Oh man Creative dropped the ball...

[SickBeast]

Originally posted by: Grimbones
raptors > your mother. Debate ended.

Along with your brief tenure at AnandTech.

 

[Gurck]

No, the thread isn't about the Zen. Before I posted you alluded at least twice that iPods beat every other player out there by a long shot, and that's so far from the truth it's laughable. Further, depending how you weight price, it only debatably can beat the Zen in the first place. Itunes gets buggy when you load too much music into it, at least according to half the people who use it (why do I have no doubt you're in the half that has no problems? ). Perhaps people for whom computers are complicated and enigmatic need its organizational features, but anyone with a basic understanding of directory structure and with the ability to create a playlist can do it better & faster. Plus choice is a good thing. Also, why should people have to suffer to listen to the music they've bought because of piracy concerns? Justifying this is mind-boggling.

Originally posted by: n0cmonkey
I don't think a ricer would like the elegant simplicity of the iPod.

Well it's a matter of opinion of course, but imo it looks like a child's toy. All plasticky and covered with tacky-colored lights and such. I prefer the charcoal, textured style of electronics to the smooth white plastic look.

 

[SickBeast]

Originally posted by: Gurck
No, the thread isn't about the Zen. Before I posted you alluded at least twice that iPods beat every other player out there by a long shot, and that's so far from the truth it's laughable.

Actually, I said this:

I'm still amazed the nobody seems able to compete with Apple after all this time.

What I meant by that was that the iPod is still the best MP3 player, even after all this time.

Further, depending how you weight price, it only debatably can beat the Zen in the first place. Itunes gets buggy when you load too much music into it, at least according to half the people who use it (why do I have no doubt you're in the half that has no problems? ).

I have yet to hear of iTunes being unstable in the least; where do you get this 50% figure? I have over 1600 songs running through iTunes ATM and it hasn't crashed on me a single time.

Perhaps people for whom computers are complicated and enigmatic need its organizational features, but anyone with a basic understanding of directory structure and with the ability to create a playlist can do it better & faster.

I would like to see you time yourself while creating a smart playlist. It would probably take you 30 minutes, whereas iTunes can do it in a millisecond.

Plus choice is a good thing. Also, why should people have to suffer to listen to the music they've bought because of piracy concerns? Justifying this is mind-boggling.

Listening to music you've bought on the iPod is extremely simple. The only semi-difficult operation is getting your music from the iPod onto another computer. 90% of the time if you are doing this it will be because you are pirating your collection for a friend though. In any event, there is no suffering involved in listening to your purchased music on an iPod; I don't know why you would say that.

 

[Gurck]

What I meant by that was that the iPod is still the best MP3 player, even after all this time.

Exactly - you weren't comparing it to the Zen but to all mp3 players. And I heartily disagree; I think it's below average, for many reasons, which I've gone over.
I don't know what percentage of people have claimed instability with itunes; just that a lot have. 1600 songs really isn't that much. My collection is ~3300 and pales in comparison to how many some people have. Half an hour to create a playlist? Maybe if was the type to have trouble tying my shoes and was high on crack at the time on top of that... and what about music people haven't bought on their ipod? And truthfully I don't like buying mp3s at all; I'd rather have a higher quality source (cd) to rip in a higher bitrate or to ogg/flac if I end up really liking it and wanting better quality. But that's beside the point, which is that we should have these choices.

 

[SickBeast]

Originally posted by: Gurck
Half an hour to create a playlist? Maybe if was the type to have trouble tying my shoes and was high on crack at the time

You're telling me you could go through your entire collection of 3,300 songs, pick out all of your favorites of a certain genre that were recorded in a certain decade in LESS than 30 minutes? That would mean you would have to open up the ID3 tag of 3,300 songs, read them all, then create your list.

 

[Gurck]

*taps head* access to these id3 tags is faster

 

[SickBeast]

Originally posted by: Gurck
*taps head* access to these id3 tags is faster

Sure man.

 

[Gurck]

So we disagree on how to play and organize our collection *shrug* thing is, ipod users have no choice

 

[SickBeast]

Originally posted by: Gurck
So we disagree on how to play and organize our collection *shrug* thing is, ipod users have no choice

I suppose. You could always just drag and drop all the folders you want into iTunes and it will copy them straight to the iPod for you. It's one extra step.

