Okay, network Guru's, does this exist?

[Russ]

Does a type of switch or router exist that allows one to plug modem equipped systems in, with ethernet out? The goal being, of course, to access the web without plugging in to the phone line.

Russ, NCNE

 

[jmcoreymv]

I dont quite understand what your asking. They sell dialup routers like this:
http://www.netgear.com/products/modems_routers.shtml

But Im not sure if thats what your looking for?

 

[Russ]

That's close, but not quite. I want to be able to plug modems IN, with ethernet OUT, so that it hooks up to one of my switches and the modem equipped systems access the web through my DSL connection. In otherwords, it would be essentially the reverse of that router.

Russ, NCNE

 

[loner]

If I understand you correctly, you want to share your connection from your DSL router, through a switch, to a machine that only has a modem?

I am not aware of any form of connecting with a modem without actually dialling up to something. Modems work by a completely different method than ethernet.

A modem modulates data by converting it to audible tones that can be transmitted on a telephone wire, and demodulates received signals to get the data

The only way to get data into a machine through a modem, is to send it a signal (sound) that it may demodulate. In short, you're best off to stick in a $10 NIC, otherwise you will have to run a dial-up server and have multiple phone lines.

Hope this answers your question.

 

[jmcoreymv]

I think I understand what you mean now, loner clarified it, and Im pretty sure youre going to need another NIC like he said.

 

[Herr Yunta]

You could plug your DSL modem into a switch with a crossover cable and have a NIC in all your machines connected to the switch. I run 3 machines off of a cable modem this way.

 

[cot]

The only way I can think of to do something like this would be to have a separate machine with modems and a nic in it. Then hook up the modems to each other and set the new machine up as a router.

Sounds hokey, but there are ways of hooking up modems directly to each other (as evidenced by many people doing the iopener hack). Sometimes, I think depending on the specific modem, you may need a battery in there to simulate the line voltage.

If you try this don't blame me for the noise/smoke/electrical fire/etc

cot

 

[cot]

Actually, now that I think about it, this wouldn't be that different from what ISPs must use - some kind of modem farm with the ability to be connected to a network.

I am almost positive you could find dedicated hardware to do that, just a matter of setting it up correctly (and fooling the modems into directly connecting).

I AM positive that if you didn't like that "connect em and hope they work" approach, you could build (or maybe buy) a circuit that would exactly simulate a phone line connection between the two modems. As for how, I don't know off the top of my head. I have a book on phone electronics at home, I could look if you want.

cot

 

[jmcoreymv]

or you could buy a 10 dollar nic

 

[cot]

> or you could buy a 10 dollar nic

Umm, I don't think he is ignorant enough to post this question if that would suffice.

Maybe he is attaching some weird hardware that isn't expandable. Or something not so weird, like a dreamcast. Who knows?

cot

 

[Russ]

<< some kind of modem farm with the ability to be connected to a network. >>



Cot nailed it. I've seen precisely that at the local ISP that I build machines for. The problem is actually finding one. The sysadmin there had no leads for me, as the equipment was installed before she was hired.

NIC's in the machines are not an option because these are for sale systems at my shop, and most people don't want a network card. I don't feel like opening them up and yanking the NIC before they go out the door.

But, I would like to have them connected, so the customer could play on the web as part of the presentation process.

Russ, NCNE

 

[davisdog]

ISPs and Corporations use pools of Modems set up for remote access for people to come in via modem and access the Intra/Internet via ethernet if that's what you are sorta trying to mimic ...3Com makes some of these remote access products that allow computers to get on the Corporate ethernet via a modem connection...look around here to see if you find what you want (never tried it by plugging the two modem (RJ11) ports together though and bypassing all the mod/demod and A/D)

http://www.3com.com/carrier/nsd/products/rapd/ssii/400356.html

or here's something slightly different that they call a lan modem (I'm too lazy to read exactly what it is)
http://www.3com.com/client/pcd/analog/lan_features.html

 

[jmcoreymv]

Russ: Just use USB nics, i think for what your saying that would be great. Buy X amount of usb nics and keep reusing them for each machine.

 

[cot]

USB NICs is a good idea. Another would be parallel port networking - I think windows still has support for this. Just a direct connection over the parallel port. A null modem cable would work too.

Still, you would have to set the machines up a bit differently once sold, and I am guessing that is one thing you are trying to avoid.

still thinkin...

cot

 

[Russ]

I thought of USB NIC's. The problem is that the customer would be surfing at 512k and get home to a 56k modem. I felt that this would be a less than honest way to present the systems.

Russ, NCNE

 

[BuckMaster]

I'm not 100% sure what your looking for Russ. But if its anything like what davisdog advised from 3com. I would check out
http://www.intel.com/isp/network/shiva.htm I like there Hardware and software MUCH better them 3Coms. Ive used both. We use Shiva for our Dial-in users that dont have networking cards in there laptops. But can dial in to our server and go out to the internet.

