Obama Has Brought Us to ‘Constitutional Tipping Point’

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Stewox

Senior member
Dec 10, 2013
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Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
72,789
6,223
126
and thus a dictatorship is born, it always starts with things that "need to be done".

Exactly. There is absolutely nothing to be done but to understand that humanity is in a state of perpetual dissatisfaction because it was taught to hate itself. Cure that and it's the kingdom of heaven.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
84,974
49,711
136
I wonder how many more times we'll see the almighty race trump card thrown in the next 2 1/2 years

This is true. While some conservatives are motivated by an irrational hatred of race, most are simply driven by an irrational hatred of the opposing political 'tribe'. This isn't limited to conservatives, but much of the Obama hate specifically comes from that.

There's some pretty interesting/depressing research on this subject.
 

MagickMan

Diamond Member
Aug 11, 2008
7,537
3
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If you truly really believe that then whats the point of getting upset?

Because of how much damage that would be done before he or she is removed. Remember what I said about consequences?

A Strawman? Hardly. Dictatorship is a form of Government, do you disagree?

Yes, it is, but agreeing that government is needed doesn't mean a person would support a dictatorship, that's absurd.
 

Jhhnn

IN MEMORIAM
Nov 11, 1999
62,365
14,681
136
A black, Kenyan, Muslim, communist, is in the White House!

Well, yeh, but Obama hate isn't about bigotry, at all. Ask 'em.

Even so-called Liberal wonks can play chicken little, too. I'm confident that Obama will hand over the reins to his successor, and that Congress & the Judiciary can take back some of the power they have refused to use, should it suit their purposes.

OTOH, if they do that, they won't get to blame Obama for everything, so I think they like it the way it is.

I don't recall Righties moaning & raving over the Bush Admin & their claims of the Unitary Executive, either. But that was *different* somehow.
 

alcoholbob

Diamond Member
May 24, 2005
6,272
323
126
When there are things that need to be done and those who are supposed to do it refuse, someone needs to step up to the plate.

You are right, we need more corporate welfare and welfare for the rich. It's very important Obama make these exceptions for the Affordable Care Act for the richest Americans to maintain their wealth.
 

Jhhnn

IN MEMORIAM
Nov 11, 1999
62,365
14,681
136
You are right, we need more corporate welfare and welfare for the rich. It's very important Obama make these exceptions for the Affordable Care Act for the richest Americans to maintain their wealth.

Oh, please. It's a concession to business, not to the those insured under employer plans. Those plans are, iirc, mostly ACA compliant anyway.

Explain who loses.
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,143
5,662
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Because of how much damage that would be done before he or she is removed. Remember what I said about consequences?



Yes, it is, but agreeing that government is needed doesn't mean a person would support a dictatorship, that's absurd.

It's not absurd at all. If it was, there would never be Dictatorships.
 

Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
50,879
4,266
126
It's not absurd at all. If it was, there would never be Dictatorships.

Some kind of government falls naturally out of human interactions but it never needs to be a dictatorship. You say things need to get done. That's irrelevant. Things get done and are getting done. The interplay between parties is getting done. The people and parties in Congress are doing just what we hired them to do. They are operating within the bounds of the Constitution. That they aren't doing what you want in the way you think they should is also irrelevant. The majority party invites the minority party to do what it tells them however ill thought out that is and the republicans are cantankerous and inept. It sounds like a group which represents America as it is today. If you don't like it, how about a slave owning theocracy? That would surely be as wonderful as a dictatorship.

Governments happen as soon as social interaction requiring action happens. It may not have that name but it's so anyway. Offering a dictatorship as a requirement is nonsense. You are getting into the splitting hare mode.
 
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Sean325

Junior Member
Apr 27, 2010
9
0
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Wish I could say I was surprised. Government will continue to spiral further down this hole of "protecting" us.

40 years from now, retirement will be nationalized, we will also be allowed to choose from one of 4 cars, and you'll be allowed to live in specific houses based on your Social Security rating, or something.

By then, I'll be living in another country... lol
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,143
5,662
126
Some kind of government falls naturally out of human interactions but it never needs to be a dictatorship. You say things need to get done. That's irrelevant. Things get done and are getting done. The interplay between parties is getting done. The people and parties in Congress are doing just what we hired them to do. They are operating within the bounds of the Constitution. That they aren't doing what you want in the way you think they should is also irrelevant. The majority party invites the minority party to do what it tells them however ill thought out that is and the republicans are cantankerous and inept. It sounds like a group which represents America as it is today. If you don't like it, how about a slave owning theocracy? That would surely be as wonderful as a dictatorship.

Governments happen as soon as social interaction requiring action happens. It may not have that name but it's so anyway. Offering a dictatorship as a requirement is nonsense. You are getting into the splitting hare mode.

That's not what I am saying. What I am saying is that this level of disruption can not be sustained. The US is slipping and without a functioning Government you will lose the Republic. The Republican Party has put itself before the needs of the Nation to such an extent that it is damaging the US.
 

