NVIDIA Pascal Thread

[railven]

How do you determine that from the demo? For sure there is the possibility, just as there is the possibility that 2114 was the highest before artifact's started to appear. But how does a 60fps locked demo indicate one way or the other?

If you watch the demo again, the FPS meter never goes over 61 and keeps resting at 60. Exactly how my system does if I set the FPS limit to 59, it will bounce between 59 and 60.

Well, I can only assume there is more head room. Without a GPU Load meter, I can't guarantee it, but I'm will to bet there is some head room. They just didn't want to show their card hitting 70-80c, or higher.

Its locked because if its locked at 60FPS GPU dont work at 99% and you will have far better temperatures after OC.Just marketing trick and it works how i see it.Just wow.
Nv marketing is really briliant a people are blind to it.

Yeah, I pretty much assumed it was because they didn't want to show their card roasting haha. If it has more headroom, it's going to take it, and I'm pretty sure the 65-67c they showed during the demo is not where the card will start to throttle. He even mentioned the temps.

 

[LTC8K6]

The Inno3d card spec says it is 180 watts for the Founder's 1080, versus 165 watts for the reference 980, and 250 watts for the reference 980ti.

Seems unlikely that the 1080 would be roasting?

 

[railven]

The Inno3d card spec says it is 180 watts for the Founder's 1080, versus 165 watts for the reference 980, and 250 watts for the reference 980ti.

Seems unlikely that the 1080 would be roasting?

Roasting is subjective. I'd never run any of my GPUs > 60c.

And I wouldn't be impressed by a cooler that is letting a card hit >60c and FPS locked to 60.

 

[Grooveriding]

Sorry, but we just need to stomp out this idea asap because it's not true.

Again, I'm not trying to start arguments with anyone, just stating facts.

Guy here spoke with an nvidia rep at the event and confirmed all of this.

http://www.gamersnexus.net/news-pc/2427-difference-between-gtx-1080-founders-edition-and-reference

The "Founders Edition" is what nvidia refers to as "Bone Stock Reference Cards" now. They are -NOT- special in any way what so ever.

Yeah I did some more reading and hardocp put up an article on it. The founders card is the new name for the reference card. That's all it is. It's not entirely clear from the article, but it appears that it will always have a $100 MSRP markup for the lifetime of the card and going forward reference cards will be referred to as founders cards. The claim is that the reference cards are better quality than the cards the AIB use; 'better components'. Sounds like total horseshit to me. Reference cards usually are close to the bottom of the barrel for overclocking, noise levels and power delivery design. The blowers on reference TX and 980ti are airplanes. They also suffer from coil whine in my experience. My 780tis, Titans and TX all had coil whine under a high load. Conversely my experience with Classified cards is no whine whatsoever.

I guess the idea is that a reference card is more desired and demands a premium somehow ? lol ? I think the reality is that it's more a new way to get an extra margin off early adopters who want the card in the first month. It sort of also forces a $100 premium on watercoolers who tend to get reference cards because of block compatibility.

I'm interested to see how AIBs react in pricing their premium SKUs. You used to have your MSRP, and that is where reference cards and most AIB aftermarket cards sat at. Then you'd have a few premium models like the EVGA Classified or MSI Lightning that would get a $60-$100 markup. So now, for example, once everything is on the market will the EVGA Classified or MSI Lightning continue to be about $70 more than MSRP ? Or will it be $70 more than founders edition pricing ? Aftermarket cards are generally better than reference cards, so the founders will sell well initially when that's all that is available, then sales of those models will probably drop off once aftermarket cards show up.

I was planning to get a 1080 shortly to sit on until GP100 geforce comes. Nvidia wants the money I'd use for the waterblock and then I have to buy a block on top of that ? I'll wait for the 1080 Classified model and get that with block to hold me over until GP100 shows up. I can live with paying $1000 for Titan cards, but not giving nvidia an extra $100 just because they are constraining availability. Especially when you are talking reference cards which are bottom of the barrel designs with noisy coolers.

 

[Sweepr]

More Pascal details today?

https://*****/oYp99OREbQ

 

[exar333]

Yeah I did some more reading and hardocp put up an article on it. The founders card is the new name for the reference card. That's all it is. It's not entirely clear from the article, but it appears that it will always have a $100 MSRP markup for the lifetime of the card and going forward reference cards will be referred to as founders cards. The claim is that the reference cards are better quality than the cards the AIB use; 'better components'. Sounds like total horseshit to me. Reference cards usually are close to the bottom of the barrel for overclocking, noise levels and power delivery design. The blowers on reference TX and 980ti are airplanes. They also suffer from coil whine in my experience. My 780tis, Titans and TX all had coil whine under a high load. Conversely my experience with Classified cards is no whine whatsoever.

