NVIDIA Stereovision on morning news(!)

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: Creig

If you're ready to get off your high horse, you could go back through my posts and see that I already own, and have used, technology that is identical to what Nvidia is offering today. The ELSA Revelator glasses work exactly the same.

Not really.
1. Old glasses had no LCDs and DLPs to work with, so they pretty much burned your eyes out of your head on most monitors. What kind of res were you running to get the 75Hz that was pretty much bare minimum survivable with those old strobe lights?
2. Old glasses didn't have 350 user configurable driver profiles, and on screen tips for the games.
3. Those glasses looked like something from a 1950s sci-fi show.
4. Those glasses didn't fit over eyeglasses.
5. AFAIK, those glasses didn't work with movies.
6. Couldn't use SLi with those glasses.
7. The depth wasn't adjustable on those glasses

Originally posted by: Creig
If anybody here is misguided, it's you and Rollo with your constant praise of anything and everything Nvidia related just to keep those freebies rolling in.

Creig, you know me well enough to know I don't have to kiss any ass to get what I want in life- why do you keep trying to imply I'm on some video card grubbing mission? It's just tacky, dude.

Originally posted by: Creig
Once again you show who is really the misguided one here. Your last statement should read:

Stereovision is too damn expensive. "It needs to be cheaper before I'll consider purchasing it."

For who? You? Everyone I know can easily afford this. I spend this much (or more) on hobbies every month of the year.

Originally posted by: Creig
What's so wrong with saying that? Nvidia does have a history of pricing their products well above their cost to manufacture. $650 GTX280 ring a bell?

The logical fallacy of "false analogy" applies here. All tech companies have high margin products- X1900XT PE, QX9770, FX-60, Skulltrail, AMD 4X4 ring any bells? Why the cheap shot at NVIDIA?
However, given that this rocks, and there is no comparable competition on the market, I'd say it's cheap.

Originally posted by: Creig
It's my opinion that IR shutter glasses that sold for $80 ten years ago should be no more than $100 today, in my opinion. In fact, I think they should be even cheaper than that as the cost to produce the LCD lenses must surely have dropped since then. But I would probably spend up to $100 for them as long as I already had a compatible display and a fast enough Nvidia video card.

Why is that? Do tvs, houses or cars cost less than they did 10 years ago? How about video cards, motherboards, monitors, or CPUs?
These should though, because Creig says so.

Originally posted by: Creig
Well, right now 120Hz monitors are nearly twice as expensive as their 60Hz counterparts. That cost also has to factor the whole 3D stereovision package. So even if someone needs a new monitor anyhow, they'll have to spend $200 on the glasses, plus around $200 extra for the 120Hz capability. If you don't suffer any problems using a regular 60Hz LCD, then there's no reason to spend the extra money to get a 120Hz display unless you intend to purchase the Nvidia glasses as well. If you do decide to get the 120Hz monitor and the glasses, now you're still looking at $400 minimum, more if you need a video card as well. That's still a good chunk of change to enable a single gaming feature.

Do those monitors that are $200 less have 20K:1 contrast? Can they display at 19X10 @ 60Hz or 16X10 @ 120Hz? Do they come with dual link DVI cords? If not, they're not really comparable products, are they?

Originally posted by: Creig
Once 120Hz monitors become mainstream and 60Hz sets are naturally phased out, then the price of admission for 3D stereoscopic gaming will drop. Not to mention that hopefully the cost of the glasses themselves will have dropped as well.

So you think the price of a tech item will drop over time? Well, I guess as that happens every single time, you're probably right with that. So are you saying no one should ever buy things when they are relatively new on the market? They should all deny themselves to save a few bucks?

I don't get why you keep throwing the "we can't afford the likes of this!" card over...and over...and over.

I don't seem to recall you saying people should "wait" and not spend $550+ on a 4870X2:

Instead, they opted to release their cards at a price point that put them within reach of the average gamer while obviously still providing an acceptable profit.That's true, but ATI could have gone the route of Nvidia and priced their boards astronomically high to match Nvidia's pricing structure in order to maximize their profits, but they didn't.

Oh no, $550+ is "well within the reach of the average gamer" when ATi is selling the part, but let NVIDIA try and get $600 and it's best to "wait" and "it's way too expensive!".

I think we can all see why it's too expensive for you- the wrong company is selling it. It's just wrong Creig. You'd never see me saying a high end ATi part is too expensive- good stuff commands premium prices, no matter who sells it.

 

[zebrax2]

Originally posted by: nRollo

Originally posted by: Creig
Once 120Hz monitors become mainstream and 60Hz sets are naturally phased out, then the price of admission for 3D stereoscopic gaming will drop. Not to mention that hopefully the cost of the glasses themselves will have dropped as well.

So you think the price of a tech item will drop over time? Well, I guess as that happens every single time, you're probably right with that. So are you saying no one should ever buy things when they are relatively new on the market? They should all deny themselves to save a few bucks?

I don't get why you keep throwing the "we can't afford the likes of this!" card over...and over...and over.

I don't seem to recall you saying people should "wait" and not spend $550+ on a 4870X2:

Instead, they opted to release their cards at a price point that put them within reach of the average gamer while obviously still providing an acceptable profit.That's true, but ATI could have gone the route of Nvidia and priced their boards astronomically high to match Nvidia's pricing structure in order to maximize their profits, but they didn't.

