OFFICIAL NFL week 9 thread

[Miramonti]

No. I don't think Manning would readily mentor his replacement either, unless it was truly his decision to leave.

Seriously? If favre didn't, that's a douchebag move. I think manning would in a heartbeat, especially if he's on the bench due to injury. No rookie is going to come in and make a guy/competitor like p. manning insecure.

 

[IAteYourMother]

Seriously? If favre didn't, that's a douchebag move. I think manning would in a heartbeat, especially if he's on the bench due to injury. No rookie is going to come in and make a guy/competitor like p. manning insecure.

It's not really being a douchebag... it's about what kind of mentor you might be. Some just lead by example, which Manning would be great at, given his work ethic and command of the offense. But he doesn't necessarily have to take the young QB under his wing and explain to him everything there is to know about QBing... Luck or whoever should be able to figure that out for himself. Peyton did.

 

[purbeast0]

I'm a Steeler fan and all I can say is the refs gave ravens that first touchdown. Although the real problem was not stopping 3rd downs. They really need Woodly back for pass rushing. First half seemed to have none at all. Also not sure what the coaches see in Gay. Any time there is a big first down it seems to always be his guy.

haha typical.

the steelers lose and their fans blame it on the refs.

 

[bignateyk]

haha typical.

the steelers lose and their fans blame it on the refs.

The pass interference calls and non-calls for both teams were pretty bad. I don't know why they're so quick to throw the flag on PI. They get it wrong way too many times and it basically gives the other team a touchdown. It's not like a holding call where if they get it wrong it only costs them 10 yards. They should leave the flag in their pocket unless it's an egregious interference.

 

[KMFJD]

haha typical.

the steelers lose and their fans blame it on the refs.

I always thought it was the fault of the O-Cordinator as well

 

[Jeffg010]

haha typical.

the steelers lose and their fans blame it on the refs.

Who is your team? That was one of the reasons but like I said the main reason for that lose was because the Steelers D could not stop 3rd down. The other guy got it right we like to blame Bruce Arians Don't worry the Steelers will make the playoffs like we do every year.

 

[purbeast0]

Who is your team? That was one of the reasons but like I said the main reason for that lose was because the Steelers D could not stop 3rd down. The other guy got it right we like to blame Bruce Arians Don't worry the Steelers will make the playoffs like we do every year.

my team is the redskins (unfortunately).

why not blame it on the pick that rothlesberger threw on the 20yd line which led to a ravens TD?

or the fumble that stopped a drive in it's track?

or the 3rd and longs that the steelers gave up 90% of the time? (although you did mention that now)

 

[manly]

Seriously? If favre didn't, that's a douchebag move. I think manning would in a heartbeat, especially if he's on the bench due to injury. No rookie is going to come in and make a guy/competitor like p. manning insecure.

I can't guess what Manning would do but it's at least a little awkward if it's obvious to everybody that he's asked to "mentor" the guy replacing him within 1 year tops. No team is going to draft Luck and have him carry a clipboard for 2+ years, even if the incumbent is a future HOFer. It's not about insecurity so much as it is about the organization basically turning you out to pasture and forcing you to start thinking about your next team while you're still wearing the same jersey you put on as a rookie.

 

[AstroManLuca]

what i want to know is why i don't get the packers more. what is fox thinking?

You can see which games will be broadcast depending on your location here:

http://the506.com/nflmaps/

 

[Miramonti]

It's not really being a douchebag... it's about what kind of mentor you might be. Some just lead by example, which Manning would be great at, given his work ethic and command of the offense. But he doesn't necessarily have to take the young QB under his wing and explain to him everything there is to know about QBing... Luck or whoever should be able to figure that out for himself. Peyton did.

There's no substitute equal to experience when learning how to read defenses. And a guy like favre should be willing to help a new comer, who in turn will be playing if favre gets injured. It's totally douche to not share some wisdom after so many years in the league.

I'm talking hypothetical tho...I don't know if favre was such a douche or not. Actually I'd find it hard to believe favre just gave him the finger.