I guess the idea is that a reference card is more desired and demands a premium somehow ? lol ? I think the reality is that it's more a new way to get an extra margin off early adopters who want the card in the first month. It sort of also forces a $100 premium on watercoolers who tend to get reference cards because of block compatibility.

I'm interested to see how AIBs react in pricing their premium SKUs. You used to have your MSRP, and that is where reference cards and most AIB aftermarket cards sat at. Then you'd have a few premium models like the EVGA Classified or MSI Lightning that would get a $60-$100 markup. So now, for example, once everything is on the market will the EVGA Classified or MSI Lightning continue to be about $70 more than MSRP ? Or will it be $70 more than founders edition pricing ? Aftermarket cards are generally better than reference cards, so the founders will sell well initially when that's all that is available, then sales of those models will probably drop off once aftermarket cards show up.

I was planning to get a 1080 shortly to sit on until GP100 geforce comes. Nvidia wants the money I'd use for the waterblock and then I have to buy a block on top of that ? I'll wait for the 1080 Classified model and get that with block to hold me over until GP100 shows up. I can live with paying $1000 for Titan cards, but not giving nvidia an extra $100 just because they are constraining availability. Especially when you are talking reference cards which are bottom of the barrel designs with noisy coolers.

NV ref coolers have been pretty decent at stock levels. They are competitive with aftermarket coolers (like the Strix) from a noise level. Look at the 980Ti vs. Titan X. Pretty similar at load, although aftermarkets are a little more quiet at idle (which matters less honestly).

Not saying it is the best cooler when OCing, but NV ref coolers have been pretty solid for a while. That certainly can change in 2-3SLI configs or when OC'd, but general use is actually pretty good. Take that TX cooler and apply it to the 1080/1070 at 75w less TDP and it could be pretty darn good...

Also, you are making an assumption here without any information on the 1080/1070. Unless you have a source?

http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/asus_geforce_gtx_980_ti_strix_review,11.html

 

[exar333]

I couldn't do it, cause Im from europe. I searched across all google and didnt find europe portal.

But to answer your question. Yes, you need to register if you wont to have 3 year warranty from day when card was manufactured, not from a day you bought this card.

Unfortunately the days of paying cash for a GPU on the street corner and still getting a warranty are past.

 

[Grooveriding]

Also, you are making an assumption here without any information on the 1080/1070. Unless you have a source?

I outlined my experiences with recent nvidia reference cards in my post. I've used these blowers and they are loud. Before I got blocks for my TX cards they were like airplanes, loud is the word to describe that blower. We can assume noise levels won't be as loud with the Pascal cards because of less heat to dissipate. But the aftermarket cards will still be quieter than the reference blower. https://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/MSI/GTX_980_Ti_Lightning/22.html

The reference cards costing more than cards that are quieter, overclock better, have better power delivery and better overclock potential given equal chips is really odd. They are trying to attach a pedigree to reference cards that doesn't exist. Aesthetically the reference cards have looked quite nice since they introduced the design with the Titan. Functionally, the reference cards have not been as good as the aftermarket models.

 

[mkmitch]

I don't believe there is any special reason why the reference cards are more expensive other then they are going to offer them for sale for the lifetime of the card and can't compete with their business partners if they are going to sell them too. They are giving them a $100 to play with.

 

[railven]

I don't believe there is any special reason why the reference cards are more expensive other then they are going to offer them for sale for the lifetime of the card and can't compete with their business partners if they are going to sell them too. They are giving them a $100 to play with.

I already showed that NV was already charging between $50 to $100 more on their NV branded cards since 2010.

They just cut out the middle man, Best Buy, this time.

 

[Raising]

Managed to sell one of my 980tis for 580€ today, they cost 670€ new, phew..

Should I sell the other one and hold on with a AMD HD 5850 ?

Really want to play Overwatch though the release date is still 2 weeks away

 

[Aristotelian]

I agree. Unless going with Tri- or Quad-SLI, or using water blocks, the reference cards are a waste of $. They probably won't have 0% fan operation at idle/low 3D speeds, will still lag after-market cards in noise levels at load, component quality won't be as good compared to Military Grade and Asus Power Kit components, etc. Since now NV is jacking up the price of reference 1080 cards $100, we should have Gigabyte Xtreme for $699.