Oh no, $550+ is "well within the reach of the average gamer" when ATi is selling the part, but let NVIDIA try and get $600 and it's best to "wait" and "it's way too expensive!".

I think we can all see why it's too expensive for you- the wrong company is selling it. It's just wrong Creig. You'd never see me saying a high end ATi part is too expensive- good stuff commands premium prices, no matter who sells it.

He never said that everyone should wait, that statement directed for those who can. if you really want to buy it and have the money to spend why bother listening to anyone? as for the pricing people set a limit on how much they could spend and sadly $600 too much for most

 

[vhx]

Could be ok, never got excited about 3D though.

I most likely won't get this, if not only for the price, but for the main reason. Which is not knowing if I'll like it or not. Unlike graphics cards, or regular monitors that we all have experienced, few of us have ever experienced a '3D' effect other than Red and Blue glasses. Going out and blowing money on a new monitor, new cards, new motherboard (SLI), new glasses and finding out you don't like it, it hurts your eyes, or some other circumstance won't leave many happy. It's not really worth the risk and hassle to a lot of people. Considering if you were to take back the purchases you'd be paying restocking fees and shipping, and just general time lost hassling with it all.

I kind of see this like the Wii, in a way: gimmicky. It will probably be fun for a bit, but after a while, you'll get annoyed and want to go back to using a regular display.

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: vhx
Could be ok, never got excited about 3D though.

Have you ever used it? Why wouldn't you "get excited about" 3D, as every game you play tries to give you the illusion of 3d, but fails compared to this?

Originally posted by: vhx
I most likely won't get this, if not only for the price, but for the main reason. Which is not knowing if I'll like it or not. Unlike graphics cards, or regular monitors that we all have experienced, few of us have ever experienced a '3D' effect other than Red and Blue glasses.

If money is tight, I definitely recommend trying it at a friend's house, store, or tech show first. Not because I think it's possible for someone to dislike it, but because it's a luxury item.

Originally posted by: vhx
Going out and blowing money on a new monitor, new cards, new motherboard (SLI), new glasses and finding out you don't like it, it hurts your eyes, or some other circumstance won't leave many happy.

Why would you need a SLi motherboard? The single core benches got 32min/62max/50.8ave at UT3 and 26min/62max/49.8ave at Left 4 Dead, so anyone with a GTX260/280 should be able to enjoy this with without SLi at very nice framerates. It would also probably be cheaper just to sell your current video card and get a GTX295 if you demand uber-SLi performance levels than to buy a new motherboard.

Like I said, a person should try it first, but the glasses are adjustable for amount of depth (which makes them easier on eyes) and the 120Hz monitors mean you're looking at the same 60Hz LCD you look at all day at work. All the reviews say this is very easy on the eyes, as does my own extensive user experience.

Originally posted by: vhx
It's not really worth the risk and hassle to a lot of people. Considering if you were to take back the purchases you'd be paying restocking fees and shipping, and just general time lost hassling with it all.

It sounds like money is pretty tight for you if the re-stock fees on $600 worth of stuff is a big deal to you, so you're probably not in the target market for this anyway. I agree there are more people that don't have $600 to spend on a luxury item than people who do, but that doesn't mean this is a bad product. For people with $600 to spare it's a great product and adds more to a computer with a 3GHz C2D/$230 GTX260 C216 than any other $600 you could spend.
Would buying a $600 CPU get you a ton more gaming performance, or add to the immersion 1/1000th of what this does? No. Would adding a GTX295? Getting closer, but I'd still pick this. New monitor? Well, you get a 22" monitor here that does 19X10 @ 60Hz or 16X10 @ 120Hz, and has 20K:1 contrast. I'd take that over a $600 monitor, especially with the 3d factored in.

Originally posted by: vhx
I kind of see this like the Wii, in a way: gimmicky. It will probably be fun for a bit, but after a while, you'll get annoyed and want to go back to using a regular display.

I imagine you do, as you haven't used it, apparently don't believe the reviews, and it sounds like money is tight for you. All that is fine.

I can tell you I'm not getting tired of it, and I have one of the best gaming displays on the planet gathering dust sitting next to it. Says a lot when a guy has the holy grail monitor and he chooses to use a $400 monitor doesn't it?

 

[Creig]

Originally posted by: nRollo

Originally posted by: Creig
If you're ready to get off your high horse, you could go back through my posts and see that I already own, and have used, technology that is identical to what Nvidia is offering today. The ELSA Revelator glasses work exactly the same.

Not really.
1. Old glasses had no LCDs and DLPs to work with, so they pretty much burned your eyes out of your head on most monitors. What kind of res were you running to get the 75Hz that was pretty much bare minimum survivable with those old strobe lights?
2. Old glasses didn't have 350 user configurable driver profiles, and on screen tips for the games.
3. Those glasses looked like something from a 1950s sci-fi show.
4. Those glasses didn't fit over eyeglasses.
5. AFAIK, those glasses didn't work with movies.
6. Couldn't use SLi with those glasses.
7. The depth wasn't adjustable on those glasses

I'm guessing you never used the old Revelator glasses either because:

1. The ELSA glasses never burned my eyes out. I seem to recall running my display at 70Hz refresh which, although not perfect, was vastly improved over the 60Hz minimum recommendation. As far as resolution goes, yes, it was low. But we're talking about 10 years ago. Everything back then would be considered low-res compared to what we run today.
2. The glasses may not have had user configurable profiles, but the technology still worked the exact same. So I already know what the Nvidia stereoscopic view is going to look like.
3. Looks? Who cares what they looked like? I'm not planning on walking around in public with my 3D glasses on. Are you?
4. Wrong, they did fit over glasses.
5. If Nvidia had continued to support them they would have. Both the ELSA glasses and the Nvidia glasses work exactly the same.
6. Probably not since SLI still belonged to 3DFX back then. But this would be a driver limitation today, not a limitation of the glasses themselves.
7. Wrong again. The strength of the depth of field effects were definitely adjustable.

