Nvidia 3D questions

[Knytestorme]

Hey all, just a (hopefully) easy question looking for an answer.

If I run a HDMI out of my NV460 setup (or 580 next week) into my panasonic 3D plasma will it work natively (ie with just needing the glasses from the TV) or do I still need to get the Nv3D kit? And is it better for 3D 1920x1080 to be running off SLI or will a single card have enough power to output playable framerates at good IQ?

 

[ViRGE]

For 3D to a TV, you only get 3D movies for "free". For games and everything else you need to buy NVIDIA's 3DTV Play software.

As for performance, keep in mind that 3D TVs only support 1080P24 and 720P60. So for games that means you'll be running at 1280x720 to get a smooth framerate, and that resolution is low enough that a single card should be plenty.

 

[Keysplayr]

For gaming, you'll still need the 3DVision glasses with emitter. As as a rule of thumb, I have found that whatever acceptable and playable settings are for your card in a given game, you'll need to drop it down 1 res (1920x1080 to 1680x1050) for playable settings in 3D. Don't forget, you are doubling the framerates required for standard gameplay when using 3D. Your GTX580 will be a Ginormous power boost over your 460.

 

[Knytestorme]

Hmm, thanks for the replies guys, didn't realise that about the 1080p24. That seems to imply that going forward even PS3 and 360 3D games will only ever render at 720p max :/

Slightly annoying about still needing to get the glasses kit as well, guess I'll scrap that plan and just worry about getting a 120Hz monitor as my next monitor upgrade.

 

[ViRGE]

With all due respect to Keys he's mistaken on this one. You have a 3D TV, not a 120Hz monitor. You don't need NVIDIA's glasses, you only need their cheaper 3DTV Play software to enable 3D to your TV.

 

[VeryCharBroiled]

fwiw at 1280x720 and 2 GTX 285s in SLI using 3DPlay on a samsung 46" 3D TV I get mid 50s - mid 70s for FPS on uengine Heaven demo. dx10, high, normal, 4x, none for settings. fullscreen, vsyc off.

virge is correct, I use the TVs glasses.

EDIT oops, had the card clocks set for folding. stock (for BFG factory OC models that is) clocks are high 50s to low 80s.

 

[Keysplayr]

With all due respect to Keys he's mistaken on this one. You have a 3D TV, not a 120Hz monitor. You don't need NVIDIA's glasses, you only need their cheaper 3DTV Play software to enable 3D to your TV.

Is the 3D TV not 120Hz? If he wants to use 3DVision and it's support for games, then yes, he will need the 3DVision glasses and emitter.

Of course, the TV has to meet minimum requirements for that to happen. A "3D TV" doesn't necessarily mean 3D gaming ready.

OP: Exact model of your TV please?

 

[OILFIELDTRASH]

Is the 3D TV not 120Hz? If he wants to use 3DVision and it's support for games, then yes, he will need the 3DVision glasses and emitter.

Of course, the TV has to meet minimum requirements for that to happen. A "3D TV" doesn't necessarily mean 3D gaming ready.

OP: Exact model of your TV please?

120hz, 240hz, 400hz TV's are still only really 60hz. Only way to get 120hz is with a 3d Pc monitor.

Also if he's going to end up using a tv for 3d gaming not only is the res limited to 720p the fps are capped at 30 while in 3D as opposed to a true 120hz monitor which can do 1080p at 60fps.

 

[SirPauly]

From my understanding, nVidia's 3dTV should work with the 1.4 HDMI TV manufacturers glasses included passive. There is no need to buy the 3d vision kit.

 

[ViRGE]

Is the 3D TV not 120Hz? If he wants to use 3DVision and it's support for games, then yes, he will need the 3DVision glasses and emitter.

Of course, the TV has to meet minimum requirements for that to happen. A "3D TV" doesn't necessarily mean 3D gaming ready.

OP: Exact model of your TV please?

3D TVs don't accept 120Hz. For plasmas they take a frame-packed signal over HDMI, split out the individual frames, and then display it at 120Hz. The TV in turn has its own proprietary glasses that are paired to the TV so that they are synced with the TV refresh.

