Official AMD Polaris Review Thread: Radeon RX 480, RX 470, and RX 460

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guachi

Senior member
Nov 16, 2010
761
415
136
we talked about the 300$ vs 400$ scenario, specifically

According to the graph in the first post of this thread, the 1070 is 50% faster than the 480 in 1080 gaming according to techpowerup - a performance of 100 for the 480 is 150 for the 1070.

If the AIB 480 is really $300 in stock (I don't think it'll be that high) and you really could get a 1070 for $400 easily in stock (I don't think it'll be that cheap) then the AIB 480 would have to score 112.5 in order for a 1070 to be exactly 1/3 faster and 1/3 more expensive.

That 112.5 means the AIB 480 needs to only be 12.5% faster to have identical price/performance (and, therefore, likely higher DX12 and lower DX11 performance - and DX12 performance is probably more important to most people).

Do you think a AIB 480 will be 12.5% faster than a reference 480? I do. So even in your unlikely pricing scenario, a 480 is a fair buy for 1080 gaming.
 

sze5003

Lifer
Aug 18, 2012
14,184
626
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we know nothing about AIB 480s so far or their prices or their performance.

and where do you shop that you can find a 399$ 1070? I am genuinely curious. and wouldn't shipping and tax apply to 1070 too? no need to include that in your calculations.
I'm in the US. Newegg has a gigabyte 1070 for $399. Shipping should be free usually. Tax for me is about 7% but last time I used newegg they didn't charge tax until recently.

And I was just speculating if the AIB models were to go that high which I don't think they will.
 

boozzer

Golden Member
Jan 12, 2012
1,549
18
81
I'm in the US. Newegg has a gigabyte 1070 for $399. Shipping should be free usually. Tax for me is about 7% but last time I used newegg they didn't charge tax until recently.

And I was just speculating if the AIB models were to go that high which I don't think they will.
cheapest 1070 on newegg i found is 430$ + 5$ shipping, have no idea about ur tax situation and oos.

480 are 240$ and 4$ shipping. wait for AIBs to find out how much they cost.
 

guachi

Senior member
Nov 16, 2010
761
415
136
So atm, either go with RX 480, or pay more for a 1070.

I know you're more down on 480 for power reasons than I am, but we agree here. There is currently, though I hope price adjustments will sort it out, a dead zone between $200 and about $450 for video cards.

And even then, neither the $200 option nor $450 option is as good as it should be. The $200 option has no AIB choices at a few bucks more and the $450 option is selling over retail.
 
Feb 19, 2009
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With a smaller die, too. And at equal performance, Nvidia will set the MSRP at $250-260 as well, meaning they are making noticeably more money per chip/card sold with higher prices and lower costs. AMD's margins continue to get squeezed and R&D continues to suffer as a result.

It's too late to say woulda coulda shoulda but AMD needs to back off the high end again and bring out a technologically competitive mid-range die that can scale well as an x2 card to compete with Nvidia's high end. Had P10 been within 20% of GP104's efficiency, an RX 480 would be only 20% slower than GTX 1070, could have been priced at $250, and would easily defeat GTX 1080 as a $500 x2 card.

AMD's continued console-update wins will help alleviate the technical hurdles vs. Pascal somewhat, but I don't think Pascal is going to lose ground as much as Maxwell did (and certainly not as much as Kepler). If Pascal holds up well and Nvidia's technical advantages keeps them steam rolling the market, we could be looking at AMD's last node it manufactures discrete GPU's on.

2x strategy is bad because of the aversion to multi-GPU setup. Gamers just don't like it, SLI/CF are niche. **

Until Navi, on the same interposer, presenting as a single big GPU to APIs, it's not a viable strategy.

They just needed GloFo to perform better. If Vega is on GloFo, it's not going to look good at the high end against GP102 either. Damn shame really.

As for how GPUs age..

Do you remember when Fury X was released, it was 10% behind 980ti at 1440p? I said give it 6 months and it will match it. It did. GCN just keeps getting better with time due to the console effect & AMD's driver optimizations.

Pascal will no doubt fade once Volta is here. Remember they have to put back a hardware scheduler if they want to excel in DX12 and it's multi-queue parallel nature. By that time frame, DX12 would certainly have matured.

