*** OFFICIAL MATRIX RELOADED AFTERMATH THREAD *** spoilers

[CrazyDe1]

Originally posted by: Mannkind
The oracle never actually tells neo he is not the one. Listen closely, I am not watching the movie ATM, BUT, if I remember right, he says "I'm not the one..." or something to that factand the oracle says "No"... denying what he said.
Even if I am mistaken, she never actually tells him he isn't the one, that was a choice he made in his head.
Also, 2nd level matrix. Anyone think that the 2nd level of the matrix is HUMANS controlling the matrix for the machines, and that they are controlling the matrix that neo was awoken from? Just a thought that passed through my head.

She did in the first movie...

 

[CrazyDe1]

Originally posted by: Mannkind
The oracle never actually tells neo he is not the one. Listen closely, I am not watching the movie ATM, BUT, if I remember right, he says "I'm not the one..." or something to that factand the oracle says "No"... denying what he said.
Even if I am mistaken, she never actually tells him he isn't the one, that was a choice he made in his head.
Also, 2nd level matrix. Anyone think that the 2nd level of the matrix is HUMANS controlling the matrix for the machines, and that they are controlling the matrix that neo was awoken from? Just a thought that passed through my head.

She did in the first movie...

 

[Gage]

Originally posted by: PoonDaddy007
Correct me if I'm wrong but I remember either the Oracle or someone saying that the end of the road fro Neo is inside the door with the white light implying that he would die in there. Now once he gets in there he has to make a choice, sacrifce himself for all of mandkind or stay in the matrix and help Trinity. Sort of anti-messiah in that he chooses to stay in the matrix but the fact that he had the choice of sacrifice for mandkind is similar to Jesus in the Bible.

I thought the oracle said that the path of THE ONE ends at the door with the white light. If Neo is not the one then his path doesnt end there. So maybe Neo is not THE ONE.

How can there be more than 1 ONE? This whole movie has just messed with my mind. It will take days for me to figure it out.

I also thought the rave scene was a little long but the whole point to the rave was to emit a whole lot of energy and heat so the Sentinals burrowing into the city could know they were there. They were defying the sentinals and showing that they were not afraid.

 

[slydecix]

Originally posted by: CrazyDe1

Originally posted by: Mannkind
The oracle never actually tells neo he is not the one. Listen closely, I am not watching the movie ATM, BUT, if I remember right, he says "I'm not the one..." or something to that factand the oracle says "No"... denying what he said.
Even if I am mistaken, she never actually tells him he isn't the one, that was a choice he made in his head.
Also, 2nd level matrix. Anyone think that the 2nd level of the matrix is HUMANS controlling the matrix for the machines, and that they are controlling the matrix that neo was awoken from? Just a thought that passed through my head.

She did in the first movie...

Nope... she tells him that he already knows the answer... then she says "i'm sorry"
it wasn't a direct statement

 

[CrazyDe1]

Originally posted by: Elitebull

Originally posted by: CrazyDe1

Originally posted by: Mannkind
The oracle never actually tells neo he is not the one. Listen closely, I am not watching the movie ATM, BUT, if I remember right, he says "I'm not the one..." or something to that factand the oracle says "No"... denying what he said.
Even if I am mistaken, she never actually tells him he isn't the one, that was a choice he made in his head.
Also, 2nd level matrix. Anyone think that the 2nd level of the matrix is HUMANS controlling the matrix for the machines, and that they are controlling the matrix that neo was awoken from? Just a thought that passed through my head.

She did in the first movie...

Nope... she tells him that he already knows the answer... then she says "i'm sorry"
it wasn't a direct statement

Yeah, I think you're right. I think Neo says something like I'm not the one and she kind of says "I'm sorry" or something...

 

[Kaervak]

Originally posted by: CrazyDe1

Originally posted by: Elitebull

Originally posted by: CrazyDe1

Originally posted by: Mannkind
The oracle never actually tells neo he is not the one. Listen closely, I am not watching the movie ATM, BUT, if I remember right, he says "I'm not the one..." or something to that factand the oracle says "No"... denying what he said.
Even if I am mistaken, she never actually tells him he isn't the one, that was a choice he made in his head.
Also, 2nd level matrix. Anyone think that the 2nd level of the matrix is HUMANS controlling the matrix for the machines, and that they are controlling the matrix that neo was awoken from? Just a thought that passed through my head.

She did in the first movie...

Nope... she tells him that he already knows the answer... then she says "i'm sorry"
it wasn't a direct statement

Yeah, I think you're right. I think Neo says something like I'm not the one and she kind of says "I'm sorry" or something...

She then says, "You've got the gift, but it looks like you're waiting for something." Neo: "What?" Oracle: "Another life perhaps. Who knows?"

Yes, I've watched the movie a lot.