Originally posted by: nRollo

Originally posted by: Creig
If anybody here is misguided, it's you and Rollo with your constant praise of anything and everything Nvidia related just to keep those freebies rolling in.

Creig, you know me well enough to know I don't have to kiss any ass to get what I want in life- why do you keep trying to imply I'm on some video card grubbing mission? It's just tacky, dude.

Didn't it ever occur to you that to us, we see somebody who claims to be nothing more than an Nvidia enthusiast and who is constantly telling us all how much money he has to burn on his boats, houses, computers, hobbies, etc, yet he keeps getting free hardware? Wouldn't a true Nvidia enthusiast with money to burn purchase all his computer hardware himself in order to help support his favorite company? Yet for all the extra money you apparently have lying around, you still keep accepting thousands of dollars worth of freebies. Since you claim you can so easily afford to purchase what you receive for free, we can only assume that you keep promoting Nvidia so heavily in return for Nvidia's sponsorship, otherwise you'd simply go out and purchase it on your own. To us, you're the tacky one here.

Originally posted by: nRollo

Originally posted by: Creig
Once again you show who is really the misguided one here. Your last statement should read:

Stereovision is too damn expensive. "It needs to be cheaper before I'll consider purchasing it."

For who? You? Everyone I know can easily afford this. I spend this much (or more) on hobbies every month of the year.

To me, other members here and even other reviewers, it's too expensive for one feature. Not many people are going to go out and spend $400 to replace their perfectly good primary gaming monitor simply to be able to go out and spend another $200 for 3D shutter glasses. Simple as that.

Originally posted by: nRollo

Originally posted by: Creig
What's so wrong with saying that? Nvidia does have a history of pricing their products well above their cost to manufacture. $650 GTX280 ring a bell?

The logical fallacy of "false analogy" applies here. All tech companies have high margin products- X1900XT PE, QX9770, FX-60, Skulltrail, AMD 4X4 ring any bells? Why the cheap shot at NVIDIA?
However, given that this rocks, and there is no comparable competition on the market, I'd say it's cheap.

Because Nvidia was the most recent and had the most dramatic case of overpricing to be seen in quite awhile. A $650 GTX280 dropping down to $400 in a matter of weeks from launch simply because AMD's 48X0 came out? That simply screams 'price gouging'. Just because there wasn't any direct competition is no reason to overcharge your customers so much. The same goes for these glasses. The ELSA Revelator IR glasses were sold for $80 years ago, and yet Nvidia has dusted off the technology, repackaged it and is now trying to sell the exact same thing for $200? More price gouging.

Originally posted by: nRollo

Originally posted by: Creig
It's my opinion that IR shutter glasses that sold for $80 ten years ago should be no more than $100 today, in my opinion. In fact, I think they should be even cheaper than that as the cost to produce the LCD lenses must surely have dropped since then. But I would probably spend up to $100 for them as long as I already had a compatible display and a fast enough Nvidia video card.

Why is that? Do tvs, houses or cars cost less than they did 10 years ago? How about video cards, motherboards, monitors, or CPUs?
These should though, because Creig says so.

Wow, talk about misleading... Houses appreciate in value, computer equipment does not. Are the TV's of today the exact same technology as the ones produced 10 years ago, or have they vastly improved? How about video cards, motherboards, monitors and CPUs? All the same as 10 years ago or have they improved dramatically as well? And yet these "new" glasses, which are basically the same as the ones produced 10 years ago, are being priced as if they are vastly superior to the old ones. Price gouging.

Originally posted by: nRollo

Originally posted by: Creig
Well, right now 120Hz monitors are nearly twice as expensive as their 60Hz counterparts. That cost also has to factor the whole 3D stereovision package. So even if someone needs a new monitor anyhow, they'll have to spend $200 on the glasses, plus around $200 extra for the 120Hz capability. If you don't suffer any problems using a regular 60Hz LCD, then there's no reason to spend the extra money to get a 120Hz display unless you intend to purchase the Nvidia glasses as well. If you do decide to get the 120Hz monitor and the glasses, now you're still looking at $400 minimum, more if you need a video card as well. That's still a good chunk of change to enable a single gaming feature.

Do those monitors that are $200 less have 20K:1 contrast? Can they display at 19X10 @ 60Hz or 16X10 @ 120Hz? Do they come with dual link DVI cords? If not, they're not really comparable products, are they?

Well, let's see... A $200 1680x1050 monitor with 20,000:1 contrast ratio? check. Running an LCD at 19x10 @ 60Hz or 16x10 @ 20Hz? Why would you want to run an LCD monitor at any res other than native in the first place? And if a 60Hz LCD looks just fine to a person, why spend twice as much simply to get 120Hz? Dual-link DVI cables being included?!? You can get them for under $10! Now you're reeeaaally stretching.

