NVIDIA Pascal Thread

[guskline]

I just checked on EK and apparently they are ready to release a water block for the GP 104 so custom water coolers will jump on it.

ShintaiDK's one GTX1080 recommendation makes a lot of sense.

You can see from my sig I run 2 water cooled rigs. My 5960x rig originally had my 2 Water cooled R9 290s in it (they moved to the 4790k rig).

About this time last year when both the Fury X and GTX980TI came out I decided to make a move to a single high end card for my 5960X rig to replace the 290s.

It basically came down to the GTX980TI having better performance at the time and having a EK waterblock available.

BTW, the 2 R9 290s give a bit more FPS but the GTX980TI as a single card is brutally fast and I suspect the GTX 1080 will take that performance up a few more notches.

 

[tviceman]

The GP106 is around 200mm2,so Polaris 10 is probably in-between the GP106 and GP104 in size if we take into account the different nodes. The editor on Videocardz said Polaris 11 was probably close to 150mm2 using a rough estimate.

It might be the case,we won't see any GPUs which are direct competitors to each other this year.

It will depend on the architectures. Look at GM206 vs. Tonga. The 380x is 20% faster than GTX960, give or take, but required a 60% larger die and 60% more power consumption. If Pascal's makings continues to favor a very lean design with limited DX12 hardware features, we could be again looking at both large perfomance differences on a game by game basis AND large overclocking differences (again).

 

[tential]

One 1070 or two? I'm gunning for 2 1080s, or two flagship AMDs, but time is critical here. I'm on an old, old PC and I'm itching to build a new one as soon as Broadwell-E is out, so whoever hits the ground running first with a flagship faster than the previous generation of cards gets my money.

It doesn't look like amd and Nvidia are competing. Nvidia will dominate high end amd will get low end it seems

Also no clue why people are telling you to avoid 2 1080s... Definitely get 2 if that's the performance you want. 1080 sli will be the fastest thing out 4k resolution gaming or 1440p 100+ fps will be more than possible.

If you don't have a good monitor though it's stupid. Definitely should invest in gsync too.

 

[antihelten]

It doesn't look like amd and Nvidia are competing. Nvidia will dominate high end amd will get low end it seems

I don't think this is entirely accurate.

Yes GP104 does look set to take over the high end and Polaris 11 the low end, but GP106 and Polaris 10 looks like they might fall quite close to each other in the midrange, and would thus be competing with each other.

Of course this shouldn't be terribly relevant with regards to the 1070 or 1080 being discussed, it probably won't be relevant until you get down to the 1060 or 1060 Ti.

 

[happy medium]

Has it been confirmed that the MSI gtx1080 uses GDDR5X memory?

"While the specs of GP104 are still hidden, we can now say that the chip packs 1920 CUDA Cores and a 256-bit controller supports both GDDR5 and GDDR5X (MSI uses GDDR5X) memory. That should suffice for up to 384 GB/s i.e. easily surpass the bandwidth offered by the GeForce GTX 980, 980 Ti, and even TITAN X."

http://vrworld.com/2016/04/25/16nm-nvidia-geforce-gtx-1080-leak-ahead-computex-taipei-2016/

 

[Kris194]

Has it been confirmed that the MSI gtx1080 uses GDDR5X memory?

"While the specs of GP104 are still hidden, we can now say that the chip packs 1920 CUDA Cores

http://vrworld.com/2016/04/25/16nm-nvidia-geforce-gtx-1080-leak-ahead-computex-taipei-2016/

1920 CUDA Cores? Less than predecessors? What did they smoke or drink? vrworld starts to look more and more like a clickbait site.

 

[happy medium]

I think the magic number is 45 for Nvidia, mabe more in direct x 12 games.

gtx960 +45% = gtx1060ti
gtx970 +45% = gtx1070
gtx980 +45% = gtx1080

 

[Glo.]

