Olbermann on Rumsfeld's "fascism" comment

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Drift3r

Guest
Jun 3, 2003
3,572
0
0
Originally posted by: bobdelt
Originally posted by: DonVito
Originally posted by: LEDominator

He cited CBS is the relevancy. Obviously Iraq isn't very secular btw if people have alegiances to clerics and whatnot. Not that it matters, but Saddam Husseins regime also has ties to the Nazis in world war II. The History channel had a thing on it a while back. I also would note that I never mentioned Iraq, all I am saying is at some time or another the West is going to have a big confrontation with Islam.

What allegiances to clerics are you talking about? How could Saddam Hussein's regime have had ties to the Nazis when he was 8 when the war ended? He didn't take office until almost 35 years later.

The Bath party started during that time period and had nazi ties. The bath party studied hitlers actions in france, and then took his tactics back to the middle east.

The Ba'ath party started around 1958. The main founder of the party was a man named Salah al-Din Bita who acknowledged that he was influenced by many pro-independence, socialists, nationalists movements and leaders. One person he was said to of been influenced by included a man named Mohammad Amin al-Husayni who himself had the real ties to Germany during WW2.

Mohammad Amin al-Husayni ties to Germany all stemmed around the British control over the Middle-East ( especially Palestine as he was born in Jerusalem ) during the period after WW1 and before/during WW2. Mohammad Amin Al-Husayni was exiled from the region by the British because of his rampant support for their overthorw and his calls for the formation of a Pan Arab nationalist goverment in the region. His close ties to the Germans in general started during WW1 as he served and fought as a soldier for the Ottaman Empire against the British and just before WW2 when the Germans offered him asyllum after being kicked out of Syria. He eventually ended up commanding a SS unit in the Eastern Front and was captured by the Allies but never put on trial for war crimes. Mohammad Amin Al-Husayni had very strong anti-Zonist and anti-British feelings because of the British Mandate which allowed Jews into Palestine and because of British rule over the region.

The resentment of the British in areas like the Middle-East, Africa, Asia and India during, before and somewhat after WW2 was spurred on because of British colonialism. Countries that we know as Iraq, Syria, Lebannon, Palestine and Jordan ( might of left one or two out ) became a holding of the British Empire after WW1 when the Ottaman Empire was knocked out of the war by the British. The British then took over the regions left behind by the Ottaman Empire and controlled them just after WW2.

Just before and during WW2 the Germans and Japanese put themselves into the position of opposing the British rule in those regions and offered independence to any country with anti-British movements in exchange for their support during WW2. Men like Mohammad Amin al-Husayni were more then eager to accept German support if it meant furthering their goals of removing the British from the Middle-East and establishing a pro-Arab nationalist goverment in the region that would unite all Arab nations.

The ties made between the Ba'ath's party and the Nazi Regime at best is one made through admiration because it all focuses around the fact that the Ba'ath's founder was said to have made statements about being influenced by pro-Arab nationlist movements and leaders like Mohammad Amin al-Husayni during the time of British rule over the region prior to and after WW2.
 

miketheidiot

Lifer
Sep 3, 2004
11,060
1
0
Originally posted by: LEDominator
Originally posted by: miketheidiot
Originally posted by: bobdelt
Originally posted by: DonVito
Originally posted by: LEDominator

He cited CBS is the relevancy. Obviously Iraq isn't very secular btw if people have alegiances to clerics and whatnot. Not that it matters, but Saddam Husseins regime also has ties to the Nazis in world war II. The History channel had a thing on it a while back. I also would note that I never mentioned Iraq, all I am saying is at some time or another the West is going to have a big confrontation with Islam.

What allegiances to clerics are you talking about? How could Saddam Hussein's regime have had ties to the Nazis when he was 8 when the war ended? He didn't take office until almost 35 years later.

The Bath party started during that time period and had nazi ties. The bath party studied hitlers actions in france, and then took his tactics back to the middle east.


I've studying hitlers actions in france too. I guess that makes me a fascist and a nazi.

