PC Client shipments in free fall Q1.

[Phynaz]

As the article says:

"The company is finally realizing things have changed for the long term," he said, "and they've shifted the focus of the company."

Desktop is dead. Long live the desktop.

 

[poohbear]

Why r u guys having this conversation now? It's been beaten to death in all the enthusiast forums. Intel themselves said they're not focusing on performance anymore. It's all about efficiency and battery life since sandy bridge. Mobile is king. Survey after survey shows the the avg person does NOT care for anything other than MS Office & websurfing. U don't even need an i3 to do stuff like that. Is it any surprise that pc shipments started declining after the emergence of the smartphone in the late 2000s? It's a given. Be happy u don't have to update ur CPU every 2-3 generations. I'm planning on keeping my 4790k until 2021 at the very least! I'll upgrade my GPU & SSD plenty of times till then. Otherwise I'm content.

 

[Ketchup]

Why r u guys having this conversation now? It's been beaten to death in all the enthusiast forums. Intel themselves said they're not focusing on performance anymore....

The article in the OP was published the day the thread was started, and is not about performance, it's about sales. Now, the key is to answer the question "why are sales falling?". I did read some posters here points out the lack of petformance increase as the cause, and maybe that's what you are pointing to (you didn't specify). But I maintain that software is no longer demanding better hardware in the PC segment. So with no strong competition, and no real need for it, it should be no wonder that Intel is changing its focus. You are correct, however in the sense that information in the article should be old news, but strangely is presented in a way that it doesn't seem to be.

 

[IntelUser2000]

I think performance increases will help. Probably not fix the underlying issue, which is likely that income disparity is hurting average folks and really, no one needs faster computers. Need drives real sales. No marketing needed.

But more importantly, they need massive performance increases on PC for one reason: So they don't need to cripple Atom and make it more competitive in Smartphones/Tablets. They are artificiallly crippling them. Core chips are getting 5% annually. Few years ago they were "promising" that Core chips would always have the 2x gap from Atom.

How do you keep 2x gap between Core and Atom when Core isn't improving?

 

[cbn]

How do you keep 2x gap between Core and Atom when Core isn't improving?

That gap only refers to IPC, if we consider the design parameter for single thread the gap is 3.5X.

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2453365&highlight=

 

[VirtualLarry]

That gap only refers to IPC, if we consider the design parameter for single thread the gap is 3.5X.

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2453365&highlight=

If that's true, why don't they use a single-core SKL with HT, in budget tablets and laptops?

Could it be, that "moar cores" sells to the average joe at walmart, and that if they were presented with a 2.0Ghz Skylake single-core with HT, or a quad-core Cherry Trail (no HT), same clock speed, that "Joe" would pick the quad-core, pretty-much every time?

Which is quite contrary to what ShintaiDK claims, that the average joe doesn't care about core count. I disagree. They may not understand the usefulness of multi-cores versus IPC and ST performance, but they do understand the number 4 is higher than 1.

When Zen 8-core computers start showing up at Walmart, then we'll really know what Joe sixpack prefers.

 

[ShintaiDK]

Which is quite contrary to what ShintaiDK claims, that the average joe doesn't care about core count. I disagree. They may not understand the usefulness of multi-cores versus IPC and ST performance, but they do understand the number 4 is higher than 1.

When Zen 8-core computers start showing up at Walmart, then we'll really know what Joe sixpack prefers.

They can buy 8 cores FX today. Doesn't move any. Zen wont do anything.

So if your theory would be true, the change would already be showing. In other words, "moar cores" doesn't sell PCs.

 

[gorion]

They can buy 8 cores FX today. Doesn't move any. Zen wont do anything.

So if your theory would be true, the change would already be showing. In other words, "moar cores" doesn't sell PCs.

It's also a matter of availability.
How many different AMD notebooks are phisically available in stores?

Also marketing plays its role. Intel = good, AMD = less good is a common refrain that average Joe quickly learn to know.
That's why even if AMD was clearly better I'm not so sure AMD sales would be higher than 50% of market.

 

[frozentundra123456]

Shintai, you are starting to get some signature worthy quotes going here, especially if Zen is even a half decent product.

And obviously, the reason FX doesn't sell well, is not that it is 8 cores, but that the 8 cores are slow and use too much energy.

 

[frozentundra123456]

If that's true, why don't they use a single-core SKL with HT, in budget tablets and laptops?

Snip

Because Atom is cheap, and they have to find some place to get rid of it??

 

[ShintaiDK]

Shintai, you are starting to get some signature worthy quotes going here, especially if Zen is even a half decent product.

And obviously, the reason FX doesn't sell well, is not that it is 8 cores, but that the 8 cores are slow and use too much energy.

So now you say "moar cores" wont increase sales.

Tell me what Zen will change that will somehow do what Intel cant do and change the course of the PC segment and go against the global trends.

 

[ShintaiDK]

It's also a matter of availability.
How many different AMD notebooks are phisically available in stores?