I think the magic number is 45 for Nvidia, mabe more in direct x 12 games.

gtx960 +45% = gtx1060ti
gtx970 +45% = gtx1070
gtx980 +45% = gtx1080

And people say that expectations about Polaris GPUs are high...

 

[FatherMurphy]

@Glo... for a 45% increase, mid-range to mid-range, after a process shrink?

 

[Glo.]

You have GTX 970 OC'ed to 1457 MHz. You will not see any benefit if you would want to go for GTX 1060 Ti. Performance will be similar. The same goes for people who have GTX 980 OC'ed to 1.4 GHz, and will want to go for GTX 1070.

 

[exar333]

You have GTX 970 OC'ed to 1457 MHz. You will not see any benefit if you would want to go for GTX 1060 Ti. Performance will be similar. The same goes for people who have GTX 980 OC'ed to 1.4 GHz, and will want to go for GTX 1070.

A little premature to say this...

While this is entirely possible, it is not a fact. How will Pascal overclock? Better? Worse? The same? If Pascal overclocks 30%, great, that's a decent bump. If only 10%? Not so much. We don't know until we get reviews...

The fact is we don't know how Pascal will perform and we don't know how it will OC. Until we do, we can't say either way what is 'worth it' from a performance standpoint.

Your point may very well have validity though. It is a fact that Maxwell OCs very well, so that's something that will be important when looking at upgrading to Pascal...

 

[ShintaiDK]

gtx960 +45% = gtx1060ti (+50% bandwidth, +100% SP, +20-30% clock)
gtx970 +45% = gtx1070 (+33.3% bandwidth, +38½ SP, +20-40% clock )
gtx980 +45% = gtx1080 (+71½% bandwidth, +25% SP, +20-40% clock )

I added rumoured/theoretical increases to the list. Bandwidth one should be certain. 2560SP for full GP104 also seems certain. Clocks are based on GP100 vs GM200 as Tesla.

In short:
GTX1080 2560 SP, 8GB 256bit 12Ghz GDDR5X, 1300-1500Mhz clock. 1440p/2160p target.
GTX1070 2304 SP, 8GB 256bit 8Ghz GDDR5, 1300-1500Mhz clock. 1080p/1440p target.
GTX1060TI, 2048 SP, 6GB 192bit 7Ghz GDDR5, 1200-1400Mhz clock. 1080p target.

 

[Grooveriding]

You have GTX 970 OC'ed to 1457 MHz. You will not see any benefit if you would want to go for GTX 1060 Ti. Performance will be similar. The same goes for people who have GTX 980 OC'ed to 1.4 GHz, and will want to go for GTX 1070.

If they are calling the cards 1070 & 1080, which looks highly likely unless someone really wanted to troll with those cooler shrouds that leaked, they had better be good enough that the 1070 is faster than a 980 and the 1080 is faster than a 980ti.

I'm not expecting much, but if they're not even upgrades to the 980 and 980ti respectively, then the launch will be a disaster.

 

[SteveGrabowski]

That's surprising to hear GP106 may be coming out soon too. I figured Nvidia wouldn't want to cannibalize their GP104 sales and might wait a few months like they did with Maxwell.

 

[Qwertilot]

Rather more real competition (in that segment that is!) this time round though, and we know they're due to be shipping in those car modules round Autumn sometime so no particular reason to wait as long as they did with Maxwell.

 

[happy medium]

That's surprising to hear GP106 may be coming out soon too. I figured Nvidia wouldn't want to cannibalize their GP104 sales and might wait a few months like they did with Maxwell.

I think they will announce the GP106, but we won't see cards till the end of the summer.

http://www.techpowerup.com/221848/n...nge-gp106-based-graphics-cards-in-autumn-2016

 

[Game_dev]

That's surprising to hear GP106 may be coming out soon too. I figured Nvidia wouldn't want to cannibalize their GP104 sales and might wait a few months like they did with Maxwell.

Probably cheaper to release a gp106 for the mid-range than keep making the older larger chips.

