Papst or Panaflo fans

[JK16]

I hear that panaflos have good air pressure, but I don't know about the papst. Papst look slightly better though (sleeve bearing) and seem to push about 3-5 cfm more than a panaflo w/ the same dB rating, but if papst fans don't have good air pressure, then the panaflos are my choice. What do you think, and would a papst or panaflo pushing 24-35 cfm be a good match for an Alpha 8045 on a Athalon 1600 with nothing overclocked? Also, which is "better" is I am aiming for a DEAD SILENT PC w/ respectable airflow?
Thanks!

 

[FlowerMan]

Papst are simply the best fans you can buy. I would grab them if they were available and affordable. Panaflos are a good alternative. Dont worry about the Papsts' power, they have plenty.

 

[mchomicz]

I have a Lian-Li PC60 USB case with 3 Papst 8412NGL fans; I also have a Papst 8412NGML on an Alpha PAL8045. Finally, in my Enermax power supply, I switched the fans from whatever stock fans it had to a Papst 8412NGL and a 9cm Panaflo (a Papst replacement is on order ;-)

I used to have the quietest available 8cm Panaflos everywhere (the model number escapes me) but have switched to Papst to get things as quiet as possible.

I put 8412NGML and not NGL on the CPU heatsink to get a little extra cooling. I am running XP1600+ overclocked to 1700+ (10.5 x 133+7) at core voltage dropped by 0.25 from the default. It's also worth noting that I have 2 hard drives in the case (you guessed it - they are Seagate Barracudas ATA IV), the northbridge has passive cooling only (courtesy of Zalman ZM-NB32) and a Geforce 3. The last one produces a lot of heat...

I almost always run a United Devices distributed computing client (running right now); here are my temps:
room: 24 C
case: 34 C
cpu: 48 C

Both the case and CUP temps are rather high. But the CPU is perfectly stable - even slightly overclocked, with lowered core voltage and under full load. Also, the 2 front intake fans run at reduced speed (since the case allows you to select from H, M and L speeds)

It's a lenghty reply, but I guess the answer to your question is - a Papst 8412NGML on Alpha PAL8045 will do a fine job cooling an XP1600+. I?m guessing 8412NGL would probably also work.

However, don't expect your PC to be silent. Sure, my rig is pretty quiet compared to an average PC. But you'd be surprised how fast you get used to lower noise! When I first got the Barracuda ATA IV hard drives, I couldn't tell they were in there. Now I can easily make out head acivity. Same goes for quiet fans. When I first switched to Panaflos from Sanons I used to have, I was amazed at how much quieter the computer got. But again ? I quickly got used to the lower noise level... I guess sound suppressing materials are going to have to be my next step in my quest for a ?Quiet High Performance PC?

Michael

 

[cookieman]

Hi!

I can only say that the Papast are very good. I own one.

Go look at their site and find out the parameters of every PAPST fan they made. For every FAN there is a diagram that shows the
variation of the fan speed and CFM eficiency to the air pressure.

You can download the PDF file here

Cheers,

 

[oakfan]

So now the question is where do you buy Papst fans from. I took a quick look and could find very few places that sold them & they had poor selections.

 

[Kipper]

<< So now the question is where do you buy Papst fans from. I took a quick look and could find very few places that sold them & they had poor selections. >>



This is exactly the problem. This is why you're probably better off with Panaflo - nearly the same quality, but they are easier to find and there is a better range of fans available - high CFM, low CFM...you get the idea.

 

[Egrimm]

<<

<< So now the question is where do you buy Papst fans from. I took a quick look and could find very few places that sold them & they had poor selections. >>

This is exactly the problem. This is why you're probably better off with Panaflo - nearly the same quality, but they are easier to find and there is a better range of fans available - high CFM, low CFM...you get the idea. >>



Papst actually has an okay selection of fans (both high and low cfm), here's the 80mm I can get from a danish web-bstore (that always has all of 'em in stock by the way, but since it's danish I don't know if it ships outside Denmark, doesn't mention that they do on their site):
8412NGL (Ultra Low Noise, 12dba/19,4cfm)
8412NGML (Low Noise, 19dba/26,5cfm)
8412NGM (High Output,26dba/34,1cfm)
8412NGH (Ultra High Output, 37dba/46,5cfm) have three of these in my case, are less loud than the 7000rpm fan on my old DragnOrb3 and 1 80mm noname case fan and 1 90mm noname case fan.

