Oh Newt you silly Newt

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SMOGZINN

Lifer
Jun 17, 2005
14,221
4,452
136
Didn't you quote an unconfirmed statement from Trump where he said

“I faced great pressure because of Russia. That’s taken off.”

Apparently Trump thought the pressure was "taken off". Not alleviated.

That is splitting hairs pretty fine. Trump is not well known as a precise orator, he has about a 4th grade vocabulary and is often having to re-explain what he means because of his poor grammar and small vocabulary. I'm pretty sure he meant alleviated when he said that.
 

buckshot24

Diamond Member
Nov 3, 2009
9,916
85
91
Which Comey wouldn't say because Trump probably was (and is) a party of interest in the investigation. Firing Comey for not saying something that could harm the investigation is obstruction of justice.
Dream on. You people are nuts. Everything is obstruction of justice with you.
No, Comey was the boss of the people investigating Trump and company. The person that could definitely the people doing the investigation to stop Trump out of it. Since Comey would not do that Trump fired him, and is hoping to replace him with someone that will do that.
Comey testified that it would be good if some of his affiliates did something wrong that it would be known. Hardly sounds like somebody trying to impede an investigation.
 

buckshot24

Diamond Member
Nov 3, 2009
9,916
85
91
That is splitting hairs pretty fine. Trump is not well known as a precise orator, he has about a 4th grade vocabulary and is often having to re-explain what he means because of his poor grammar and small vocabulary. I'm pretty sure he meant alleviated when he said that.
Its funny that his tweets get parsed as if they are inspired scripture but when I do it then there's a problem.
 

SMOGZINN

Lifer
Jun 17, 2005
14,221
4,452
136
Dream on. You people are nuts. Everything is obstruction of justice with you.
When you have even a small degree of influence over an investigation that you could even possibly involved in you have to be extremely carful because obstruction of justice has a very broad definition. It is intentionally that way. It covers nearly anything that could hamper the investigation, with only the courts (or in this case Congress) to decide what is and is not obstruction. The final question you have to ask is 'Was this action intended to keep an investigation from finding the truth?' Forcing someone over the investigation to announce publicly that a specific person is not a part of the investigation, before the investigators have had a chance to determine that could very easily be seen as an attempt to put political pressure on them to keep that person from being investigated.
 
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SMOGZINN

Lifer
Jun 17, 2005
14,221
4,452
136
Its funny that his tweets get parsed as if they are inspired scripture but when I do it then there's a problem.
Even if he did mean 'lowered' and not removed, it would still be obstruction of justice to intentionally do something to lower the chances that you would be investigated.
 
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buckshot24

Diamond Member
Nov 3, 2009
9,916
85
91
When you have even a small degree of influence over an investigation that you could even possibly involved in you have to be extremely carful because obstruction of justice has a very broad definition. It is intentionally that way. It covers nearly anything that could hamper the investigation, with only the courts (or in this case Congress) to decide what is and is not obstruction. The final question you have to ask is 'Was this action intended to keep an investigation from finding the truth?' Forcing someone over the investigation to announce publicly that a specific person is not a part of the investigation, before the investigators have had a chance to determine that could very easily be seen as an attempt to put political pressure on them to keep that person from being investigated.
You don't agree with unitary executive theory?
 

buckshot24

Diamond Member
Nov 3, 2009
9,916
85
91
Even if he did mean 'lowered' and not removed, it would still be obstruction of justice to intentionally do something to lower the chances that you would be investigated.
He doesn't say investigation either though, does he?
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
85,650
50,905
136
Telling people what to say under oath isn't witness tampering.

Yes it is. Witness tampering is any attempt to alter the testimony of a witness. Duh. Regardless, firing the FBI director to impede an investigation is a crime.

Absolutely not.

Color me completely unsurprised that you are unwilling to rescind false statements once someone tells you better.

Translation, you know I'm right and this is all you can say about it.

Whatever you need to tell yourself.

Setting the legal question aside for a moment, my point is that nothing happened to the Russian investigation. Only a complete moron would think it would by firing the head of the FBI, Trump isn't a complete moron.

You of course have no way of knowing what the Russian investigation has uncovered, and Trump has certainly acted like a complete moron repeatedly in only a few months.

