Official AMD Ryzen Benchmarks, Reviews, Prices, and Discussion

[raghu78]

Pinnacle ridge is basically the same core that is in Raven ridge, that core has improvements to cache latency, precision boost 2 and optimisations to achieve better efficiency at higher clocks.
That's what AMD said anyhow, I'm hoping that we get some improvements to the IMC and fabric that not only allow higher clocked ram, but also lower latency down the stack, how much of this is wishful thinking on my part is anyone's guess.

Raven Ridge core does not have all the core improvements in Zen+. The IMC in Pinnacle Ridge is expected to be able to support DDR4 upto 4000 Mhz which is not possible in Raven Ridge. btw I think the memory and cache latency improvements in Pinnacle Ridge are much more than what Raven Ridge has. We could see L3 latency reduction in Pinnacle Ridge.

https://www.computerbase.de/bildstrecke/81229/4/

The biggest difference is Pinnacle Ridge is built using 12LP high performance libraries while the Summit Ridge and Raven Ridge chips were built using High density 14LPP libraries (CPP=78nm, 9T)

https://pc.watch.impress.co.jp/img/pcw/docs/733/713/html/9.jpg.html
https://www.pcper.com/news/Processors/AMD-Details-Zen-ISSCC

12LP is an optical shrink and my guess as to the MMP is 56nm as it matches 12FDX MMP and 7LP CPP. I think Zen+ will be built using 12LP Ultra high perf libraries (MMP=56nm, CPP=84nm, 10.5T)

https://m.eet.com/content/images/eetimes/1 7 12 14 copared x 800_1505972923.jpg

 

[VirtualLarry]

Not till April? Gah. More time to earn some coin-money I guess beforehand and save up!

 

[krumme]

Raven Ridge core does not have all the core improvements in Zen+. The IMC in Pinnacle Ridge is expected to be able to support DDR4 upto 4000 Mhz which is not possible in Raven Ridge. btw I think the memory and cache latency improvements in Pinnacle Ridge are much more than what Raven Ridge has. We could see L3 latency reduction in Pinnacle Ridge.

https://www.computerbase.de/bildstrecke/81229/4/

The biggest difference is Pinnacle Ridge is built using 12LP high performance libraries while the Summit Ridge and Raven Ridge chips were built using High density 14LPP libraries (CPP=78nm, 9T)

https://pc.watch.impress.co.jp/img/pcw/docs/733/713/html/9.jpg.html
https://www.pcper.com/news/Processors/AMD-Details-Zen-ISSCC

12LP is an optical shrink and my guess as to the MMP is 56nm as it matches 12FDX CPP and 7LP MMP. I think Zen+ will be built using MMP=56nm, CPP=84nm, 10.5T.

https://m.eet.com/content/images/eetimes/1 7 12 14 copared x 800_1505972923.jpg

So:
Plus 10% perf from 12nm
New algorithm for smartprefetch
Silicon changes for lower latency and higher speed ram
Precision, all core turbo and xfr changes we know from rr
New high end 400 series chipset

Seems pretty good to me. Especially for gaming loads on desktop.

 

[french toast]

Where?

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=7MPxN6MEgbk&feature=youtu.be
6.45 mark Ish, actually a poster on here a couple of days ago linked it then I was all over it.

Just think of Raven Ridge as a zen core with the Vega graphics. A lot better than the crap APU's they had before. Mostly because Zen is far superior to the crap AMD has had for the last 10 years. I think Pinnacle Ridge will be Zen 2 core.

No, zen 2 is coming on 7nm first/only, 2019 timeframe.
Pinnacle ridge is zen+/Ryzen 2000, confirmed from AMD themselves to be virtually the same core as raven ridge...of course there is uncore stuff they could improve including IMC which would not make his statement false, but I digress....watch the link I posted above.

Raven Ridge core does not have all the core improvements in Zen+. The IMC in Pinnacle Ridge is expected to be able to support DDR4 upto 4000 Mhz which is not possible in Raven Ridge. btw I think the memory and cache latency improvements in Pinnacle Ridge are much more than what Raven Ridge has. We could see L3 latency reduction in Pinnacle Ridge.

https://www.computerbase.de/bildstrecke/81229/4/

The biggest difference is Pinnacle Ridge is built using 12LP high performance libraries while the Summit Ridge and Raven Ridge chips were built using High density 14LPP libraries (CPP=78nm, 9T)

https://pc.watch.impress.co.jp/img/pcw/docs/733/713/html/9.jpg.html
https://www.pcper.com/news/Processors/AMD-Details-Zen-ISSCC

12LP is an optical shrink and my guess as to the MMP is 56nm as it matches 12FDX MMP and 7LP CPP. I think Zen+ will be built using 12LP Ultra high perf libraries (MMP=56nm, CPP=84nm, 10.5T)

https://m.eet.com/content/images/eetimes/1 7 12 14 copared x 800_1505972923.jpg

Whilst agree with 90% of what you wrote, according to AMD's James prior? (Linked above) the main core at least is virtually the same, including cache improvements, precision boost 2, improvements to enable higher frequencies/better efficiency.
Now that does leave scope for the new IMC that you and others have mentioned, also does leave open some changes to the fabric speed/associativity with IMC, (latter of which I would love to see).
I would not get your hopes up though, it's unlikely James was sandbagging so that leaves little wiggle room.
12nm should be a nice upgrade in it's self.