You didn't put them into practice. At least I hope not.


Neither did the baath party, really.
 

miketheidiot

Lifer
Sep 3, 2004
11,060
1
0
Originally posted by: LEDominator
Originally posted by: miketheidiot
Originally posted by: LEDominator
Originally posted by: miketheidiot
Please try to find a sources a little bit more credible and less sensationalistic than the history channel. Thanks.

Post, Jerrold M., and Amatzia Baram. Saddam Is Iraq: Iraq Is Saddam. Maxwell Air Force Base, Ala.: Air Univ. Press, 2002.

Eppel, Michael. Iraq from Monarchy to Tyranny: From the Hashemites to the Rise of Saddam. Gainesville: U. Pr. of Florida, 2004.

Saddam Husayn and civil-military relations in Iraq: the quest for legitimacy and power. Ahmed Hashim. The Middle East Journal 57.1 (Wntr 2003): p9.

Those should get you started


Seeing as I seem to be guiding you though this process, you now get parts from those that confirm your statements.

You asked for more sources, I gave them to you. Even if I were to cite from them you more than likely wouldn't believe me, so I'll let you do it. Besides, that way you'll get the full account and not my synthesised remarks. I would post a review of them, but I can't as it is copyrighted (If you have University Access, you should be able to read them though ) Considering I don't have the actual books at my fingertips, only book reviews, I am not willing to circumvent them by posting their reviews online just to satisfy one person and break their copyright as well as my schools fair use policy.

Well seeing as you haven't given me any source, at all, and absolutely nothing to back you up... If you actually gave me ANY evidence, I would certainly take that into account. Right now, you are telling me something I have NEVER heard of, and telling me to take your word for it. Not gonna happen, sorry. The burden of proof is on you.
 

LEDominator

Senior member
May 31, 2006
388
0
76
Few people realize that the Baath party was actually formed upon the principles and organizational structure of the Nazi party. Iraq, because of its oil and hatred of Jews, was an important battleground between the Axis and Allied powers in World War II. Nazi propaganda was broadcast throughout Baghdad, and Iraqis often went on rampages against Jews throughout the war. One of the most ardent Nazi supporters during WWII was named Khairallah Talfah. Talfah was Saddam's uncle. After the war, many of the key Iraqi Nazi supporters, all of whom evaded prosecution, wound up involved in Saddam's rise to power. This special examines the key individuals of the Iraqi-Nazi connection, the little-known battle for Iraq in WWII, and the strange link to Saddam Hussein.

There you go

Edit: And because I am lazy I will cite the History channel. Heres the link linky
 

daveymark

Lifer
Sep 15, 2003
10,573
1
0
Originally posted by: Todd33
Originally posted by: CitizenKain
Originally posted by: daveymark
well, how about that. Olbermann is right for once in his pathetic life.

Just goes to show you, even a sack of sh!t can be right once

Too bad this will be forgotten when Olbie's next blunder overshadows any good that may come of this.

Something tells me that little diatribe wasn't the result of Olbie's thoughts alone - then again, you'd have to be pretty dense to have not already known what Olbie stated...

Err..what? What kind of rant is that?

One that sounds like it came from a "special" kid who's mom was raped by Oberman.


I wouldn't expect anything less from you. And you wonder why no one pays attention to your posts...
 

daveymark

Lifer
Sep 15, 2003
10,573
1
0
Originally posted by: catnap1972
Originally posted by: CitizenKain
Originally posted by: daveymark
well, how about that. Olbermann is right for once in his pathetic life.

Just goes to show you, even a sack of sh!t can be right once

Too bad this will be forgotten when Olbie's next blunder overshadows any good that may come of this.

Something tells me that little diatribe wasn't the result of Olbie's thoughts alone - then again, you'd have to be pretty dense to have not already known what Olbie stated...

Err..what? What kind of rant is that?


Pay no attention to him--the fumes from his kissing King Georgie's @$$ are starting to really take their toll.

how so? As I already stated, I agree with what Olbermann said. I'm intersted in your fuzzy logic.

