

 

[magomago]

had the Nokia 920 not been a Windows phone and availlible for Tmobile, I'd be considering going for it since the Nexus 4 is just taking forever to get back into stock.

And it isn't that I have anything against the Windows phone, but I want to see it gain market share before I commit. Android and IOS are a no brainer in that regard.

 

[pantsaregood]

I wouldn't say it's paying off. Nokia use to be the number one phone maker before they partnered with MS. Now Samsung is selling more than ten times as many Android phones as Nokia sells Windows phones. Nokia has gone from number one to being a bit player. Partnering with MS has almost destroyed them.

They sold 9.3 million Asha smartphones. So why not say Asha is paying off? They still sold 2.2 million Symbian phones last quarter, and they are trying to kill off Symbian.

Nokia's position was dropping before the partnership with Microsoft was announced. They seemed pretty lacking of direction for a while.

 

[Mopetar]

They sold 9.3 million Asha smartphones. So why not say Asha is paying off?

Calling the Asha series smartphones is stretching things a bit. Not all of the models have touch screens and they're more similar to feature phones and are primary aimed at developing markets judging by the price tags. They're probably not making much profit from these.

 

[lupi]

sounds good, I hate the 2 brands only due to apps crap so going to 3 or 4 woul dbe good.

 

[Insomniator]

I wish I had bought more nokia stock... went up 20% today alone.

 

[386DX]

I'm glad Nokia is doing better and I think they made the right move going with Windows Phone instead of Android. If you look on the Android side and who's doing well there the only company that's really making money off Android is Google and Samsung and the Chinese company that can put out cheap phones. Even HTC the once poster child is having it's worst quarter despite arguably putting out there best phone. It just shows that in the Android space it's tough to make money with every company putting out new models every few months with just enough spec to bump the competition.

That being said I'm a bit confused at Nokia's choice with it's flag ship 920 phone. Firstly I think every phone should have expandable memory, there's no excuse for not having a microSD slot on your phone period... the lower end 820 phone has it the 920 should as well. Secondly while the wireless charging is a cool feature I don't think it was a good choice putting it in the phone. It added significant thickness and weight to the phone (185g phone is alot). IMO it would of been better to remove this feature that not many people are going to use and have a lighter, slimmer, cheaper phone. Or even put a larger battery (3000+ mAH instead of 2000) instead. Nokia's thinking is look how easy it is to charge your phone with no wires when if you had any common sense you would go if I had a bigger battery I wouldn't have to charge my phone during the day and not need the wireless charging. I hope Nokia (and pretty much all phone makers) stop this trend of skimping out on expandable storage and making phones with no removable batteries. They have to remember that a 2000 mAH battery that might give you 5 hours of screen time when new, will probably only give 4 hours in a year, and 3 hours in 2 years as the battery wears down.

 

[crisscross]

I have a Windows Phone 7.5 device (Samsung Focus) and while I would love to get the Lumia 920 in all probability i will end up with an Android phone. While, I haven't used WP 8 I do think that WP looks unfinished.

1. Let's say you mistyped a digit on a phone number and just want to add or delete it, it's an absolute nightmare with WP you will either select the entire number or take the cursor to the beginning or end of the phone number, neither the iphone or the latest version of android have this problem.

2. Want to quickly connect to Wifi or 3G for data access? you will need an app which creates a shortcut to the settings connections page on your homescreen, you then have to go in to the setting and slide the connection to on. On my friend's Android you have a toggle switch on the homescreen to switch off or switch on the connection and that saves you so many steps.

3. Skydrive integration is a nightmare on the phone. Let's say someone has shared an excel spreadsheet and has given me full edit permission, I still can't edit it on my phone since the Live account of the person who sent it is not the same as the default Live account on my Skydrive account on my phone.

Microsoft owns Office, Live and Windows Phone and still manages to screw up the functionality. This make me seriously doubt their ability to mount a serious challenge to Apple or Google.

I am not even going to go into the other big issues like lack of apps and other things. While it's heartening to see Nokia do well I really think it's for Microsoft to step up their game if not Nokia's positive earnings will only delay the inevitable.

 

[BladeVenom]

Calling the Asha series smartphones is stretching things a bit. Not all of the models have touch screens and they're more similar to feature phones and are primary aimed at developing markets judging by the price tags. They're probably not making much profit from these.

True, I called it a smartphone because the article labeled it as a smartphone. Most label it as a feature phone, and don't consider it a smartphone.

 

[Fire&Blood]

Nokia's were always the best quality phones I had in the past... but that was pre smartphone.

Loved my 8110.

 

[BladeVenom]

I'm glad Nokia is doing better and I think they made the right move going with Windows Phone instead of Android.

Before they announced they were going with Windows, Nokia was number one, far ahead of Samsung. Now they are far behind Samsung. I can't imagine them going with Android could have turned out worse than going with Microsoft. They also had the option of sticking to their original plan with MeeGo.

 

[Crono]

Nokia was still riding their old OS and dumbphones back then; they were losing their future if not actually losing in units sold. Emerging markets were booming with cell phone sales. Now the global demand is for smartphones - while MeeGo could have served them well, there chances might be better now with Microsoft and Windows Phone than it would have been with their own OS. It's hard to say for sure.

