Discussion ***Official*** 2021 Stock Market Thread

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Train

Lifer
Jun 22, 2000
13,863
68
91
www.bing.com
ya I sat on a flat AMD for a while, then sold because nothing was happening.

Sold apple at the all time high of $86 and was proud of myself. A year later they released the first iPhone. I think the stock has gone up 60x since then. Probably 100x from when I sold.
 

ultimatebob

Lifer
Jul 1, 2001
25,135
2,445
126
I now own a single share of Kyndryl in my Fidelity IRA account, thanks to the IBM spinoff. What should I do with that?
 

dasherHampton

Platinum Member
Jan 19, 2018
2,543
488
96
I now own a single share of Kyndryl in my Fidelity IRA account, thanks to the IBM spinoff. What should I do with that?

I'd sell it and buy 10-12 shares of something like XELA that could pop at some point, especially if it becomes a meme stock.

Or leave it until you retire and buy a bottle of booze.
 

repoman0

Diamond Member
Jun 17, 2010
4,539
3,461
136
I’ve sold a lot of HUBS over the years in the $50-400 range. Luckily still have enough to retire on right now if I wanted to, but some of the earlier sales hurt anyway. We needed a house though.
 

ultimatebob

Lifer
Jul 1, 2001
25,135
2,445
126
I'd sell it and buy 10-12 shares of something like XELA that could pop at some point, especially if it becomes a meme stock.

Or leave it until you retire and buy a bottle of booze.

Heh... I only reason I have this share is because I used to work for IBM, and I kept the shares that I earned through their employee purchase plan while I worked there. I really only keep them for nostalgia purposes, as IBM is (by far) the worst performing stock in my portfolio. While it's paid out a bunch of dividends since then, the actual stock price is basically the same as when I left the company 14 years ago.

Amusing thing to think about: If I somehow survived the many rounds of layoffs and still worked for IBM today, the department I worked for would have likely been spun off to Kyndryl.
 

dasherHampton

Platinum Member
Jan 19, 2018
2,543
488
96
I love selling puts on penny stocks that have decent outlooks. There's a lot of money there.

I just sold 10 contracts at 2.5 on a stock called IO (energy exploration). They just released their ER and the stock predictably cratered to 2 so I got $1200 for them. As long as IO doesn't fall below like 1.3 I won't lose any money.
 

AdamK47

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
15,315
2,922
126
I love my boring index funds. I'm up 25% on VITAX since putting a good amount into it in March.

My plan is to put a good portion of it towards buying my 2022 R8 outright. Whenever that may be. Allocation is a bit of a problem.
 
Reactions: FelixDeCat

dasherHampton

Platinum Member
Jan 19, 2018
2,543
488
96
Ouch. Gonna take a bath on DCPH.

Thank God its only one contract. When it comes to pharmaceuticals its better to sell one contract on 10 different companies than 10 contracts on one.
 

ultimatebob

Lifer
Jul 1, 2001
25,135
2,445
126
Datadog price shot up pretty nice today. It took longer than I hoped, but I finally doubled my money on that one. I guess that I should sell some and take some profits?
 
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uclaLabrat

Diamond Member
Aug 2, 2007
5,578
2,912
136
What changed in their outlook? Is their catalyst coming up? Did they report any favorable data analysis?

If no, sell the news. If yes, hang on.
 

FelixDeCat

Lifer
Aug 4, 2000
29,297
2,097
126
SAVA has doubled in the past 4 days ($45 to $92). Should I sell or wait for moon lambos?

Lately, every time I trade that stock I get my ass kicked.

On Tuesday I decided to buy some stock. I bought at $49.95 when I noticed it jumped up from $44. This was when the market surmised Pfizer might looking to get into an Alzheimers drug company and SAVA was assumed to be it. Pfizer had an earnings call.

I traded back and forth, first buying 1000 @ 49.95. It kept hitting a wall at $50.

Within minutes the stock raced to $52, 57, 59 and pulled back quickly to $58 at which point I dumped the shares and calls. It was now $56 and I got back in for a smaller amount. Sold that for $62. Damn thing nearly hit $70 before collapsing back to $54.



