Obama: Mandatory voting to counteract BIG money

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Fern

Elite Member
Sep 30, 2003
26,907
173
106
money would become an even bigger deal because all those non-voters don't know shit and are informed by tv ads only.

Thank you. That's what I came here to post.

If everyone were required to vote much more money would flow in. Forget targeting your spending at MSNBC, CNN, Fox etc. Now you'd have to target soap operas, cartoons, X Games, porn channels, food channels etc. Hang banners at fast food places and medical pot places, tons of highway billboards. You'd have to saturate every demographic of at least 18 yrs of age because every demographic would be voting.

Obama is a fool, and lately I'm thinking insane too.

Fern
 

kage69

Lifer
Jul 17, 2003
28,100
38,662
136
Intellectual oligarchy? That's rich coming from the party who's motto lately seems to be "Stupid Republicans should sit down, shut up, and let the smart Democrats in government rule the world." Intellectual oligarchy indeed.



I'd say a large majority of Americans likely qualify for intellectual status, provided of course we're only comparing them to House republicans

Yep, I'd bet those Dems would MUCHrather work with "Not Stupid Republicans," given what the others have been up to lately. The shut up part might apply I guess, but the sit down part doesn't really float given it's the GOP who is bent on getting fewer Americans to vote, while the Dems are moving in the opposite direction and trying to get all eligible voters to vote.

You do realize that the propaganda arm of the GOP pretty much already did exactly that, right? Ladies, do us a favor and stay home on election day because you all have no idea what the real world is about something like that? If someone in your office had personally fucked up the last 5 or 6 large contracts, showing a poor work ethic, a lack of fluency in subject matter, and largely unwilling to abandon the principles that were shown to be either ineffective or counterproductive with those contracts --- why the fuck would you keep that knob on the team, let alone let him commandeer the upcoming largest ever contract? The rage, she makes you dumb.

I'm actually laughing at this now. The republicans have been consistently wrong about pretty much everything since, what? 2000?

Voters want to hear good ideas, particularly ones that happen to coincide with the values we often tell the world we cherish. If you want to get mad about the GOP being offended that it's debunked policies and lack of ideas aren't being embraced by people who want to actually do their jobs, well tough shit. Obama's record on the economy, for the most part, makes the republicans look like petulant, self-absorbed gasbags who suffer amnesia. Just deal with it - something that should be easy for someone who holds no love for either party (as you've proclaimed many times). If you're so convinced these Dems will reverse Obama's achievements and show the world their true colors, then why not just sit back and watch it all happen? I realize those with a protective attachment to the party are probably disheartened by what it means when their chosen are not winning any popular elections, only making gains in DC by gerrymandering or when voter turnout is at it's lowest point since 1942. 2016 will not be pretty.

But why repeatedly throw that big, tall frosty mug of RAGE in your own face for all to see?
 
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Jhhnn

IN MEMORIAM
Nov 11, 1999
62,365
14,681
136
That's a special kind of crazy. You must have been conditioned from birth.

Fern

It's not crazy at all. The American Revolution was against the East India Co as much as it was against the Monarchy. Early America was entirely leery of corporate power, insisting that State power hold supremacy.

http://reclaimdemocracy.org/corporate-accountability-history-corporations-us/

There's also the small matter of TR as a trust buster & the establishment of the New Deal in response to corporate irresponsibility, but, uhh, never mind, right?
 

Jhhnn

IN MEMORIAM
Nov 11, 1999
62,365
14,681
136
The quoted article supports the claim it was intended to: The one just above it.

Fern

It does not support this claim, which is what I was talking about-

Publicly held corporations aren't contributing. Political campaign spending hasn't grown anymore than it has in prior years.

I suppose you could dance around about the meaning of "campaign spending" rather than broadening it to include all political spending, but that would be dishonest & misleading, don't you think?
 

Fern

Elite Member
Sep 30, 2003
26,907
173
106
It's not crazy at all. The American Revolution was against the East India Co as much as it was against the Monarchy. Early America was entirely leery of corporate power, insisting that State power hold supremacy.

http://reclaimdemocracy.org/corporate-accountability-history-corporations-us/

There's also the small matter of TR as a trust buster & the establishment of the New Deal in response to corporate irresponsibility, but, uhh, never mind, right?

Get back to me when corporations have the power to compel me to give them my money ("taxation"), can press me into military service ("draft"), can create and enforce rules that govern my daily life and subject me to imprisonment etc.

Corporations, by virtue of money, can certainly cause me some headaches under limited circumstances, but by no means are they anywhere near the threat of a powerful federal government; which, BTW, the FF were greatly concerned about (unfortunately to no avail given the current state of affairs).

Fern
 

MongGrel

Lifer
Dec 3, 2013
38,751
3,068
121
Get back to me when corporations have the power to compel me to give them my money ("taxation"), can press me into military service ("draft"), can create and enforce rules that govern my daily life and subject me to imprisonment etc.