Originally posted by: nRollo

Originally posted by: Creig
Once 120Hz monitors become mainstream and 60Hz sets are naturally phased out, then the price of admission for 3D stereoscopic gaming will drop. Not to mention that hopefully the cost of the glasses themselves will have dropped as well.

So you think the price of a tech item will drop over time? Well, I guess as that happens every single time, you're probably right with that. So are you saying no one should ever buy things when they are relatively new on the market? They should all deny themselves to save a few bucks?

I don't get why you keep throwing the "we can't afford the likes of this!" card over...and over...and over.

I don't seem to recall you saying people should "wait" and not spend $550+ on a 4870X2:

Instead, they opted to release their cards at a price point that put them within reach of the average gamer while obviously still providing an acceptable profit.That's true, but ATI could have gone the route of Nvidia and priced their boards astronomically high to match Nvidia's pricing structure in order to maximize their profits, but they didn't.

Oh no, $550+ is "well within the reach of the average gamer" when ATi is selling the part, but let NVIDIA try and get $600 and it's best to "wait" and "it's way too expensive!".

I think we can all see why it's too expensive for you- the wrong company is selling it. It's just wrong Creig. You'd never see me saying a high end ATi part is too expensive- good stuff commands premium prices, no matter who sells it.

I was referring to the 4870 and 4850 compared to the GTX280 and GTX260 in that thread, not the 4870X2.

And it's not just me or people in this thread who are saying the entire setup required for Nvidia 3D sterescopic is too expensive. You keep going on and on about how the reviewers are saying we should all run out and purchase this. What about these reviewers?

GeForce 3D Vision cannot truly succeed without some sort of embrace from game developers, and that's what we imagine Nvidia is working on right now. Until that happens, we?d be inclined to let the prices on those brand-new monitors and glasses come down a bit. The technology is remarkably novel?there?s just so much else you can do with $600 right now.

http://www.tomshardware.com/re...on-stereo,2121-10.html

The requirement for a totally new monitor though is what knocks the legs out from underneath the 3DVision, taking it off the market for those who were after a big boys toy. As an unproven technology it needs to be cheap enough for interested parties to buy it on a whim so they can check it out and tell their friends ? and the one thing that 3D gaming still isn?t; is cheap enough for the average consumer.

http://www.bit-tech.net/hardwa...orce-3dvision-review/8

Aren't they saying the exact same thing I've been saying?


I've said it before and I'll say it again. I LIKE THE TECHNOLOGY. I had fun with it back when it was first release and I'll have fun with it again in the future if the price drops to what I consider reasonable. ie - less than $100 for the glasses. And since I already own both a high end CRT and a 3D ready DLP, I won't need to spend $400 on a new display. But I will need an Nvidia video card and I'm not currently planning on upgrading ATM. But when the time comes that I need a new vid card, I'll look at both Nvidia and AMD to see what each offers and at what price. 3D stereoscopic glasses will be a consideration because I liked them. But I also refuse to pay for something if I feel it's being overpriced, which I think Nvidia's glasses currently are.

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: Creig
I already own both a high end CRT and a 3D ready DLP, I won't need to spend $400 on a new display. But I will need an Nvidia video card and I'm not currently planning on upgrading ATM. But when the time comes that I need a new vid card, I'll look at both Nvidia and AMD to see what each offers and at what price. 3D stereoscopic glasses will be a consideration because I liked them. But I also refuse to pay for something if I feel it's being overpriced, which I think Nvidia's glasses currently are.

This is the only thing you said which I am going to address because I cannot convince you things a re a good value if you do not think they are.

This straight out blew me away.

You have a 3d capable DLP, and you haven't ordered this yet? Over the $100 you consider makes it "fair" and whatever pocket change it would cost you to switch video cards?!

There's nothing I can say to you- you have a gaming and movie extravaganza in front of you for $200-$300 and you balk at it. It obviously has no value to you at all, or very little.

P.S. On the "Why do you let NVIDIA give you parts, when you could support them by paying retail" the answer is "Just because you have the money, doesn't mean you give it away." Beyond that, I do support them as much as most people- I bought a 9800GX2, a 7950GX2, and a 8800GTX at launch day price of over $600 in the last few years for example. Have you spent $1900 on ATi cards in the last 2.5 years?
Not to mention the $1000s and $1000s I spend on other parts to make their hardware look good when I do benches.

 

[Creig]

As I've said before, I prefer to get as much value for my dollar as possible. I don't go out and buy every gadget, gizmo and do-dad simply because I can. I read lots of reviews and do comparison shopping before deciding what to purchase. And if I feel an item is overpriced, I don't buy it even though I can afford it. It's simply my personal policy. If the price of the glasses drops to $100 and my next video card is Nvidia, I'll purchase them. If the price doesn't drop and my next video card is Nvidia, I won't purchase them. That's simply what I feel they're worth having already used this technology.

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: nRollo

Originally posted by: Creig
I already own both a high end CRT and a 3D ready DLP, I won't need to spend $400 on a new display. But I will need an Nvidia video card and I'm not currently planning on upgrading ATM. But when the time comes that I need a new vid card, I'll look at both Nvidia and AMD to see what each offers and at what price. 3D stereoscopic glasses will be a consideration because I liked them. But I also refuse to pay for something if I feel it's being overpriced, which I think Nvidia's glasses currently are.

