**OFFICIAL** FFXIV:ARR Thread

[redrider4life4]

I loved this game when it first came out, slowly died out though. Idk every single MMO now is trying to mimick WoW and it just can't get there. I wish FF14 stuck with the hardcore FF11 strategy, even though I can't play hardcore anymore I still enjoy a good hardcore MMO. Even if it takes me 3 months to hit max level. Dungeons are just old, WoW burned them out over the years.

 

[PowerYoga]

eh, I don't have as much time as I used to and I'm glad FF14 is a lot more casual friendly. I don't really see the "mimick wow" thing though. Wow does a lot of things right: the last thing I want to do in order to upgrade my gear is to camp fafnir or nidhogg for 12 hours.

They need to have a lot more token based turn ins so people feel like they're making progress even with all the bullshit RNG drops.

 

[tedrodai]

Yeah the casual friendly stuff is what keeps me going. I have just enough time most weeks to do coil, do 1-2 CT runs, finish capping myth via high lv roulette, then maybe 2-3 more hours of whatever.

I also agree that the RNG is crap. Right now I go in CT hoping for a few certain items and might act a tad picky on the 1st run, but on the second run I just roll on the first piece no one wants unless it's a belt. It isn't so bad that way (yet...but it can only get worse), but neither is it necessarily any good. There's no way I'm gonna keep running CT all week.

It's infinitely better than the FFXI RNG though...at least most instances guarantee a drop and most things have an equal chance of dropping. But they're starting to add more 'rare' vanity drops like nightmare whistle, which is a disconcerting trend.

 

[PowerYoga]

I would too if it wasn't fucking DRG/BRD/MNK pieces all the time.

I have those classes at 10/15/7 respectively.

I don't mind the vanity stuff, since it's just flavor. All of the beastman dailies are also just vanity dyes and mounts and whatnot. I do NOT miss camping nidhogg for MONTHS just to get a new glove or whatever. FF11 had it's time, it was fun and good but it's time to move on to the newer generation of mmos.

They need to make the world dangerous and a lot more lore centric, like FF11's world. But instances and TOKENS where loot is concerned.

 

[pandemonium]

I disagree. The casual gamer world has taken over and I dislike its focus.

There will always be a demand for hardcore playstyle...just not as largely as the casual. The problem is incorporating both and keeping it "fair" for everyone. There-in lies the problem; this incessant need to make it fair. Screw fair. There will always be different levels of gamers in any type of gaming platform, so why bother trying so hard to make it "fair"?

My answer to the current development teams out there is: to stop focusing on fair, and start focusing on the gaming platform and make it their own instead of copying what's in demand today.

Let the community develop the game for fairness like it was done in the good 'ole days. There's a couple games I'm hoping will accept the challenge: Star Citizen and Camelot Unchained.

This game is too much like WoW and I probably won't be resubscribing. Instance queuing, gear grinding tiers, and quest reward system in a community that doesn't really care about anyone else just trying to reach elitist status isn't my idea of fun. Been there, done that; shallow rewarding feeling leaving you wanting for more.

 

[PowerYoga]

You're free to disagree and to pursue hardcore gaming. I don't have the time for it anymore and neither do most people who grew up with games. The industry recognizes there is a market for casual gamers and they're unlikely to ostracize them to "make a game theirs". Ultimately the industry is about making money, especially something like a MMORPG which costs millions to develop and hundreds of thousands every month to maintain. You can always play EVE online if you want hardcore games where you lose everything when you die.

And you're just plain wrong about the community, 50% of my time is spent with PUGs and most don't care about "being elite". There's a difference between being elitist and not tolerating stupid bullshit.

 

[darkewaffle]

I have enough other games I want to actively play or try that and I don't want to spend so much time playing just one so I appreciate a more lightweight approach as well. As much as I enjoyed old FFXI parties these days I want to play BF4 and Hearthstone and Civ and Reus and TF2 and finish Bioshock 2 and get to Bioshock Infinite and the Borderlands2 DLC and hopefully try Everquest Next and so on and so forth lol.

 

[clok1966]

I loved this game when it first came out, slowly died out though. Idk every single MMO now is trying to mimick WoW and it just can't get there. I wish FF14 stuck with the hardcore FF11 strategy, even though I can't play hardcore anymore I still enjoy a good hardcore MMO. Even if it takes me 3 months to hit max level. Dungeons are just old, WoW burned them out over the years.

play any of the F2P designed ones after 20.. they are all hardcore (well if you consider that old grind, hardcore)

 

[tedrodai]

Last night I joined a random Titan HM Party-finder group to help folks get their relic. No one in the group knew each other, and upon entering the instance, someone asked how many people actually needed the completion for their relic (suspiciously high HP for most of the group). It turned out 6/8 were very well geared and only there to help...not even looking for a weapon drop. It was a quick clear and the 2 on the relic quest thanked everyone and we all moved on to whatever else we wanted to do that night.