I think that's an acceptable range of fans, don't know if they make more 80mm but I can live with that selection. As for the fans, I like mine a lot, not much more noisy than my old noname 80mm noname fans but moves much more air, that's also the only reason the little more noise.

 

[Strafe]

I remember reading a post from Joe @ procooling.com that Panaflo's could not sustain static pressure as well as a Papst. May be a personal observation but it's good enough for me.

 

[VatriX]

You can get Papst fans here:

Papst

They are expensive tho

 

[VatriX]

Sorry, forgot to mention

I'm personally going to Get an Alpha 8045 and one of these fans.

Its quiet and if the temps get too high you can increase the CFM to 32 witch should be enough for most summer days.

 

[Strych9]

Papst's are good but why pay that kinda money when you can get Panaflo L1A's for less than 3 bucks each.

 

[cookieman]

Hi!

I don't know about Panaflo but owning a Papst 80mm fan I can see the
manifacturing diference that went into it comparing to all case fans that I have (3 different types). A lot of very small
differences but making a big diference overall.

It is looking very carefully designed in every aspect of it.
I guess that's what is called quality. That's why is so expensive. Also look at the company that makes it. It seem that they have a very big experince in making fans and motors of every size...

Having downloaded the FAN catalog myself I can only say that every fan is very carefully documented and that tells something about the product's quality aswell. Too bad they make only FANS and motors...

Cheers,

BTW: Maybe I can find a job at their Marketing department If I ever quit the programming job I have now

 

[FlowerMan]

Papsts are expensive because they are rare.

US retailers:

www.sotrickcomputers.com
www.heatsinkfactory.com

 

[Woody419]

Add Plycon to the list of Papst 8412NGL suppliers.

 

[mchomicz]

Wow, this is some price you found! Thank you, thank you, thank you! And I thought I got a deal when I got a bunch of these for $8 a pop...

I think I have to agree - having experienced both Panalflos and Papst fans in my case, I'd say that given the price of $3 per fan contrasted with $15 I paid for each of my Papst 8412NGL, if I were to do it all over again, I would go for Panaflo fans instead - given they are FIVE times cheaper...

Michael

 

[FlowerMan]

umm... I still prefer Papsts over Panaflo, given the price. They are simply the best fans you can get. I just happened to get a great deal on my 2 92mms...

 

[tazdevl]

strafe that's the biggest pile of crap I have heard. The Panaflo has directional fins and has no problem maintaning pressure.

 

[mchomicz]

I have been buying my Papst fans from a company called Interior Electronics in British Columbia, Canada (I live in Boston, MA, USA). I think they sell mostly electronic components (not computer specific). But as long as they have Papst fans - that's all I care about. Note that their fans are "untailed." You will need to do that part yourself. Also, orders take forever because once you tell them what you want, they order the stuff from their supplier and only sell you your products once they have them in stock. On the bright side though, they can get almost any Papst fan and they have pretty good prices (8412NGL goes for around US$15). So with a little patience you can deck your case out with Papst fans!

Contact larry@interior.bc.ca for info and tell him Michael send you No, I don't have any deal going with him.

Good luck!
Michael

 

[Phunktion]

<< strafe that's the biggest pile of crap I have heard. The Panaflo has directional fins and has no problem maintaning pressure. >>



I agree with you completely..

Panaflo's have no trouble with pressure due to their design but I do know that the PCP&C Silencers do have a problem with pressure because of their design and work well as case fans but not for heatsinks due to that..

 

[Dannik]

Whoops... this thing has a grand total CFM of 5... DON'T GET IT!

Papst fan for $3.50: http://www.mpja.com/product.asp?product=12910+FN

Not sure which model it is as it only states 412F

 

[GiZzO]

Cause that is a 40mm fan Dannik

From me i study these fans all the time, my favorite is Papst, and Panaflo somewhere much lower down my line of my favorite fan manufactures. It would be:

For Low Speed 80mm...... (usually same lineup follows in different sizes exception too PCP&C since there only in 80mm)
Papst
Nidec
Sanyo Denki
AddA
PCP&C
...Then Panaflo

If you can get a hold if the good Papst fans, the one plycon sells is is so no noticable difference from its 8412NGML in noise, you might as well get the Panaflo L1a instead and get better temps. But if you can get a hold the Papst 8412NGML get that, also might wanna consider PCP&C which are a easy find, they are also low pressure. They are pretty cheap too if you factor in free shipping.