This is the only thing you said which I am going to address because I cannot convince you things a re a good value if you do not think they are.

This straight out blew me away.

You have a 3d capable DLP, and you haven't ordered this yet? Over the $100 you consider makes it "fair" and whatever pocket change it would cost you to switch video cards?!

There's nothing I can say to you- you have a gaming and movie extravaganza in front of you for $200-$300 and you balk at it. It obviously has no value to you at all, or very little.

P.S. On the "Why do you let NVIDIA give you parts, when you could support them by paying retail" the answer is "Just because you have the money, doesn't mean you give it away." Beyond that, I do support them as much as most people- I bought a 9800GX2, a 7950GX2, and a 8800GTX at launch day price of over $600 in the last few years for example. Have you spent $1900 on ATi cards in the last 2.5 years?
Not to mention the $1000s and $1000s I spend on other parts to make their hardware look good when I do benches.

Not to mention the $1000s and $1000s I spend on other parts to make their hardware look good when I do benches.

revealing ... you spend money to make their HW "look good" ?

:Q

To some of us, evidently, it seems you are a walking-talking ad for Nvidia who's "job" *appears* to be to "make their HW look good"
- if you toned it down, the appearance of "fair and balanced" may assert itself

How long have you had these 3D glasses?
- How many hours at a time do you game for using them?

do you not feel fatigue? i did at Nvision using them. Do you really think you will be using them in 6 months ... and your 30" holy grail will still be dust covered

these are the questions a normal user asks himself before dropping $600 on a 3D gaming display on a "whim"

 

[Creig]

Originally posted by: apoppin

Not to mention the $1000s and $1000s I spend on other parts to make their hardware look good when I do benches.

revealing ... you spend money to make their HW "look good" ?

And yet he claims he isn't here doing Nvidia's PR work for them. I think this definitively proves what his real intentions are here. AEG, Nvidia Focus Group... It doesn't matter what it's called, it's all about marketing Nvidia products.

 

[TantrumusMaximus]

I just have one thing to add....

Regardless of all the nay saying if your a diehard gamer you've been wondering what the BIG next thing to come out is going to be aside from the next Faster CPU or next Faster GPU..... what is that next thing going to be...

When it first comes out as ANY new tech does it will COST YOU MONEY.... if it IS all nRollo claims then by all means bring it on the table.

I just don't understand the nay saying before actually seeing it.... most people here are gamers and should be shouting praise at new technology however all I see here is mainly a bunch of old grumpy men instead of looking forward to the next big thing.... just like all the GX2 rants about the GTX295... bla bla bla bla it will suck because the GX2 did...yaddy yaddy. My grandma fell down those stairs so she better never use those stairs again.....

Who the F cares if it isn't all nRollo claimed but Technology moves on and I'm happy companies keep pushing.

I hope to be alive when something like a hologram is a reality I can only dream... gaming is my 2nd life and if this brings what it says to the table I'll open my wallet for it.

Cheers to any company that "+1" gaming.

Rant over.

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: TantrumusMaximus
I just have one thing to add....

Regardless of all the nay saying if your a diehard gamer you've been wondering what the BIG next thing to come out is going to be aside from the next Faster CPU or next Faster GPU..... what is that next thing going to be...

When it first comes out as ANY new tech does it will COST YOU MONEY.... if it IS all nRollo claims then by all means bring it on the table.

I just don't understand the nay saying before actually seeing it.... most people here are gamers and should be shouting praise at new technology however all I see here is mainly a bunch of old grumpy men instead of looking forward to the next big thing.... just like all the GX2 rants about the GTX295... bla bla bla bla it will suck because the GX2 did...yaddy yaddy. My grandma fell down those stairs so she better never use those stairs again.....

Who the F cares if it isn't all nRollo claimed but Technology moves on and I'm happy companies keep pushing.

I hope to be alive when something like a hologram is a reality I can only dream... gaming is my 2nd life and if this brings what it says to the table I'll open my wallet for it.

Cheers to any company that "+1" gaming.

Rant over.

this company is for ITSELF - first .. and Nvidia is apparently turning away from gamers to pander to the pro market
- all companies are for themselves .. and Nvidia appear sto be looking to make big bucks on this 3D tech after losing out badly after a few big miscalculations last year

Secondly, i have seen this tech and although think it is "cool", it is way over priced imo .. especially as you do not know how it will be in the long run

3D movies are actually designed for 3D and they are tiring to watch and still usually very gimmicky
- look how long they have been out without mass popular acceptance; this 3D has to be adjusted for each game and is not at all 'designed' for it; that is about 2-3 years off IF the devs want to implement it

do you think this new 3D tech is "mature" ?

it is is not .. it reminds me of the first SLi and its limitations .. Crossfire also; stuck with fixed resolutions and crappy drivers for a long time
- it took a couple of years to become really useful

Do you want to be an early adopter for $600+ dollars ?

be my guest .. and .. please report back .. regularly .. at intervals
== to see how much you "love" them in 3 months

 

[CP5670]

I just don't understand the nay saying before actually seeing it.

Many people have seen this before. It's potentially a very cool idea, but it is nothing new and has been around for a long time.

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: CP5670

I just don't understand the nay saying before actually seeing it.