VRAMdemon

Diamond Member
Aug 16, 2012
6,594
7,846
136
This is true. While some conservatives are motivated by an irrational hatred of race, most are simply driven by an irrational hatred of the opposing political 'tribe'. This isn't limited to conservatives, but much of the Obama hate specifically comes from that.

There's some pretty interesting/depressing research on this subject.

Yep..every president in my lifetime has used executive orders. Nothing new here. Hell the last guy of a different political tribe used them, and guess what, the next guy who gets in office will probably do the same. Rage on tribal wingnuts
 

boomerang

Lifer
Jun 19, 2000
18,890
642
126
Yep..every president in my lifetime has used executive orders. Nothing new here. Hell the last guy of a different political tribe used them, and guess what, the next guy who gets in office will probably do the same. Rage on tribal wingnuts

Let's do a comparison. Here's The Ten Most Abusive Obama Executive Actions

1. Amending Obamacare’s employer mandate, providing an unauthorized subsidy to congressional staff, and encouraging state insurance commissioners not to enforce certain requirements.
2 Inventing labor law “exemptions” in violation of the WARN Act so that workers would not receive notice of impending layoffs days before the 2012 election.
3. Waiving the mandatory work requirement under the 1996 comprehensive welfare reform law, which required able-bodied adults to work, prepare for work, or look for work in order to receive benefits under the Temporary Assistance for Needy Families (TANF) program.
4. Ignoring a statutory deadline and refusing to consider an application related to nuclear waste storage at Yucca Mountain, which activists sought to block for years.
5. Circumventing the Senate’s duty to provide advice and consent on appointments and instead making “recess” appointments in violation of Article II, Section 2 of the Constitution when the Senate was actually in session.
6. Deciding not to defend the constitutionality of the federal definition of marriage in court.
7. Implementing Common Core national standards through strings-attached waivers from the No Child Left Behind Act.
8. Intimidating Florida to stop its voter roll cleanup, which included removing ineligible voters such as noncitizens, before the 2012 election.
9. Imposing the DREAM Act by executive fiat under the guise of “prosecutorial discretion.”
10. Refusing to enforce federal drug laws in states that have legalized marijuana.

Let's see the top ten from Bush. Looking forward to your answer.
 

JTsyo

Lifer
Nov 18, 2007
11,781
921
126
...
3. Congressional testimony tends to be self-serving in the interest of the party in charge of the chamber. It is not surprising that the professor who testified had the same opinions as the Republicans in the House. Otherwise he would not have been asked to testify.

Not true.

liberal constitutional professor Jonathan Turley
Turley noted that while he agrees with the president on most of his policies,
 

MagickMan

Diamond Member
Aug 11, 2008
7,537
3
76
It's not absurd at all. If it was, there would never be Dictatorships.

Dictatorships appear when a cult of personality becomes too powerful and there's a political power vacuum on the side of the citizenry. Since the USA has an armed citizenry, if he were to try someone in this country would (rightfully) kill him. However, before any of that could even occur, most of the states would activate their own emergency powers and nullify federal authority until such time as there's an opportunity for another constitutional convention.
 

MagickMan

Diamond Member
Aug 11, 2008
7,537
3
76
Not true.

Indeed, the professor is a "raging moonbat liberal" politically, but he understands the danger in what's going on with this administration. I give him a lot of credit for the courage to step outside the party lines.
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,143
5,662
126
Dictatorships appear when a cult of personality becomes too powerful and there's a political power vacuum on the side of the citizenry. Since the USA has an armed citizenry, if he were to try someone in this country would (rightfully) kill him. However, before any of that could even occur, most of the states would activate their own emergency powers and nullify federal authority until such time as there's an opportunity for another constitutional convention.

It is moot what the States do. The Government as you know it can fail and be replaced by all manner of non-Constitutional forms of government.
 

MagickMan

Diamond Member
Aug 11, 2008
7,537
3
76
It is moot what the States do. The Government as you know it can fail and be replaced by all manner of non-Constitutional forms of government.

It's moot what the feds do ultimately, because the states still have the means to govern and defend themselves. Many of which have quite a few ICBMs to use in bartering.
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,143
5,662
126
It's moot what the feds do ultimately, because the states still have the means to govern and defend themselves. Many of which have quite a few ICBMs to use in bartering.

Pretty sure the States don't have the launch codes.
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,143
5,662
126
Pretty sure it doesn't matter, as most are 2 key systems that don't require codes to launch missiles.

It's all moot anyways. Regardless of these potential consequences, the current system is not impervious to failure.
 

waggy

No Lifer
Dec 14, 2000
68,145
10
81
1. He's correct. Executive power has been accelerating for some time and it's gotten worse after 9/11. Leeway granted to the Executive is hardly ever given back. Extra power that Reagan got was inherited by Bush and then Clinton. Extra power that Clinton got was inherited by Bush. Extra power that Bush got was inherited by Obama.


tl;dr Executive power has grown for years, not just under Obama. Pointing it out in a House committee is restating the obvious for political reasons.

pretty much how i view it.

The executive power has been accelerating and getting stronger with each president. It does worry me what is next?

Anyone who thinks it started with Obama is a hack. each president has had it and each has stretched it to the limit.
 
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