On Wednesday some rabid short lobby who wants to see SAVA destroyed released more "information" before market open that kept the stock down most of day. I foolishly bought the stock back pre-market at 6AM CST for $56. After the "report" it opened at $51. Ouch!

I decided to bail at $52 after it seemed to go nowhere. An hour later it jumped to $62 before the worthless market makers (notably Goldman Sachs and UBS) crammed it back down to $55 the rest of the day.



After making good money on Tuesday, getting a good ass kicking on Wednesday, I was going to avoid it on Thursday. Then I noticed the stock was halted for news pending so I searched around to figure out what was going on. I decided I was going ALL IN with the first reasonable open and quickly bought as much as I could at $77 and put a limit order to sell at $95, which got filled!

Just before the close I decided to short the $95 put, even though the stock was at $85. I was worried all night and closed it for very meager profit soon after the open today. I should have kept it!!

I dont know where they go next but they have a couple of catalysts ahead - earnings and another conference in which more data or a partnership could be announced. COULD BE, but not guaranteed. Given the enthusiasm with the stock and its all time high at $149, it might rally up to November 8th or beyond. I currently have no position for safeties sake and the expensive price of the stock. I will just wait and see.

I keep an eye on about 100 stocks and always look for tradable moves.
 
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uclaLabrat

Diamond Member
Aug 2, 2007
5,578
2,912
136
Fair enough. I think in the absence of decent volume or other "real trades" small moves around a specific stock can go crazy due to reinforcement by algos. My company's stock was getting beat like a rented mule for the last month ahead of earnings (despite the fact we beat estimates 4/4 previous quarters). We beat estimates again and the stock has jumped pretty significantly (about 10% over the last week or so), and a lot of that is probably in anticipation of our upcoming PDUFA date.

And we're mid-cap bio, so not nearly as volatile as the pre-commercial orgs.
 

FelixDeCat

Lifer
Aug 4, 2000
29,297
2,097
126
Also "traders" (memesters) decided to bid up MRIN on Friday on earnings date. I read the report and was not enthusiastic thats for sure. Again, declining revs, big losses and smaller margins on sales are a turn off. And to make matters worse they have a new $100,000,000 share offering ahead.

I did trade a tiny amount here and there but it was just for the action only.
 

ponyo

Lifer
Feb 14, 2002
19,689
2,811
126
I bought some Peloton stock and sold puts. I think this crash selloff is overdone. I like their business model and think PTON can bounce back. It might take a year or two but I don't think this is the end of Peloton growth. Peloton is only sold in 4 countries: US, Canada, UK, and Germany. So the potential is there to expand to other markets. I think the Tread will eventually be a big seller.

The appeal of PTON to me is how sticky their digital subscriptions are. It has super low churn rate. Digital subscriptions are the key. And that looks really healthy.
 

AdamK47

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
15,315
2,922
126
I wouldn't buy Peloton. The need is dissipating as in-person restrictions ease at gyms. Competition is growing stronger in the home through virtual training. They had to reduce price in the face of competition. That hasn't paid off. Their earnings report showed much of that.
 

dasherHampton

Platinum Member
Jan 19, 2018
2,543
488
96
Yeah, I'm not sure I'd mess with Peleton right now.

Any thoughts on VBIV (vaccine manufacturer)? They're at $3 right now, rated as a strong buy.

I was thinking about buying 1000 shares to see where it goes. I could hedge my exposure by selling far out 3.5 calls for around $1200.
 

ponyo

Lifer
Feb 14, 2002
19,689
2,811
126
I wouldn't buy Peloton. The need is dissipating as in-person restrictions ease at gyms. Competition is growing stronger in the home through virtual training. They had to reduce price in the face of competition. That hasn't paid off. Their earnings report showed much of that.
The stuff you mentioned are all knowns and the reason why PTON stock got crushed and down almost 70% from its high. I'm not interested in the knowns. What I'm interested in and trying to figure out is if this is a temporary hiccup which many young growth companies experience and go through. Or is Peloton a busted growth story that will never return to its glory days?

