Discussion Our healthcare mess thanks to Obamacare

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Leeea

Diamond Member
Apr 3, 2020
3,689
5,424
136
I actually like crazy homeless people so long as they stay nonviolent.
tip: I do not want to be a likable crazy homeless person

tip 2: most crazy homeless people do not want to be crazy homeless people

tip 3: while mental health care is not cheap, homeless people are also not cheap either. Not every crazy homeless person would take the handout, but for those who would, the state should give it.
 
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biostud

Lifer
Feb 27, 2003
18,391
4,962
136
Besides the difference in cost, I'm really happy I don't have to worry about what kind of plan I'm on how to pay and deduct for different services. Seems overly complicated and expensive.
 
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FelixDeCat

Lifer
Aug 4, 2000
29,288
2,094
126
tip: I do not want to be a likable crazy homeless person

tip 2: most crazy homeless people do not want to be crazy homeless people

tip 3: while mental health care is not cheap, homeless people are also not cheap either. Not every crazy homeless person would take the handout, but for those who would, the state should give it.
I have advocated for solutions to homelessness including mental treatment. However I think there are no easy solutions or we would have it already. We simply have too many people we cannot support, asylums for the untreatable were closed and now the streets have to care for them. Add to this millions of new illegal aliens straining our social fabric and you have a recipe for disaster.

If I had the power, the first thing I would do is not allow land sales to non Americans. The next thing is to ban sales to LLCs. Only individuals can buy single family homes and only to occupy full time or as a second home, limit 2. Beyond that, you are just hoarding affordable housing from the public.

Like I said, no easy solutions.
 
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FelixDeCat

Lifer
Aug 4, 2000
29,288
2,094
126
Besides the difference in cost, I'm really happy I don't have to worry about what kind of plan I'm on how to pay and deduct for different services. Seems overly complicated and expensive.
The only way I could support single payer is if the cost did not exceed 3% of income and a deductible of $1,000 would still apply to keep people from going to the doctor for no reason. The $1,000 would be withheld from tax refunds if not paid.
 

APU_Fusion

Senior member
Dec 16, 2013
943
1,431
136
The only way I could support single payer is if the cost did not exceed 3% of income and a deductible of $1,000 would still apply to keep people from going to the doctor for no reason. The $1,000 would be withheld from tax refunds if not paid.
Yes, 3% of 25k a year versus 3% of those making 250k a year. Your generosity and compassion for the 99% is noted. Because you cant comprehend health care or shared risk doesn’t mean all of us don’t. I make a good salary and have no problem paying more in single payers if it meant those less fortunate than me could get health but I just a loser woke American

you also haven’t refuted the points made that you just understand health care plans so you have high costs from previous posters. Answer those specific questions please.
 

Pohemi

Diamond Member
Oct 2, 2004
9,359
12,718
146
....Add to this millions of new illegal aliens straining our social fabric and you have a recipe for disaster.

Oh, this tripe again. Anytime you have the opportunity to bitch about immigrants, you jump on it.

Approximately 1.5M immigrants enter the country each year. Not all of these come across the Mexican border, and not all of them are illegal. As of 2019, the total number in the US was around 51M. So when you say, "millions of", you must mean all of them. Right?

As much as you want to make believe...immigrants don't cross the border and immediately have access to jobs, welfare, food stamps, healthcare, or other social benefits that you might pay taxes to support. Explain how they are such a strain on our "social fabric" that you hate them SO much.

Also, are you (and your parents, grandparents, etc.) of Native American descent? If not, guess what? You're an immigrant or offspring of immigrants as well. Must have started the FYGM early, huh?