Also marketing plays its role. Intel = good, AMD = less good is a common refrain that average Joe quickly learn to know.
That's why even if AMD was clearly better I'm not so sure AMD sales would be higher than 50% of market.

Utter BS and bad excuses.

 

[nerp]

Arachnotronic speaks the truth -- the same truth I tried to explain here but was misunderstood and attacked. Enthusiasts are a tiny segment of the market and no matter what we think, do, buy or believe, nothing will increase desktop PC shipments.

 

[gorion]

Utter BS and bad excuses.

So you know it all.
Good.

I guess you also think people would buy an Opel/Hyundai over a BMW should the Opel/Hyundai be technologically and aestethically better.

Or that people buy an iPhone only because they checked the benchmarks.

By the way, availability is key. Just ask any retailer.

 

[frozentundra123456]

So now you say "moar cores" wont increase sales.

Tell me what Zen will change that will somehow do what Intel cant do and change the course of the PC segment and go against the global trends.

I did not say more cores will not increase sales. I dont know how you twisted my post into that. What I said is more slow, inefficient cores will not increase sales.

Zen alone will clearly not reverse the downward trend in PC sales. However, one can hope that it offers move value for the money in certain segments, and might you know, force Intel to offer more value as well. I know it is a foreign concept to you that Intel might have to actually do something to accomodate the consumer instead of increasing margins, but it actually could happen. Best case, it could actually force intel to introduce a mainstream hex core, or at least cut prices on the server rejects they pawn off as HEDT, which you love so much.

 

[MiddleOfTheRoad]

Utter BS and bad excuses.

Talk about "Pot Calling The Kettle Black."

 

[IntelUser2000]

That gap only refers to IPC, if we consider the design parameter for single thread the gap is 3.5X.

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2453365&highlight=

You can't include the higher clocked parts, because they achieve that with much higher TDP. At the same TDP, Core M is 2x Atom.

Anyway, none of this matters. Because Intel will do what Intel wants to do.

If anything, the only way out for them I see is if they can bring out potentially paradigm changing technology and apply it to all their lines. Overhaul the compute architecture entirely with future Optane technology?

 

[ShintaiDK]

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/intel-to-shed-12000-jobs-in-pivot-away-from-pcs/

It started with Toshiba cutting 14000 jobs. Now Intel is cutting 12000 jobs. Expect one company after the other this year to keep reducing their staff as production goes down.

 

[pablo87]

Notwithstanding megatrends, you go into stores or online nowadays, its just a panoply of integrated video, winchester based me too skus.

Reminds me of the days when General Motors had 6 brands (Chevrolet, Buick, Oldsmobile, Pontiac, Cadillac and GMC). Interestingly enough, the ones that were the most clearly differentiated - Cadillac and GMC - did the least worst.

 

[Ketchup]

Found a thread yesterday stating that people are ever ditching cable/DSL because they are just using the data that came with their phone. Definitely don't need a desktop for THAT. As I mention in the article, I do wonder if this holds true everywhere, or just in certain areas.

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2470668

I did think of one example of the "freefall" holding back further speed increases, and that lies with Intel. The have a wonderful new GPU, the Intel Iris Pro Graphics 6200. But where can one find it? Only a couple Broadwell models! With Flash and advances in Java and HTML5, this is a great GPU for people buying any Intel system. But sadly, hardly anyone will get the opportunity to use it.

 

[Nothingness]

Another fact reinforcing the point: Mac sales have decreased by 12% in volume YoY (and by 9% in revenue). It's not the first time Mac sales decline YoY (e.g., Q3'13 vs Q3'12), but that's nonetheless worth noting.

 

[StrangerGuy]

Another fact reinforcing the point: Mac sales have decreased by 12% in volume YoY (and by 9% in revenue). It's not the first time Mac sales decline YoY (e.g., Q3'13 vs Q3'12), but that's nonetheless worth noting.

Welcome to peak consumer computing.

 

[Shmee]

I am guessing more people have learned how to build their own. Good for them.

 

[StrangerGuy]

I am guessing more people have learned how to build their own. Good for them.

That's funny, because the last time I checked on Digitimes DIY mobo shipments dropped a massive -21.7% YoY in 2015.

 

[beginner99]

Tell me what Zen will change that will somehow do what Intel cant do and change the course of the PC segment and go against the global trends.

Not things intel can't do but doesn't do: lower price of HEDT systems

Zen could be 6-8 cores cheaper (maybe $50) than Broadwell-e and offer cheaper mainboards with enough PCI-e lanes. The market segmentation from intel with limited PCIe on 5820k is somewhat doubtful. The reason to go HEDT for me but be more PCIe lanes for CF/SLI and PCie SSDs and not core count.

If AMD can offer a HEDT-like platform (enough PCIe lanes) for $100 bucks less (CPU + mobo) at similar performance, that's a win. This $100 can give you a higher tier GPU (or CPU).

It's not sure but with broadwell-e intel doesn't seem to changes anything except offering a more expensive, additional 10-core SKU to the 6,6,8 core ones instead of 6,8,10 core and all with full PCIe enabled.