Corporations, by virtue of money, can certainly cause me some headaches under limited circumstances, but by no means are they anywhere near the threat of a powerful federal government; which, BTW, the FF were greatly concerned about (unfortunately to no avail given the current state of affairs).

Fern

They all ready do to some degree in a few cases, there is no need for a draft.
 

sportage

Lifer
Feb 1, 2008
11,493
3,159
136
I brought up the subject long ago, that we should have mandatory voting, or a fine.
What's so bad about that?
During the draft, those of draft age were subject to mandatory registration.
And when you reach the age of 65, you must register with medicare within a time frame, or pay a fine.
And I'm sure we can think of many other examples of mandatory this or mandatory that in America.

Not voting just appears unpatriotic, considering the blood and life lost to protect our free democracy.
But more so than mandatory voting. first lets just simply make it a lot easier to vote.
A holiday for voting.
Automatic registering of qualified voters via DMV records.
Online voting.
Voting by mail, nation wide.
And last but not least, lets let the black folks vote, without states pulling their crap to suppress the vote.

And is anyone really that surprised that many republicans are freaking out about higher voter turnout?
Going as far to suggest not voting is in itself patriotic and something to be cherished.
Hell... Only some lame ass republican considering running for office, or in office, would ever suggest people not vote.
Right Marco?
 

Fern

Elite Member
Sep 30, 2003
26,907
173
106
It does not support this claim, which is what I was talking about-



I suppose you could dance around about the meaning of "campaign spending" rather than broadening it to include all political spending, but that would be dishonest & misleading, don't you think?

There was no intention to "dance around" anything. The term I used "Political campaign spending" was intended to include candidate campaign spending and that of PACs.

I've linked to proof of my remarks here at P&N before. I'm getting tired of the recent ploy by Dems to demand links for everything, even stuff currently on the headlines of newspapers, every website and all cable TV news. I recognize the point, and dishonest nature, of the 'exercise'.

In any case I have no time tonight as I must log off soon. Perhaps you could use google?

Fern
 

Bowfinger

Lifer
Nov 17, 2002
15,776
392
126
There was no intention to "dance around" anything. The term I used "Political campaign spending" was intended to include candidate campaign spending and that of PACs.

I've linked to proof of my remarks here at P&N before. I'm getting tired of the recent ploy by Dems to demand links for everything, even stuff currently on the headlines of newspapers, every website and all cable TV news. I recognize the point, and dishonest nature, of the 'exercise'.

In any case I have no time tonight as I must log off soon. Perhaps you could use google?

Fern
Your so-called "proof" is intentionally misleading, and has been refuted. There are plenty of ways to funnel money to support a politician besides direct campaign contributions. While such backdoor support used to be sharply limited, Citizens United blew that door off its hinges. Claiming it "hasn't really changed anything" is shamelessly dishonest.
 

touchstone

Senior member
Feb 25, 2015
603
0
0
there is zero chance of mandatory voting being instated anywhere, it would totally ruin it for all the lobbying groups and it would certainly mean the republican party would never win an election ever again


i dont know if it would make our government worse or better, but by virtue of it preventing republicans from being elected i would argue it must be an overall positive move
 

HomerJS

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
36,291
28,145
136
How about this...

Instead of mandatory voting raise enough money to issue tax credits to those who vote. Lets say $50-100.

How would we raise the money? Since the SC had made it so money in elections is unlimited, political ads will be taxed, lets say starting with 25% up to 50%. All monies raised would go back to the people in the forms of credits.

POTUS race alone spending 2 trillion would already get you $2.50 based on my estimating 200m voters
 

MongGrel

Lifer
Dec 3, 2013
38,751
3,068
121
there is zero chance of mandatory voting being instated anywhere, it would totally ruin it for all the lobbying groups and it would certainly mean the republican party would never win an election ever again


i dont know if it would make our government worse or better, but by virtue of it preventing republicans from being elected i would argue it must be an overall positive move


Agreeing with Newell Steamer. OP has united that which is ununitable.

Fern

 
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Jhhnn

IN MEMORIAM
Nov 11, 1999
62,365
14,681
136
There was no intention to "dance around" anything. The term I used "Political campaign spending" was intended to include candidate campaign spending and that of PACs.

I've linked to proof of my remarks here at P&N before. I'm getting tired of the recent ploy by Dems to demand links for everything, even stuff currently on the headlines of newspapers, every website and all cable TV news. I recognize the point, and dishonest nature, of the 'exercise'.

In any case I have no time tonight as I must log off soon. Perhaps you could use google?

Fern

Kinda forgot spending on 501(c)4 groups, didn't you? Isn't that what the whole IRS flap was all about, protecting the anonymity of donors?
 

Jhhnn

IN MEMORIAM
Nov 11, 1999
62,365
14,681
136
Get back to me when corporations have the power to compel me to give them my money ("taxation"), can press me into military service ("draft"), can create and enforce rules that govern my daily life and subject me to imprisonment etc.