 

[mchammer187]

Originally posted by: Legendary
I don't think Seraph, Merovingian and Persephone are previous "Ones". First of all, if Merovingian was a former "One" why didn't he fight? If he didn't want to stop Neo, why did he send former programs to go at him? I just have a hard time believing Seraph and Persephone are Ones. I thought, if what the Architect said is true, which it may not be, then only 1 One existed at any point in time in the Matrix. I think they're all programs. Seraph came out as gold because he was written in a different language than the rest of the Matrix. I think Neo was starting to get the better of Seraph in the end of their fight.

A different question - do we ever see what Neo looks like in code? If so, does he look like Seraph does?

neo is green al la neo saving trinity at the end of the movie

 

[atsang]

Originally posted by: mchammer187

Originally posted by: Legendary
I don't think Seraph, Merovingian and Persephone are previous "Ones". First of all, if Merovingian was a former "One" why didn't he fight? If he didn't want to stop Neo, why did he send former programs to go at him? I just have a hard time believing Seraph and Persephone are Ones. I thought, if what the Architect said is true, which it may not be, then only 1 One existed at any point in time in the Matrix. I think they're all programs. Seraph came out as gold because he was written in a different language than the rest of the Matrix. I think Neo was starting to get the better of Seraph in the end of their fight.

A different question - do we ever see what Neo looks like in code? If so, does he look like Seraph does?

neo is green al la neo saving trinity at the end of the movie

Yea, his hand is green when he reaches in and pumps her heart back to life

 

[Kev]

Originally posted by: atsang

Originally posted by: placebo139
=(

I have to wait till next friday to watch it cause of stupid finals.
Have to skip every word in this thread to avoid spoilers...

I watched it late last night, and I had 2 finals this morning and one more tomorrow morning. I don't regret it; i think it actually stimulated my mind as I think i did pretty well today.

All these cool ideas everyone is putting out there makes me want to tell everyone who's given the movie bad reviews to really try to think it through again. A lot of people have dissed Reloaded as philosophical mumbo jumbo, but to me and obviously everyone else contributing to this thread, it has provided some very interesting bits of conversation. Behind all the action scenes lie some really thought provoking pieces of philosophy.

Plus, monica bellucci was really good looking.

exactly, seems like most of the people who don't like it just don't understand the philosphy of it. either that or they were expecting too much.

i read a review where someone said it isn't as thought-provoking as the first. well the first one i understood completely after one viewing. i have a feeling i'll need to see this one a few more times.

look people, a sequel is meant to build on the original. i don't know why some of you were expecting to be blown away by new special effects...i thought the effects were great, the movie had some clever twists, and left a lot of questions to make us anticipate revolutions.

 

[Kev]

What if Neo is actually just a program, who will eventually choose humanity over machines because he discovered love with Trinity? It would parallel to that psycadelic Animatrix short where they convert the machines to be like humans, but on a much grander scale. There are so many possibilities and we won't find out till November what the truth is.

What I wonder is - if the "real world" really is another level of Matrix, then what is the actual "real world?" What are the possibilites? Maybe the whole thing is just a grand experiment like the 13th floor? Who knows...

This movie was great though. IMO 2003 will be forever remembered as the greatest year for movies ever.

 

[Ranger X]

OMG the fight scene with the Smiths was awesome!!!

 

[TheShiz]

Originally posted by: maladroit
What if Neo is actually just a program, who will eventually choose humanity over machines because he discovered love with Trinity? It would parallel to that psycadelic Animatrix short where they convert the machines to be like humans, but on a much grander scale. There are so many possibilities and we won't find out till November what the truth is.

What I wonder is - if the "real world" really is another level of Matrix, then what is the actual "real world?" What are the possibilites? Maybe the whole thing is just a grand experiment like the 13th floor? Who knows...

This movie was great though. IMO 2003 will be forever remembered as the greatest year for movies ever.

think about morpheus, he gives a really strange look when he finds out that the war isn't over after neo went in the door, so he is a program that never expects neo to make the other choice, its like his code can't understand it, why isn't the war over, neo went in the door, which would be the end of his programming.

 

[LeeTJ]

It seems to me as has been said before, that ZION is actually PART of the matrix and it's all part of the deception that was concieved by the Oracle and the Architect.

HOWEVER, I think in Matrix 3, Neo and the crew will find a way to overcome the matrix and excape to "Reality".

and the surpise will probably be that there is a NEW sun and the matrix is no longer necessary.