 

[FishTankX]

This thread is rediclous

The iPod is a nice player that has

-PDA features
-Awesome software (iTunes)
-Lossless compression playback (Albiet proprietary)
-A nice interface
-Very slim and small
-Acceptable battery life (4th gen)

But you still pay a price for it

As far as I know, the zen touch is like.. $250 or something. Or less. So it's cheaper. And it's got longer battery life. And a sound with more 'Punch'.

To each his own. Honestly, I like the Rio Karma best.

Oh, and the iPod EQ will always suck donkey balls

 

[SickBeast]

Originally posted by: FishTankX
This thread is rediclous

The iPod is a nice player that has

-PDA features
-Awesome software (iTunes)
-Lossless compression playback (Albiet proprietary)
-A nice interface
-Very slim and small
-Acceptable battery life (4th gen)

But you still pay a price for it

As far as I know, the zen touch is like.. $250 or something. Or less. So it's cheaper. And it's got longer battery life. And a sound with more 'Punch'.

To each his own. Honestly, I like the Rio Karma best.

Oh, and the iPod EQ will always suck donkey balls

It's "rediculous" that you don't know how to spell ridiculous. In any event, comparing the Zen Touch to the iPod is inevitable; what other player would you have suggested? Comparing something that costs $250 to something that costs $300 isn't a big deal IMO.

The iPod EQ does suck, but there are workarounds to mitigate the problem. If you turn down the EQ gain it reduces the EQ's effect and eliminates the distortion that many people complain about. I agree that it is a serious problem and it annoys me from time to time that Apple still hasn't dealt with the issue. The Karma may be the best player for you since you seem concerned with audio options. I almost bought one myself, but I was scared out of it from people saying that they are unreliable.

 

[FishTankX]

Allright, so I can't spell 'Ridiculous'. So sue me.

The Zen touch is merely creative's attempt to get away from the rediclously oversized Zen Xtra series.
If you look at it in such a light, it's really not that bad.

They do have a player that has very few competitors, the Nomad Jukebox 3. But That's due to it's recording facilities and awesome sound, along with a yet unmatched (Well, besides the touch) 22 hour battery life, real world.

The Karma is the best competitors to the iPod, IMHO. Awesome EQ, support for FLAC and Ogg, and it's not oversized. Extremley responsive GUI and the nice LAN feature (Now if only they would get it working better). The only thing I don't like about it is it's lack of direct external storage support.

 

[Nebor]

Originally posted by: Grimbones
Fact: SickBeast is in love with Ipod's. Thanks.

Yup.

On another note, WMA support is VERY important to me. The fact that the Ipod doesn't have it is a deal breaker. Not that I find MP3 players remotefully useful personally. I have 2 that I haven't used in forever.

 

[Pandamonium]

You two need to chill.

For the record, I'm a fan of the iPod. (My order will go through in the next 3 weeks or so, but I've tinkered with one of my buddy's iPods and liked it.)

I don't expect high fidelity audio from a portable device, so I really don't care for OGG/etc support or EQ options. Neither do (and this is a total guess, but most likely true) most people interested in MP3 players- especially most people interested in iPods. I want something that looks nice, is cheap, and plays my music. Realizing that I'll never get 3/3, I'll settle for 2 and get the iPod.

 

[Gurck]

I'm not a "ricer" (racist term)

Just saw this and have to say it's not a racist term. While it originated from what people were doing with Japanese cars, it now simply refers to any kid who thinks it's cool to make his car look garish while ignoring it's usually already subpar performance. Generally white kids.

I'd order an iRiver h140 right now if it had an AM tuner. As it is I'm waiting, as it's a pretty important feature to me.

You two need to chill.

Bah, nothing wrong with lively debate When (if) it turns into namecalling and posting with no real points but only to attack/taunt someone, there's a problem. This thread has been mostly civil.

 

[Gurck]

Oh, and check out this thread on iTunes, from the OT forum.

 

[EviLRas]

iPods are amazing looking machines. the style icon of the decade if you believe the hype. slim, well designed. but the earphones SCREAM "STEAL ME!!! ROB THIS MAN!! HE HAS A £400 DEVICE IN HIS POCKET!"

The battery is pants, the sound quality wasnt good when i compared against my Rio Karma, and i had an old pc at time of purchase. rio handles usb 1.1 AND usb2.0. i only had usb 1.1 at the time. iPod does have firewire support, which must be amazing. but i like my WMA. i like my OGG. i know the rio is fatter, and not as pretty. And i WISH that iPod had these features so that i may also bask in the "haha, i have one and you dont" feelings my mate have. instead i have a less attractive, more capable player with which i can say "bite me, sheep boy!"


ps, iPods et al are all very well. whats the feeling on the new SONY player? they reckon its an iPod killer finally. and the new Aiwa.

also, mp4 jukebox's anyone?!