Stop getting your info on border crossings from Faux and you might not sound so stupid. Maybe.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
72,673
6,194
126
I don't care what facts or logic or reason or empathy you use, this guy will ALWAYS vote and support the shittiest of the Republican party in regards to any policy such as healthcare and any other socio-economic issue. Always.
It’s called projecting.
 

biostud

Lifer
Feb 27, 2003
18,391
4,962
136
The only way I could support single payer is if the cost did not exceed 3% of income and a deductible of $1,000 would still apply to keep people from going to the doctor for no reason. The $1,000 would be withheld from tax refunds if not paid.
But your health care cost is currently 18% of GDP. How would that work? How should the the rest of cost be covered?

Here in Denmark we use around 11% of our GDP and I think around 8% of the income taxes are used for health care.
 
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FelixDeCat

Lifer
Aug 4, 2000
29,288
2,094
126
But your health care cost is currently 18% of GDP. How would that work? How should the the rest of cost be covered?

Here in Denmark we use around 11% of our GDP and I think around 8% of the income taxes are used for health care.
In a negotiation, you always start low. My proposal calls for a 3% tax with a $1,000 deductible to make sure people dont see a doctor just because they are lonely.

If it winds up costing more then we can come up with a price that is reasonable but not unbearable. Giving up half your income is simply not appealing.
 
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Pohemi

Diamond Member
Oct 2, 2004
9,359
12,718
146
...with a $1,000 deductible to make sure people dont see a doctor just because they are lonely.
This is another example of you making shit up with no evidence. Unless someone is a hypochondriac, nobody is visiting doctors for no reason. Fuck off with that nonsense.

Giving up half your income is simply not appealing.
And here it is again. Tell me what country takes anywhere close to half your income for socialized medicine. It's complete bullshit. Tell me again about the billions of immigrants crossing the southern border. I could use a laugh.

If you can't support your opinions with evidence and facts, then you probably have shitty opinions/stances. Shocker coming from you.
 
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ivwshane

Lifer
May 15, 2000
32,318
15,116
136
I don’t know…one of my favorite hobbies is seeing my doctor for random things. I enjoy the long waits and the miracle symptom fixer pills they prescribe me that have side affects worse than the issue they are trying to address. Like who doesn’t like going to the doctors for no particular reason? I can’t think of a better way to spend my day.




/eyeroll
 

biostud

Lifer
Feb 27, 2003
18,391
4,962
136
In a negotiation, you always start low. My proposal calls for a 3% tax with a $1,000 deductible to make sure people dont see a doctor just because they are lonely.

If it winds up costing more then we can come up with a price that is reasonable but not unbearable. Giving up half your income is simply not appealing.
The best way to keep cost down in health care is to have a healthy population ie. prevention is better than treatment.

The most effective ways to do this is make unhealthy things expensive and have a well educated population.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
72,673
6,194
126
I don’t know…one of my favorite hobbies is seeing my doctor for random things. I enjoy the long waits and the miracle symptom fixer pills they prescribe me that have side affects worse than the issue they are trying to address. Like who doesn’t like going to the doctors for no particular reason? I can’t think of a better way to spend my day.




/eyeroll
Conservatives make it a big deal among themselves to take pride in being responsible, whatever the hell they fantasize that to be, so they are naturally suspicious of others fucking away their honestly earned tax dollars by spending it say, on seeing a doctor out of loneliness, because, of course, they themselves crave attention and would gladly drop your tax dollars on a whim we’re it not for being made to feel inferior by acting that way.

They have a posttive moral value not to waste money on childish needs but they don’t see they have such needs repressed and project them on others because those needs were repressed and never met.

What is the use of having moral values if the reason you do is just so you can feel superior to, and look down on other people. Everybody has real needs. When you are trained to stoic self indifference as a virtue by being humiliated for weakness, the loss of empathy for the self translates into contempt for empathy itself.

Only love can mend a broken heart.
 
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Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
72,673
6,194
126
The best way to keep cost down in health care is to have a healthy population ie. prevention is better than treatment.

The most effective ways to do this is make unhealthy things expensive and have a well educated population.
In a capitalist system huge profits can be made on unregulated production of junk food. Only profit matters to the walking dead.
 

dank69

Lifer
Oct 6, 2009
35,569
29,247
136
In a negotiation, you always start low. My proposal calls for a 3% tax with a $1,000 deductible to make sure people dont see a doctor just because they are lonely.

