Sorry, I was unaware that you could learn from being scholarly whether or not someone was a deity. If only we were all as educated/enlightened as you. :roll::coookie;Originally posted by: conjur
People are afraid to question their indocrination. For centuries, the Catholic Church has maintained the lies of the deification of Jesus. Those lies have been held steadfastly by other Christian sects, too. If true biblical scholastic review was introduced into Sunday schools and parochial schools, we'd see a mass exodus from the faith in Christ and a return to sanity.
again, the polarizing boogeyman argument. Some religious whack is a conservative, therefore every conservative out there is a religuous whack. Didnt you say something about having logic?Originally posted by: Brackis
Originally posted by: Train
Since when is the US a religious country?
90% of americans dont evn go to church.
But I guess it makes a good boogeyman to scare people
and a good excuse for the dems defeat.
March on liberals, march on.
You are so ignorant that you can't even recognize that your foolish conservatism exists in the minds of god fearing Christians nationwide.
The south is overrun with stupid people who believe in "good moral values", such as invading countries and sending american soliders to their deaths.
It has been shown in polling and studies that millions, if not tens of millions of evangelical christians supported Bush and were rounded up like sheep by Karl Rove to vote in this election.
Originally posted by: conjur
People are afraid to question their indocrination. For centuries, the Catholic Church has maintained the lies of the deification of Jesus. Those lies have been held steadfastly by other Christian sects, too. If true biblical scholastic review was introduced into Sunday schools and parochial schools, we'd see a mass exodus from the faith in Christ and a return to sanity.
And that sort of coincides with the growth of Creationism (and the new propaganda term - Intelligent Design) in response to Darwin's work.Originally posted by: Infohawk
True. And actually, this process happened early last century. American protestantism was majoritarily moderate types who were didn't reject others methods of thought and analysis. First they started with more modern interpretations of the bible. But eventually, people started moving away from it completely (a natural consequence of a more balanced study). In some cases you see remnants with unitarians and such.Originally posted by: conjur
People are afraid to question their indocrination. For centuries, the Catholic Church has maintained the lies of the deification of Jesus. Those lies have been held steadfastly by other Christian sects, too. If true biblical scholastic review was introduced into Sunday schools and parochial schools, we'd see a mass exodus from the faith in Christ and a return to sanity.
The minority had been the bible thumpers. As the main denominations became more progressive and evaporated some of their numbers, the bible thumpers grew more and more proportionally to the point where they now are the primary voice of Christianity in this country. For a lot of eneducated Christians, it was just simpler to follow the bible word for word and follow dogma than actually make any real study of the bible.
Something tells me the only thing you've ever read re:the Bible is the Bible itself...King James or NIV version.Originally posted by: CycloWizard
Sorry, I was unaware that you could learn from being scholarly whether or not someone was a deity. If only we were all as educated/enlightened as you. :roll::coookie;Originally posted by: conjur
People are afraid to question their indocrination. For centuries, the Catholic Church has maintained the lies of the deification of Jesus. Those lies have been held steadfastly by other Christian sects, too. If true biblical scholastic review was introduced into Sunday schools and parochial schools, we'd see a mass exodus from the faith in Christ and a return to sanity.
Originally posted by: Gen Stonewall
I've never met one Christian who has said or implied that it's his or her duty to hasten the Second Coming. (Such a concept isn't biblical.) Does this sort of people present an epidemic, or is Moyers just trying a way to justify his hatred?
Originally posted by: CycloWizard
Most of them spend more time praying/doing religion-related activities than anyone else I know. They read the bible daily at least. Are you more active in searching for 'answers' than that? I'm certainly not.Originally posted by: DealMonkey
I don't know that they're wrong, of course, yet they've clearly stopped seeking wisdom or answers . . .
Self-fulfilling prophecies. Scary shat mang!And you will come to understand why people under the spell of such potent prophecies cannot be expected, as Grist puts it, "to worry about the environment. Why care about the earth, when the droughts, floods, famine and pestilence brought by ecological collapse are signs of the apocalypse foretold in the Bible? Why care about global climate change when you and yours will be rescued in the rapture? And why care about converting from oil to solar when the same God who performed the miracle of the loaves and fishes can whip up a few billion barrels of light crude with a word?"
Originally posted by: Train
again, the polarizing boogeyman argument. Some religious whack is a conservative, therefore every conservative out there is a religuous whack. Didnt you say something about having logic?Originally posted by: Brackis
Originally posted by: Train
Since when is the US a religious country?
90% of americans dont evn go to church.
But I guess it makes a good boogeyman to scare people
and a good excuse for the dems defeat.
March on liberals, march on.
