NVIDIA GP102 Titan coming soon

[JDG1980]

Nvidia is probably thinking, if Intel can charge $1723 for a measly 246mm^2 die, why can't they charge the same for one twice as large?

They've already driven up the price points generation by generation, from $499 (680) to $699 (1080) for what should be a $249 card based on die size. This is just the logical endpoint. Charging $1400 or more for what should be a $499 card would be the same proportional price hike.

Expect the next-gen Titan to be between $1400 and $1800 if it's released before the bigger Vega chip. GTX 1080 Ti will be $999 when it comes out. Titan won't go below $999 (for brand maintenance reasons), but the 1080 Ti may be lowered if needed to compete with Vega.

The timing of this is going to be tricky, especially if the October Vega rumors are true. (Of course, they may not be, and even if they are, it might refer only to the smaller GP104 competitor, not the bigger chip that will compete with GP102.) Nvidia has to wait long enough to milk all the big-spending early adopters with GTX 1080, then get them again with the new Titan. I'd be surprised to see it earlier than September.

 

[badb0y]

If it ain't $649.99, I ain't buying. Every time you concede a few bucks to nVidia they comeback the following year to to somehow get more money out of you.

 

[3DVagabond]

But the claim is that the cards are in very short supply. They can't be at the top of hourly updated sales lists, and be in very short supply, I don't think.

I think they are probably simply selling like ice cream in hell whenever stock arrives.

Plus, there is a different "hot new releases" list. The top 20 are entirely 1080 and 1070 cards, with two exceptions, a recently released AMD 360 card and a 950 card.

Actually without large numbers it would be only capable to be on top of time limited lists. It's easier to be the #1 seller for the last hour than for the last week, etc...

 

[3DVagabond]

You can't even buy some of the "top sellers" because they've been OOS for a while?

That's interesting. Shouldn't be possible if they have been out of stock "for a while". :sneaky:

 

[Silverforce11]

Nvidia is probably thinking, if Intel can charge $1723 for a measly 246mm^2 die, why can't they charge the same for one twice as large?

They've already driven up the price points generation by generation, from $499 (680) to $699 (1080) for what should be a $249 card based on die size. This is just the logical endpoint. Charging $1400 or more for what should be a $499 card would be the same proportional price hike.

Exactly this. Intel drops a $1.7K bomb and everybody is like "yeah... I guess since there's no competition, they can charge whatever they want."...

So NV sees this opportunity, there's no competition from AMD on the mid-range and high-end, so they can and they SHOULD if they have the cards ready, launch it ASAP at an inflated price to milk early adopters again. Profits are good man.

 

[RussianSensation]

Exactly this. Intel drops a $1.7K bomb and everybody is like "yeah... I guess since there's no competition, they can charge whatever they want."...

So NV sees this opportunity, there's no competition from AMD on the mid-range and high-end, so they can and they SHOULD if they have the cards ready, launch it ASAP at an inflated price to milk early adopters again. Profits are good man.

By now it's obvious that all high end cards are bad value at launch esp Titan series. The dual chip 295X2/Radeon Pro Duo/Titan Z are even worse. The target market these cards are after though seems almost completely price inelastic.

$1000 OG Titan -> 9 months later $399 R9 290
$699 780Ti -> 10 months later $329 GTX970
$649 Fury X / 980Ti -> 12 months later $370 discounted 980Ti/$420 1070

Don't forget that the Titan X generally sold in retail for $1100 not $999. It means it's possible to buy almost 2x 1080s for the price of a single Titan X or almost 3x 980Tis. Knowing how this plays out since the OG Titan or $650 780, since gamers keep buying, it's only logical for NV to keep raising prices. Why shouldn't they raise Titan X successor to $1299-1499 and raise 1080Ti to $799-899? I mean the midrange 1080 is selling out for $699. It would be stupid for NV to price 1080Ti below $799, unless AMD releases something very fast.

Some leaks I've heard point to 1080Ti having 3456 CUDA cores, while the full GP102 Titan will have 3840. Both cards will have 384-bit GDDR5X, with 1080Ti at 12GB and Titan at 24GB. Clocks speeds at about 1607 Boost or so. We'll see if this rumour pans out.

