Performance imporvement of Ivy Bridge vs Sandy Bridge (speculation)

[ydnas7]

SB is a quite radically new architecture for Intel, it may appear to be Westmere tweaked, but fundamentally its a new, new beast, so I would guess there are a few features that were left out in SB but will appear later, possibly starting in IB.

DX 11 to be fully implemented (tessellation currently missing)
better filling of EUs (currently the 4 core, 12 EU die can obviously take 16 EU.)
possible more EUs (rumor also expect a 24 EU unit)
AVX expands to 512 bit then to 1024 bit (its in the roadmap)
rumors about high bandwidth on package memory (shades of IBM POWER thinking and console thinking)
and my own rumor, a duplication of an exec unit so to increase HT performance (but HT off performance stays the same)

so in general, AVX 512, more EUs, on package memory, these all make for for a better graphical experience...

 

[IntelUser2000]

On a tick? No way. Haswell, the Tock on 22nm brings FMA. Doubling of execution units and AVX width would be Haswell at the earliest.

 

[Concillian]

Do you guys think we can see a performance improvement like the one of Sandy Bridge compared to Bloomfield / Lynnfield?

I've currently got an C2D E8500, HD 4870 and 4 GB DDR2, and I'm thinking of an upgrade for better gaming performance. Sandy bridge looks awesome from what the benchmarks show, and I'm wondering whether I should upgrade now or wait for Ivy Bridge. In addition, I have no need for a hex / octo-core, a quad will be just fine. I've so far gotten the impression that the next launch will feature mostly high end parts with 6/8 cores ...?

It will have to be a performance improvement, or Intel will have to change it's pricing structure.

Look at what happened from 45nm C2D to 32nm i3 / i5. The i3 performs at a level equivalent to the E8500-8600 processors, but at about 2/3 the cost.

To do the equivalent for SB --> IB, Intel has to push quads down to the entry level $$$. Are they really going to do that? If you think this is the case, then waiting for IB will give you a lower cost and better power characteristics.

If they choose to keep the current structure (entry level = duals, mid = faster duals, high = quads), then IB must be faster. In this case, you will get more speed for the same $$$.

Waiting is always going to get you something, you just have to weight it against the disadvantages of waiting (living with current platform for the meantime).

 

[PreferLinux]

Well, according to Wikipedia, there will be quads at the entry-level.

 

[ydnas7]

from http://software.intel.com/en-us/avx/
FUNCTIONAL OVERVIEW
Intel AVX and FMA provide comprehensive functional improvements over previous
generations of SIMD instruction extensions. The functional improvements include:
• 256-bit floating-point arithmetic primitives: AVX enhances existing 128-bit
floating-point arithmetic instructions with 256-bit capabilities for floating-point
processing. FMA provides additional set of 256-bit floating-point processing
capabilities with a rich set of fused-multiply-add and fused multiply-subtract
primitives.

I'm wrong about AVX 512 being before FMA, but what SIMD extensions do we expect for IB? (as Intel does SIMD extensions on both ticks and tocks)

 

[Concillian]

Well, according to Wikipedia, there will be quads at the entry-level.

If that's the case, then Ivy it will push price / performance ratio in a good direction for people buying low end quads.

For thosee buying the K chips, Intel will keep them at whatever price point they're at, but they should get some additional headroom from the shrink. So there should be something at both ends, but it's mostly a shrink, so single threaded per-clock should be only a small improvement.

If first release silicon of SB is capable at 4.4-4.7 GHz on air, mature SB revs will improve that, and IB shrink should further improve, so IB could be the first silicon we can reasonably expect 5GHz on an "everyday" modest type OC. I suspect we might be there already with SB duals, but Intel won't let anyone try it.

 

[Relto]

I'd like to grab an SSD, but my chipset is Nvidia based and as such lacks AHCI mode, which would severely hamstring its abilities. I'll likely wait for the next gen vertex3 SSDs to launch and then go ahead and upgrade to a P67 board with Sandy Bridge, and reuse all the other components like my dual gtx280s, PSU, ddr3 ram, etc.

It is tempting to wait for Haswell though...I'm not sure if I can suppress the new hardware itch for another 2 years at least though.

 

[nyker96]

so what is the speculation on the max core count expected on the top end version of IB? are we finally going 8? or 12!?

 

[Dadofamunky]

Owning the newest and greatest is all about wasting money

He said, fat and happy with his 4.6 GHz OC Way to go man!

 

[Idontcare]

I think Ivy Bridge will do more for the mobile sector than the high end desktop sector due to the power improvements that follow new fab scales.

This is my expectation. The shrink for Ivy will be all about minimizing power-consumption at a given level of performance, and maximizing Intel's gross margins at a given SKU ASP.

Higher performance will come for those who overclock or buy the more spendy but higher stock-clocked SKU's, but no serious IPC improvements should be expected from a tick.

 

[dougri]

as long as we're speculating...

I'm betting IB will mirror westmere by not offering a cheap upgrade path to enthusiasts... more cores to locked processors on LGA1155 with better graphics, 8 cores unlocked on i7 extreme for LGA2011. Those buying 2600k hoping to upgrade to a 6 or 8 core unlocked CPU with Ivy Bridge will be disappointed... doubt they'd want a boatload of unlocked chips on the used market to compete with their new offerings. You want unlocked 6 or 8 cores, you say? time to buy LGA2011. Intel has a way of never giving you everything you want

 

[nyker96]

as long as we're speculating...

I'm betting IB will mirror westmere by not offering a cheap upgrade path to enthusiasts... more cores to locked processors on LGA1155 with better graphics, 8 cores unlocked on i7 extreme for LGA2011. Those buying 2600k hoping to upgrade to a 6 or 8 core unlocked CPU with Ivy Bridge will be disappointed... doubt they'd want a boatload of unlocked chips on the used market to compete with their new offerings. You want unlocked 6 or 8 cores, you say? time to buy LGA2011. Intel has a way of never giving you everything you want

I have heard rumors that Ivy 4 cores will be available to 1155 but 6/8 variants will be 2011 exclusives.

 

[dougri]

I have heard rumors that Ivy 4 cores will be available to 1155 but 6/8 variants will be 2011 exclusives.

likely. although I would not be surprised to see a locked 6 core at lower clock to compete with AMD... probably depends on how successful BD is.

 

[Edrick]

So the consensus here seems to be that there should be no real reason to upgrade to a 4 core IB from a 4 core SB (unless using the IGP and need DX11).

 

[Makaveli]

Owning the newest and greatest is all about wasting money

You shouldn't be making those assumptions when you don't know everyones budget

 

[Makaveli]

Upgrade when your games don't run as well as you'd like them.

This pretty much has worked for me the last few years. However these days I do alot more processor intensive stuff so games alone are only half the story.

 

[Goi]

As a newb sometimes I have to ask, how fast is fast enough?

I can understand upgrading so that you can play your favorite game with every option maxed out but it does seem that some are just going for the best benchmark score...?

I'm still on my 2.5 year old C2Q9450, and performance wise I'm not seeing a need to upgrade yet