* * * OFFICIAL * * * Bush / Kerry Debate . . .

[FelixDeCat]

Bush smoked Kerry. Smoked him out of his spiderhole of deceptions

 

[Emveach]

Originally posted by: Deus3344

Originally posted by: JHoNNy1OoO

Originally posted by: Deus3344

Originally posted by: Emveach
I looked at the Factcheck link for the Lumber Buisness Bush is supposed to own. The $84 is from a company named The Lone Star Trust, and is described as dealing with oil and gas production. That matches a Yahoo buisness search for Midland Texas.

So no, he doesn't own a lumber company.

Thanks.

The issue wasn't if he owned a lumber company. It was that Bush under the numbers that he uses (900,000) of small businesses that Kerry's tax increase will effect for the people making $200k+, Bush himself will be considered a small business owner. I know it's ridiculous but thats how Bush came up with the numbers. The true number of small businesses effected is less than half of the 900,000 figure at 417,000.

I don't think there is a doubt that both sides twist numbers for their own agenda.

So true. The Bush side is using an inflated number of small buisness owners, and the Kerry side is sticking to the 200 billion war cost when its actually just 119 billion. they also claim that 90% of the deaths are American in Iraq, when the Iraqi soldiers fighting along side us alone have had more deaths then the USA. The actual death percentage is closer to 40-50%.

 

[CycloWizard]

Originally posted by: Emveach
So true. The Bush side is using an inflated number of small buisness owners, and the Kerry side is sticking to the 200 billion war cost when its actually just 119 billion. they also claim that 90% of the deaths are American in Iraq, when the Iraqi soldiers fighting along side us alone have had more deaths then the USA. The actual death percentage is closer to 40-50%.

Agreed. I think they need to have someone more heavy-handed as the moderator to point out lies, even if it is after the candidate speaks. If it takes Mike Tyson, so be it. Both sides just spout out the same BS lies that they spout out in their campaign ads, and it's shameful. 99% of the population doesn't have the motivation/capability of finding out the truth, so they take what the candidates say at face value.

 

[chowderhead]

GWB attacks Kerry for making so many promises that he break his promises or raise taxes.
Kerry already said he plans are paid for and that they are willing to scale back the plans i.e. national service if they couldn't afford it.
We could do what GWB is doing and promise EVERYTHING to everyone, leave no bill unsigned and leave billions and billions in debt to future generation. :thumbsdown:

Come on, the media ain't picking these gaffes up.
internets
when I came into office, the stock market was going up then later, when I came into office, the market was going down.
GWB thought he was debating Senator Kennedy
GWB didn't know he was partial owner to a timber company and either lied or was did not know his finances.
We don't want any judges that supported controversial subjects like slavery.
GWB said that had we gone with Kerry, the world would be a safer place

GWB was better (though that ain't saying much) but Kerry was so much superior.

 

[Emveach]

Originally posted by: CycloWizard

Originally posted by: Emveach
So true. The Bush side is using an inflated number of small buisness owners, and the Kerry side is sticking to the 200 billion war cost when its actually just 119 billion. they also claim that 90% of the deaths are American in Iraq, when the Iraqi soldiers fighting along side us alone have had more deaths then the USA. The actual death percentage is closer to 40-50%.

Agreed. I think they need to have someone more heavy-handed as the moderator to point out lies, even if it is after the candidate speaks. If it takes Mike Tyson, so be it. Both sides just spout out the same BS lies that they spout out in their campaign ads, and it's shameful. 99% of the population doesn't have the motivation/capability of finding out the truth, so they take what the candidates say at face value.

Maybe Macho-Man should be there then, like someone said earlier.

"Ohhhhh yeahhhhh......that wasn't true......gonna snap you like a slim-jim now."

 

[SViscusi]

Originally posted by: Emveach

Originally posted by: Deus3344

Originally posted by: JHoNNy1OoO

Originally posted by: Deus3344

Originally posted by: Emveach
I looked at the Factcheck link for the Lumber Buisness Bush is supposed to own. The $84 is from a company named The Lone Star Trust, and is described as dealing with oil and gas production. That matches a Yahoo buisness search for Midland Texas.

So no, he doesn't own a lumber company.

Thanks.