 

[Miramonti]

I can't guess what Manning would do but it's at least a little awkward if it's obvious to everybody that he's asked to "mentor" the guy replacing him within 1 year tops. No team is going to draft Luck and have him carry a clipboard for 2+ years, even if the incumbent is a future HOFer. It's not about insecurity so much as it is about the organization basically turning you out to pasture and forcing you to start thinking about your next team while you're still wearing the same jersey you put on as a rookie.

Maybe a little awkward if a team is jerking around the starting qb with discussion about a draftee starting, but I don't think there would be anything Manning could say that would make someone like luck a starter over him, same with favre to rogers imo. It's all about getting experience to learn how to put everything one learns together and over time 'get it.'

 

[manly]

Maybe a little awkward if a team is jerking around the starting qb with discussion about a draftee starting, but I don't think there would be anything Manning could say that would make someone like luck a starter over him, same with favre to rogers imo. It's all about getting experience to learn how to put everything one learns together and over time 'get it.'

I tend to agree with you that Manning would be a pro about it, but who knows?

Cam Newton got what, $25M guaranteed? (Half of what Sam Bradford got IIRC.) Whoever drafts Luck is only asking themselves in which game during the first season will he start.

If they get lucky, the Colts are more likely to cut ties with Manning before he starts collecting on his massive new contract than to pay 2 guys starters money and patiently wait for the kid to develop. About the only scenario where a GM might consider having both is if the Colts were a serious contender with a healthy Manning; right now I highly doubt that's even plausible.

 

[AstroManLuca]

There's no substitute equal to experience when learning how to read defenses. And a guy like favre should be willing to help a new comer, who in turn will be playing if favre gets injured. It's totally douche to not share some wisdom after so many years in the league.

I'm talking hypothetical tho...I don't know if favre was such a douche or not. Actually I'd find it hard to believe favre just gave him the finger.

He sort of gave him the finger (figuratively speaking) earlier this year saying he wasn't surprised Rodgers won a Super Bowl but he was surprised he didn't do it sooner. But I have no clue how they got along when they were on the same team.

That seems common though. You hear about a lot of old football players who get all cranky and bitter when their former teams succeed without them or when others overcome their accomplishments. Don Shula threw a hissy fit when the Patriots went undefeated (in the regular season) and probably creamed himself when they lost the Super Bowl. Fran Tarkenton was actively rooting against his old team the Vikings when they got Brett Favre, probably because he was terrified that someone might upstage him by actually winning a Super Bowl (which of course didn't happen).

 

[IndyColtsFan]

If they get lucky, the Colts are more likely to cut ties with Manning before he starts collecting on his massive new contract than to pay 2 guys starters money and patiently wait for the kid to develop. About the only scenario where a GM might consider having both is if the Colts were a serious contender with a healthy Manning; right now I highly doubt that's even plausible.

Two months ago, I would've said that Manning would be back and healthy without a doubt. Heck, I was saying it up to 2 or 3 weeks ago. Then he gave an interview and it completely changed my perception of the situation. It is pretty clear that he isn't healing as quickly as they had hoped and now, the goal is for him to be able to *practice* this season. It is pretty unlikely he will play at all.

The Colts, from their perspective, want to see him throw before the March deadline to exercise the option to extend his contract another 4 years and give him $28 million. I would hope that if they have doubts, they can convince him to retire a Colt or at a minimum, renegotiate with Manning to lower the numbers. If Manning is cut or traded, the people of Indy will run the Colts out of town. Manning IS the Colts (as proven this year), and if he can't play, Irsay had better damn well do something to ensure that Manning is a member of the Colts org in one capacity or another. In the entire history of the Indy Colts, the only other decent QB we've had was Harbaugh. The rest have been awful! Manning saved this franchise.

At any rate, even if Manning comes back and plays well, the fact is that he will be a 36 year-old QB next season. The Colts must start planning on bringing in his successor or else, the Colts will perform like this every year.

Besides Manning, there are some other interesting storylines this year. The Colts have lots of high-profile FAs (Wayne, Mathis, Saturday), so it is going to be interesting to watch. Lots of questions on this team at this stage....