 

[maddie]

That's surprising to hear GP106 may be coming out soon too. I figured Nvidia wouldn't want to cannibalize their GP104 sales and might wait a few months like they did with Maxwell.

I'm surprised also, since they recently brought out the 75W 950 models. I thought that was an attempt to be more competitive with Polaris. Do you have a new SKU for only 1 month?

 

[SteveGrabowski]

Probably cheaper to release a gp106 for the mid-range than keep making the older larger chips.

Good point.

 

[SteveGrabowski]

So based on past history we should expect to hear no news Friday? This is all stuff that's going to be under an NDA until launch, probably around Computex? Or will Nvidia likely throw the public a bone?

 

[raghu78]

In short:
GTX1080 2560 SP, 8GB 256bit 12Ghz GDDR5X, 1300-1500Mhz clock. 1440p/2160p target.
GTX1070 2304 SP, 8GB 256bit 8Ghz GDDR5, 1300-1500Mhz clock. 1080p/1440p target.
GTX1060TI, 2048 SP, 6GB 192bit 7Ghz GDDR5, 1200-1400Mhz clock. 1080p target.

Clocks are too low. If a Tesla P100 with 1/2 fp64 can run at 1328 mhz base and boost to 1480 Mhz then we can expect much smaller GP104/GP106 chips run at a minimum base clock of 1400-1450 Mhz and boost clock of 1550-1600 Mhz. I think TSMC 16FF+ is going to enable probably 2 Ghz max overclocks on a GPU for the first time ever on a GPU.

As for performance expectations GTX 1080 with GDDR5X should be atleast 25% faster than GTX 980Ti / Titan X. I think 30-35% is realistic. 40% would be possible in a best case scenario.

As for GTX 1070 the bandwidth could hold it back. So I would put it at GTX 980 Ti + 0-10%. It depends on how good Pascal color compression is. GTX 1060 Ti should probably end up GTX 980 Ti - 10%.

 

[Silverforce11]

I posted about the GDDR5x vs normal GDDR5 separation already prior here:

http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=38198758&postcount=2588

It's going to mean the 1080 has a clear lead over the 1070, which it cannot close by overclocking.

8Gbps GDDR5 is used and it's at it's limits. Thus the 1070 is bandwidth bottlenecked, so even if you can push the core clock, it will behave like the 960 when OC, almost no gains.

The 970 was good, but it cannibalized the sale of the 980 due it's ability to get 980 performance with an OC. I read it out-sold the 980 by a factor of 10. This is a sure way for NV to promote more sales for the higher priced 1080.

Those thinking of SLI, should definitely go with the 1080 with GDDR5X, it'll scale better at higher resolutions.

 

[Head1985]

Do you remember GTX670 vs 680?
It was just like aftermarket 980TI vs TitanX.Aftermarket GTX670 was fast or faster than GTX680.

970 was already terrible cutdown.I cant imagine how Nv can screw GTX1070 even more.

I will say it again and again.If is gap in 1080 vs 1070 more than 20-25% average its not 1070.It is renamed 1060TI.

GTX470 after oc match GTX480

GTX570 beat GTX580 after oc

GTX670 beat GTX680

GTX970 beat gtx980

 

[happy medium]

The 970 was good, but it cannibalized the sale of the 980 due it's ability to get 980 performance with an OC. I read it out-sold the 980 by a factor of 10. This is a sure way for NV to promote more sales for the higher priced 1080.

970 was already terrible cutdown.I cant imagine how Nv can screw GTX1070 even more

I think Silverforce11 answered your question.

Nvidia wants to make money.
I think this round the gtx1080 will justify its extra cost with its 4k performance vs the 1070. I'm looking at the memory bandwidth numbers.

 

[JDG1980]

GTX 980 Ti has 2816 shaders and can clock to above 1400 MHz on the best aftermarket cards (>1500 MHz for those that include closed-loop water coolers). If GP104 really has only 2560 shaders, then either shader IPC must have gone up a lot since Maxwell, or the clock gains are really stupendous, or else the performance won't be as good as many people are hoping.