Investing is about looking forward and trying to figure out where the world and the company will be 5-10 years down the line. That's what makes investing hard and separates people who outperform against people who struggle. You have to skate to where the puck is going and not where it is now. I look at Peloton and think they can bounce back because I think this is temporary hiccup that can and will be fixed. I'm going to give the management the benefit of doubt and bet they can fix the problem.

Even after this spanking, PTON is still not cheap at around $16 billion market cap. But that's sure better than $45 billion or so it was trading at beginning of the year. You're always going to pay a premium for category leader. And Peloton is category leader in the emerging digital connected fitness space.

When I evaluate a company, I try to look at their total addressable market. Peloton thinks they can eventually sell about 20 million exercise equipment to 15 million household worldwide. They've sold little over 2 million so far. So if I do some back of the napkin quick math, I can come up with some valuation models. The real value of Peloton is in their digital subscription which they charge $40 /month and that's recurring revenue even after the sale of the equipment. They also charge like $13 /month for digital subscription access to people who don't own Peloton equipment but want access their online classes and digital resources. This is my area of focus. Peloton currently has over 2 million digital connected subscriptions. And the churn rate is remarkably low. It's less than 1%. That's absolutely amazing and tells me people really love their Peloton equipment and digital subscription. If the churn rate was like 10-20%, I would be more concerned about their future growth and future earnings potential. But with churn rate less than 1%, I'm pretty confident Peloton can keep growing once they fix their current issues.

Let's say Peloton can sell 10 million bikes and treadmills and get to 10 million monthly subscriptions. At $40 /month, that's $400 million revenue a month just from digital subscriptions and $4 billion a year. Digital subscriptions are high margin and almost pure profit. If we assign 20 multiple on that $4 billion, that's $80 billion market cap. Give it 40 multiple and that's $160 billion valuation. And that's at 10 million subscriptions. Peloton thinks they will eventually get to 20 million worldwide subscriptions.

At $160 billion valuation, that's 10x from today's current market cap and price. At $80 billion, that's 5x from today's price. I will be ok with 5X my money in 5-10 years. 10X or more would be even better. The potential is there for Peloton. The question is can the management execute. As I mentioned in the initial post, Peloton is currently only sold in 4 countries: US, Canada, UK, and Germany. So they have lot of countries and market they can tap into for future growth. I just came back from trip to Korea and I can tell you Peloton would sell well in Korea. Personal fitness is becoming huge in Korea. I look at digital connected fitness market and think we're in the infancy and Peloton can grow with it in North America, Europe, and Asia.

Anyways, that's my quick analysis why I decided to buy PTON shares yesterday. I was initial Peloton skeptic but have been warming up to the company after visiting their showroom and running some numbers. Not investing advice but sharing some of my thought process.
 
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ultimatebob

Lifer
Jul 1, 2001
25,135
2,445
126
I wouldn't buy Peloton. The need is dissipating as in-person restrictions ease at gyms. Competition is growing stronger in the home through virtual training. They had to reduce price in the face of competition. That hasn't paid off. Their earnings report showed much of that.

I wouldn't invest in Peloton on principle... they basically took a $200 exercise bike, slapped a $100 tablet on it, and then charged $1,500 for it PLUS a monthly subscription fee to rich yuppies and their trophy wives.

I hope that some of the other fitness brands like Schwinn makes a $350 knockoff product and puts them out of business.
 

jpiniero

Lifer
Oct 1, 2010
14,835
5,452
136
I wouldn't invest in Peloton on principle... they basically took a $200 exercise bike, slapped a $100 tablet on it, and then charged $1,500 for it PLUS a monthly subscription fee to rich yuppies and their trophy wives.

Yep, plus Apple got into the fitness content game too.
 

dasherHampton

Platinum Member
Jan 19, 2018
2,543
488
96
So I tried something new today. I bought 1000 shares of VBIV and sold calls under my cost basis. Granted - they're pretty close: the CB is like 3.03 and the calls are at 3. I've never done that.

I got $1500 for selling the calls expiring Jan 2023. I figure if I'm lucky and VBIV stays over 3 its a free 1500 bucks. if VBIV drops I can still make some money (52 week low a little over $2) and own the shares to sell more calls.
 
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