And any 3D TV should be gaming ready. I mean, the only way a 3D TV could not be gaming ready is if it couldn't display 3D (in which case it's not a 3D TV), otherwise it supports 3D over HDMI and we have the scenario above.

http://www.nvidia.com/object/3dtv-play.html

NVIDIA® 3DTV Play™ software allows you to leverage the 3D processing power of your GeForce GPU to create an immersive 3D experience in your own home. Game night? Convert over 500 of the most popular PC games into immersive 3D environments. And photos never looked so real. Bring home the 3D theatre experience and surround yourself in the latest Blu-ray 3D movies. Relive the moments captured in your 3D photos as you browse them on your 3D TV or view them as a slideshow.

 

[Keysplayr]

Ah, ok then. Maybe the OP should pick up a 120Hz 3D monitor then for 1080p.

 

[VeryCharBroiled]

Also if he's going to end up using a tv for 3d gaming not only is the res limited to 720p the fps are capped at 30 while in 3D as opposed to a true 120hz monitor which can do 1080p at 60fps.

?

I run a 3D TV @ 1280x720, nvidia 3DPlay, with the TV glasses. I get 60 Hz display. IOW 60 frames *each eye* per second -- thats 120 individual frames the card has to send each second.

its the same as 60 hz on a standard LCD. but its two images (one each eye) at 60 Hz (FPS).

call it 120hz, 60 hz, whatever, but the upshot is a 3D TV @ 1280x720 gives the same *effective* frame rate as a 60 Hz monitor. 60 Hz (FPS if you want) x 2 eyes (or "frames" if you want). not 30.

 

[OILFIELDTRASH]

?

I run a 3D TV @ 1280x720, nvidia 3DPlay, with the TV glasses. I get 60 Hz display. IOW 60 frames *each eye* per second -- thats 120 individual frames the card has to send each second.

its the same as 60 hz on a standard LCD. but its two images (one each eye) at 60 Hz (FPS).

call it 120hz, 60 hz, whatever, but the upshot is a 3D TV @ 1280x720 gives the same *effective* frame rate as a 60 Hz monitor. 60 Hz (FPS if you want) x 2 eyes (or "frames" if you want). not 30.

Tv's are not capable of 120fps under any circumstances. Maximum is 60fps in 2d. Cut that in half and you're at 30fps which is what 3D does. There is no possible way that a 60hz tv is giving you 60fps per eye when it's not capable of going beyond 60fps. On top of that hdmi in it's current state isn't even capable of handling the bandwidth needed.

 

[ViRGE]

Tv's are not capable of 120fps under any circumstances. Maximum is 60fps in 2d. Cut that in half and you're at 30fps which is what 3D does. There is no possible way that a 60hz tv is giving you 60fps per eye when it's not capable of going beyond 60fps. On top of that hdmi in it's current state isn't even capable of handling the bandwidth needed.

No, VeryCharBroiled is right in this case. 3D 720P over HDMI is 60hz per eye. HDMI transmits a pair of images (left/right) using frame packing at 60hz. For a Plasma TV (which can easily display 120Hz), the result is a full 1280x720 image for each eye at 60hz.

Remember: TV's can't take 120Hz as an input; a number of them can do 120Hz as an output however. Frame packing is how you get around the input limitations.

 

[VeryCharBroiled]

No, VeryCharBroiled is right in this case. 3D 720P over HDMI is 60hz per eye. HDMI transmits a pair of images (left/right) using frame packing at 60hz. For a Plasma TV (which can easily display 120Hz), the result is a full 1280x720 image for each eye at 60hz.

exactly. the card sends a 60 hz signal, say 1280 x 1440 (thats one way, there are others). top 720 lines are right eye image, bottom 720 lines are right eye image. the tv splits image in half. it then displays *at 120 hz* the images. left, right, left, right etc each for 120th of a second.

so it is displaying 120 hz (120 discreet images per second). the glasses only allow each eye its respective frames so *you* see 60 hz.

so effective *to you* frame rate is 60 hz *when both eyes are taken into account* but the tv is displaying 120 images per second. thats the technical definition of 120 hz output.

input is frame packed 60 hz as virge said. output is 120 hz.

 

[Knytestorme]

In regards to which model I have it's the Samsung PS58C7000, no idea why my mind went to panasonic in OP :/

Again all, thanks for the replies though point is kind of moot now as I am going to go with a 6950 for a short-term upgrade until Ivy Bridge and next gen cards are out.