 

[jmcoreymv]

If you could some how network them via a serial cable you could throttle the port down to 56700 bps.

 

[cot]

So, how many machines are you talking about? I think these ISP solutions are going to be quite expensive, unless you can pick one up used. Check out http://www.digi.com, there are some expensive server products there.

Might be cheaper to throw some modems in a pc and use it as a dial up server.

Digi also has some cards with loads o serial ports, an 8 port one runs <$500. You could just pick up some external modems and use those.

I still think that a serial or parallel connection might be easier. Heck, even a USB NIC could probably be throttled down to ~56K on the ethernet side of things. I think.

cot

 

[Damaged]

Those ISP solutions ARE expensive! AND...you'll need either a T-1 or a PRI from the TelCo. You still need carrier. Not what he's looking to do.

I'm sure something like this could be done, though I don't know of any such devices. Basically you would need some type of MUX (multiplexor) which would provided POTS signalling, voltage, etc. (IOW mimic carrier) which would interface via ethernet as well.

I've tried searching but I'm not coming up with anything. I swear Shiva used to make a software/harware solution to do this. Shiva was purchased by Intel though and I don't see any mention of this solution on their site.

Hmm, I wonder if you could pick up an old Livingston Pormaster and do this via serial with null modem cables? It's a thought. What you'd want is an old 2E series. The new PMX series units would still be mucho $$$.

 

[Xanathar]

Russ, If you use an aolder cisco switch <like a 1900 series> and the usb nics you can limit the bandwith on a per port basis. This should make things VERY simple.... even allowing you the ability to make 1 port simulate modem, 1 port isdn, 1 port slow dsl, 1 port cable modem, 1 port fast dsl... combined with an internal server <so you know any lag wont be the internet> you can show the client EXACTLY what they are buying, and the benefits....

 

[barebottoms]

Russ,

2 solutions:

One Call Equinox and see if they have their Legacy Products:
http://www.equinox.com/product/legacy.htm

The bottom one sounds like it meets your criteria.

Two. If they have modems and not serial ports,
then you have to get an analog modem pool. The use a dialscript to
issue a dial. One the modem pool modems set them to auto answer.. etc.. I don't have the exact strings on hand, but can get them if you need them. Just connect phone lines between the modems, they will answer even without going through the telco switch first.

Port Master won't work in this case if you only have modem outs, unless you dangle modems off each of the serial ports of the PM2. If you have serial.

If you do have serial outs, then any term server that supports SLIP, CSLIP, PPP will work. Just depending on what stack you have on your POS (no no... Point of Sale.. though I guess it could be the other POS too) device

 

[Herr Yunta]

With 16 modems, that is $3000! I say a used Cisco Cat 1900 with some USB NICs are in order. I will have to dig out those PearCom USB NIC's that were $18.

 

[IceStorm]

If I understand your request, you want to be able to attach a machine to the Internet via a serial port.

That, you can do. You'd run SLIP to a remote access server. Probably a Linux box.

Actual setup is a bit more complicated than that. I've never done it myself, but that's what you're looking for.

Modem wouldn't work. You'd need something to emulate DTMF, etc, so that the modem could dial, etc. That's expensive. Null modem cables with you clamping the transfer rate at 38.4 kbit/sec in both directions is about the best you'll get.

 

[barebottoms]

That was my question. Does the target machine have serial ports. If not YOU CAN STILL DO BACK to BACK modems. I do it all the time.

DTMF has NOTHING to do with it. DTMF is the means for the SWITCH of grab digits via TOUCH TONE, translate them, send the SPC if inter LATA a DB query for Point Code of the FAR end switch. If intra LATA most often, SPC route look up is not required.

There is nothing magical the PSTN does to a modem. All a modem does is modulate and demodulate anlog/digital signals.

To do back to back modems all you have to do is this.

On Far end modem (ras, linux box with pppd, or just a terminal
program so you can type to yourself if you want)
Issue the following to the modem:

ATZ
ATM0 (or ATM1L2 if you need sound verification)
AT#CW0
AT#CWT6
ATX1
ATA


Connect the modems back to back with just a standard phone cord
via the telco RJ 11's. Look ma, no PSTN


Fire up a terminal program like hyperterm
type
ATZ
ATDT1 (or any number all we want the modem to do is thing its dialing
to ultimately connect)


Wow.. magic.. the only DTMF was from the 1 which the far end modem did not care about. You could of even did an
ATD1
Pulse dial and no DTMF what so ever.

 

[LocutusX]

Russ,

If you're handy with non-Windows based UNIXxy programs, you can do EXACTLY what you're looking for with Freesco.

Check it out: http://www.freesco.org

In fact, in one of the doc pages, the author mentions how he set up a freesco box at his office plugged into the LAN there and also connected to a modem, so that he can dial into the box from home and use the office LAN to surf the web.