**OFFICIAL** Diablo 3 Thread

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biostud

Lifer
Feb 27, 2003
18,678
5,407
136
Since I've restarted completely on Diablo III, I'm not going to compete with your elite items, but I was lucky enough to get these pants.



They are insanely effective with leap/call of Arreat.
 
Oct 20, 2005
10,978
44
91
I am doing the challenge achievements achievements and am now down to two. I need to kill 25k trees and and then the other one has become a pain in the butt to get, killing Azmodan before any demon gates spawn troopers while the game is on Master or higher.

My Monk has 242k dps buffed with Scoundrel and still can't do it. I got my friend to come on his Archon Wizard and still could not get it. The gates spawn adds fast.

Are you killing the gates when they spawn?

Or are you just ignoring them and trying to burn Az down?
 

Cappuccino

Diamond Member
Feb 27, 2013
4,018
726
126
Since I've restarted completely on Diablo III, I'm not going to compete with your elite items, but I was lucky enough to get these pants.



They are insanely effective with leap/call of Arreat.
lol I thought you was trolling for showing us your pants. Then I realize you play self found
 

smackababy

Lifer
Oct 30, 2008
27,024
79
86
Not sure if this is new or old but worth a look. Kinda funny!
http://i2.minus.com/i4OVEI5CPV9hc.png

Besides the awful font, it fails to address the real problem the person who made it has: they believe that they deserve to have every time be useful. The general population of gamers (especially Blizzard's core customers) feel like they are entitled to loot. So, to "fix" this, Blizzard made legendary items in D3 just rare items with a different color. The people who are happy finding shiny orange items are happy and the hardcore who want to be the top 1%, continue to find that perfect roll, regardless of the color.

People that want to be handed everything make graphics like that one. And it is why games are getting dumbed down.

A legendary doesn't have to be godly, an upgrade, or even interesting. They can simply be a rarer item.
 

biostud

Lifer
Feb 27, 2003
18,678
5,407
136
lol I thought you was trolling for showing us your pants. Then I realize you play self found

hehe, I've just reached lvl 60 +2 paragon levels with my new barbarian during the weekend, and I've just found my first set item. I compared my equipment with my old lvl 60 barbarian, and the old is utter crap. With the new loot system Diablo III so much more fun to play for me. It's like a new game. I gave up on the old game when I reached 3 paragon levels, and I didn't have all my characters @ lvl 60.
 

Wardawg1001

Senior member
Sep 4, 2008
653
1
81
Besides the awful font,

The font is from Diablo...

it fails to address the real problem the person who made it has: they believe that they deserve to have every time be useful.

I assume 'time' is a typo meant to be 'item'. And what are you basing this off? The creator of the graphic went into quite a bit of detail about what his real problem is. Too many legendary's that are literally not special at all, and too many of the ones that are special simply rely on having higher stats than your average rare, or a single unique attribute. What exactly is not valid about this complaint?

It's not about 'deserving' to have every item be useful. We don't deserve anything but a playable game. We want a great game though, and D3 could be so much better if Blizzard would get off their asses and actually put some real work into their itemization.

The general population of gamers (especially Blizzard's core customers) feel like they are entitled to loot. So, to "fix" this, Blizzard made legendary items in D3 just rare items with a different color.

I don't get it. Blizzards core Diablo fan base, prior to D3 being released, was entirely made up of D2 players. D2 had tons of interesting uniques, sets, runewords, etc. These were all obtainable by your average player (with the possible exception of some of the more difficult to obtain runewords). This wasn't broken to begin with, it didn't need to be fixed. Making legendary items in D3 just rare items with a different color is what broke it in the first place.

The people who are happy finding shiny orange items are happy and the hardcore who want to be the top 1%, continue to find that perfect roll, regardless of the color.

Nobody was happy finding shiny orange items that were literally just regular yellow items with some extra flavor text. That's why Loot 2.0 exists. Everyone will be happier with more interesting itemization. Blizzard is taking steps towards that, and its already showing how well its paying off. But its been so long, and they have so much more they could do. That is what the graphic is pointing out. We are 2 years in, Blizzard should have been able to accomplish more by now.