You are so ignorant that you can't even recognize that your foolish conservatism exists in the minds of god fearing Christians nationwide.
The south is overrun with stupid people who believe in "good moral values", such as invading countries and sending american soliders to their deaths.
And if your such a good debater, as you claim, youd offer up a link the this "study" your toutingIt has been shown in polling and studies that millions, if not tens of millions of evangelical christians supported Bush and were rounded up like sheep by Karl Rove to vote in this election.
Put away your bigotry. I've never owned nor read from either of those versions. I'm not sure what that has to do with my comment that you're responding to, either. You're wrong, so you attack me while completely ignoring the issue as usual. I'll call you out any time you pull similar jackassery and be prepared for your personal attack.Originally posted by: conjur
Something tells me the only thing you've ever read re:the Bible is the Bible itself...King James or NIV version.
Open your eyes.
Originally posted by: CycloWizard
I never implied that they're right, merely that they found a solution. When I go to turn in my math homework, I don't know 100% whether or not the problem is correct, but it's my best try at achieving the correct solution.Originally posted by: DealMonkey
So there you go again: implying that they're right. How is that different from me implying that they're wrong?
Look, if the only "searching" you do is in the same spot, you're bound to miss a whole lot of other things. And once you believe you're right and once you believe you've found the answer, you stop looking. Math is a logical process while religion not so much. Solving a math problem != finding the right spiritual path. It's two completely different things.
Religion can be very much a logical process. It's certainly not for all people, but it can be. For myself, I cannot look around at what I see and logically conclude that, at the very least, there wasn't at least some force that started the process that put us where we are today. Arriving at this conclusion for some is a lifelong process, for others it's plain as day from when they are a child. The interpretation of this force is certainly open to interpretation. I don't criticize those who doubt its existence, which is why I take exception to those who do criticize those who do not doubt.
Originally posted by: CycloWizard
Maybe they already found the answer? Once I solve a math problem, I don't typically go hunting for other possible solutions. Have you found any answers yet? How hard are you looking?Originally posted by: gutharius
Part of searching for an answer is to look for that answer in more than one source of informational reference. Anything else is a blind answer and is self defeating.
Originally posted by: Train
Since when is the US a religious country?
90% of americans dont evn go to church.
But I guess it makes a good boogeyman to scare people
and a good excuse for the dems defeat.
March on liberals, march on.
Originally posted by: racebannon
Christ's bride is a republican whore.
Analagous does not imply equality. A parable does not mean the exact same principles can be applied. You and yours (most of the lefties in this forum) feel free to criticize the choice of some in seeking truth - why? What business is it of yours? You are all for complete freedom of action and call people bigots who oppose it, then you turn around and stick your nose in the business of others. The anti-Christian (especially Christian fundamentalist) sentiment on this forum is really starting to piss me off. You're all for freedoms, as long as they're freedoms that you want. You want to teach 'safe sex' in schools? You'd damn well better be prepared for someone to offer you their religion. The hypocrisy is off the charts.Originally posted by: gutharius
Mathmatical problem solving and the search for God are two VERY different things and are not equal. You have to be willing take all the information available to truly find god even the information NOT in the bible which many brainwashed baptist christians conveiniently ignore or are unaware of as their church does a piss poor job of informing them of their resources.
Do you have any idea what the legal basis for abortion is in this country? A misrepresentation by the US Supreme Court of a single sentence of an amendment that was passed when EVERY state in the nation had existing laws banning abortion. In other words, there is no legal basis for it. Why would anyone need religion to refute this obviously ridiculous basis?Originally posted by: jackschmittusa
All of the fights against abortion and homosexual unions are based on religion.
Chaos is some pretty interesting stuff. In fact, the possibility exists that it could happen just that way, but sitll not be an accident--that we simply have not come to be able to predict 'random' number systems properly. For all we know, finding God could, quite literally, be in an equation somewhere--we just haven't found it.Originally posted by: DealMonkey
Originally posted by: CycloWizard
I never implied that they're right, merely that they found a solution. When I go to turn in my math homework, I don't know 100% whether or not the problem is correct, but it's my best try at achieving the correct solution.Originally posted by: DealMonkey
So there you go again: implying that they're right. How is that different from me implying that they're wrong?
Look, if the only "searching" you do is in the same spot, you're bound to miss a whole lot of other things. And once you believe you're right and once you believe you've found the answer, you stop looking. Math is a logical process while religion not so much. Solving a math problem != finding the right spiritual path. It's two completely different things.
Religion can be very much a logical process. It's certainly not for all people, but it can be. For myself, I cannot look around at what I see and logically conclude that, at the very least, there wasn't at least some force that started the process that put us where we are today. Arriving at this conclusion for some is a lifelong process, for others it's plain as day from when they are a child. The interpretation of this force is certainly open to interpretation. I don't criticize those who doubt its existence, which is why I take exception to those who do criticize those who do not doubt.