This is where it's getting problematic for me. As I've said dozens of times in other posts, I want to build an extreme pc around the 6950X soon. The 1080 looks like it'll be the fastest single gpu card at that time and I want to go either double or triple SLI. But, the reference cards seem to cost a lot for a special cooler that I don't need, and I'd be shocked if EVGA's waterblock versions (hydro copper) are reasonably priced. The only thing I've seen going for the refernce cards are Nvidia announcements that they are using "high quality electronics" (I'm paraphrasing), which could be useful from a watercooling perspective.

At this stage I'm waiting for reviews, and since this is my first watercooling build I'm not keen to splurge on a card including a super duper air cooler, because when I sell the 1080s down the line I'd bundle the waterblocks with them, to a watercooler looking for bang for the buck performance when I switch to Volta HBM2 flagship etc.

And I have to repeat that while I do get the "release the Ti later" thing, in this case with a new product cycle, why not release the Ti up front? The 980Ti was leaps and bounds better than the 980 and investing in a dual or triple SLI 1080 setup feels a bit like a waste of money with a 1080Ti looming, and yet I want to build a new PC now. This is one sector where being an enthusiast builder becomes rather costly, it's almost as if videocards are becoming flagship cellphones that become outdated so quickly and in countries like Japan are dumped on a 6 month or 1 year cycle. So, from a watercooler perspective, it seems better to invest significantly in the maximum chip and watercool that.

Colour me slightly confused...

 

[railven]

This is where it's getting problematic for me. As I've said dozens of times in other posts, I want to build an extreme pc around the 6950X soon. The 1080 looks like it'll be the fastest single gpu card at that time and I want to go either double or triple SLI. But, the reference cards seem to cost a lot for a special cooler that I don't need, and I'd be shocked if EVGA's waterblock versions (hydro copper) are reasonably priced. The only thing I've seen going for the refernce cards are Nvidia announcements that they are using "high quality electronics" (I'm paraphrasing), which could be useful from a watercooling perspective.

At this stage I'm waiting for reviews, and since this is my first watercooling build I'm not keen to splurge on a card including a super duper air cooler, because when I sell the 1080s down the line I'd bundle the waterblocks with them, to a watercooler looking for bang for the buck performance when I switch to Volta HBM2 flagship etc.

And I have to repeat that while I do get the "release the Ti later" thing, in this case with a new product cycle, why not release the Ti up front? The 980Ti was leaps and bounds better than the 980 and investing in a dual or triple SLI 1080 setup feels a bit like a waste of money with a 1080Ti looming, and yet I want to build a new PC now. This is one sector where being an enthusiast builder becomes rather costly, it's almost as if videocards are becoming flagship cellphones that become outdated so quickly and in countries like Japan are dumped on a 6 month or 1 year cycle. So, from a watercooler perspective, it seems better to invest significantly in the maximum chip and watercool that.

Colour me slightly confused...

Because then they don't have a refresh ready to go if needed.

The bigger Kepler essentially made up the top tier for the 700 series. I'm surprised they didn't attempt something similar this time, but with the node change coming they probably knew they didn't have enough time (ie why the 980 Ti was as is, and not a refresh akin to what 780/780Ti was to 680.)

This node is expected to last a while like the previous one, and with no idea where Vega lands, chances are big Pascal might not even see release as a 10-series. But that's just me basing it on NV waiting for Hawaii (AMD's second flagship chip) to counter with Big Kepler.

EDIT: I would even go so far as to say AMD may have something similar in mind. If Polaris 10/11 is 400-series, nothing stopping them from holding Vega10/11 for 500-series.

 

[exar333]

I outlined my experiences with recent nvidia reference cards in my post. I've used these blowers and they are loud. Before I got blocks for my TX cards they were like airplanes, loud is the word to describe that blower. We can assume noise levels won't be as loud with the Pascal cards because of less heat to dissipate. But the aftermarket cards will still be quieter than the reference blower. https://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/MSI/GTX_980_Ti_Lightning/22.html

The reference cards costing more than cards that are quieter, overclock better, have better power delivery and better overclock potential given equal chips is really odd. They are trying to attach a pedigree to reference cards that doesn't exist. Aesthetically the reference cards have looked quite nice since they introduced the design with the Titan. Functionally, the reference cards have not been as good as the aftermarket models.

I'm still not buying it. 42db isn't silent, but it sure isn't 50db+. It is 'acceptable' at stock. Again, your experience is your experience. You had multiple cards, with almost 100w more power on each vs. this first gen Pascal. I much prefer WC setups too, but the TX wasn't terrible. A similar cooler on a 160-180w card would likely be fine. 90% of most air-cooled GPUs will be in the same ballpark for noise.

 

[CHADBOGA]

Managed to sell one of my 980tis for 580€ today, they cost 670€ new, phew..

Congrats.

However I am astonished that the person who bought your card was willing to accept such a small discount on a secondhand card.