However, that was the 2nd attempt. The 1st attempt involved a dude acting high and mighty as if it was a waste of his time because he thought it was supposed to be Extreme instead of Hard (party finder clearly indicated otherwise in multiple ways lol, including "for relic"). 1-2 minutes after starting the instance we were back outside replacing about 4 people. It took another 5 minutes to build the 2nd group that was so awesome.

The community is what you make it. Every online game I've played since 1997 has had the same mix of good folks, asshats, and in-betweens (a group we all belong to at times), just in various quantities and with different ways to deal with each other. Game design (including price) definitely has an effect on the types of players who play and who stick around, but it's still up to you to choose who you play with and how you play. The casual features and popularity make it easy to encounter the asshats IMO, but also make it easy to avoid them if you actually try.

Oddly enough, FFXIV 1.x had the best overall community of any online game I've ever played, but that's because the only people who could stomach it were those who had an unhealthy dose of optimism for the game's future, and thus in general were willing to work together against a ton of shit designed towards making them uninstall (and even then only stayed because it was free during that shit-period). ...Not a model any game designer is going to willingly emulate. Games with a more "hardcore" play model do something similar...weed out certain groups of people, but it certainly doesn't ensure fewer asshats. Hardcore games have their place, and *can* be successful, but it also makes it that much harder to be successful when you narrow your audience like that. That's why a lot of them are 'free to play' with incentives to buy premium content or items to make the game less frustrating.

That's just my viewpoint...none of my comments are meant to bash anyone or their opinions of the game. Anywho, good luck finding that perfect game.

 

[pandemonium]

I've had similar experiences and agree with your view points, tedrodai. FFXI holds some of my fondest MMO memories, and I certainly won't say it didn't have its share of people unfavorable. Same with your point of FFXIV v1.0, I feel difficult game play is conducive to a more rewarding feeling once a task was completed and was more conducive to a community that was willing to just help without having a hidden, self-interest agenda.

I want a hardcore game that demands my attention; forces me to study, learn, and up my game. I simply don't have the tolerance any more for people that can't even say hello when they join a party or thank you when I buff them or help in some way. Simple etiquette is something I look for, and seems its more and more difficult to find because everyone is so focused on getting tasks done with the limited time they have. I also believe the themepark, instance queue genre takes advantage of the community by being disenchanted to the point that they believe they're playing with a screen full of NPCs.

I should've been more clear on my stance. I don't like the game play. The themepark, quest-driven, FATE grind, isn't my idea of fun. Weekly runs for different currencies to achieve yet another level of gear is a poor excuse for revolving challenge. FFXIV's community certainly was better to me than others have been and its certainly not the worst MMO, but it's not for me. If you guys enjoy it, then more power to ya.

I meant no disrespect here. It's just frustrating finding a game that suits all aspects of my needs now. How I miss the days of being newb and having no expectations. The awe and wonder of freshly engaging a game and community are long gone for me. Sad old gamer I've become. >.<

 

[asteldian]

I certainly see Pandemonium's viewpoint, I miss decent games with decent communities. All games nowadays are a fast track race to the top then farm your currencies.
It's not necessarilly that which is the problem, as in reality that has been very much the MMO model forever (instead of currency it was just raid drops, but same thing). What I dislike is the fact that the modern gamer considers lvling a chore and not part of the game, its always all about 'end game' I miss the days of EQ1 when lvling was a big part of the experience.

Course, to me some of the biggest problems with FFXIV, and modern games are:
Duty Finder (Cross Server)
Auction House

I hate cross server Duty Finders, grouping with people you aren't going to see again is a big part of causing a very lazy attitude and antisocial behaviour. In previous games it is dungeons that I made my Guilds from and got to know people, built up that friendslist and then went and did all sorts of gaming stuff together. A cross Server Duty Finder is one of te biggest community killers there is.

Auction House, I miss the days of having a Trade channel, hawking my wares in zones - people got to know crafters, items sell at reasonable prices because you don't want to be stuck with your loot forever.

Course, these two things are now the backbone of any modern MMO and you lose them and you lose the masses.
FFXIV is fun and I will keep playng, but that's mainly because you won't find a proper MMO anymore.
Ever since WoW, the definition of MMO changed to Mass Market Online and that won't change anytime soon. Too much money is spent on the games for the companies to risk anything other than a generic game for the majority.