People that want to be handed everything make graphics like that one. And it is why games are getting dumbed down.

Please point out the specific parts of that graphic that indicate that the creator simply wants everything handed to him. And how the fuck do you make the connection between wanting interesting item design and dumbing down the game? He's asking for the opposite. He wants MORE unique items, MORE interesting mods on them, MORE customization. The original design of 'legendaries are just rares with flavor text and higher stats' is what is dumbed down.

A legendary doesn't have to be godly, an upgrade, or even interesting. They can simply be a rarer item.

You are right. A legendary doesn't have to be anything. Hell, Blizzard could make it so that all legendaries are intentionally worse than your average yellow item. Blizzard can do whatever the hell they want. That isn't the point. The point is that the game would be more fun with more interesting item design. Interesting item design opens up more options for build customization (which is sorely lacking, due to the way skills are designed in this game), and lets face it, its simply more fun to try to farm for legendary items than it is to farm for a rare item with the same stats as the one you are wearing but with higher rolls.
 

akahoovy

Golden Member
May 1, 2011
1,336
1
0
And they're account bound. Often the also have some special property.

I was being sarcastic, but what Wardawg said highlighted the point of the graphic very well. I was thinking along the same lines before I saw the graphic anyway. What's the point of an item being a legendary item if it has the same 4 primary/2 secondary attribute affixes and nothing else?

Diablo had a pretty good take on unique items, so did Diablo 2. A lot of the items in Diablo had flavor by having penalties for having multiple stats, even though a lot of the beneficial stats were kinda weak. Diablo 2 had unique items that had multiple stats that benefited each other when they were on the same item.

There will likely be a Loot 3.0 because now there are multiple damage modifiers that compete for those 4 primary slots, like +main attribute, +attack speed, +critical chance, +critical hit damage, +damage to specific skill, and +damage to elemental type that can be occupied by defensive stats like +life on hit, +life per second, +armor, and +resist all. So even when legendary items drop, they can be weak.

I'd be happy with a lower drop rate for legendary items if it meant there was a high chance I was going to keep it for one of the classes rather than salvaging it for crafting. Real excitement when one dropped because I didn't have to pray that it was going to be worthwhile. That's what rares are for. I wouldn't mind more very good legendaries with a penalty you have to figure out how to balance against, like Andariel's Visage.
 

akahoovy

Golden Member
May 1, 2011
1,336
1
0
I love this item:

http://us.battle.net/d3/en/item/mirrorball

or this:

http://us.battle.net/d3/en/item/winter-flurry

Items that change how skills work are exciting. Finding stuff like this will make me want to play another class purely from finding items like that. However, all the off-hand orbs that are scaling up to level 60 have subpar damage to Triumvirate or Oculus (just the primary damage), so that's not addressed yet either. What is Blizzard's hang up?
 

Imp

Lifer
Feb 8, 2000
18,828
184
106
Holy product placement, Diablo 3 shows up on Once Upon a Time with real game and cinematic footage. Awesome because shows usually use fake games with fake button mashing.
 

CU

Platinum Member
Aug 14, 2000
2,415
51
91
Found my my best item so far. It is a 1.3k dps pig sticker. Bumped my wizard to over 100K dps. Does the squeal do anything besides make a noise?
 

Tweak155

Lifer
Sep 23, 2003
11,448
262
126
I think the AT clan has made it better. Just join a random game playing the difficulty you're looking for... we need more people to join!

With the way they changed the difficulty system, it's easier for people to join the same game and get going.
 

darkewaffle

Diamond Member
Oct 7, 2005
8,152
1
81
Man this game's playerbase amazes me. A week before gold is basically useless, the price of gold on the RMAH is at what is almost surely at least a 12 month high - it's basically tripled since December.