The issue wasn't if he owned a lumber company. It was that Bush under the numbers that he uses (900,000) of small businesses that Kerry's tax increase will effect for the people making $200k+, Bush himself will be considered a small business owner. I know it's ridiculous but thats how Bush came up with the numbers. The true number of small businesses effected is less than half of the 900,000 figure at 417,000.

I don't think there is a doubt that both sides twist numbers for their own agenda.

So true. The Bush side is using an inflated number of small buisness owners, and the Kerry side is sticking to the 200 billion war cost when its actually just 119 billion.

They're using the figure that Iraq is going to cost, which is typical. Example when the cost of the prescription drug benefit plan is talked about they say 500 million not what it's cost to this point.

they also claim that 90% of the deaths are American in Iraq, when the Iraqi soldiers fighting along side us alone have had more deaths then the USA. The actual death percentage is closer to 40-50%.

It's pretty clear he's talking about coalition deaths and even if you include Iraqi deaths it's still 58% which also doesnt change the fact that the U.S. is paying for 90% of the cost.

 

[CycloWizard]

Originally posted by: Emveach
Maybe Macho-Man should be there then, like someone said earlier.

"Ohhhhh yeahhhhh......that wasn't true......gonna snap you like a slim-jim now."

He's Bonesaw McGraw now... I like that a lot better than Macho-Man.

 

[HomeBrewerDude]

Originally posted by: CycloWizard

Originally posted by: Emveach
So true. The Bush side is using an inflated number of small buisness owners, and the Kerry side is sticking to the 200 billion war cost when its actually just 119 billion. they also claim that 90% of the deaths are American in Iraq, when the Iraqi soldiers fighting along side us alone have had more deaths then the USA. The actual death percentage is closer to 40-50%.

Agreed. I think they need to have someone more heavy-handed as the moderator to point out lies, even if it is after the candidate speaks. If it takes Mike Tyson, so be it. Both sides just spout out the same BS lies that they spout out in their campaign ads, and it's shameful. 99% of the population doesn't have the motivation/capability of finding out the truth, so they take what the candidates say at face value.

No. The moderator job is to keep people on schedule and to aske the questions. Its our job to sort out the mess afterwards.

 

[Engineer]

Originally posted by: CycloWizard

Originally posted by: Emveach
Maybe Macho-Man should be there then, like someone said earlier.

"Ohhhhh yeahhhhh......that wasn't true......gonna snap you like a slim-jim now."

He's Bonesaw McGraw now... I like that a lot better than Macho-Man.

LOL...Spiderman kicked his @ss....hehe!

 

[CycloWizard]

Originally posted by: HomeBrewerDude
No. The moderator job is to keep people on schedule and to aske the questions. Its our job to sort out the mess afterwards.

*sigh* Very constructive to just say 'no.' Read what I said again. His powers should be expanded. Thus, the current job description doesn't rule out what I said.

 

[batchusa]

The non online polls have Kerry winning it by 4-5%. The momentum continues....

 

[nageov3t]

I'd say Kerry won by a pretty slim margin... but more importantly, though, Bush didn't lose.

he didn't fvck anything up, which is all he really needed to do (or not do, as it may be).

 

[HomeBrewerDude]

Originally posted by: CycloWizard

Originally posted by: HomeBrewerDude
No. The moderator job is to keep people on schedule and to aske the questions. Its our job to sort out the mess afterwards.

*sigh* Very constructive to just say 'no.' Read what I said again. His powers should be expanded. Thus, the current job description doesn't rule out what I said.

The problem with the idea that the moderator should call out inconsistencies, or lies if you prefer, is that then we have to worry about who the moderator is and what he/she believes is truth. Its better to let the debaters say what ever they want, make public record of it, and then let them be held accountable for their words later.

 

[ntdz]

Originally posted by: batchusa
The non online polls have Kerry winning it by 4-5%. The momentum continues....

what polls? I don't see any non online polls getting released...

 

[Sonic587]

.

 

[OutHouse]

I think its sickening on how we are basing our vote on who is the better pubic speaker.

 

[nageov3t]

Originally posted by: Citrix
I think its sickening on how we are basing our vote on who is the better pubic speaker.

I think the debates offer some insight into how the canidate thinks and reacts under pressure, when they don't have a script availible to read from. that's a pretty important consideration (for me at least). it's a way of judging who would react the best under pressure when they're in the Situation Room.