 

[PowerYoga]

Sorry but I hate bartering. I don't want to spend 45 minutes trying to find some vegetables to cook a stew with and going from city to city to find different trade channels. You never know what the real market price of any item was because it's hard to find people with stuff, and in return there's actually huge price gouging instead of "reasonable prices". It's also incredibly easy to scam people. Scams are common place.

It's part of the reason why there was a huge uproar about the retainer system in 1.0: people hated sifting through literally 100s of retainers to find a single nut or bolt at a reasonable price. People want to get in, buy things, get out so they can continue playing the game.

I'll agree with the FF11 experiences, but I simply don't have time for the hardcore grindy stuff anymore. There's plenty of mmorpgs that deviate from the norm, so if something feels too generic or bland to you, you're free to move to another game.

 

[pathos]

I don't think having to hawk your guilds in the trade channel needs a return.

I also wouldn't want the duty finder to go away. I would, however like to see the duty finder go local server only.

Well, if the population of the server supports it, anyway.

 

[Sohaltang]

I been playing about 10 days. Level 26 gladiator. While the game looks nice and I do like it, the more I play it the more I miss ffxi. It was such a better game. Not sure if I will stick with this one more than a month or two. Very much WOW feel with FF storyline. Sucks I cant get Uber armor or weapons. Farming gil is very hard. Dungeons are repetitive. I miss the 6 hour party and grind. Maybe Im doing it wrong..

 

[cbrunny]

The problem with server-only DF is that it punishes small population servers - even adding it as an option will punish the small worlds. Otherwise, I agree it would be a nice feature.

 

[asteldian]

Price gouging is rampant on auction houses, because it is easy to dump stuff on and not care if it sells fast. Heck, I was selling HQ mythril for 15k a pop, it cost what...300 gill to make if I bought the ingredients?
The 2* recipes, make for 45k sell for 100k. When you hawk your wares you have to b reasonable. I even still do hawk my wares - and sell the stuff about 10k less than market price and the stuff ets bought pretty quick and I get requests for other items.

But that's not really the point, I know most like auction houses - of course they do, else these mass market games wouldn't have them.


As for the Duty Finder, if a game has a healthy population it isn't an issue - even Rift did fine with local only for a long time, only when poulation started dying out did cross server DF come in, and really it's nothing more than a crutch to a dying state.
The fact DF is needed at all speaks volumes for the state of modern game community, EQ1 had a tiny population compared to games these days, yet grouping was very easy and done server only and without DF to hold people's hand.
People can't be bothered to be social, or friendly and so DF is there for the instant gratification requirement - get in, talk to no one, get out, attitude.
It's funny, even Fate farming groups are usually dead silent - even when doing NOTHING but waiting for a a Fate to pop.

It's less the modern day easiness of games and the fast food style they now go that is the issue, its the fact that the modern design actually diminishes any form of comunity feel that I have issue with. It becomes very hard to find people youactually want to play with. Heck, most people are probably only in an FC becaue they said yes to a spam invite

 

[cbrunny]

That is probably true for the majority asteldian. But I would expect that this majority will also be shorter-term players. Being part of a community is part of what makes some MMOs great - something you can really only experience if you actually make the connection.

 

[PowerYoga]

Price gouging is rampant on auction houses, because it is easy to dump stuff on and not care if it sells fast. Heck, I was selling HQ mythril for 15k a pop, it cost what...300 gill to make if I bought the ingredients?
The 2* recipes, make for 45k sell for 100k. When you hawk your wares you have to b reasonable. I even still do hawk my wares - and sell the stuff about 10k less than market price and the stuff ets bought pretty quick and I get requests for other items.

Uh, that's not price gouging at all. That's just a premium you pay to not have to spend money and time to turn the raw goods into the actual finished product, especially if you can't make the product itself. This is especially true for HQ goods and ingredients since a lot of people use them to make class quest items. There's also a big supply and demand effect I won't bother going into as it's essentially the basics of economy. You'll see finished products being sold for a cheap price when there's no demand for the product.

Price gouging happens when you control a market and can essentially charge what you want and people have no choice but to buy it since there's no other sources, which is clearly not what happens on the AH as people are constantly undercutting one another to sell stuff.

 

[pathos]

I been playing about 10 days. Level 26 gladiator. While the game looks nice and I do like it, the more I play it the more I miss ffxi. It was such a better game. Not sure if I will stick with this one more than a month or two. Very much WOW feel with FF storyline. Sucks I cant get Uber armor or weapons. Farming gil is very hard. Dungeons are repetitive. I miss the 6 hour party and grind. Maybe Im doing it wrong..