And for myself, I can look around and easily conclude that life on this planet is just one big cosmic "mistake." There's a certain beauty to randomness and it's just as easy to conclude that life on Earth started at the single-cell level, in a primordial soup of amino acids and the building blocks of life. Apply evolution and quite a few million years and bam -- you've got yourself some walking, talking shaved apes who think they know what's what.
I don't think time will help. We've had plenty of time. People need to accept that they are ignorant. Not just admit it, but accept it. There are people who believe in academics that rival in board rooms as much as others believe in God. My own introspection brought me to a quite liberating conclusion that many simply won't hear: God is irrelavent.Originally posted by: smthmlk
if you want something to believe in, believe in your mother, your father, your older brother, your aunt or uncle, your professor at school (GO TO SCHOOL!), and most importantly, your SELF. Religion's ability to teach people has been a great sucess, but what it has been teaching people apart from how to be decent citizens is how to believe in false things. The bible was not meant to be taken literally, and the book of revelations is so cryptic so that you WONT take it literally. Believe me, it's prediction of an apocolypse is true (didnt see that coming did you?), and here's why: The 40 or so people who wrote the bible knew man couldn't overcome greed and lust and idiocy, and saw that, sooner or later, we'd be a little farther than where we are now. Right now we have a president who says he's been given a mandate from god to do his work, and that people should follow him because of this. This man has killed his own people, hundreds of thousands of other people in other countries, and all the while, he's using a Jesus (and God) as his icon. Jesus didn't preach killing others who disagreed, he taught tolerance & decency. The bible doesn't say "kill those who dont think like you." But people blindly follow it, vote for it, and can't wait for more. These people aren't even reading the bible in an effort to find answers, if they did, they would have known that Jesus was against killing.
The bibles purpose was to teach decency to people and to show them that man will kill himself eventually if he doesnt put down his greed & stupidity (the apocolypse). Man can do that, but we need more time. You can see in every forum that people are 50/50 split on this: science vs. blind religion. If you support your religion in an effort to spread good ideas and to promote decency yet you dont personally believe in some god is OK. People need to realize that it's ok to question things and still feel good about helping others. The internet is the ultimate forum for helping others, and as we can see, science & reason is on the rise. Full on blind religion will be removed at one point or another, either when man has nuked himself & the envirionment or when a vast majority realize that killing in the name of religion is retarded, and that believing in higher beings leads directly to the thought-processes which validate killing in the name of religious beliefs.
Why? I think I'm the only person in this thread that hasn't tried to mock anyone else's beliefs.Originally posted by: Cerb
P.S. Don't mention the A word around CycloWizard :beer:
Your argument implies that you think people should be allowed to act as they see fit: abortion, homosexual marriage, and so on should be legalized. Why, then, are you pressing for a restriction on the actions of religious persons? My brain aches when I read such hypocrisy.
You have a habit of dragging the subject of abortion into the thread just about every time someone mentions it, rather than sticking to the topic.Originally posted by: CycloWizard
Why? I think I'm the only person in this thread that hasn't tried to mock anyone else's beliefs.Originally posted by: Cerb
P.S. Don't mention the A word around CycloWizard :beer:
So you admit you're a hypocrite? At least you admit it.Originally posted by: jackschmittusa
CycloWizard
Yup, that pretty much sums it up. I'm a live and let live kind of guy. So long as the rights and privileges you claim for yourself don't infringe on mine (or others), have at it.
Homosexuality was accepted by many cultures for millennia till the Christians decided that the Jews had condemned it, and that was a good idea.
Abortion has been practiced since man figured out how to do it. Then Christians decided that when a sperm fertalized an egg, god dropped by at that moment, sprinkled some pixie dust or whatever on it and gave it a "soul"; making it special beyond reason.
You tell me who has the agenda.
Funny, because I didn't bring it up. JSUSA did. Oh well - troll away.Originally posted by: Cerb
You have a habit of dragging the subject of abortion into the thread just about every time someone mentions it, rather than sticking to the topic.
And anyway, with Riprorin absent from this thread, it won't be any fun watching the discussion go by
I didn't say you broguht it up, just that you seem compelled to reply to it every single time.Originally posted by: CycloWizard
Funny, because I didn't bring it up. JSUSA did. Oh well - troll away.Originally posted by: Cerb
You have a habit of dragging the subject of abortion into the thread just about every time someone mentions it, rather than sticking to the topic.
And anyway, with Riprorin absent from this thread, it won't be any fun watching the discussion go by