 

[Sonic587]

Originally posted by: SViscusi

Originally posted by: Emveach

Originally posted by: Deus3344

Originally posted by: JHoNNy1OoO

Originally posted by: Deus3344

Originally posted by: Emveach
I looked at the Factcheck link for the Lumber Buisness Bush is supposed to own. The $84 is from a company named The Lone Star Trust, and is described as dealing with oil and gas production. That matches a Yahoo buisness search for Midland Texas.

So no, he doesn't own a lumber company.

Thanks.

The issue wasn't if he owned a lumber company. It was that Bush under the numbers that he uses (900,000) of small businesses that Kerry's tax increase will effect for the people making $200k+, Bush himself will be considered a small business owner. I know it's ridiculous but thats how Bush came up with the numbers. The true number of small businesses effected is less than half of the 900,000 figure at 417,000.

I don't think there is a doubt that both sides twist numbers for their own agenda.

So true. The Bush side is using an inflated number of small buisness owners, and the Kerry side is sticking to the 200 billion war cost when its actually just 119 billion.

They're using the figure that Iraq is going to cost, which is typical. Example when the cost of the prescription drug benefit plan is talked about they say 500 million not what it's cost to this point.

they also claim that 90% of the deaths are American in Iraq, when the Iraqi soldiers fighting along side us alone have had more deaths then the USA. The actual death percentage is closer to 40-50%.

It's pretty clear he's talking about coalition deaths and even if you include Iraqi deaths it's still 58% which also doesnt change the fact that the U.S. is paying for 90% of the cost.

SViscusi is correct. When Kerry/Edwards mention 90% of casualties are on the US side they are talking about coalition deaths. They aren't trying to play up a false number.

I also think it's wrong to use the iraqi body count in such a manor that the Bush/Cheney ticket has. You have to have a lot of guts to try and spin a US death toll into a more positive light.

 

[joshw10]

Originally posted by: Citrix
I think its sickening on how we are basing our vote on who is the better pubic speaker.

It's certainly one of the many factors. I believe the President should be capable of communicating with the people through words. I dont care if Bush is actually really intelligent, but just cant speak because he has dyslexia or whatever. Too bad for him. There's enough intelligent people out there with great ideas who would like to be President, I think we can find one who has the ability to speak as well.

 

[rickn]

Originally posted by: joshw10

Originally posted by: Citrix
I think its sickening on how we are basing our vote on who is the better pubic speaker.

It's certainly one of the many factors. I believe the President should be capable of communicating with the people through words. I dont care if Bush is actually really intelligent, but just cant speak because he has dyslexia or whatever. Too bad for him. There's enough intelligent people out there with great ideas who would like to be President, I think we can find one who has the ability to speak as well.

or in the case of the first debate, he looked and acted like a belligerent drunk

 

[Aimster]

Originally posted by: ntdz

Originally posted by: batchusa
The non online polls have Kerry winning it by 4-5%. The momentum continues....

what polls? I don't see any non online polls getting released...

ABC &CNN

 

[raildogg]

the town hall setup is totally wrong. the audience is prepared, the candidates are prepared ... there is no surprise.

 

[ntdz]

Originally posted by: Aimster

Originally posted by: ntdz

Originally posted by: batchusa
The non online polls have Kerry winning it by 4-5%. The momentum continues....

what polls? I don't see any non online polls getting released...

ABC &CNN

abc has kerry winning by 2% w/ more democrats surveyed than republicans and cnn has kerry winning by 3%. What poll has him up by 4-5%?

 

[conjur]

Belligerent Bush turning his back on Charlie Gibson was, imo, a damning indictment as to the President's character and his state of mind. Charlie keeled over and let Bush stomp all over his own stated rules. If Kerry had done that, the media would have been all over him.

 

[SViscusi]

Originally posted by: ntdz

Originally posted by: Aimster

Originally posted by: ntdz

Originally posted by: batchusa
The non online polls have Kerry winning it by 4-5%. The momentum continues....

what polls? I don't see any non online polls getting released...

ABC &CNN

abc has kerry winning by 2% w/ more democrats surveyed than republicans

Every national poll should have more democrats because there are more democrats in the country.