I will note that I was pretty much always broke while I played. Of course, I hate tradeskilling, in any mmo. I mean, hate, hate, hate.

The only way I ever made any money, was farming points in one of the end game dungeons, and buying/selling tradeskill items that could only be bought with those points.

Fortunately, you don't really need much in the way of money leveling up the first time, since you get plenty of gear from quests (while never top of the line, it's always enough to make do). The only money I spent was repairing gear.

 

[grimed]

Ok I tried EQ one again and got bored trying to get to wear you can group with others like 70. and you need to have aa's at the level or they won't want you in a group and that too takes a lot of boring time of grinding.

I work a 12 hrt swing shift and just wondered if this game is good for a casual player?
If it is what are one of the better jobs to start out with or the easier one being i am new to FF.

 

[asteldian]

Very casual friendly. Majority of quests can be done alone and pretty quickly. There are some dungeons you need to have groups for but you can use the Duty Finder for these - and thanks to Daily Roulettes it means there should be no issue with no one doing them.

Easiest class to play I would say Archer. The safety of DPS at range without cast times makes it very easy to do consistent damage and avoid enemy special attacks.
The melee DPS (Lancer and Puglist) involve a lot of shifting positions to maximise attacks, not to mention they are melee which is always more of a pain than ranged.

Course, if you want to be a caster I would go with Thaumaturge, they pretty much have an unlimited mana resource and one of the simpler 'rotations' with the added bonus of being able to cross class the Arcansit heal spell, so when soloing you can heal if needed.

Course, if it is just FF you are new to, but an experienced MMOer, then you can go with any class as it's a familiar feel so you should find you have the knack for it quick enough. In which case being a tank instead of DPS could be a wise choice - you never have to wait more than a minute or two for a dungeon as a tank

 

[PowerYoga]

Gladiator and Marauder are Tank classes, FYI.
Arcanist is a "DPS" below lvl 30. At lvl 30 it branches into Scholar (healer) and Summoner (DPS). SMN is the warlock of the game with lots of dots and pet utility.

As starter: I'd actually look at being a tank if you don't have a lot of time to play. They get quick queues into dungeons and are fairly easy to play. Archers and other ranged DPS have queue times up to an hour just to get into the dungeon.

 

[tedrodai]

I had some extra time to play this week because I was snowed in, so among other things I decided to jump into a random Titan HM learning party to help. Three guys from 1 FC were trying the fight for the first time, but had watched vids. After 1 busted group, we entered with those 3 and 2 more who were used to nothing but wipes and lots of being yelled at. 3 of us were helping, and to make a long story short, it felt really great when we got the win and those 5 got their first relic!

I took us around 6-8 attempts overall...3 after we switched to 3 healers since both healers were inexperienced. The newer guys were getting hit early and often to start, but they were dodging like pros on the last attempt. Our next to last attempt wiped at around 2-3 % with 1/2 the party dead in the final phase lol...soooooo close. But I'm glad we wiped, cause it gave everyone a chance to pull it together and make it through the whole fight for that last one.

Anywho, that was easily one of the best times I've had playing this game so far.

 

[cbrunny]

Sounds like fun! My first Titan HM win I was dead for about the last 20%. Really sucked, very bittersweet. I've since taken him down a few times though I loathe to get back in there.

I'm mostly grinding myth tomes as of late, getting gear for Coil. I think I have four pieces including Zenith relic, which isn't bad. Need to spend some time grinding my alt class though!

 

[darkewaffle]

Picked up 14 again over the weekend to finally try out some of the new stuff. Made it from like 39 to 46 on Scholar without much trouble and basically zero fates; the daily bonus XP from both roulette guildhest and dungeon are well appreciated and it compounds nicely with the beastman tribe quests/treasure hunting/battlecraft leves for new XP options. Doing the 40 or 45 battle leves with +4 difficulty levels was netting me 16-19k XP for just a few minutes of 'work', not bad at all.

The Hildibrand quest and the Aesthetician quests were ridiculous lol. Also the Dragon Quest event quest was pretty amusing. I even thought the new storyline quests revolving around the Scions were somewhat interesting. I'd read the patch notes before but after seeing it all implemented I find myself somewhat impressed with all the new stuff before even getting into CT/Ultima/Extremes or any of the new dungeons (high level roulette has given me WP/WP/AK thus far lol). King Moogle fight was quite good as well.

I just wish my dumbass friends were still playing. Much as I want to do some of the new stuff, I still feel like I wouldn't particularly enjoy attempting to PUG it - although I have been pleasantly surprised at how much the Party Finder has caught on and finding a 'learning' group for my first Thornmarch was pretty easily done and down on the second attempt fortunately.