 

[CakeMonster]

If those rumored 1080Ti specs are right, I'm guessing they'll have to limit the OC potential somehow in order to not deliver more than ~30% next year. Gotta save up that potential for the next 3-4 years of 16/14nm...

 

[swilli89]

Amazon's top list is not a good measurement at all because their algorithm for getting stuff to the top is proprietary and arcane. They purposefully keep it hidden to try and stop people gaming the system. I've heard some really weird stuff about what improves your ranking in that list. It's a little like SEO where some tricks can put you higher than you ought to be.

Keeping in mind the list isn't meant to be a summary of success -- its a tool to drive more sales.

The algorithm changes depending on the item category as well. Below are just a couple easy to find links on how to game Amazon features to some degree. Note: it looks like grouping sales into a short time frame = higher on best seller list, perhaps even if your total numbers are lower.

http://okdork.com/2014/02/17/hit-1-amazons-bestseller-list/. https://moz.com/blog/amazon-seo-organic-search-ranking-factors.

All you can really deduce from an amazon best selling listing is that its at least selling to some minimum level, whatever that minimum is for the product category.

Can confirm, I've found all of this to be true in doing my own research on Amazon's rankings. They like to rank products that have a nice margin higher than other products.

 

[thilanliyan]

I'll stick to $600 and below I think.
I'd rather spend the extra on a vacation lol.

 

[Qwertilot]

1080ti will be a little cut down don't forget. Also the power budget should limit the stock cards.

As for pricing when when the ti rolls out, imagine NV haven't fixed it yet. 6xx to 7xx was a big rearrangement of course, Maxwell never did that. It'll presumably depend how well everything is selling/what AMD manage etc.

 

[moonbogg]

$1,200 Titan and $850 1080ti sounds reasonable. Well, its actually crazy as hell but they will all sell out instantly. The best part about this rumor is the legions of Nvidia warriors already planning to ditch their 1080's and get the timing right for maximum resale value...all before most of them even had a chance to install the damn things. LOL. I predict an ocean of 1080's on ebay in a few months. Gotta sell early! You can't wait for the 1080ti to get too close to release because it will damage the 1080 resale value, so you have to prepare to sell those 1080's now if you want to maximize resale value.
If 1080ti comes in at $650.00 to compete with Vega around the end of the year, then yes, 1080 resale will plummet only a few months after its release, so sell quickly.
1080 had a good run but its time is up now. All eyes are on Titan and 1080ti.

 

[NTMBK]

I predict an ocean of 1080's on ebay in a few months.

Is it possible to have an ocean when they only shipped 12 cards in the first place?

 

[moonbogg]

Is it possible to have an ocean when they only shipped 12 cards in the first place?

LOL. In my defense, I did say most people who bought them or will buy them, are already planning to sell them and they don't even have them installed. To clarify, it will rain 1080's for cheap money's everywhere. I just made sense. D:

 

[Aristotelian]

Any new tidbits here? Or is this going to depend on whether or not AMD pushes Vega out? I personally don't see how 1080 sales would be cannibalized by an earlier Titan/Ti release because I don't think many people buying 1080s tend to be in the market for USD 999+ (or whatever the new era of prices will bring) video cards.

And I think, as RS posted earlier, Nvidia is likely to push the upper limit for single gpu cards higher. I argued this in the Broadwell thread and lo and behold, the 6950x came out to roughly what I predicted it would be. I wonder if I jinx things by mentioning higher upper pricing ceilings...

 

[Timmah!]

Any new tidbits here? Or is this going to depend on whether or not AMD pushes Vega out? I personally don't see how 1080 sales would be cannibalized by an earlier Titan/Ti release because I don't think many people buying 1080s tend to be in the market for USD 999+ (or whatever the new era of prices will bring) video cards.

And I think, as RS posted earlier, Nvidia is likely to push the upper limit for single gpu cards higher. I argued this in the Broadwell thread and lo and behold, the 6950x came out to roughly what I predicted it would be. I wonder if I jinx things by mentioning higher upper pricing ceilings...

Yes, its all your fault

 

[Sweepr]

So Fudzilla was right.