 

[IndyColtsFan]

He sort of gave him the finger (figuratively speaking) earlier this year saying he wasn't surprised Rodgers won a Super Bowl but he was surprised he didn't do it sooner. But I have no clue how they got along when they were on the same team.

That seems common though. You hear about a lot of old football players who get all cranky and bitter when their former teams succeed without them. Don Shula threw a hissy fit when the Patriots went undefeated (in the regular season) and probably creamed himself when they lost the Super Bowl. Fran Tarkenton was actively rooting against his old team the Vikings when they got Brett Favre, probably because he was terrified that someone might upstage him by actually winning a Super Bowl (which of course didn't happen).

I wonder what Favre will say when Rodgers wins another, likely this year. Maybe they can interview Rodgers and he can say "Yeah, I wonder why Brett never won another one."

 

[davmat787]

Maybe a little awkward if a team is jerking around the starting qb with discussion about a draftee starting, but I don't think there would be anything Manning could say that would make someone like luck a starter over him, same with favre to rogers imo. It's all about getting experience to learn how to put everything one learns together and over time 'get it.'

IIRC Favre himself said in a TV interview that it is not in his contract to be a role model for Aaron Rodgers. Also in a recent interview Rodgers was asked if Favre has congratulated him on his Super Bowl. Rodgers looked uncomfortable, and simply said he had not heard from Brett.

 

[manly]

I wonder what Favre will say when Rodgers wins another, likely this year. Maybe they can interview Rodgers and he can say "Yeah, I wonder why Brett never won another one."

Even better if Rodgers said, "I hope Brett comes back to a contender for a chance to win another SB."

Regarding your Colts, I think the overall team landscape argues even more strongly that picking up the rest of Manning's contract is a very dicey and expensive proposition. As far as Irsay being run out of town, hypothetically if Andrew Luck has a solid rookie or 2nd year campaign, much will be forgiven.

 

[IAteYourMother]

Maybe a little awkward if a team is jerking around the starting qb with discussion about a draftee starting, but I don't think there would be anything Manning could say that would make someone like luck a starter over him, same with favre to rogers imo. It's all about getting experience to learn how to put everything one learns together and over time 'get it.'

It's not about that, it's that Manning, if he is healthy next season, has limited time left in the league. If it's true the Colts can get 3 1st round picks + more for the #1 pick overall, then Peyton's going to feel slighted that the team didn't give him (probably best QB in franchise history) another chance to win the Super Bowl (which such a haul would give them).

I think they should draft Luck and rebuild that team to take the safe route and set yourself up for the next 20 years, but that leaves Peyton on the outside looking in, and for what he's given this franchise, it can't feel good.

 

[BoomerD]

It's not really being a douchebag... it's about what kind of mentor you might be. Some just lead by example, which Manning would be great at, given his work ethic and command of the offense. But he doesn't necessarily have to take the young QB under his wing and explain to him everything there is to know about QBing... Luck or whoever should be able to figure that out for himself. Peyton did.

Why the fuck should ANYONE be expected to train their replacement?

It's not like quarterbacks are in some "apprenticeship" where the "journeyman" is tasked with training of the noobs...:whiste:

 

[bignateyk]

Why the fuck should ANYONE be expected to train their replacement?

It's not like quarterbacks are in some "apprenticeship" where the "journeyman" is tasked with training of the noobs...:whiste:

This. If I was tasked to train my replacement, I would do everything I could to make him look like an incompetant douche.

 

[Jeeebus]

To quote a local reporter's blog, my Dolphins suffered a crushing victory on Sunday. The Colts are looking so pathetic that I'm not even sure it's a contest at this point. Someone give Peyton a new neck and get him back on the field.

 

[IndyColtsFan]

It's not about that, it's that Manning, if he is healthy next season, has limited time left in the league. If it's true the Colts can get 3 1st round picks + more for the #1 pick overall, then Peyton's going to feel slighted that the team didn't give him (probably best QB in franchise history) another chance to win the Super Bowl (which such a haul would give them).

Except the person picking those players (unless it changes after this season) is Chris Polian, who has proven beyond a shadow of a doubt that he doesn't know his ass from a hole in the ground in terms of talent.