So:
Plus 10% perf from 12nm
New algorithm for smartprefetch
Silicon changes for lower latency and higher speed ram
Precision, all core turbo and xfr changes we know from rr
New high end 400 series chipset

Seems pretty good to me. Especially for gaming loads on desktop.

Agreed .

 

[indydude345]

Posted this in the CB 11.5 thread, but I recently got my Ryzen 1600 to just over 4GHz, something I thought I couldn't do. I did it in a very strange way, at least it was to me. I used the APU/PCI multiplier in my BIOS, while the actual CPU multiplier was at 3725. It wouldn't go over 4GHz using just the CPU multiplier, which was weird. But hey, it worked this way so I can't complain!

 

[dark zero]

I am seriously thinking to get an AMD rig after 10 years... I have an old case for it, so guys, what do you recomend to me? get a Ryzen 1 or wait for Ryzen 2?

 

[Markfw]

I am seriously thinking to get an AMD rig after 10 years... I have an old case for it, so guys, what do you recomend to me? get a Ryzen 1 or wait for Ryzen 2?

Up to you. Who knows how much better it will be or when. Ryzen 1 is great and proven.

If you can't wait, go for it,

 

[mattiasnyc]

Well other people have more technical knowledge than me for sure, but it seems to me that about 10% improvement in performance might happen. However, given then that there are no architectural changes and no changes in the platform as far as we know, it might be as simple as just making it a budget issue. Either buy a top-of-the-line next-gen Ryzen when it comes out, or just make a reasonable guess as to what the price might be and see if it's worth the increased performance.

In other words; if you want bang for buck and the 1700 is a great value now, will the new version of it be only 10% more expensive? If it ends up being closer to 30% more expensive for example, will it still be worth it?

Just something to ponder if absolute performance isn't the most important issue....

 

[krumme]

Well other people have more technical knowledge than me for sure, but it seems to me that about 10% improvement in performance might happen. However, given then that there are no architectural changes and no changes in the platform as far as we know, it might be as simple as just making it a budget issue. Either buy a top-of-the-line next-gen Ryzen when it comes out, or just make a reasonable guess as to what the price might be and see if it's worth the increased performance.

In other words; if you want bang for buck and the 1700 is a great value now, will the new version of it be only 10% more expensive? If it ends up being closer to 30% more expensive for example, will it still be worth it?

Just something to ponder if absolute performance isn't the most important issue....

If you play older games and at 120Hz i would wait for revised zen as there is transistor changes to the memory controller giving both higher freq but also lower latency. Games is very memory latency bound. Depends on your need really. You can also go Intel 8400 if you dont do any heavy productivity lifting and use the power for gaming.

 

[LTC8K6]

I am seriously thinking to get an AMD rig after 10 years... I have an old case for it, so guys, what do you recomend to me? get a Ryzen 1 or wait for Ryzen 2?

At this point, you might as well wait for Ryzen+ which will be out soon.
Ryzen2 is not until 2019.

 

[mattiasnyc]

If you play older games and at 120Hz i would wait for revised zen as there is transistor changes to the memory controller giving both higher freq but also lower latency. Games is very memory latency bound. Depends on your need really. You can also go Intel 8400 if you dont do any heavy productivity lifting and use the power for gaming.

My impression was that the bigger difference was at 1080p and below, and that at 1440 and up the bottleneck was in the graphics card. So the question really seems to be whether that is significant enough of a difference (i.e. how many fps do you really need?).

 

[mattiasnyc]

At this point, you might as well wait for Ryzen+ which will be out soon.
Ryzen2 is not until 2019.

I'm inclined to sort of agree. However, I was in the same boat before Ryzen was launched last year, and then the rumors started building regarding Threadripper. So combined with that having been a new architecture and a possible HEDT platform I waited. And then I waited for sales. And then all of a sudden it was Christmas, and I finally upgraded before the New Year. So my point is just that sure, it'll be out "soon", but a lot of times people don't buy the new product right away because they want to read reviews and watch out for any issues, and at that point it's really no longer "soon".... In other words; how long is the wait realistically when accounting for that, and does the wait still make sense when one could have used the current version during that time?