Also I sold two of my old 300 spears on the RMAH for $30 and $11 yesterday. (edit: just got email notice that a spear I picked up for $6 last night successfully flipped for $16 )

I really like some of the skill re-balancing that took place. Like making the mini-teleport innate to Fist of Thunder rather than part of the one rune it makes the rune choice much more interesting now. Also the addition of an elemental affinity to each skill is a nice dynamic.

I kind of dislike how throw barb plays now though, I preferred the original "No Escape" passive (particularly the free reset on Ancient Spear) and using AS as a fury gen instead of a fury dump. Might just take some getting used to.

Loot hasn't been that interesting for me thus far. Seems like they're trying to establish a rough baseline dps/survival level for every character by making gear with gobs of mainstat/vit/AR available pretty easily while tuning down CC/CD/AS.

Diablo had a pretty good take on unique items, so did Diablo 2. A lot of the items in Diablo had flavor by having penalties for having multiple stats, even though a lot of the beneficial stats were kinda weak. Diablo 2 had unique items that had multiple stats that benefited each other when they were on the same item.

For the record, a huge portion of the set and unique loot in D2 was completely unusable/unused because it sucked (The Rising Sun, Snakecord, Darksight Helm, theres a hundred more). I don't see a difference personally. Even then D2 had plenty of "stat stick" legendaries that were highly sought after but at the same time unremarkable - Herald of Zakarum, Mara's Kaleidoscope, Shako for instance. I think the whole "special feature" legendary idea is quite misleading - it's the exception, not the rule.
 
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smackababy

Lifer
Oct 30, 2008
27,024
79
86
So, fired up the old DH last night with my Monk gear on (and a really crappy Manticore). Well, he is pretty much a god now. ~250k dps... I am probably using a terrible build, but whatever. The sad part is I can do higher T level than my monk can, with identical gear. =(
 

artemicion

Golden Member
Jun 9, 2004
1,006
1
76
Not sure if this is new or old but worth a look. Kinda funny!
http://i2.minus.com/i4OVEI5CPV9hc.png

He had a decent argument until he started complaining about the stat numbers being too big. Then he went full whiner.

I get people who rant on Internet forums about how they hate the latest iteration of their beloved video game franchise, but when it gets to the point when you are making oversized jpegs, gathering screenshots for examples, trying to use Diablo 2 font ironically ... seriously. Get. A. Life. It's a video game. Get over it. Talk about having a case of HEY EVERYBODY, LOOK AT ME I'M ON MY SOAP BOX SCREAMING AND KICKING AND MARVELING AT MY OWN PROFUNDITY.
 

Wardawg1001

Senior member
Sep 4, 2008
653
1
81
He had a decent argument until he started complaining about the stat numbers being too big. Then he went full whiner.

Oh, you must be talking about the ONE paragraph in the middle of the graphic where he mentions it. Or do you mean the part at the very end, where he is summarizing the entire graphic, and once again mentions the words 'inflated stats' without further elaborating. Which part is where he went full whiner and ruined his entire argument, invalidating every other meaningful point?

What you don't seem to grasp, is that the stats are not themselves the problem. The problem is that the stats are so much of the item. Str/dex/int/vit is BORING. Yet your primary stat + vit is the most important thing you can get on damn near every item, and here is the key part - Reaper of Souls is making no effort to change this. If that isn't worthy of ONE paragraph out of 20+ in an attempt to identify the problems with D3 item design, then what is?

I get people who rant on Internet forums about how they hate the latest iteration of their beloved video game franchise, but when it gets to the point when you are making oversized jpegs, gathering screenshots for examples, trying to use Diablo 2 font ironically ... seriously. Get. A. Life. It's a video game. Get over it. Talk about having a case of HEY EVERYBODY, LOOK AT ME I'M ON MY SOAP BOX SCREAMING AND KICKING AND MARVELING AT MY OWN PROFUNDITY.