Comey said the only thing Trump asked him to do with the Russian investigation is to let it be known that he wasn't under investigation. That statement lines up exactly with sworn testimony from the former director.
That isn't clear at all.

False. The idea that the investigation of Flynn's contacts with the Russians that he lied about are separate from the overall investigation is a lie. Comey testified that Trump attempted to influence him to drop the investigation into Flynn, which is likely a crime. (A felony to be exact.)
 
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fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
85,650
50,905
136
Didn't you quote an unconfirmed statement from Trump where he said

“I faced great pressure because of Russia. That’s taken off.”

Apparently Trump thought the pressure was "taken off". Not alleviated.

I would love to know what you think the difference between take off and alleviate is.

Use specific definitions please.
 

buckshot24

Diamond Member
Nov 3, 2009
9,916
85
91
The investigation is what is being talked about, it is the understood subject.
Not in that context, assuming that leak is true. It is just as reasonable to say he's talking about it being known publicly that he wasn't under investigation.
 

buckshot24

Diamond Member
Nov 3, 2009
9,916
85
91
Yes it is. Witness tampering is any attempt to alter the testimony of a witness. Duh. Regardless, firing the FBI director to impede an investigation is a crime.
Don't move the goal posts.
Color me completely unsurprised that you are unwilling to rescind false statements once someone tells you better.
You telling me they are false is you telling me they are false, nothing more.
Whatever you need to tell yourself.
You made a complete leap of logic.
You of course have no way of knowing what the Russian investigation has uncovered, and Trump has certainly acted like a complete moron repeatedly in only a few months.
President isn't working in a vacuum either, he has advisers who are not imbeciles who would have told him this wouldn't have stopped or impeded a Russian investigation that Comey testified that Trump said it would be good to know if his affiliates did something wrong.

What we do know is that there has been leak after leak damaging to the president. To suggest that there has been something uncovered and not leaked is not credible.
False. The idea that the investigation of Flynn's contacts with the Russians that he lied about are separate from the overall investigation is a lie. Comey testified that Trump attempted to influence him to drop the investigation into Flynn, which is likely a crime. (A felony to be exact.)
That wasn't a part of the "Russian investigation", Comey made that distinction when questioned by Rubio at the hearing.
 
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fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
85,650
50,905
136
Don't move the goal posts.

I am literally dragging back the goalposts you are trying to move. Firing the FBI director to impede an investigation is a crime. In fact, it is a felony.

You telling me they are false is you telling me they are false, nothing more.

No, you said firing the FBI director is not obstruction of justice. This is an exact quote. That is a false statement because firing the FBI director can absolutely be obstruction of justice. You should be mature enough to admit your error.

You made a complete leap of logic.
President isn't working in a vacuum either, he has advisers who are not imbeciles who would have told him this wouldn't have stopped or impeded a Russian investigation that Comey testified that Trump said it would be good to know if his affiliates did something wrong.

What we do know is that there has been leak after leak damaging to the president. To suggest that there has been something uncovered and not leaked is not credible.

So you're just making things up now. Talk about a leap of logic. You have absolutely no idea what the investigation has uncovered and it is hypocritical for you to say that about other aspects of the investigation and then make this unsupported assumption.

That wasn't a part of the "Russian investigation", Comey made that distinction when questioned by Rubio at the hearing.

He most certainly did not. You're trying to move the goalposts by saying only the campaign stuff is part of the 'Russia investigation' when it is clearly not.
 
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buckshot24

Diamond Member
Nov 3, 2009
9,916
85
91
Thank you for proving my point. By your logic Nixon should have stuck it out because he did nothing wrong as the Saturday night massacre was just an HR issue.

This is how corrupted modern American conservatism has become. The mental and moral rot is near total.
He didn't do anything illegal that Saturday. Stupid? Yes. Wrong? Definitely. Criminal? No I don't think so.
 

Screech

Golden Member
Oct 20, 2004
1,202
6
81
Haha, winner winner chicken dinner. Obstruction of justice is illegal except when it isn't!

So I guess the conclusion is that if a Republican president manages to fire every single law enforcement individual who might try to investigate him for any crime, such that such investigations do no occur, then this is the way justice should work in this country. All hail the King! I guess a good following question is to ask if there is ever a situation in which firing someone in order to impede an investigation WOULD be breaking the law.
 
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