Discussion Nvidia Blackwell in Q1-2025

[DavidC1]

I can't believe how badly Nvidia is screwing up Blackwell. It confirms that human nature is cyclical, and react the similar under similar circumstances, making us repeat our mistakes over and over again.

4000 series were basically their Geforce 4 Ti series. So if AMD had a halo part, it would have been their R300 moment.

Blackwell-->Blackeyewell

 

[DAPUNISHER]

Top comment is spot on - "Meanwhile Someone Else on YouTube: "The RTX 5070 Ti is an OVERCLOCKING MONSTER and costs $749!"Yeah, no, man... Glad der8auer did this video right after."

 

[SolidQ]

new feature is add

https://videocardz.com/newz/first-geforce-rtx-5080-discovered-with-104-rops-8-missing-in-action

 

[ToTTenTranz]

new feature is add

https://videocardz.com/newz/first-geforce-rtx-5080-discovered-with-104-rops-8-missing-in-action

How are 7% less ROPs resulting in 13% lower performance in a benchmark? Even if Time Spy was exclusively fillrate limited, it couldn't be more than 7% slower.

Those lower binned chips probably have additional issues, like hitting lower clocks or additional caches disabled.


What a mess.

 

[SolidQ]

How are 7% less ROPs resulting in 13% lower performance in a benchmark?

need more investigation

 

[branch_suggestion]

How are 7% less ROPs resulting in 13% lower performance in a benchmark? Even if Time Spy was exclusively fillrate limited, it couldn't be more than 7% slower.

Those lower binned chips probably have additional issues, like hitting lower clocks or additional caches disabled.


What a mess.

It could be similar to 3.5GB.

 

[deasd]

Sorry but I can't help making meme for Blackwell, this is my first time making meme and it's also my true feeling on Blackwell since release. This looks like a perfect storm and in my memory Nvidia never screwed up like this before, even Fermi didn't.

I hope there would be no more new issue in the future otherwise the longer issue list needs bigger meme template.

 

[jpiniero]

You need to add "5070 slower than 4070 Super"

 

[Tuna-Fish]

How are 7% less ROPs resulting in 13% lower performance in a benchmark? Even if Time Spy was exclusively fillrate limited, it couldn't be more than 7% slower.

IIRC ROPs are dedicated to GPCs, with 2 clusters of 8 rops in each GPC, and work items in a GPC can only use the local ROPs. -1 cluster in a GPC means that there is now only one remaining, halving the raster performance for a single GPC. IIRC this should be less bad than the 3.5GB fiasco because there is some load-balancing across GPCs, work items stalling at the ROPs means that new work gets issued to other GPCs first.

 

[MrTeal]

IIRC ROPs are dedicated to GPCs, with 2 clusters of 8 rops in each GPC, and work items in a GPC can only use the local ROPs. -1 cluster in a GPC means that there is now only one remaining, halving the raster performance for a single GPC. IIRC this should be less bad than the 3.5GB fiasco because there is some load-balancing across GPCs, work items stalling at the ROPs means that new work gets issued to other GPCs first.

Techpowerup when testing Elden Ring at 4k got 94.3% of the performance of the 5090 reference using the 168 Zotac, while the ROPs are 95.5% of reference.
Just spitballing, but perhaps something more complicated is happening in the affected GPC that's causing stalls and greater than 1/2 a GPC worth of performance loss.

 

[igor_kavinski]

Nvidia can somewhat save this generation by making a single 5060 Ti SKU with 16GB VRAM for $450. But WILL they do it? Probably not.

 

[fastandfurious6]

AWOL ROPs funniest hardware defect ever lmao

blackwell is total flop

 

[MrTeal]

Nvidia can somewhat save this generation by making a single 5060 Ti SKU with 16GB VRAM for $450. But WILL they do it? Probably not.

A 40 SM cut of GB205 with 16GB (edit: or 12) at $450 really isn't out of line for a 5060 Ti. The 5070 would give you 20% more compute for right about 20% more money, though with less VRAM. I'd really rather they do that than release a $400 8GB model.
Now a $400 16GB would really stick it to AMD, but that's isn't something Nvidia really seems to care about.