NVIDIA has almost segments covered: GP102, GP104, GP106 on the market. Only GP107/GP108 left.

NVIDIA Announces “NVIDIA Titan X” Video Card: $1200, Available August 2nd

GP102
3584 SPs
1417MHz base
1531MHz boost
11 TFLOPs
12GB GDDR5X @ 10Gbps GDDR5X
250W TDP
$1200

NVIDIA isn’t offering any comparisons to GTX 1080 at this time, but relative to the Maxwell 2 based GTX Titan X, they are talking about an up to 60% performance boost.

www.anandtech.com/show/10510/nvidia-announces-nvidia-titan-x-video-card-1200-available-august-2nd

 

[jpiniero]

Kind of surprised they are releasing it so soon, especially with nothing from AMD going to be available for some time. Reduces their chances of double dipping.

Oh and couldn't they call it something other than "Titan X"?

 

[guskline]

This price doesn't shock me one bit.
Supply and demand.

Moreover, Nvidia has no reason to wait to release their new Titan, in this case Titan X if it is ready.

Sounds like a brute of a new Pascal card.

 

[linkgoron]

Very aggressive behavior from nvidia, I'm quite surprised that they're already releasing a Titan.

If true - 60% from Titan X would mean 30% from 1080?

 

[antihelten]

GP102
3584 SPs

This would be equal to 28 SM, so it must be a cut down chip with the full chip being 6 GPCs, 30 SMs and 3840 Cuda Cores.

Hopefully we'll get the fully unlocked version as the 1080 Ti, just like we did with the 780 Ti versus the Titan.

It's also interesting to note that the theoretical performance gap to the 1080 (24%), is smaller than what we got with the GTX Titan X to the 980 (34%) and the Titan to the 680/770 (45%/41%). Of course the GTX Titan X and the Titan where full size GX100 chips, whereas this is "only" a GX102 chip, but then again I still personally doubt we will see GP100 in the consumer space.

If true - 60% from Titan X would mean 30% from 1080?

More like 20% from 1080 (the 1080 is roughly 30% faster than the GTX Titan X).

 

[Timmah!]

Hah, now i guess i am glad after all the 1080 is released in such a slow manner and i still did not get one, as i am/was waiting for Hybrid AiO version....

Since i was thinking 2 cards, now i got bit of a headache. I assume single Titan is almost as much as 2 1080s, so which way to go? Since i want it for GPGPU and not SLI gaming, 2x2560 CC at 2GHz+ is actually going to give me more performance than single Titan. Then again, i could add later another one, even though next year at best, or 1080Ti or 1080...which would be faster than 2x1080. Obviously way costlier as well, but at least over longer time-span....

Difficult choice ahead. Did not expect this to happen so soon.

BTW, do you think there will be non-ref Titan with better cooler?

 

[3DVagabond]

Hah, now i guess i am glad after all the 1080 is released in such a slow manner and i still did not get one, as i am/was waiting for Hybrid AiO version....

Since i was thinking 2 cards, now i got bit of a headache. I assume single Titan is almost as much as 2 1080s, so which way to go? Since i want it for GPGPU and not SLI gaming, 2x2560 CC at 2GHz+ is actually going to give me more performance than single Titan. Then again, i could add later another one, even though next year at best, or 1080Ti or 1080...which would be faster than 2x1080. Obviously way costlier as well, but at least over longer time-span....

Difficult choice ahead. Did not expect this to happen so soon.

BTW, do you think there will be non-ref Titan with better cooler?

There never has been one. So, probably not.

 

[Arachnotronic]

Kind of surprised they are releasing it so soon, especially with nothing from AMD going to be available for some time. Reduces their chances of double dipping.

Is it better to be the only game in town or to have to share the spotlight with a competitor?

If it's ready, put it out there and sell it for what you can get for it. In this case, that's $1200. Why wait?

 

[USER8000]

So if this is $1200 and is 60% faster than a Titan X,how fast would this be over a GTX1080??

20%?? 25%??

So you can get a GTX1080 and a decent GSYNC monitor for the same price or less money??

 

[redzo]

Just hold on. 1080ti and Vega incoming.