That is truly mindboggling to me.

 

[Arachnotronic]

Congrats.

However I am astonished that the person who bought your card was willing to accept such a small discount on a secondhand card.

That is truly mindboggling to me.

I sold my 980 Tis for $520 per, and I paid $599 for them

 

[exar333]

I sold my 980 Tis for $520 per, and I paid $599 for them

Nice!

I definitely agree with the approach to either (1) constantly upgrade and buy at launch sell before new product stack releases or (2) buy and hold forever. Those seem to be the least $$ in the long term.

Just because we are enthusiasts, and we may not mind dropping $2000 on GPUs doesn't mean I don't mind recouping some $$ on the back end. Hobbies are expensive, but if I can do it cheaper, why not?

 

[Sweepr]

Rumor: NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1080 much faster than GTX 980 Ti in 4K?

GeForce GTX 1080 4K gaming performance might just have been leaked through Chinese social media.

Video was posted by someone named Uing07, who apparently is an overclocker sponsored by EVGA (just guessing). His video compares GeForce GTX 1080 and GTX 980 Ti running four games in 4K resolution. Unfortunately performance was measured in different scenes, so it is not the best material for comparison (as always). However it should give you some impression about GTX 1080 performance compared to last gen GPU.

The GTX 1080 is most likely overclocked, or it simply boosts to high frequencies, which were not disclosed by the leaker. GTX 980 Ti performance seems to correspond to 4K Ultra benchmarks performed by GamerNexus (Witcher 3/GTA5)

And here’s what the original uploader had to say:

Oculus The GTX 1080 and GTX 980Ti game testing (4K, Ultra Setting) test items:

Just Cause 3, GTA 5, Dark Souls 3, Witcher 3;

Test results GTX 1080 is 49% stronger than the 980Ti, and the actual game scenes not the same, the data for reference only.

http://videocardz.com/59788/nvidia-geforce-gtx-1080-4k-game-performance-gp104-400-confirmed

 

[Kris194]

49% faster than GTX 980 Ti in 4K? Holy crap

edit

Different locations? Ok then, still waiting for tuesday.

 

[railven]

Nice!

I definitely agree with the approach to either (1) constantly upgrade and buy at launch sell before new product stack releases or (2) buy and hold forever. Those seem to be the least $$ in the long term.

Just because we are enthusiasts, and we may not mind dropping $2000 on GPUs doesn't mean I don't mind recouping some $$ on the back end. Hobbies are expensive, but if I can do it cheaper, why not?

Good ideology. Hobbies are suppose to be for pleasure/relaxation. Sometimes I feel judging by people's posts they aren't happy unless they have the best, and they are upset if they can't afford the best or refuse to pay for the best. (And here best is subjective because it will vary from person to person).

Again, these are corporations - they don't care for us outside of milking us dry. If you're going to get squeezed, at least make the best of it haha.

 

[xAlias]

49% faster than GTX 980 Ti in 4K? Holy crap

Seems like the 1080 was overclocked but still impressive performance!

 

[Timmah!]

More Pascal details today?

https://*****/oYp99OREbQ

So?

EDIT: Oh, a game. No idea what to do. Seems i gotta google whats binomial denominator triangle, LOL.

 

[mkmitch]

980ti's I've been watching on Ebay have sold for $450-$470 yesterday and so far today.

 

[railven]

Did you guys see this thing?

http://videocardz.com/59813/first-custom-geforce-gtx-1080-is-here-gp104-400-confirmed

Haha, isn't that the horrendous shroud MSI was trying to use to sell cheaper 980 Tis? (By cheaper, I mean like $20).

EDIT: Yes, yes it is

Welps, thats what they mean by "you don't get that fancy cooler" you can a dull thing on a reference board.

People who are looking to watercool, snag one and just toss that cheapo cooler away.

 

[exar333]

Did you guys see this thing?

http://videocardz.com/59813/first-custom-geforce-gtx-1080-is-here-gp104-400-confirmed

Haha, isn't that the horrendous shroud MSI was trying to use to sell cheaper 980 Tis? (By cheaper, I mean like $20).

EDIT: Yes, yes it is

Welps, thats what they mean by "you don't get that fancy cooler" you can a dull thing on a reference board.

People who are looking to watercool, snag one and just toss that cheapo cooler away.

Love the comments.

People complain that the Founder's edition is an extra $100 and then also complain this looks 'cheap' and might be closer to MSRP. LOL

I grabbed the cheapest 970 I could get with a small PCB and threw on a 670 WC block and enjoyed that card for a long time with 1500mhz+ clocks. I don't care how my card looks, but rather how it performs.