I think they should draft Luck and rebuild that team to take the safe route and set yourself up for the next 20 years,

That's my argument as well. Assuming Manning comes back at 100%, the Colts are probably still a wild card team and would drop in the first round to a point out of reach of most franchise QB prospects. Once Manning is gone, they're going to REALLY stink for a few years and even then, may not land a franchise QB. Why not kill 2 birds with one stone -- your season is lost this year beyond a doubt, and we know that the guy regarded as the best QB prospect in years is on the clock -- why not pick him now? That way, you may avoid several seasons of poor play post-Manning if Manning can mentor him now.

but that leaves Peyton on the outside looking in, and for what he's given this franchise, it can't feel good.

They have to do the right thing where Peyton is concerned. He is idolized in this city and his brilliance has been completely wasted because of Polian's arrogance and Caldwell's ineptitude.

 

[Gigantopithecus]

They have to do the right thing where Peyton is concerned. He is idolized in this city and his brilliance has been completely wasted because of Polian's arrogance and Caldwell's ineptitude.

I got into an argument last week about Manning's place in the all-time QB rankings. I'm only 30 so my perspective is limited to the last decade or so and the history books, but damn, Manning is good. Really, really, really good. He's not just an extremely gifted athlete, he's smart, and he's easily the best student of the game playing today. He just knows football. Peyton Manning essentially gets a team to the playoffs on his own. But he's not good enough to get Super Bowl Ws on his own (no one is). That's why the Colts were so disappointing year in and year out.

Can you imagine the Colts in the mid 00s with today's Packers management? Or the Pat's organization of the early 00s? Dungy was a good coach, and Manning is one of the best QBs to ever play the game. But the Colts consistently underperformed for years and years because they were never a balanced team - and we're seeing that very clearly this year. I tease my friends from Indy that they'll be joining my winless Lions for that ignominy. They were extremely lucky to face one of the worst QBs to ever play in the Super Bowl (Grossman), otherwise, they might not have even won that one.

 

[IndyColtsFan]

I got into an argument last week about Manning's place in the all-time QB rankings. I'm only 30 so my perspective is limited to the last decade or so and the history books, but damn, Manning is good. Really, really, really good. He's not just an extremely gifted athlete, he's smart, and he's easily the best student of the game playing today. He just knows football. Peyton Manning essentially gets a team to the playoffs on his own. But he's not good enough to get Super Bowl Ws on his own (no one is). That's why the Colts were so disappointing year in and year out.

People are now just understanding how good he is. I've watched the NFL longer than you've been alive (damn I feel old), and the only one I'd say was equivalent or better was Montana. I think Manning beats him in pure knowledge of Xs and Os but Montana had an other-worldly presence and coolness about him that no one has matched to this day.

Can you imagine the Colts in the mid 00s with today's Packers management? Or the Pat's organization of the early 00s? Dungy was a good coach, and Manning is one of the best QBs to ever play the game. But the Colts consistently underperformed for years and years because they were never a balanced team - and we're seeing that very clearly this year. I tease my friends from Indy that they'll be joining my winless Lions for that ignominy.

Exactly. Everyone who screamed "Manning is a choker!" in the early part of the 2000s (aka Pats fans) are now seeing that, in fact, Manning was no choker. He was on a team with a horrible defense and special teams -- much like what has happened with Brady the last few years. Furthermore, the claims Manning had it "easy" because of all the offensive talent certainly hasn't weathered time very well, either -- look at Wayne and Clark this year.

They were extremely lucky to face one of the worst QBs to ever play in the Super Bowl (Grossman), otherwise, they might not have even won that one.

And Caldwell's stupidity cost them the SB against the Saints too.

 

[Gigantopithecus]

And Caldwell's stupidity cost them the SB against the Saints too.

There is that point, as well. I know Dungy is widely revered as an all-around great person, but I never really thought he was more than an average coach. He is brilliant defensively but I never got the sense that he knew offenses (Peyton was running that show), nor special teams. I think Dungy's hand-picked successor illustrates his overall mediocrity - Caldwell is one of the worst coaches in the NFL.