To be clear, I'm not disagreeing, just saying that sometimes (in my case) the "soon" in practice turns out to be not so soon.

PS: Of course the option of buying gen.1 Ryzen doesn't disappear when the new one shows up...

 

[LTC8K6]

I'm inclined to sort of agree. However, I was in the same boat before Ryzen was launched last year, and then the rumors started building regarding Threadripper. So combined with that having been a new architecture and a possible HEDT platform I waited. And then I waited for sales. And then all of a sudden it was Christmas, and I finally upgraded before the New Year. So my point is just that sure, it'll be out "soon", but a lot of times people don't buy the new product right away because they want to read reviews and watch out for any issues, and at that point it's really no longer "soon".... In other words; how long is the wait realistically when accounting for that, and does the wait still make sense when one could have used the current version during that time?

To be clear, I'm not disagreeing, just saying that sometimes (in my case) the "soon" in practice turns out to be not so soon.

PS: Of course the option of buying gen.1 Ryzen doesn't disappear when the new one shows up...

All signs still point to 1Q 2018 for Ryzen+, so unless something odd happens, we will see it and the new chipsets on the market very soon.

 

[mattiasnyc]

All signs still point to 1Q 2018 for Ryzen+, so unless something odd happens, we will see it and the new chipsets on the market very soon.

You misunderstood me. My point was that for some people - like myself - "soon" is true for the project launch, but if I'm honest with myself it isn't true of what actually happens. Last year it was "soon" for me before Ryzen launched, but then I decided to wait and see how Threadripper turned out, and then I decided to wait for sales, and all of a sudden it was December.

So all I was saying was that for some people (like me) the wait isn't the same as the "soon" the product will release, it's much longer. So for some of us (like me) it's worth keeping in mind.

 

[rainy]

At this point, you might as well wait for Ryzen+ which will be out soon.
Ryzen2 is not until 2019.

It's funny like some people are confused by Zen and Ryzen names:
Summit Ridge (Zen core) it's Ryzen 1xxx series, Pinnacle Ridge (Zen+) is a Ryzen 2xxx series and Mattise (Zen 2 core) would be Ryzen 3xxx series (in 2019 of course).

 

[Hitman928]

You misunderstood me. My point was that for some people - like myself - "soon" is true for the project launch, but if I'm honest with myself it isn't true of what actually happens. Last year it was "soon" for me before Ryzen launched, but then I decided to wait and see how Threadripper turned out, and then I decided to wait for sales, and all of a sudden it was December.

So all I was saying was that for some people (like me) the wait isn't the same as the "soon" the product will release, it's much longer. So for some of us (like me) it's worth keeping in mind.

I'm in the same boat. I was close several times to pull the trigger on Ryzen last year but motherboard availability and a general wanting to avoid some of the early issues made me wait. Then when the threadripper rumors appeared to be legit, I decided to wait on that. In the end I still haven't bought anything and I'm waiting to see how Pinnacle Ridge turns out.

I do think it's different this time around though for a few reasons.

1. Ryzen was a huge unknown leading up to its release. There were lots of rumors but nothing concrete until shortly before release.
   
2. Even after it's release, there was the motherboard availability and memory compatibility issues to deal with for a while.
3. Exactly what threadripper was and how it would work was again, a big unknown.

None of these issues should exist this time. I am going to wait to see a good variety of reviews before making a decision as I'm still fine with my current rig and am not hurting to upgrade, just have that itch.

 

[LTC8K6]

You misunderstood me. My point was that for some people - like myself - "soon" is true for the project launch, but if I'm honest with myself it isn't true of what actually happens. Last year it was "soon" for me before Ryzen launched, but then I decided to wait and see how Threadripper turned out, and then I decided to wait for sales, and all of a sudden it was December.

So all I was saying was that for some people (like me) the wait isn't the same as the "soon" the product will release, it's much longer. So for some of us (like me) it's worth keeping in mind.

I decided to skip Broadwell and wait for Skylake.
Then I decided to wait for Kaby Lake.
Then Zen came on the scene to wait for.
Then I decided to wait for Coffee Lake.

I'm still waiting.

 

[indydude345]

Since X370 is still going to be relevant with the AM4 platform, the upgrade path for Ryzen is going to be pretty good for most. When I first upgraded, I came from an Ivy Bridge i5 which even today still isn't that bad, but I was definitely able to see the performance gain in a lot of areas. Multi-threaded performance being one of them, obviously.

With the mainstream AMD platform, even Intel now for that matter, it really comes down to if you need the extra cores and threads.

I can see why a lot of people want to wait, which is understandable. Honestly, when are we going to see the CPUs finally reach a limit for the technology we have today? Silicon can only hold so much and be so thin.