 

[Mannkind]

Originally posted by: Kaervak

Originally posted by: CrazyDe1

Originally posted by: Elitebull

Originally posted by: CrazyDe1

Originally posted by: Mannkind
The oracle never actually tells neo he is not the one. Listen closely, I am not watching the movie ATM, BUT, if I remember right, he says "I'm not the one..." or something to that factand the oracle says "No"... denying what he said.
Even if I am mistaken, she never actually tells him he isn't the one, that was a choice he made in his head.
Also, 2nd level matrix. Anyone think that the 2nd level of the matrix is HUMANS controlling the matrix for the machines, and that they are controlling the matrix that neo was awoken from? Just a thought that passed through my head.

She did in the first movie...

Nope... she tells him that he already knows the answer... then she says "i'm sorry"
it wasn't a direct statement

Yeah, I think you're right. I think Neo says something like I'm not the one and she kind of says "I'm sorry" or something...

She then says, "You've got the gift, but it looks like you're waiting for something." Neo: "What?" Oracle: "Another life perhaps. Who knows?"

Yes, I've watched the movie a lot.

Yeah, she never ever says "No you're not the ONE, move along" hehe
I think people think what Neo thinks at the begining, that he isn't the one.

 

[s2kpacifist]

The movie was awesome and confusing at the same time...I loved it.

Anyways, here's my theory:

THE Matrix is the 6th matrix (what we think is the real world), underneath the other 5 layers of the matrix (the 5th layer is the Zion/the machines rule the world). Basically a matrix within a matrix within a matrix.....etc.

The matrix levels above Zion shown in the movie are just copies of Zion/machines rule the world, except there is no resistance. Zion is just part of the program to make people think they are resisting, which restarts whever the machines win. Morpheus, Neo, and everyone in the resistance are actually still in big tubs of fluid, plugged in.

When Neo said, "Something feels different" and slips into a coma, he is actually now in the 4th matrix now. It's kinda like when the people of Zion sit at a terminal and plug themselves in. They just sit there, in a "coma" while they do stuff in the Matrix. He now has power over the sentinels because he realized they aren't real. I'm assuming Neo is trying to dig himself to the actual matrix and get freed to the real world.

Okay I thought about this movie too much. I did have practically the whole day to think about this.

By the way, I yelled NOOOOOOOOO at the end of the movie.

 

[silent tone]

Originally posted by: Kaervak

Originally posted by: CrazyDe1

Originally posted by: Elitebull

Originally posted by: CrazyDe1

Originally posted by: Mannkind
The oracle never actually tells neo he is not the one. Listen closely, I am not watching the movie ATM, BUT, if I remember right, he says "I'm not the one..." or something to that factand the oracle says "No"... denying what he said.
Even if I am mistaken, she never actually tells him he isn't the one, that was a choice he made in his head.
Also, 2nd level matrix. Anyone think that the 2nd level of the matrix is HUMANS controlling the matrix for the machines, and that they are controlling the matrix that neo was awoken from? Just a thought that passed through my head.

She did in the first movie...

Nope... she tells him that he already knows the answer... then she says "i'm sorry"
it wasn't a direct statement

Yeah, I think you're right. I think Neo says something like I'm not the one and she kind of says "I'm sorry" or something...

She then says, "You've got the gift, but it looks like you're waiting for something." Neo: "What?" Oracle: "Another life perhaps. Who knows?"

Yes, I've watched the movie a lot.

So was Neo's 'another life' the life after he was resurrected, or maybe the life after his coma, or something else in revolutions?

Why didn't anybody know the Oracle was a program before now? Morpheus said "she's been with us since the beginning... of the resistance". She doesn't live in Zion, didn't they ever offer her a red pill?

FX:
I thought they were pretty good. Neo flying in the clouds looked a little strange. The walking gunner robot looked like freaking stop-motion animation. Neo's face looked weird in some of the fight scenes. But in an interview with the FX supervisor, he said that 100% of the burly brawl was CG, and lots of that looked great. One of the trucks in the ducati chase scene was pretty poor. I don't see why people are complaining about the agent jumping on the hood of the car though.

 

[Mustanggt]

If neo was so fast in the last fight of the first matrix why is he so slow in reloaded why should he need to fight at all if he can stop bullets? The trailer of reloaded pretty much shows all the good parts of movie there not much more to it, I got very bored not as good as first movie not even close.

 

[Spudd]

The movie was awesome, especially the explanation of werewolves, vampires, and ghosts...that was just a freaking awesome twist. Anyway, I think the reason so many of you are saying many of the fights were ho-hum and was lacking "something" is this: Neo's freaking superman now. In the first, it was quite clear the Agents were vastly superior to all of the Zion warriors, who were themselves terrified of the Agents (remember how hard Trinity tried to run from Smith in the first movie??). Now, it's like when you see Neo fight, you KNOW he's NOT just going to win the fight, he's going to kick the living boogers out of the other guy. You can also clearly see that the Morpheus and Trinity have become better warriors: perhaps it's their confidence in Neo and the fact that they are learning how to twist the Matrix to their will even further. That's why Morpheus and Trinity can actually put up more of a fight with the Agents now, but still can't win. Aside from the fact that the rave scene was too damn long (definitely on purpose I think), I would have LOVED to have seen some "real world" mech combat! Did you see the Gatekeeper Mech??? That thing was awesome!! The pilot flipped and twirled his gattling guns like a Wild Western movie! Sweeeeet.