Many people have seen this before. It's potentially a very cool idea, but it is nothing new and has been around for a long time.

and for some people it is *tiring* to game for a long time with it
- imo after having seen it and played with it, it is still a novelty .. a $600 novelty that some are attempting to portray as "cool" - despite it's cost, newness and serious limitations

if you decide to be "cool", make sure you get an extra pair of glasses so your friends can also be impressed


. . . $800


[as they walk away saying, 'what a jerk' ]
:laugh:

EDIT: Here's a marketing tip for Nvidia in these "tough times"

Give away a pair of glasses with each set [glasses/LCD] sold - "a spare pair for a friend to try" - or to game with you, and for families and co-op play
(i am guessing we will see this for Xbox/PS platforms also, and this can be extended ad infinitum)
{of course they have to buy a LCD for themselves if they like it}
- 3D would spread much faster in the gaming community and more people would be buying monitors and still more pairs of glasses; IF it is really the next big thing
- i am sure the LCD vendors would be glad to chip in for a package deal with Nvidia

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: Creig

Originally posted by: apoppin

Not to mention the $1000s and $1000s I spend on other parts to make their hardware look good when I do benches.

revealing ... you spend money to make their HW "look good" ?

And yet he claims he isn't here doing Nvidia's PR work for them. I think this definitively proves what his real intentions are here. AEG, Nvidia Focus Group... It doesn't matter what it's called, it's all about marketing Nvidia products.

Would you give it up already. LOL. You wouldn't put a GTX295, or even a 4870X2 in a P4 rig would you? No, of course not. You would need fast CPU's, mobos, and RAM to make those cards shine. Doesn't matter if it's ATI or Nvidia Creig. You need to get off of that train, because the route your taking has very limited scenery. You see the same thing over and over again.

What is MOST apparent here, beyond anything else, is that you are on the edge of your seat waiting for comments that could easily be taken out of context and use them for your own purpose. Now THAT is a true marketer if I ever saw one. Congrats. :beer:

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: Creig

Originally posted by: apoppin

Not to mention the $1000s and $1000s I spend on other parts to make their hardware look good when I do benches.

revealing ... you spend money to make their HW "look good" ?

And yet he claims he isn't here doing Nvidia's PR work for them. I think this definitively proves what his real intentions are here. AEG, Nvidia Focus Group... It doesn't matter what it's called, it's all about marketing Nvidia products.

Would you give it up already. LOL. You wouldn't put a GTX295, or even a 4870X2 in a P4 rig would you? No, of course not. You would need fast CPU's, mobos, and RAM to make those cards shine. Doesn't matter if it's ATI or Nvidia Creig. You need to get off of that train, because the route your taking has very limited scenery. You see the same thing over and over again.

What is MOST apparent here, beyond anything else, is that you are on the edge of your seat waiting for comments that could easily be taken out of context and use them for your own purpose. Now THAT is a true marketer if I ever saw one. Congrats. :beer:

Give what up? Disagreeing with you and Nvidia on *perceived value* of a brand new and expensive novelty item?


Can you even put a GTX295 into a P4 rig?
:Q

You don't have these glasses do you, Keys?
- for how long did you get to preview them?

Do you not think the novelty of imperfect 3D might get tiring after awhile .. hour after hour gaming ?
- can you even game for hours on end wearing these glasses as some of us tend to do?

EDIT: i notice the little distraction dance you got going on, also
- got any music i can hum while i read your posts?
:music:

it is *wrong* to try and turn the tables on Creig by accusing HIM of marketing
- it appears that he is *cautious* and expressing RESERVATIONS about what you are gushing so enthusiastically over - all the while you are ignoring those same reservations
.. as i am .. it is not marketing as i have nothing to sell; it is not i - nor Creig - that is promoting expensive new and unproven tech.

 

[SlowSpyder]

Originally posted by: Creig

Originally posted by: apoppin

Not to mention the $1000s and $1000s I spend on other parts to make their hardware look good when I do benches.

revealing ... you spend money to make their HW "look good" ?

And yet he claims he isn't here doing Nvidia's PR work for them. I think this definitively proves what his real intentions are here. AEG, Nvidia Focus Group... It doesn't matter what it's called, it's all about marketing Nvidia products.

While normally I don't really care for a lot of nRollo's posts or agree with the way he spins things, I think in this case he's being chastised over nothing. I think what he's saying is he isn't going to run a GTX280 on a Sempron, for example. That would not do the card justice and would show it in a bad light that isn't truely reflective of what the card is capable of.

My guess is any focus group member who was to post benches in a public forum of Nvidia's new flagship card on an Athlon 2800+ isn't going to be a focus group member for long.

And on topic - I think the cost of entry is going to slow down or even stop this technology from getting off the ground. Most people are content with their monitors and don't want to buy a new monitor and $200 glasses (and potentially a new video card) for this. Just my thoughts on it.

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: SlowSpyder

Originally posted by: Creig

Originally posted by: apoppin

Not to mention the $1000s and $1000s I spend on other parts to make their hardware look good when I do benches.

revealing ... you spend money to make their HW "look good" ?

And yet he claims he isn't here doing Nvidia's PR work for them. I think this definitively proves what his real intentions are here. AEG, Nvidia Focus Group... It doesn't matter what it's called, it's all about marketing Nvidia products.

While normally I don't really care for a lot of nRollo's posts or agree with the way he spins things, I think in this case he's being chastised over nothing. I think what he's saying is he isn't going to run a GTX280 on a Sempron, for example. That would not do the card justice and would show it in a bad light that isn't truely reflective of what the card is capable of.