Rascle

 

[Gurck]

Originally posted by: EviLRas
ps, iPods et al are all very well. whats the feeling on the new SONY player?

They'd have to pay me to endure the headache of dealing with Sony, both in regards to the quality (rather, lack thereof) of their products and their customer service, which is excellent - if you enjoy being plowed from behind.

 

[EviLRas]

I do love sony. most of they're products are very high quality. i LOVE my DSC-T1 digicam. its credit card sized, though obviously thicker! and its 5MP. got it in hongkong in jan. took amazing pictures!

but on the flipside, i bought a minidisk USB thing. was crap! the piracy software is a pain in the arse! you have to log songs back into the machince. if ONLY they would get rid of that feature!

on the iPod killing side though, it (new sony mp3 player) has large colour screen for checking out pictures you've stored etc. not sure if it supports mp4 yet, but its a step in the right direction!


Rascle

 

[SickBeast]

Originally posted by: EviLRas
on the iPod killing side though, it (new sony mp3 player) has large colour screen for checking out pictures you've stored etc. not sure if it supports mp4 yet, but its a step in the right direction!

If we're both thinking about the same Sony MP3 player, then no, it's not an iPod killer as of yet. I was reading about it and Sony claims you can fit 20,000 songs on its 20GB hard drive whereas the iPod can only fit something like 5,000. What they neglect to mention is that it can only hold that many songs if you encode them at 48kbps, which would sound similar to an AM radio.

They seem to be trying to sell the 20GB player for the same price as a 40GB iPod. They just hide the fact that it has less actual capacity and tell people how many songs they think it can hold.

Nobody seems to know if it will actually play MP3 files either; 99% of Sony's "MP3" players in reality only play ATRAC.

As for Sony's design/build quality, I would take them over iRiver, Creative, or Rio any day of the week. Their sound quality is traditionally phenominal as well.

I'm very surprised that Sony has yet to come out with a killer MP3 player. They invented the walkman. This type of product has traditionally been their niche.

 

[Huma]

despite being a general apple hater, I bought an ipod. It worked better than anyone else's player.

The navigation system has yet to be matched, and it's size is awesome. The only complaint I have about my pod is the battery life which seems to be improved in the newest revision. I only really use mp3s, so file formats are moot, don't listen to the radio.

It's expensive, but it's worth the cost if you want a product that works very well and is small. If someone else pulled it off as well, I'd own that instead. I can't say I love the white plastic finish, but that won't stop me from using a great product.

 

[Yourself]

I'm not a fanboy either way, but I've had both a 3rd gen 15 gig Ipod and I now have a 4gb Muvo and the Creative sounds soooooo much better than my Ipod did.


Self

 

[Cobalt]

Originally posted by: SickBeast

Originally posted by: FishTankX
24 hour battery life might atract people, too.

The iPod with it's external battery "backpack" strapped on is probably about the same size as the Zen Touch. Is 12 hours not enough? I have yet to see my 8 hour 3G iPod run out of juice. I even took a bus from Toronto to Philadelphia with it and it lasted the whole trip.

You could probably fit 8 AA batteries in the extra volume that the Zen Touch takes up over the iPod.

I'm still amazed the nobody seems able to compete with Apple after all this time.

The iRiver H series-120,140,320,340- IMO and others, stomp all over the iPod.

 

[Lonyo]

Originally posted by: Gurck

Originally posted by: EviLRas
ps, iPods et al are all very well. whats the feeling on the new SONY player?

They'd have to pay me to endure the headache of dealing with Sony, both in regards to the quality (rather, lack thereof) of their products and their customer service, which is excellent - if you enjoy being plowed from behind.

Quality? Customer support?
WHO CARES?

The fact is, the software they WILL force you to use to get files on there will be mosre of a PITA.
It will suck to do anything with, Sony sucks.

 

[Looney]

Originally posted by: SickBeast
You keep on comparing AOL to tech gear which makes no sense; you're comparing a service to a product. Name a single piece of tech gear that costs at least $300 and outsells a similar product worth $50.

Wow, you're so oblivious. The comparison he's doing isn't hardware vs. software, but giving examples of other 'world's opinions' that are obviously untrue to most people in the know.

Anyways, why is it you feel you have to justify the ipod so much? So you like it, do you have to convince us to agree with you for you to enjoy it?