--Spudd

 

[0roo0roo]

those mechs get shreded in the animatrix.

 

[silent tone]

Originally posted by: Mustanggt
If neo was so fast in the last fight of the first matrix why is he so slow in reloaded why should he need to fight at all if he can stop bullets? The trailer of reloaded pretty much shows all the good parts of movie there not much more to it, I got very bored not as good as first movie not even close.

He never fights fewer than 3 agents at a time, except for Seraph, so it takes more effort/speed. The new agents have some sort of upgraded capabilities. He's still fighting at least as fast, time is just flowing at a slower rate for the camera to see.

OT:
Film technology is getting way too old. 24fps isn't even fast enough to pan the camera without massive blurring. When you first see multiple agent smiths in the courtyard, they could have been brown haired grannies in suits for all the detail left after the stuttering and motion blur.

 

[0roo0roo]

I thought they were pretty good. Neo flying in the clouds looked a little strange. The walking gunner robot looked like freaking stop-motion animation. Neo's face looked weird in some of the fight scenes. But in an interview with the FX supervisor, he said that 100% of the burly brawl was CG, and lots of that looked great. One of the trucks in the ducati chase scene was pretty poor. I don't see why people are complaining about the agent jumping on the hood of the car though.

your right about the clouds, but thats probably about how a mech like that would move. atleast based on the goofy kinda limb driven/motion imitating robots we have now.

Film technology is getting way too old. 24fps isn't even fast enough to pan the camera without massive blurring. When you first see multiple agent smiths in the courtyard, they could have been brown haired grannies in suits for all the detail left after the stuttering and motion blur.

i can't pan my head at that speed without massive blurring hehe

 

[Kev]

Originally posted by: istallion

Originally posted by: Mustanggt
If neo was so fast in the last fight of the first matrix why is he so slow in reloaded why should he need to fight at all if he can stop bullets? The trailer of reloaded pretty much shows all the good parts of movie there not much more to it, I got very bored not as good as first movie not even close.

He never fights fewer than 3 agents at a time, except for Seraph, so it takes more effort/speed. The new agents have some sort of upgraded capabilities. He's still fighting at least as fast, time is just flowing at a slower rate for the camera to see.

OT:
Film technology is getting way too old. 24fps isn't even fast enough to pan the camera without massive blurring. When you first see multiple agent smiths in the courtyard, they could have been brown haired grannies in suits for all the detail left after the stuttering and motion blur.

i agree. i noticed a motion blur when they were panning through zion, it was pretty annoying

 

[Spudd]

Maybe that's why Lucas' idea that all movies should be done digital instead of on film will become a reality in the future--at least for sci fi/action moves where there is a lot of fast stuff going on.

By the way, the mechs in the animatrix weren't the same ones we saw in the movie. The ones in the animatrix are more like mech suits, with closed canopies. THe ones in Reloaded, looked bigger, and had an open cage (like the loader from ALienS).

 

[Kev]

Originally posted by: TheShiz

Originally posted by: maladroit
What if Neo is actually just a program, who will eventually choose humanity over machines because he discovered love with Trinity? It would parallel to that psycadelic Animatrix short where they convert the machines to be like humans, but on a much grander scale. There are so many possibilities and we won't find out till November what the truth is.

What I wonder is - if the "real world" really is another level of Matrix, then what is the actual "real world?" What are the possibilites? Maybe the whole thing is just a grand experiment like the 13th floor? Who knows...

This movie was great though. IMO 2003 will be forever remembered as the greatest year for movies ever.

think about morpheus, he gives a really strange look when he finds out that the war isn't over after neo went in the door, so he is a program that never expects neo to make the other choice, its like his code can't understand it, why isn't the war over, neo went in the door, which would be the end of his programming.

ahhhh so maybe morpheus is the program..... so many possibilities, i love this movie more and more every minute!

 

[Kev]

And how about this theory that just popped into my head....

Maybe the real world really is the real world, and Neo was actually the first anomaly with his level of power that ever was born into the Matrix. That would explain him having extroardinary telekinetic powers in the real world (ie, his mind is so advanced and evolved that he has amazing psychic powers - almost like an X-Man). The machines have no way to stop him in the Matrix, and they know they are doomed if Neo survives, so they invent this crazy story about how Zion has been destroyed 6 times etc, just to try to force him to choose to give in to the machines. Hmm...

All I know is that I've never had this much fun thinking about a movie before...