My guess is any focus group member who was to post benches in a public forum of Nvidia's new flagship card on an Athlon 2800+ isn't going to be a focus group member for long.

And on topic - I think the cost of entry is going to slow down or even stop this technology from getting off the ground. Most people are content with their monitors and don't want to buy a new monitor and $200 glasses (and potentially a new video card) for this. Just my thoughts on it.

Maybe. Could be another slip, also. i put a "question" at the end of my statement for him to clarify for himself. It was not a direct accusation from me of anything; imo it does not require a defensse .. it was Creig that took my question and ran with it.

Actually Nvidia won't send any FG member a flagship product that has an slow PC.

and i agree completely

i had a much different view of it when it was expressed that the cost would be ~$100 and the monitors would not have a big premium
- i was also expecting it to be a bit further along in development

it reminds me of the Arabian Nights story of Alladdin and the 40 Thieves
"New Lamps for Old"

repackaged old tech slightly improved .. if it catches on, then StereoVisionII will be pretty cool

there are also future alternatives to wearing glasses .. like 3-D LCD displays using *overlays* - no glasses needed!
- i saw that also at Nvision

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: apoppin

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: Creig

Originally posted by: apoppin

Not to mention the $1000s and $1000s I spend on other parts to make their hardware look good when I do benches.

revealing ... you spend money to make their HW "look good" ?

And yet he claims he isn't here doing Nvidia's PR work for them. I think this definitively proves what his real intentions are here. AEG, Nvidia Focus Group... It doesn't matter what it's called, it's all about marketing Nvidia products.

Would you give it up already. LOL. You wouldn't put a GTX295, or even a 4870X2 in a P4 rig would you? No, of course not. You would need fast CPU's, mobos, and RAM to make those cards shine. Doesn't matter if it's ATI or Nvidia Creig. You need to get off of that train, because the route your taking has very limited scenery. You see the same thing over and over again.

What is MOST apparent here, beyond anything else, is that you are on the edge of your seat waiting for comments that could easily be taken out of context and use them for your own purpose. Now THAT is a true marketer if I ever saw one. Congrats. :beer:

Give what up? Disagreeing with you and Nvidia on *perceived value* of a brand new and expensive novelty item?


You really can't figure out what I said? This is getting good.

Can you even put a GTX295 into a P4 rig?
:Q

Should I have said an Athlon 4400X2? Would that have been correct? Again, if you want to get into semantics, Apoppin, I'm game. Lets rock.

You don't have these glasses do you, Keys?
- for how long did you get to preview them?

I don't have the glasses or the monitor. I have told you this already. You need to ask again for what reason? It didn't sink in the first time? But did you know, that the glasses or the monitor is not what you or Creig was hinting at, was it innocent boy? This is terrific, I now have to explain your own posts to you.

Do you not think the novelty of imperfect 3D might get tiring after awhile .. hour after hour gaming ?

Hour after hour of any gaming gets tiring after a while.

- can you even game for hours on end wearing these glasses as some of us tend to do?

Can you even game for hours on end without wearing any glasses? Without getting eye tired? Give me a break dude. It's all crap. Every last syllable that spews forth from your gaping pie hole is pure crap.

EDIT: i notice the little distraction dance you got going on, also
- got any music i can hum while i read your posts?
:music:

it is *wrong* to try and turn the tables on Creig by accusing HIM of marketing
- it appears that he is *cautious* and expressing RESERVATIONS about what you are gushing so enthusiastically over - all the while you are ignoring those same reservations
.. as i am .. it is not marketing as i have nothing to sell; it is not i - nor Creig - that is promoting expensive new and unproven tech.

So says you. Pfft.

 

[ArchAngel777]

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Every last syllable that spews forth from your gaping pie hole is pure crap.

Isn't that a bit harsh? I thought this was a friendly forum, welcome to new users, but that type of talk might turn away people.

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: SlowSpyder

Originally posted by: Creig

Originally posted by: apoppin

Not to mention the $1000s and $1000s I spend on other parts to make their hardware look good when I do benches.

revealing ... you spend money to make their HW "look good" ?

And yet he claims he isn't here doing Nvidia's PR work for them. I think this definitively proves what his real intentions are here. AEG, Nvidia Focus Group... It doesn't matter what it's called, it's all about marketing Nvidia products.

While normally I don't really care for a lot of nRollo's posts or agree with the way he spins things, I think in this case he's being chastised over nothing. I think what he's saying is he isn't going to run a GTX280 on a Sempron, for example. That would not do the card justice and would show it in a bad light that isn't truely reflective of what the card is capable of.

My guess is any focus group member who was to post benches in a public forum of Nvidia's new flagship card on an Athlon 2800+ isn't going to be a focus group member for long.

And on topic - I think the cost of entry is going to slow down or even stop this technology from getting off the ground. Most people are content with their monitors and don't want to buy a new monitor and $200 glasses (and potentially a new video card) for this. Just my thoughts on it.

Glad someone gets it, and isn't a conspiracy theorist.

It's really two things- like you say, wouldn't be any point in posting my user experiences with a grossly imbalanced system. (and posting user experience is part of the what we do in the group)

The second part is "why would I want to use a grossly imbalanced rig?".

