Nvidia shares skyrocket after great financial results

[Piroko]

Yeah,
Nvidia just hands them a tegra and an ARM manual.

haha
That would be funny if i though you were joking.

I am actually glad you included that second part because at least now we know why you keep saying this kind of stuff. Dont let your distaste cloud your better judgement. See, I would bet anything that nvidia is doing much better than you would have thought. They have most likely surpassed your expectations even though you still want to downplay their success.

Or maybe I actually do know what I'm talking about because I have worked in that industry field up until recently.
How about this press statement from Bosch here:
http://www.bosch-presse.de/presseforum/details.htm?txtID=6782&locale=en
Notice how it's a lot less vague and actually supplying technical information beyond stating that it's a Tegra SOC on a VCM?
That's the difference between a systems integrator and a company selling a SOC.

Also, take note of their revenue from Mobility Solutions, just over 8 Nvidias. Not Tegras, the whole Nvidias. You just do not develop several SOC variants, a software ecosystem and dozens of customer designs to barely make 500m $ revenue a year (taken from AT), unless someone else does the actual work.

And what about the graphics development? Want some hints?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ujRWiGIaT5o
Yep, shiny animations. And neither developed from Nvidia nor locked to their platform. I gave this information two posts back, mind you, just countering your "clouded judgement" spite.

Nvidia made large waves with their Drive PX platform, mostly because they've been first to market with such a powerful SOC. But their press presence really doesn't match their significance in this market. I expect them to grow, mind you, but this is not going to be a cakewalk with billions of dollars in earnings in the next quarter and fun and fluffy times.

 

[Keysplayr]

So you're actually maintaining that Nvidia did in fact just hand Audi a tegra chip and and manual?

I have no choice but to believe this due to this comment;

"That's the difference between a systems integrator and a company selling a SOC."

 

[Samwell]

Or maybe I actually do know what I'm talking about because I have worked in that industry field up until recently.
How about this press statement from Bosch here:
http://www.bosch-presse.de/presseforum/details.htm?txtID=6782&locale=en
Notice how it's a lot less vague and actually supplying technical information beyond stating that it's a Tegra SOC on a VCM?
That's the difference between a systems integrator and a company selling a SOC.

Maybe you know what you're talking about, but you're still wrong. The truth is actually in between you two. Nvidia is not developing everything, but also not just selling the soc. They are selling the socs with good developer support. They even develop some stuff themself, as they mentioned developer services in the last earnings, but mostly they are giving support. And you were talking about the money nvidia gets per soc. That seems more between 30-40$ and not 20-15$ as you wrote. For an old Tegra 2 or 3 that's pretty high margin.

 

[Piroko]

So you're actually maintaining that Nvidia did in fact just hand Audi a tegra chip and and manual?

I have no choice but to believe this due to this comment;

"That's the difference between a systems integrator and a company selling a SOC."

See below.

Maybe you know what you're talking about, but you're still wrong. The truth is actually in between you two. Nvidia is not developing everything, but also not just selling the soc. They are selling the socs with good developer support. They even develop some stuff themself, as they mentioned developer services in the last earnings, but mostly they are giving support. And you were talking about the money nvidia gets per soc. That seems more between 30-40$ and not 20-15$ as you wrote. For an old Tegra 2 or 3 that's pretty high margin.

Not going to deny this, developer support is part of larger contracts. Especially when you are early adopter and work with engineering samples, track bugs and report manual errors. Nvidia might excel at support, even extending that into compiler improvements or software bug- and performancetracking if needs be, that is not something I can tell.
Neither can I tell if they successfully manage to jump into the software middleware business, I only know that the Audi FPK used different tools (public info) and that there is no free lunch there.

As for the SOC price, that was a rough guesstimate, anything between 15$ to 60$ might be realistic. But the automotive industry is very competitive, everything's negotiated down to the last penny. And sometimes you lose even with the best offer if that increases the pressure to compete further.

 

[Samwell]

See below.

Not going to deny this, developer support is part of larger contracts. Especially when you are early adopter and work with engineering samples, track bugs and report manual errors. Nvidia might excel at support, even extending that into compiler improvements or software bug- and performancetracking if needs be, that is not something I can tell.
Neither can I tell if they successfully manage to jump into the software middleware business, I only know that the Audi FPK used different tools (public info) and that there is no free lunch there.

What do you mean with different tools? Nvidia needs to offer support as they are controlling CUDA which is used for programming. Actually i'm surprised that car manufacturers are using CUDA because it will cost quite a bit to change to OpenCl if they prefer Renesas or others. That might be Nvs big advantage in the future.

 

[Piroko]

What do you mean with different tools? Nvidia needs to offer support as they are controlling CUDA which is used for programming. Actually i'm surprised that car manufacturers are using CUDA because it will cost quite a bit to change to OpenCl if they prefer Renesas or others. That might be Nvs big advantage in the future.

This has nothing to do with Cuda or OpenCL.

 

[ocre]

See below.

Not going to deny this, developer support is part of larger contracts. Especially when you are early adopter and work with engineering samples, track bugs and report manual errors. Nvidia might excel at support, even extending that into compiler improvements or software bug- and performancetracking if needs be, that is not something I can tell.
Neither can I tell if they successfully manage to jump into the software middleware business, I only know that the Audi FPK used different tools (public info) and that there is no free lunch there.