GiZzO's Fan Database Page

 

[mchomicz]

>If you can get a hold if the good Papst fans,

In spite of "urban legends" that would have you believe otherwise, getting hold of Papst fans is not an issue... If you live in North America, email larry@interior.bc.ca and ask if they can get what you want. They can get quite a large assortment of Papst fans, certainly all of the ultra-low noise sleeve baring fans. It just takes some time to complete the order...

Michael

 

[Ausone]

Michael,

I'm thinking of building my second box with Lian-li PC60USB case. Although their stock Ada fans might be quiet if run at the lowest level, I'm thinking of replacing them with Papst fans. One potential problem is Papst fans that I'll be getting from noisecontrol.de, are four-pinned, whereas two front fans of Lian-li box seem to have two-pin connections, which I haven't confirmed yet. I suppose this wasn't the problem for you since you bought untailed fans, but I wonder if you could tell me what types of connectors are needed for front and rear case fans for Lian-li PC60USB.

Also let me ask you if replacing Adda fans with Papst ones makes a noticeable difference.


It seems the place you order Papst fans from offers better price, but I don't like to tail fans Besides, there are other things I like to order from noisecontrol, like Enermax premodded with Papst fans, Magic Fleece and more Papst fans for my existing box, which is Chenbro Genie with two 120mm & 90mm PanafloL1As (total of four fans), running at 7V. As far as Enermax is concerned, you can replace its fans by yourself, but it looks a bit troublesome for me since I don't have an quipment for soldering.


TIA

 

[mchomicz]

>Although their stock Ada fans might be quiet if run at the lowest level, I'm thinking of replacing them with Papst fans.
Note that only the 2 front fans have speed control. The one in the rear of the case does not.

> whereas two front fans of Lian-li box seem to have two-pin connections
Actually, it has a 3 pin connectors for the 2 front fans. However, power is provided to the whole assembly (i.e. fan power connectors, resistors and the speed switch) via a 4 pin connector. So if you have fans with 4 pin connectors, you can still connect set them up in your case; you just forgo the speed control feature provided to you by the case. Of course there are many places where you can buy connector adapters that will allow you to hook your 4-pin fans to 3-pin connectors at the front of the case.

>what types of connectors are needed for front and rear case fans for Lian-li PC60USB
For front ? see above. The back fan plugs into the motherboard (if you have a fan power socket on your board) and I?m pretty sure one 3 to 4 pin connector is supplied with the case so you can plug the 3 pin rear case fan into a regular 4 pin Molex connector. I say I?m pretty sure, because I no longer remember which parts come with the case, which with the power supply and which with the motherboard. In any case ? connector adapters are easy to come by in most computer stores. And if you plan to replace stock fans with Papst fans tailed with 4 pin connectors ? this is not an issue any way.

>Also let me ask you if replacing Adda fans with Papst ones makes a noticeable difference.
Huge! But as I said in one of my previous posts, I got used to the lower noise level very fast and am looking into ways of making the case even quieter.

>It seems the place you order Papst fans from offers better price, but I don't like to tail fans
Well, it?s not hard. It requires no soldering and it can be done with ?professional? quality results with a tool that you can pick up for $10 at Radio Shack (I?m assuming you live in the US?) But it?s a personal choice

>As far as Enermax is concerned, you can replace its fans by yourself, but it looks a bit troublesome for me since I don't have an quipment for soldering.
Actually, I replaced stock fans in my Enermax power supply without any soldering. It turns out the fans are were not soldered in but rather plugged in using 2 pin connectors. I wasn?t able to find the right connectors (it?s a long story) but managed to pull it off with some heat-shrink tubing and regular 3-pin connectors.

Michael

 

[Ausone]

Thanks a lot for your reply, Michael. It clarified everything that I wanted to know about Lian-li PC60 but could not just by reading its reviews.