How the high-end play out will depend on whether GloFo get their act together for 14nm or even if Vega is on 14nm, could be 16nm FF. We don't know. But how the mainstream play out, I'm pretty sure GP106 is going to wreck Polaris 10 in sales due to the perf/w advantage.

** I find it hard to justify for my own purchase of RX 480s. But because I only play a handful of AAA per year, as long as those titles have CF support, it's good. I don't care about most other games. To me, BF1 needs excellent CF scaling, so does Deus Ex. Still waiting for this TW Warhammer DX12 patch, I've already got 200 hours into it and more, mods are great.
 
Last edited:
Feb 19, 2009
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No, there was no regression. Just neglect. When the 290X was released, they were going toe-to-toe with 780Tis with games at the time. Now 290Xs are easily up to 20% faster in today's games as an example.

Correction. When the 290X & 780Ti was released, the 780Ti murdered it because the reference 290X was a throttling mess. That's why it was $699 vs $549. 780Ti was simply faster, for about 3 months until custom 290X came and it equalize somewhat. However, during 2014, we started to see next-gen games came and the 290X took the lead in these titles and the effect kept on going since then.
 

digitaldurandal

Golden Member
Dec 3, 2009
1,828
0
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They just needed GloFo to perform better. If Vega is on GloFo, it's not going to look good at the high end against GP102 either. Damn shame really.

This is also my fear. Especially after the real power numbers for Polaris have shown their face. If Polaris was 110w TDP it would be an incredible card. It still remains a decent card for people who are behind the curve, TW but looking at it from a prediction point of view for Vega worries me about what AMD will release.

I guess the only good thing in that regard is they are putting Vega out second, so they hopefully can get the process down better for it.

I really want to support AMD. I hate Nvidia's business practices. I even have a freesync monitor. However, if Vega cannot compete with the 1080 in performance and price then I don't think I can justify staying in the red camp.

I am almost tempted to grab the $440 Fury X now. I mean, what performance target is AMD going to look at for $440? If AIB 480s are going to fill to $300?
 

HiroThreading

Member
Apr 25, 2016
173
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Correction. When the 290X & 780Ti was released, the 780Ti murdered it because the reference 290X was a throttling mess. That's why it was $699 vs $549. 780Ti was simply faster, for about 3 months until custom 290X came and it equalize somewhat. However, during 2014, we started to see next-gen games came and the 290X took the lead in these titles and the effect kept on going since then.

Not if the reviewer put the card on Uber mode. The 290X and 780 Ti were about neck and neck. However reviewers banged on about the 780 Ti's cooler.

It's very obvious that Global Foundries let AMD down severely. Their 14nm FF process is a joke.

I anticipate Sony and Microsoft to demand AMD to fab their SoCs at TSMC.
 

Bacon1

Diamond Member
Feb 14, 2016
3,430
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This is also my fear. Especially after the real power numbers for Polaris have shown their face. If Polaris was 110w TDP it would be an incredible card. It still remains a decent card for people who are behind the curve, TW but looking at it from a prediction point of view for Vega worries me about what AMD will release.

I guess the only good thing in that regard is they are putting Vega out second, so they hopefully can get the process down better for it.

I really want to support AMD. I hate Nvidia's business practices. I even have a freesync monitor. However, if Vega cannot compete with the 1080 in performance and price then I don't think I can justify staying in the red camp.

I am almost tempted to grab the $440 Fury X now. I mean, what performance target is AMD going to look at for $440? If AIB 480s are going to fill to $300?

Robert from AMD in the Q/A / AMA did say that the GPU core itself had a 110w TDP, and the rest was being sucked up by the board / memory / leakage and such.
 

bononos

Diamond Member
Aug 21, 2011
3,894
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We're being a bit ridiculous here since we don't have all of the facts yet. The reviewers received custom cards with switches on them that changed the amount and speed of the VRAM as well, so this could have been an issue with just those.
......

Hopefully the reviewed 'engineering samples' is the cause of the possible issue of excessive power draw through the mb pcie connector. And those cards could possibly be overvolted as well which would push the temps higher.
 