 

[blckgrffn]

A 40 SM cut of GB205 with 16GB at $450 really isn't out of line for a 5060 Ti. The 5070 would give you 20% more compute for right about 20% more money, though with less VRAM. I'd really rather they do that than release a $400 8GB model.
Now a $400 16GB would really stick it to AMD, but that's isn't something Nvidia really seems to care about.

I am with you on this. $399 MSRP means maybe it’ll get there some day but a lot of options $420-$500. It’s just such a drag trying to do a PC build and realize how much a GPU with more than 8GB of ram costs from Nvidia. Not that the 4070 wasn’t a solid card but boy did the value fall off below that point.

 

[jpiniero]

I am with you on this. $399 MSRP means maybe it’ll get there some day but a lot of options $420-$500. It’s just such a drag trying to do a PC build and realize how much a GPU with more than 8GB of ram costs from Nvidia. Not that the 4070 wasn’t a solid card but boy did the value fall off below that point.

I have a feeling the 5060 Ti 16 GB will be $500.

 

[blckgrffn]

I have a feeling the 5060 Ti 16 GB will be $500.

I don't think you're wrong per se, but pricing it there with a "$550" 5070 is still dumb.

 

[jpiniero]

I don't think you're wrong per se, but pricing it there with a "$550" 5070 is still dumb.

Which is fine since they don't want to sell it. They want to sell the 8 GB model.

 

[Mopetar]

Nvidia can somewhat save this generation by making a single 5060 Ti SKU with 16GB VRAM for $450. But WILL they do it? Probably not.

At that rate things are going for Blackwell it might only come with 12 of the 16 GB, so I'd still hold off on a purchase as tempting as the price may be.

 

[gdansk]

GB206 with 8 and/or 16GB again seems more likely to me. Then they can do the 5060 Ti Super next year which is a chopped GB205.

 

[blckgrffn]

GB206 with 8 and/or 16GB again seems more likely to me. Then they can do the 5060 Ti Super next year which is a chopped GB205.

Competitively priced at $550.

 

[amenx]

Said this before and will say again. The buck stops with Jensen. The people in his company are more competent than him in many areas, and I believe he over-rides their counsel and his micromanaging style gets in their way too much.

No sane engineering team would approve the 12v2x6 connector on 600w cards without fear of losing their jobs. Therefore Jensen was the guy who OK'd it.
No sane marketing team would insult the intelligence of their consumers by calling a 192bit, 12gb card a 4080 only to have it reversed soon after. Jensen was the guy behind it.
The obsession with strict 2 year new gen launch cycles without flexibility can prove disastrous. 50 series needed to be pushed back, improved (preferably skipped until next process) and undergone better QC to ensure no cock-ups or oversights. Jensen again.

If I was a shareholder I would demand he be replaced. Dont care if he was in the top 3 best CEOs of a company, he was just lucky that the gaming business morphed into data centers and AI. The company is too often so amateurish its breathtaking.

 

[jpiniero]

No sane marketing team would insult the intelligence of their consumers by calling a 192bit, 12gb card a 4080 only to have it reversed soon after. Jensen was the guy behind it.

The xx4 die had been where the 80 card had been coming from for some time. They really could have called the 4080 16 GB the 4080 Ti... but well they didn't.

 

[igor_kavinski]

If I was a shareholder I would demand he be replaced.

You can't.

https://s201.q4cdn.com/141608511/files/doc_financials/2025/q3/NVDA-F3Q25-Quarterly-Presentation-FINAL.pdf

Page 7 and 8. Data center is bringing in almost 10 times more revenue than gaming.

 

[amenx]

You can't.

https://s201.q4cdn.com/141608511/files/doc_financials/2025/q3/NVDA-F3Q25-Quarterly-Presentation-FINAL.pdf

Page 7 and 8. Data center is bringing in almost 10 times more revenue than gaming.

Yes, true. Shareholder sentiment only follows bottom line. Regardless of any monumental screwups a CEO may be involved in with the smaller parts of the business.

 

[fastandfurious6]

Jensen has crazy positive PR around him, way beyond customers / gamers / enthusiasts, also is the OG founder 31 years ago.... virtually nobody can replace him

crazy conspiracy theory speculation: as TSMC fab capacity is limited, Jensen intentionally caused desktop blackwell failures to limit desktop production in order to produce even more data-center blackwell 🤪🤪