Corporations, by virtue of money, can certainly cause me some headaches under limited circumstances, but by no means are they anywhere near the threat of a powerful federal government; which, BTW, the FF were greatly concerned about (unfortunately to no avail given the current state of affairs).

Fern

You seem to have forgotten about company towns & stores, also about the necessity of obtained corporate fuel, food, clothing & etc. It's not like all of America can go back to the land or heat our homes with wood.

And what precisely is the threat of a powerful federal govt any more so than a powerful state govt other than to state level power holders?
 

finglobes

Senior member
Dec 13, 2010
739
0
0
Ah yes mandatory voting - no doubt Obama also likes making voting possible from phones. That way he can give free phones away to people he will also dangle free cheese in front of just before election day.

Make no mistake - Obama is a psyhco, banana republic politician through and through. All he needs is one of those funky military costumes like Qaddafi used to wear. He could get by with some Michael Jackson epaulets too.
 

Cozarkian

Golden Member
Feb 2, 2012
1,352
95
91
I brought up the subject long ago, that we should have mandatory voting, or a fine.
What's so bad about that?

Off the top of my head with just a modicum of thought? Well, one, freedom of speech also entails the right not to speak, so it violates the First Amendment. Two, forcing someone to vote is a deprivation of liberty without due process of law, so it also violates the Fifth Amendment.

But you know what? Screw the Constitution. Let's force people to vote. Heck, let's go beyond that. We should force people to volunteer for political campaigns.
 

touchstone

Senior member
Feb 25, 2015
603
0
0
Ah yes mandatory voting - no doubt Obama also likes making voting possible from phones. That way he can give free phones away to people he will also dangle free cheese in front of just before election day.

Make no mistake - Obama is a psyhco, banana republic politician through and through. All he needs is one of those funky military costumes like Qaddafi used to wear. He could get by with some Michael Jackson epaulets too.

is that your nightmare? every last person actually getting a voice in government?



i often wonder if people like you are actually as stupid as you sound on these message boards, then i remember the time i took a trip to dallas and realize you are just a provincially minded average dumb american. everybody cant be smart enough to see beyond the borders of their state or the colors of their skin. you arent, but thats ok. the world needs truck drivers, cops and computer repair men too
 

unokitty

Diamond Member
Jan 5, 2012
3,346
1
0

In the 2010 election cycle, 26,783 individuals (or slightly less than one in ten thousand Americans) each contributed more than $10,000 to federal political campaigns. Combined, these donors spent $774 million. That's 24.3% of the total from individuals to politicians, parties, PACs, and independent expenditure groups... When it comes to politics, they are The One Percent of the One Percent...

Unlike the other 99.99% of Americans who do not make these contributions, these elite donors have unique access. In a world of increasingly expensive campaigns, The One Percent of the One Percent effectively play the role of political gatekeepers. Prospective candidates need to be able to tap into these networks if they want to be taken seriously. And party leaders on both sides are keenly aware that more than 80% of party committee money now comes from these elite donors.
No candidate from either major party can run without the support of the .01% that are the election funders. These .01% are the political gatekeepers for both major parties.

The problem is systemic. As Professor Lessig has observed it is 'legal corruption.'

Forcing the 99.99% that aren't the funders to vote isn't a fix...

Uno
 
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MongGrel

Lifer
Dec 3, 2013
38,751
3,068
121
is that your nightmare? every last person actually getting a voice in government?



i often wonder if people like you are actually as stupid as you sound on these message boards, then i remember the time i took a trip to dallas and realize you are just a provincially minded average dumb american. everybody cant be smart enough to see beyond the borders of their state or the colors of their skin. you arent, but thats ok. the world needs truck drivers, cops and computer repair men too

Vote to evict ?

NM.
 

finglobes

Senior member
Dec 13, 2010
739
0
0
is that your nightmare? every last person actually getting a voice in government?



i often wonder if people like you are actually as stupid as you sound on these message boards, then i remember the time i took a trip to dallas and realize you are just a provincially minded average dumb american. everybody cant be smart enough to see beyond the borders of their state or the colors of their skin. you arent, but thats ok. the world needs truck drivers, cops and computer repair men too


You want everyone to be made to vote and then you defame whole bunches of people as stupid for superficial reasons. You're view is very conflicted - pretzelized.
 

touchstone

Senior member
Feb 25, 2015
603
0
0
You want everyone to be made to vote and then you defame whole bunches of people as stupid for superficial reasons. You're view is very conflicted - pretzelized.

what is conflicted about recognizing the various intellectual demographics of certain professions? cops aren't too bright by design, same with all the rest, obviously there is variation. would you think that suggesting that doctors are intelligent, and bus drivers arent, is accurate (by and large)?



just because they are dumb doesnt mean they shouldn't get a say. and yea, i think they should all vote
 

WackyDan

Diamond Member
Jan 26, 2004
4,794
68
91
Sorry... I'm no constitutional lawyer, but chatter out there on this has mandatory voting being in conflict with the first amendment.

Think about it.
 
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