MrTeal

Diamond Member
Dec 7, 2003
3,585
1,743
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Hopefully the reviewed 'engineering samples' is the cause of the possible issue of excessive power draw through the mb pcie connector. And those cards could possibly be overvolted as well which would push the temps higher.

If Tom's is correct and the memory VRM along with 3 of 6 core phases are fed from the PCI socket while the other 3 phases are fed from the 6 pin, there's going to be really nothing that can be done short of disabling a phase to move more load from the x16 socket to the 6 pin plug. Even that might not be possible, as IR's controllers tend to only allow you to disable the last numbered phases (ie you could run 1-5 and not 6, but not 1-2, skip 3 and run 4-6). If the PCIe socket phases are 1-3, the only real option is to just further limit the power. Power through the socket will pretty much always be equal to or higher than the 6-pin with how they designed the PCB.
I don't see why Tom's wouldn't be correct on this either, they seem to have a decent power measurement test suite and testing for that is dead simple.
 

DDH

Member
May 30, 2015
168
168
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Hopefully the reviewed 'engineering samples' is the cause of the possible issue of excessive power draw through the mb pcie connector. And those cards could possibly be overvolted as well which would push the temps higher.

I think thats probably too much to hope for.



In light of the current performance per watt metric of the RX480, Nvidia clearly has the superior architecture.

Not only that, they have the GP104 released and looks set to release the GP106 sometime this month.


Not to rule AMD out completely here, they achieved their goals with polaris 10, improved efficiency compared with previous generations, a very attractive price point for many people, a good performance improvement over the previous generation 380x
 

hardhat

Senior member
Dec 4, 2011
425
115
116
I am pretty disappointed. I could have bought a 390 months ago for $260 after rebate. Getting a better deal wasn't what I wanted. I think it's a good deal for oem's, but not for me.
 

poofyhairguy

Lifer
Nov 20, 2005
14,612
318
126
So looking on Newegg every 4GB model they have listed (all backordered) has 8Ghz memory. Soon we will know if these listings are correct or the reviews are correct.
 

SPBHM

Diamond Member
Sep 12, 2012
5,058
410
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Ryan from pcper on their RX480 video mentioned that all the current 480 4GB are actually physical 8GB with a firmware limiting them to 4GB, it might be worth looking into it, for a possible unlock
 
Feb 19, 2009
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They had a good noise test, with video comparison.

The RX 480 reference looks exactly like a 1070 and 1080 reference.



Similar noise output.



Similar thermals.

I classify the 980 blower as a good reference design due to it's mix of noise/thermals, so some of the review sites that said this was noisy, is completely bull.

I'll have my own cards tomorrow to test. Having used a 290/X reference, I know noisy. lol
 

trane

Member
May 26, 2016
92
1
11
Correction. When the 290X & 780Ti was released, the 780Ti murdered it because the reference 290X was a throttling mess. That's why it was $699 vs $549. 780Ti was simply faster, for about 3 months until custom 290X came and it equalize somewhat. However, during 2014, we started to see next-gen games came and the 290X took the lead in these titles and the effect kept on going since then.

When 290X released, 780 Ti did not exist. It was going up up against 780 and Titan, the flagship then, and beating both. AMD did mess up the reference cooler though. They saw Hawaii was performing better than expected and were just tempted to push the clocks higher to get the performance crown cleanly.

Nvidia responded with 780 Ti the next month, and yes, it was faster. But it wasn't good value for money.

But of course, AMD continues to gain over time. I mean, even a 7870 is faster than 680 now. 7970 GHz is up there with a 780. 290X is closing in on 980, let alone 780 Ti. So, AMD has actually bridged entire generations over time.
 

SolMiester

Diamond Member
Dec 19, 2004
5,331
17
76
When 290X released, 780 Ti did not exist. It was going up up against 780 and Titan, the flagship then, and beating both. AMD did mess up the reference cooler though. They saw Hawaii was performing better than expected and were just tempted to push the clocks higher to get the performance crown cleanly.

Nvidia responded with 780 Ti the next month, and yes, it was faster. But it wasn't good value for money.

But of course, AMD continues to gain over time. I mean, even a 7870 is faster than 680 now. 7970 GHz is up there with a 780. 290X is closing in on 980, let alone 780 Ti. So, AMD has actually bridged entire generations over time.

Yeah...nah!
 
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