I think Olbermann is a waste of space, therefore I'm kowtowing to Bush?

I can't wait to see your answer to this one. Make it good.

Chop chop.
 

Red Dawn

Elite Member
Jun 4, 2001
57,529
3
0
Originally posted by: daveymark

Just goes to show you, even a sack of sh!t can be right once
We are still waiting for your moment in the Sun little Brown Bagger

 

DivideBYZero

Lifer
May 18, 2001
24,117
2
0
Originally posted by: bobdelt
Originally posted by: DonVito
Originally posted by: LEDominator

He cited CBS is the relevancy. Obviously Iraq isn't very secular btw if people have alegiances to clerics and whatnot. Not that it matters, but Saddam Husseins regime also has ties to the Nazis in world war II. The History channel had a thing on it a while back. I also would note that I never mentioned Iraq, all I am saying is at some time or another the West is going to have a big confrontation with Islam.

What allegiances to clerics are you talking about? How could Saddam Hussein's regime have had ties to the Nazis when he was 8 when the war ended? He didn't take office until almost 35 years later.

The Bath party started during that time period and had nazi ties. The bath party studied hitlers actions in france, and then took his tactics back to the middle east.

The Italians had Nazi ties. Should we boycott Pasta, then invade Italy to take control of the Olive Oil?
 

Used Rugs

Member
Jul 14, 2006
84
0
0
For as children tremble and fear everything in the blind darkness, so we in the light sometimes fear what is no more to be feared than the things children in the dark hold in terror and imagine will come true.
-Titus Lucretius Carus

Avoiding danger is no safer in the long run than outright exposure.
The fearful are caught as often as the bold.
- Helen Keller

The only thing we have to fear is fear itself - nameless, unreasoning, unjustified, terror which paralyzes needed efforts to convert retreat into advance.
- Franklin Delano Roosevelt (first inaugural address, March 4, 1933)

The facts of [the Japanese attacks] speak for themselves. The people of the United States have already formed their opinions and well understand the implications to the very life and safety of our nation.

- Franklin Delano Roosevelt (speech to Congress, December 8, 1941)

Let us never negotiate out of fear. But let us never fear to negotiate.
- John Fitzgerald Kennedy

Inaction breeds doubt and fear. Action breeds confidence and courage. If you want to conquer fear, do not sit home and think about it. Go out and get busy.
- Dale Carnegie

We will not walk in fear, one of another. We will not be driven by fear into an age of unreason . . . [W]e are not descended from fearful men, not from men who feared to write, to speak, to associate and to defend causes which were for the moment unpopular. This is no time . . . to keep silent.
- Edward R. Murrow

I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.
- Frank Herbert, Dune (Bene Gesserit: Litany Against Fear)

Fear has its use, but cowardice has none. I may not put my hand into the jaws of a snake, but the very sight of the snake need not strike terror into me.
- Mahatma Gandhi

As fear is close companion to falsehood, so truth follows fearlessness.

A man who is afraid will do anything.
- Jawaharlar Nehru

Courage is contagious. When a brave man takes a stand, the spines of others are stiffened.
- Billy Graham

Yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of Death, I will fear no evil
- Psalms 23:4

I accept chaos. I am not sure whether it accepts me. I know some people are terrified of the bomb. But then some people are terrified to be seen carrying a Modern Screen magazine. Experience teaches us that silence terrifies people the most.
- Bob Dylan


Don't let the righties say you support the terrorist if you don't want illegal wire taps. All they know is fear. Republicans will use fear this election.
 

db

Lifer
Dec 6, 1999
10,575
292
126
It really is shocking, and sad, that some people will post without thinking about what they are saying, and whether or not it actually pertains to the subject at hand. Repeating what you heard one of your heros sayon the TV or radio is not appropriate; come on, you have a brain--use it! You are an adult now (or will be soon, hopefully); it's time to figure things out for yourself rather than repeat what your dad says.
 
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