If it winds up costing more then we can come up with a price that is reasonable but not unbearable. Giving up half your income is simply not appealing.
If someone is lonely they are going to blow through that $1000 in the first week and then go to the doctor daily for the rest of the year. Maybe just stick to losing money in the stock market instead of dreaming up ways for us all to lose more money in the healthcare system?
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
110,802
29,553
146
I have advocated for solutions to homelessness including mental treatment. However I think there are no easy solutions or we would have it already. We simply have too many people we cannot support, asylums for the untreatable were closed and now the streets have to care for them. Add to this millions of new illegal aliens straining our social fabric and you have a recipe for disaster.

If I had the power, the first thing I would do is not allow land sales to non Americans. The next thing is to ban sales to LLCs. Only individuals can buy single family homes and only to occupy full time or as a second home, limit 2. Beyond that, you are just hoarding affordable housing from the public.

Like I said, no easy solutions.

you vote to end mental health care in the US every time you vote for a GOP fascist. You vote to increase homelessness every time you vote GOP. This has been true since Reagan.

Stop lying.
 

kitkat22

Golden Member
Feb 10, 2005
1,463
1,322
136
This is another example of you making shit up with no evidence. Unless someone is a hypochondriac, nobody is visiting doctors for no reason. Fuck off with that nonsense.


And here it is again. Tell me what country takes anywhere close to half your income for socialized medicine. It's complete bullshit. Tell me again about the billions of immigrants crossing the southern border. I could use a laugh.

If you can't support your opinions with evidence and facts, then you probably have shitty opinions/stances. Shocker coming from you.
Oh trust me, there are plenty of people who show up in the ER for whatever reason. Some for STD checks, pregnancy tests. Some for very simple reasons that could easily be addressed by an urgent care or PCP. I actually advocate for a small barrier of entry to the ER. Something like $50-100 per visit or there abouts.
 
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kitkat22

Golden Member
Feb 10, 2005
1,463
1,322
136
And what makes you think private healthcare would be/can be affordable?
I love paying for medical insurance company profits! Gives me such warm feelings inside that a CEO, board members and shareholders get the benefit of people who are healthy and the detriment of those who are not. What could go wrong?

I'm already marked as a high utilizer. I have company nurse checking on me regularly. Makes sure I have no problems getting my meds and such. Also checks that I'm taking them. Hmm, I wonder why? 🙄

BTW, I don't mind it. It's more interesting to me than not. My history is already well know across multiple insurance carriers.
 

thilanliyan

Lifer
Jun 21, 2005
11,910
2,127
126
Besides the difference in cost, I'm really happy I don't have to worry about what kind of plan I'm on how to pay and deduct for different services. Seems overly complicated and expensive.
Yeah I'm perfectly fine with higher taxes to cover our healthcare costs in Canada. I'm a healthy 40 yr old with no health issues atm, but one day I might need it, and someone else currently needs it, so I'm fine paying for it. And thank goodness the quality of the plan is not tied to employers.
 

SteveGrabowski

Diamond Member
Oct 20, 2014
7,115
5,992
136
The best way to keep cost down in health care is to have a healthy population ie. prevention is better than treatment.

The most effective ways to do this is make unhealthy things expensive and have a well educated population.
A well educated population would rise up against American oligarchs which is the last thing the ruling class wants.
 
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NWRMidnight

Platinum Member
Jun 18, 2001
2,965
2,571
136
Ive already successfully argued against single payer, so the only remaining option is affordable private healthcare.
Sorry, arguing to yourself, as you look in a mirror, doesn't qualify as being successful.

Folks, this kind of nonsense of believing you succeeded in arguing something, because you believe your own stupidity and falsehoods, is what happens when you live in your own closed off made up world, that has no connection to reality.

edit: wording, punctuation
 
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