On the second part- if you're right, Creig gets his wish and the prices will drop. The market sets the price, and it always starts higher than it ends.

 

[Keysplayr]

At ArchAngel: Yes, it was too harsh. Apologies Apopp. My patience is just wearing a bit thin with the FG group witch hunts. Someone always ready to pounce it seems. hehe. Screw it. Let them. :beer:

 

[Wreckage]

Originally posted by: apoppin


Give what up? Disagreeing with you and Nvidia on *perceived value* of a brand new and expensive novelty item?

How is that any different from you running around saying that because you don't like it, no one else should or that because you don't have the money to spare no one else does?

You have always been such a hypocrite.

"perceived non-value"

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: apoppin

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: Creig

Originally posted by: apoppin

Not to mention the $1000s and $1000s I spend on other parts to make their hardware look good when I do benches.

revealing ... you spend money to make their HW "look good" ?

And yet he claims he isn't here doing Nvidia's PR work for them. I think this definitively proves what his real intentions are here. AEG, Nvidia Focus Group... It doesn't matter what it's called, it's all about marketing Nvidia products.

Would you give it up already. LOL. You wouldn't put a GTX295, or even a 4870X2 in a P4 rig would you? No, of course not. You would need fast CPU's, mobos, and RAM to make those cards shine. Doesn't matter if it's ATI or Nvidia Creig. You need to get off of that train, because the route your taking has very limited scenery. You see the same thing over and over again.

What is MOST apparent here, beyond anything else, is that you are on the edge of your seat waiting for comments that could easily be taken out of context and use them for your own purpose. Now THAT is a true marketer if I ever saw one. Congrats. :beer:

Give what up? Disagreeing with you and Nvidia on *perceived value* of a brand new and expensive novelty item?


You really can't figure out what I said? This is getting good.

Can you even put a GTX295 into a P4 rig?
:Q

Should I have said an Athlon 4400X2? Would that have been correct? Again, if you want to get into semantics, Apoppin, I'm game. Lets rock.

You don't have these glasses do you, Keys?
- for how long did you get to preview them?

I don't have the glasses or the monitor. I have told you this already. You need to ask again for what reason? It didn't sink in the first time? But did you know, that the glasses or the monitor is not what you or Creig was hinting at, was it innocent boy? This is terrific, I now have to explain your own posts to you.

Do you not think the novelty of imperfect 3D might get tiring after awhile .. hour after hour gaming ?

Hour after hour of any gaming gets tiring after a while.

- can you even game for hours on end wearing these glasses as some of us tend to do?

Can you even game for hours on end without wearing any glasses? Without getting eye tired? Give me a break dude. It's all crap. Every last syllable that spews forth from your gaping pie hole is pure crap.

EDIT: i notice the little distraction dance you got going on, also
- got any music i can hum while i read your posts?
:music:

it is *wrong* to try and turn the tables on Creig by accusing HIM of marketing
- it appears that he is *cautious* and expressing RESERVATIONS about what you are gushing so enthusiastically over - all the while you are ignoring those same reservations
.. as i am .. it is not marketing as i have nothing to sell; it is not i - nor Creig - that is promoting expensive new and unproven tech.

So says you. Pfft.

You are beyond rude and i'd expect this personal attack from someone else, not you.

You could try and not exaggerate .. like your silly p4 out of the ballpark analogy
-- so .. i *finally* get it .. you are defending something you have not seen nor tested.

it DOES get tiring - to ME
.. How tiring? .. one might ask this .. but not of you .. i DO game for sometimes EIGHT HOURS AT A STRETCH
- i am not that unusual .. for a gamer .. although a HW "enthusiast" may put these glasses on for 10 minutes and bubble "it is awesome"

i have seen it and i do not think it is wrong to question anyone else who has it now; no witch hunts
-i have better things to do than hunt "witches" .. there is no need to hunt whatsoever

 

[AmberClad]

Originally posted by: apoppin
it DOES get tiring - to ME
.. How tiring? .. one might ask this .. but not of you .. i DO game for sometimes EIGHT HOURS AT A STRETCH
- i am not that unusual .. for a gamer .. although a HW "enthusiast" may put these glasses on for 10 minutes and bubble "it is awesome"

Same here. 100+ hrs over two weeks (some of that was admittedly over the holidays...).

I didn't read through all of what was being debated, but longterm comfort for extended gaming sessions does seem like a legitimate concern for gamers.

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: AmberClad

Originally posted by: apoppin
it DOES get tiring - to ME
.. How tiring? .. one might ask this .. but not of you .. i DO game for sometimes EIGHT HOURS AT A STRETCH
- i am not that unusual .. for a gamer .. although a HW "enthusiast" may put these glasses on for 10 minutes and bubble "it is awesome"

Same here. 100+ hrs over two weeks (some of that was admittedly over the holidays...).

I didn't read through all of what was being debated, but longterm comfort for extended gaming sessions does seem like a legitimate concern for gamers.

Agree 100% and honestly don't know.

As a parent, husband, software consultant, fisherman, hunter, caretaker of two houses (well, house and fishing cabin anyway) I do not have the time to spend 100 hours in two weeks.

I've played 30-60 minutes several times without issue, but don't know if the experience would be different for marathon sessions. There was something in the review kit (or FAQ?) about a person's eyes becoming more acclimated to it with time.

It's pretty addictive though maybe one of these days I'll pull a 3 hour stretch and know better.