Nv6800 and Nf3-250? ATi RS480 and the X800XT? Company optimizations swaying the market?

[DerwenArtos12]

Since I read the review for the Nforce 3-250 with it's many and obvious optimizations towards the FX5950 I have been wondering something. With the new cards just being debuted will the Nforce optimizations cary over into the new series of cards as prevalantly or even more prevalantly than they did with the 5950? And how severly will these inter-company optimizations change the upcoming NV40/R420 wars?

EDIIT: should I take this to video? I think it is in a gray area because it also involves the motherboards.

UPDATE:
Now with the slated release of a northbridge from teh people over at ATI how do you all think this will affect the market? Do you think that the ATI's will do better than their P4 predecessors and make a viable impression on the market? Do you think that ATI will make similar optimizations to their boards at Nvidia has done with their Nf3-250's?

 

[DerwenArtos12]

Bump, speculations welcome.

 

[Sunner]

How is nForce optimized for nVidia GFX cards?
While I didn't read every single word in Anand's review of the NF250, I didn't see any mention of this, if I just missed it, pardon my ignorance.

 

[JBT]

its in the 2nd review, Kinda how it does that... I would imagine the same would happen for the 6800 though

 

[NFactor]

Thats actually a really good point and one that i haven't thought of so far. I think we need to see benchmarks comparing results with chipsets.

 

[mboy]

Even if their is no optimization for it, that is still a winning combo

 

[DerwenArtos12]

Originally posted by: NFactor
Thats actually a really good point and one that i haven't thought of so far. I think we need to see benchmarks comparing results with chipsets.

I would love to see a comparison between the VIA used in the 6800 review and the combo of the 250 ES they have the the 6800 ES. If anyone who reads this is or is on a more personal basis with one of the reviewers if you would let them know. I think that this could really be a turning point for the market. I know ATI worked for awhile on their own chipsets but that never really took off. I can only imagine system fully designed by nvidia.

 

[InlineFive]

The so called "optimizations" are coming with PCI Express. When a nVidia 250 Chipset (or higher) is paired with a NV40 (or higher) the system AGP bus will accelerate to 20x instead of the AGP standard, 16x. If this will yield any performance is your guess.

-Por

 

[DerwenArtos12]

Originally posted by: PorBleemo
The so called "optimizations" are coming with PCI Express. When a nVidia 250 Chipset (or higher) is paired with a NV40 (or higher) the system AGP bus will accelerate to 20x instead of the AGP standard, 16x. If this will yield any performance is your guess.

-Por

I am refering to the currently existant optimization that were evident in the Nforce3-250 review in the second part. If they are here now with the current agp boards then they are obviously not coming with pci express or for that mater with the NV40 if they are there now with the NV38.

 

[DerwenArtos12]

Bump, I am quite surprised with the lack of traffic here.

 

[XBoxLPU]

Originally posted by: DerwenArtos12
Bump, I am quite surprised with the lack of traffic here.

Because maybe these "optimizations" you speak of do not exist

 

[ronnn]

Probably because it is such an awful thought. First pick the vid card - than decide which mb is optimized the best ......

 

[MemberSince97]

Originally posted by: mboy
Even if their is no optimization for it, that is still a winning combo

Seems to be....

 

[EarthwormJim]

I think the optimizations are just increasing the AGP bandwidth to the video card. So instead of running at agp 8x, the card will run at agp 10x or something (just throwing out numbers, but I think that's what it does).

 

[KristopherKubicki]

I wouldnt be surprised if RS480/RS400 has optimizations for ATI cards while NF3 has optimizations for NV40. I have a pretty good feeling the guys devel the graphics cards on their own chipsets - so that would only logically make sense no? Thats just me speculating though, dont consider any of that fact.

Kristopher

 

[DerwenArtos12]

Originally posted by: XBoxLPU

Originally posted by: DerwenArtos12
Bump, I am quite surprised with the lack of traffic here.

Because maybe these "optimizations" you speak of do not exist

Do you read the anandtech articles too, or are you just a forum person?

 

[Anemone]

Its going to be mostly done on Pci-e where the bus that should be x16 is actually made to run @ x20. There is speculation that some overhead in the bus itself can be put to use, but really no details on how it would be done, for obvious reasons. I did note that the 5950 ran better and that's not really shocking, nor was it really all that dramatic. While I do love the thought of Nvidia making their video cards and chipsets worth better together using Pci-e, my suspicion given the bandwidth already available for x16 slots, that you won't see anything really dramatic for improvements. To me, at least, 1-5fps is only dramatic if I'm down below 40fps. If I'm above that the tiny fps differences don't really say much. The bandwidth on a x16 slot is huge. The improvements should be somewhat tangible, and certainly this is the only slot to use going down the road, hence my upgrade decision this year. But to say that x16 to x20 is going to make something seem dramatically better is probably the marketing dept doing the talking again. My thought is, if you are headed to AMD and the Nforce 3, yes it will be a benefit to choose a 6800 based card if you are using pci-e. Is it a super strong reason to use a 6800? No. So make your choice based on what's good for you and if that comes with a few more fps then yay, otherwise its not going to be the end of the world. Personally I like Nvidia, but I like Intel too, so I won't be getting the benefit.

$.02

 

[Schadenfroh]

notice the nforce driver versions they used on the 250, i wonder when they will bother releasing those to the public

 

[Twsmit]

At this point its not worth speculating. The R420 could blow the NV40 out of the water, the NV40 could blow the R420 out of the water, or it could be neck and neck. The only thing for certain is that unless Via makes a greatchipset... we will all be getting NF3 250's. I think waiting for finished retail motherboards and videocards is when you should make a choice.

Maybe the GF6800 gets 3 more FPS, but who cares if the R420 gets 20 more than it? etc...... Right now the R420 isnt out and the nvidia stuff is reference with basic drivers. I think botht he mobo and video card have room to push and it would be best to wait until we can actually compair then side by side.

Though like someone said PCIe will bring out most of the optimizations if there are any to see....

 

[DerwenArtos12]

No-one has yet to comment on whether or not the ATI chipsets will be worth anything at all. I never used one of their P4 chipsets but I am sure someone on here has. I heard they were not worth their weight in crap let alone gold like the Nf chipsets. Anyspeculations as to if they have got it figured out and will have a contender for Nf3?

 

[DerwenArtos12]

Man this used to be a computer hardware place. Now it is ATOT, sad.

 

[KristopherKubicki]

DerwenArtos12: I do not have very high expectations for RS480. We all expected RS480 to have a true DX9 IGP- instead SIS, VIA and Intel (and maybe even NVIDIA) will all have DX9 IGP before ATI, which doesnt even have DX9 IGP on their roadmap yet.

ATI's first K7 chipset wasnt much either. I dont have very high expectations for any first gen chips, lets just put it that way.

Kristopher

 

[Dantzig]

What worries me is that instead of each company actually optimizing their motherboard chipsets for their graphics cards is that they will instead somehow actually penalize graphics cards made by other companies.

 

[KristopherKubicki]

Dantzig, while that seems probable, it would probably not occur. If ATI or NVIDIA were big enough, they probably would just create a proprietary interface like PCI-E-NV or something. Ho

If R420 is a better card, NVIDIA would be shooting themselves in the foot by making it perform poorly on its AMD systems. For 1. AMD would probably drop their license, and 2. everyone would start buying VIA or Intel boards instead

Kristopher