 

[raghu78]

I am seriously thinking to get an AMD rig after 10 years... I have an old case for it, so guys, what do you recomend to me? get a Ryzen 1 or wait for Ryzen 2?

You should definitely wait for Ryzen 2000 desktop CPUs. I think most people have low expectations but I think Zen+ on 12LP is going to be a big improvement especially in ST perf, gaming perf and max clocks.

 

[Herr Kutz]

You should definitely wait for Ryzen 2000 desktop CPUs. I think most people have low expectations but I think Zen+ on 12LP is going to be a big improvement especially in ST perf, gaming perf and max clocks.

I really hope they can improve on single thread performance. I'd like to go with an AMD processor for my next upgrade, but they are just too far behind in single threaded performance (for now).

 

[The Stilt]

Raven Ridge core does not have all the core improvements in Zen+. The IMC in Pinnacle Ridge is expected to be able to support DDR4 upto 4000 Mhz which is not possible in Raven Ridge. btw I think the memory and cache latency improvements in Pinnacle Ridge are much more than what Raven Ridge has. We could see L3 latency reduction in Pinnacle Ridge.

https://www.computerbase.de/bildstrecke/81229/4/

The biggest difference is Pinnacle Ridge is built using 12LP high performance libraries while the Summit Ridge and Raven Ridge chips were built using High density 14LPP libraries (CPP=78nm, 9T)

https://pc.watch.impress.co.jp/img/pcw/docs/733/713/html/9.jpg.html
https://www.pcper.com/news/Processors/AMD-Details-Zen-ISSCC

12LP is an optical shrink and my guess as to the MMP is 56nm as it matches 12FDX MMP and 7LP CPP. I think Zen+ will be built using 12LP Ultra high perf libraries (MMP=56nm, CPP=84nm, 10.5T)

https://m.eet.com/content/images/eetimes/1 7 12 14 copared x 800_1505972923.jpg

Has there been any official statement that Pinnacle would indeed be using HP instead of HD?
Or that the cores in Zeppelin were using HD in the first place? Caches were never the issue with Zeppelin anyway.

 

[formulav8]

All signs still point to 1Q 2018 for Ryzen+

February 12th IIRC

 

[The Stilt]

February 12th IIRC

Isn't that for Raven only?

 

[raghu78]

Has there been any official statement that Pinnacle would indeed be using HP instead of HD?
Or that the cores in Zeppelin were using HD in the first place? Caches were never the issue with Zeppelin anyway.

We can confirm that Zeppelin used 14LPP High density libraries (CPP=78nm, 9T) from the ISSCC Zen core specification (CPP=78nm, MMP=64nm)

https://www.pcper.com/news/Processors/AMD-Details-Zen-ISSCC

14LPP High performance (9T) and Ultra high performance (10.5T) both use relaxed CPP of 84nm.

https://pc.watch.impress.co.jp/img/pcw/docs/733/713/html/9.jpg.html

btw GF confirmed support of the performance option (which i guess is CPP=84nm) with all of their libraries at 12LP. My guess to the 12LP libraries that PR is built using (MMP=56nm CPP=84nm, 10.5T). I believe 12FDX and 12LP are not arbitrarily named 12nm. They share the same MMP. We already know 12FDX specs

https://www.eetimes.com/document.asp?doc_id=1332328
https://m.eet.com/content/images/eetimes/1 7 12 14 copared x 800_1505972923.jpg

GF has stated 12LP is an optical shrink to Daniel Nenni of semiwiki. All these pieces of information allow me to guess with quite a bit of confidence.

 

[The Stilt]

We can confirm that Zeppelin used 14LPP High density libraries (CPP=78nm, 9T) from the ISSCC Zen core specification (CPP=78nm, MMP=64nm)

https://www.pcper.com/news/Processors/AMD-Details-Zen-ISSCC

14LPP High performance (9T) and Ultra high performance (10.5T) both use relaxed CPP of 84nm.

https://pc.watch.impress.co.jp/img/pcw/docs/733/713/html/9.jpg.html

btw GF confirmed support of the performance option (which i guess is CPP=84nm) with all of their libraries at 12LP. My guess to the 12LP libraries that PR is built using (MMP=56nm CPP=84nm, 10.5T). I believe 12FDX and 12LP are not arbitrarily named 12nm. They share the same MMP. We already know 12FDX specs

https://www.eetimes.com/document.asp?doc_id=1332328
https://m.eet.com/content/images/eetimes/1 7 12 14 copared x 800_1505972923.jpg

GF has stated 12LP is an optical shrink to Daniel Nenni of semiwiki. All these pieces of information allow me to guess with quite a bit of confidence.

Ok, thanks for that.

But you don't know as a fact that AMD went from HD (78) to HP (84) with PR?