If you see what's going on with Blackberry, which has stuck with their own OS, we might see a kind of alternate scenario play out.

 

[WelshBloke]

I'm glad Nokia is doing better and I think they made the right move going with Windows Phone instead of Android. If you look on the Android side and who's doing well there the only company that's really making money off Android is Google and Samsung and the Chinese company that can put out cheap phones. Even HTC the once poster child is having it's worst quarter despite arguably putting out there best phone. It just shows that in the Android space it's tough to make money with every company putting out new models every few months with just enough spec to bump the competition.

They wouldn't have had to go with Android exclusively though.

Releasing both android and windows phones would have made sense until windows gained significant market share.

I doubt it would have been a lot of extra R&D either as they both run on the same hardware.

Just the nokia name would have given them a decent share of the Android market. They might not have outsold Samsung immediately but they would have sold everything they could have made, particularly in Europe.

 

[Crono]

They wouldn't have had to go with Android exclusively though.

Releasing both android and windows phones would have made sense until windows gained significant market share.

I doubt it would have been a lot of extra R&D either as they both run on the same hardware.

Just the nokia name would have given them a decent share of the Android market. They might not have outsold Samsung immediately but they would have sold everything they could have made, particularly in Europe.

What would have been awesome is if they had made the PureView 808 an Android phone. That would have made more sense as Android has a lot of photography apps and editing tools versus Symbian/Belle. Then they could have continued releasing high-end camera phones with PureView branding on a separate branch from WP8.

Nokia has the chops to compete against Samsung (Galaxy Camera) and even the camera companies like Nikon and Canon who are making WiFi connected "smart" digital cameras. They still can with Windows Phone, but it's a shame they had to limit the 808 by keeping it on their old system. I get why they did it - it showed they were still alive during the transition to the new partnership with Microsoft - but it still seems like a missed opportunity with such a high MP camera.

 

[darkewaffle]

I doubt Microsoft would have been [as] receptive to 'supporting' Nokia had they tried to produce both Windows and Android phones.

Meego was destined to go nowhere. I think with the market the way it is you'd have a really hard time gaining ground without a "name" to back you up. And at least in America, Nokia as a brand just isn't on the same level as Microsoft/Apple/Google.

Nokia may not have turned the corner entirely, I wouldn't be surprised to still see some unprofitable quarters ahead of them, but it's a slow climb. WP as a market player is in roughly the same position Android was around late 2009-early 2010; but because the market is much more saturated than it was then WP will of course be growing much much more slowly.

 

[MrX8503]

I wouldn't say it's paying off. Nokia use to be the number one phone maker before they partnered with MS. Now Samsung is selling more than ten times as many Android phones as Nokia sells Windows phones. Nokia has gone from number one to being a bit player. Partnering with MS has almost destroyed them.

They sold 9.3 million Asha smartphones. So why not say Asha is paying off? They still sold 2.2 million Symbian phones last quarter, and they are trying to kill off Symbian.

Sticking with an archaic mobile OS would be suicide.

 

[cronos]

Very surprised that I don't see a bunch of haters in this thread. I am really glad to see this development! I was originally a Nokia fanboy myself before I realized that fanboyism is stupid and became platform/brand-agnostic and equal opportunity basher (i.e. I will slam stupid stuff no matter what the brand is ). Having more options is nothing but good thing to us!

I still laugh though that there are people here who think that the label smartphone is defined by a touchscreen. That's just preposterous. Sure, the iPhone revolutionized the smartphones and took them to the next level with a touchscreen, but it doesn't mean that the Blackberries and the N and E series from Nokia that came out years before that (the original smartphones, when most people didn't know what a smartphone is) suddenly became dumbphones. That's just silly.

 

[WelshBloke]

I doubt Microsoft would have been [as] receptive to 'supporting' Nokia had they tried to produce both Windows and Android phones.

Meego was destined to go nowhere. I think with the market the way it is you'd have a really hard time gaining ground without a "name" to back you up. And at least in America, Nokia as a brand just isn't on the same level as Microsoft/Apple/Google.

Nokia may not have turned the corner entirely, I wouldn't be surprised to still see some unprofitable quarters ahead of them, but it's a slow climb. WP as a market player is in roughly the same position Android was around late 2009-early 2010; but because the market is much more saturated than it was then WP will of course be growing much much more slowly.

Microsoft wouldn't really have had a choice. They needed the phone OEMs more than the OEMs needed Microsoft.

I'm really hoping that nokia makes it though this, they are an innovative hardware and software manufacturer, but they seem to enjoy making life difficult for themselves at the moment.

 

[s44]

Nokia's been living off the Microsoft bribe payments for a while... not sure the transition to new Android devices would have been much faster -- i.e. too slow. And Microsoft wasn't going to pay them billions to be another split OEM.

Nokia's old problem, if you remember, wasn't just Symbian but their excruciatingly slow product/spec cycle. Now it's mostly that no one wants WP... though having HTC be the manufacturer who gets to use "WP" in the name can't help either.

 

[Red Storm]

I'll consider it a resurgence when we see consecutive quarters of increasing growth and profit.