As for the SOC price, that was a rough guesstimate, anything between 15$ to 60$ might be realistic. But the automotive industry is very competitive, everything's negotiated down to the last penny. And sometimes you lose even with the best offer if that increases the pressure to compete further.

you just feel the need to try to reduce or minimize, for your own reasons.

Nvidia is selling more than a tegra chip. They are heavily vested and involved. They have done a lot of work in this area. A lot.

No one said that a car manufacture just gives nvidia their car and says make this cool. No one said that car manufactures dont have their engineers involved as well. If you know anything about the automotive business than you know that a lot of time is put into small details and nothing is just thrown in.

Nvidia is not handing them a chip and a manual. That is the most ridiculous thing I ever heard. They work in close collaboration and are heavily vested in the design and function. There has been plenty of data presented to you, enough for anyone to conclude that nvidia doesnt just hand them chips and "say here you go".

What do you mean with different tools? Nvidia needs to offer support as they are controlling CUDA which is used for programming. Actually i'm surprised that car manufacturers are using CUDA because it will cost quite a bit to change to OpenCl if they prefer Renesas or others. That might be Nvs big advantage in the future.

I dont think he is aware that the stuff out today was developed years ago or how much further nvidia is taking this. But even in that, he seems to think that their car business is just them giving a customer a chip and manual.

Nvidia are pushing full blast with technologies that make cars much more aware of the surroundings by sophisticated image processing as well as autonomous functions. They are also getting attention and being recognized for the work. These more advance technologies arent just being developed for nvidia because they will one day start building cars. They arent doing all this work and research just for fun. They are creating technologies that automakers are interested in.

 

[Piroko]

No one said that a car manufacture just gives nvidia their car and says make this cool. No one said that car manufactures dont have their engineers involved as well. If you know anything about the automotive business than you know that a lot of time is put into small details and nothing is just thrown in.

You really have an issue of understanding that a car manufacturer orders this:
http://www.continental-automotive.c...enger_cars/interior/instrumentation_displays/
or this:
http://products.bosch-mobility-solu...ntation_systems/intrumentation_systems_1.html
as mostly/fully integrated devices. From the companies I linked, among others.

Just look at this scale:
http://www.continental-corporation....ointventures/pr-2015-07-01-elektrobit-en.html

Continental currently employs 11,000 professionals in the field of software development.

To contrast: Nvidia has around 9,000 employees in total (linky).

Here is a press article talking about software development, big data processing and integration, this time with IBM as a partner.
Or how about this for sensor processing and automation?
I could spam you with links like these all day long and yes, Nvidia is a partner in a couple of them.

Still think I'm mad? Or are you perhaps giving a subdivision of such a small company (in comparison) a bit too much credit?

 

[Keysplayr]

You really have an issue of understanding that a car manufacturer orders this:
http://www.continental-automotive.c...enger_cars/interior/instrumentation_displays/
or this:
http://products.bosch-mobility-solu...ntation_systems/intrumentation_systems_1.html
as mostly/fully integrated devices. From the companies I linked, among others.

Just look at this scale:
http://www.continental-corporation....ointventures/pr-2015-07-01-elektrobit-en.html
To contrast: Nvidia has around 9,000 employees in total (linky).

Here is a press article talking about software development, big data processing and integration, this time with IBM as a partner.
Or how about this for sensor processing and automation?
I could spam you with links like these all day long and yes, Nvidia is a partner in a couple of them.

Still think I'm mad? Or are you perhaps giving a subdivision of such a small company (in comparison) a bit too much credit?

I think perhaps you try to create a bigger perception of contrast than there is, if any. Honestly, all the links you have provided doesn't really prove your point (still trying to figure that out btw) and only serves to further obscure it.
You're like, "Look at this".. and "this" and "also this".. And we're like, "Yeah, so what?" Scratches head.

Nvidia and Audi (or any other automaker involved) has worked and will continue to work together to produce the best products and consumer experience that they can. All parties are involved.

http://www.pocket-lint.com/news/126...to-put-virtual-cockpit-into-new-audi-tt-video
"Audi and Nvidia engineers work closely together to develop hardware and software that truly delight customers," said Mathias Halliger, chief architect of infotainment systems at Audi."

http://www.nvidia.com/object/tegra-automotive.html
http://www.nvidia.com/object/automotive-partner-innovation.html

 

[Piroko]

Well, I will only ever give you information that is publicly available, so it's hard to be more specific in an industry as closed as this one. Nvidias full press launch is unusual, other companies like Freescale and Renesas or even Intel just don't do press launches of individual projects, even if it's a massive dual screen information center in the current S-Class (powered by Intel Atom, developed <not by Intel>).

And when I read stuff like this:

Nvidia are pushing full blast with technologies that make cars much more aware of the surroundings by sophisticated image processing as well as autonomous functions.

What would you answer? "Yeah, a team of 3 engineers outdevelops the development groups at Continental (head count ~200,000), Bosch (head count 290,000), the new "teams" at Apple and Google (which are probably the size of Nvidia) and hundreds of other companies (IBM, Intel, you name them, they're in it) and will sell complete autonomous driving solutions by the end of next year"? The whole industry is pushing that, but almost all of them do it behind closed doors. Nvidia is among them, nothing more, nothing less.

There's some proper perception of contrast.

 

[Keysplayr]

3? Come on man. Enough.