The guy has a lot of good points, and he covers the gamut of the issues with D3 item design pretty well. What the fuck do you care what he spends his time on. D3, like so many other games out there, is chock full of people who have no "life". He has a message, he got it out there. I've seen this page linked to on 3 different forums I frequent (and no I didn't post the link on any of them). Guess what would happen if this person had posted this exact same info here? How likely do you think it is that anyone besides the dozen or so regulars who still visit this thread would ever see it? He had a message, he got it out there. Why you feel the need to tear it down because he went 'full whiner' over stat numbers is far more concerning to me than anything he has done.
 
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smackababy

Lifer
Oct 30, 2008
27,024
79
86
He doesn't have a 'good point' though. He whines that items are "boring" because he can name a few good D2 legendaries and a few junk D3 ones. He fails to realize that there were a ton of junk items in D2 AND if it didn't have +skills, it was junk. Plus, D3 is much harder than D2. Thus, all those "good" items and builds, weren't really that good. They were okay, but that doesn't cut it in D3, where the higher difficulties are difficult.

People feel the need to tear it down because it is wrong. It is trying to use rose colored glasses to paint D2 as oh so superior.
 

Wardawg1001

Senior member
Sep 4, 2008
653
1
81
He doesn't have a 'good point' though. He whines that items are "boring" because he can name a few good D2 legendaries and a few junk D3 ones. He fails to realize that there were a ton of junk items in D2 AND if it didn't have +skills, it was junk. Plus, D3 is much harder than D2. Thus, all those "good" items and builds, weren't really that good. They were okay, but that doesn't cut it in D3, where the higher difficulties are difficult.

People feel the need to tear it down because it is wrong. It is trying to use rose colored glasses to paint D2 as oh so superior.

Zzzzz, you again. Come to jump on the hater bandwagon instead of actually responding to anything that was said about your last completely brain dead post. Would you care to explain yet what it is exactly about wanting more varied and interesting item design that is contributing to the down fall of gaming? No? I'll give you a few more days to collect your thoughts.

There are three places in which D2 items are even mentioned, and always as specific examples to compare D3 items against, and never in 'oh look how great D2 was' fashion. Seriously, what else would you expect? What else is there to compare against? The graphic is not an ode to the glory days of D2, its an analysis of the current state of D3 itemization. Pull your hate blinders off for a second and look at the actual content of it instead of just seeing 'oh D2 is mentioned, must be all about how great D2 is and nothing in here could possibly be valid because he brought up D2'.

How about you actually address the real concerns in the graphic instead of straw manning it. Heres a quick list for you, feel free to respond in any order.

- Stats that are specific to a class on an item that cannot be used by that class
- Completely obviously useless stats (miniscule amounts of damage reflect, which btw is sadly not limited to the Nailbiter weapon in the graphic, I've seen several others since Loot 2.0)
- Legendaries/sets that have literally no unique stat on them at all, not even a common stat that usually can't be found on that item (I have 8 of these in my stash atm, and a number of others that have been salvaged already, all found since the start of Loot 2.0)
- Legendaries/sets that have a single unique attribute that is completely worthless (gold find, magic find, and damage reflect are the biggest offenders here, and they are quite prevalent among legendaries and set items these days)
- Sockets on weapons being the absolute top tier affix, to the point where it outweighs the usefulness of every other affix on the weapon combined, and is basically mandatory for a weapon to even be considered top tier
- Even the good legendaries/sets are, for the most part, regular rare items with boosted main stats (str/dex/int/vit/damage) and a single unique attribute (this is BORING)

Now before you respond, remember that you can't bring up D2 at all, since that is apparently taboo (and notice how I pointed out all of these issues without a single reference to D2 either). I don't want to hear about whether any of these issues existed in D2 as well, or whether any of these problems are better or worse in D3 than they were in D2. NO STRAW MANNING. You tell me exactly why any of this is exceptional item design (hell, even acceptable item design), worthy of what is supposed to be the greatest ARPG in history, made by one of the most successful development studios in gaming history, after 5 years of development and 2 more years in production.

Or just quit your stupid hate mongering.
 
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