Originally posted by: BudAshes
Originally posted by: foghorn67
Originally posted by: Atheus
Originally posted by: nkgreen
Originally posted by: Atheus
Originally posted by: daniel1113
"An 8-year-old boy died after accidentally shooting himself in the head while firing an Uzi submachine gun under adult supervision at a gun fair."
"An 8-year-old boy died after accidentally swerving off the track while driving a go kart under adult supervision at a racing fair."
Yawn. Shit happens. This is no different than any other accident.
/edit: anti-American comments removed to avoid flame war
suffice to say you're a fool. clearly an uzi is orders of magniture more dangerous than a go-cart, and you have to draw a line somewhwhere - you'd let a kid fly a jet?
Is it more dangerous than a swimming pool?
Errr... of course... are you being sarcastic?
no. Look up the stats on kids drowning in swimming pools.
this the stupidest thing i have ever read on atot. You do realize there are 10's of millions of children that swim in pools while .000000001% of kids(rough estimate) fire uzi's.
This is my problem with guns, it seems the dumber you are the more guns you want. They should require an iq test before you can get anything more than a pistol/shotgun.
Originally posted by: Atheus
Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
Originally posted by: Atheus
Originally posted by: nkgreen
Originally posted by: Atheus
Originally posted by: daniel1113
"An 8-year-old boy died after accidentally shooting himself in the head while firing an Uzi submachine gun under adult supervision at a gun fair."
"An 8-year-old boy died after accidentally swerving off the track while driving a go kart under adult supervision at a racing fair."
Yawn. Shit happens. This is no different than any other accident.
/edit: anti-American comments removed to avoid flame war
suffice to say you're a fool. clearly an uzi is orders of magniture more dangerous than a go-cart, and you have to draw a line somewhwhere - you'd let a kid fly a jet?
Is it more dangerous than a swimming pool?
Errr... of course... are you being sarcastic?
Really?
Firearms outnumber swimming pools in the US by 30:1 (that is, there are 30 times as many guns as there are swimming pools). However, for children under 13, the ratio of pool deaths to gun deaths is 11:1. So, there are fewer pools, but more children die in pools than die from firearms.
Statistically the pools are more dangerous.
ZV
You're missing the point - it's not how many guns exist, it's how many < 13 year olds fire them. Very few I bet.
Also, there is every reason for a child of that age to learn to swim - they may need it at any time. A child should never need an automatic weapon and there is no reason to train them in their use, at least not until they are much older than 8, therefore this is not a good risk to take.
I would also point out that this kid was clearly NOT trained in it's use anyway, so it's analagous to putting a kid in a pool who DOESN'T KNOW HOW TO SWIM... what are the stats for that I wonder...
Originally posted by: pontifex
Originally posted by: Atheus
Originally posted by: SphinxnihpS
A boy dies and the anti-gun idiots are out in full force. Sick.
You don't think there is an arguement for gun control here? You think the boy (8 years old) should have been allowed to fire the weapon?
that has nothing to do with gun control, at least not in your context.
Originally posted by: Atheus
Originally posted by: pontifex
Originally posted by: Atheus
Originally posted by: SphinxnihpS
A boy dies and the anti-gun idiots are out in full force. Sick.
You don't think there is an arguement for gun control here? You think the boy (8 years old) should have been allowed to fire the weapon?
that has nothing to do with gun control, at least not in your context.
What's my context? I believe this gun should have been under control, i.e. nowhere near children - that's gun control.
Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
...
Finally, a firearm, in and of itself, presents no danger to anyone. The danger only exists in how the firearm is used. Used irresponsibly (e.g. an Uzi in the hands of an 8 year old) they are dangerous. Used responsibly, they are not. Just like kitchen knives.
...
ZV
Originally posted by: pontifex
true, a child should never need to fire a gun, but we don't live in fairyland, now do we?
besides, guns aren't just about killing. thats the thing that you anti-gun nuts don't get. shooting guns at targets is a very fun hobby.
Originally posted by: pontifex
Originally posted by: sdifox
Originally posted by: mooseracing
Originally posted by: sdifox
Originally posted by: SphinxnihpS
A boy dies and the anti-gun idiots are out in full force. Sick.
Err, I am against irrisponsible people having guns. The Uzi owner was definitely irrisponsible. Or do you think he was in the right?
So I suppose you are for everyone haveing to wait the x amount of days with the possibillity to be denined to buy a pistol as well? Even though by your right as an American citizen you are allowed to own one. And it's not like if the person is denined they can't get a gun.
If you want to talk irresponsible look at how many irresponsible parents there are yet they still have their kids in their possesion, they are still allowed to reproduce and they are still alive. Or auto drivers?
What are you talking about? I am talking about the gun owner being irresponsible handing a uzi to an 8 year old. Stop projecting your own prejudice.
The only regulation I would stipulate in light of this is "Do not hand a weapon to someone not licensed for that class of weapon."
I am against all irrisponsible behaviours, we just happen to be talking about gun death.
so now we have to get licensed to be able to shoot different types of guns???? dumb idea.
Originally posted by: the unknown
Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
...
Finally, a firearm, in and of itself, presents no danger to anyone. The danger only exists in how the firearm is used. Used irresponsibly (e.g. an Uzi in the hands of an 8 year old) they are dangerous. Used responsibly, they are not. Just like kitchen knives.
...
ZV
How is a gun not inherently more dangerous that a knife? A knife is a tool, used to eat. When you miss with a knife, you cut your finger, not seriously injure or kill yourself. With intent, a knife definitely takes more work and motivation than just pulling a trigger. It's also quite a bit harder to use against someone who's running, or even fighting back. Guns have only one purpose. In its recreational use, most of the thrill comes from that power to kill-- the destruction. Definitely enjoyable, but not dangerous? Don't kid yourself.
Originally posted by: Atheus
Originally posted by: mugs
Guns don't make people kill other people, they're just a tool that get the job done.
In many cases that's true - if you set out to kill someone you're gonna do it regardless of weapon, but what about this situation:
A young man, possibly not the bravest or smartest young man, is in a threatening situation. He is carrying a firearm. Someone comes over and insults him and tries to pick a fight. Does this man fight with his fists and possibly go home with a broken nose? Or does he fire that weapon out of fear?
Originally posted by: ScottyB
Who gets the Darwin award? Father or son?
Originally posted by: nkgreen
Originally posted by: the unknown
Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
...
Finally, a firearm, in and of itself, presents no danger to anyone. The danger only exists in how the firearm is used. Used irresponsibly (e.g. an Uzi in the hands of an 8 year old) they are dangerous. Used responsibly, they are not. Just like kitchen knives.
...
ZV
How is a gun not inherently more dangerous that a knife? A knife is a tool, used to eat. When you miss with a knife, you cut your finger, not seriously injure or kill yourself. With intent, a knife definitely takes more work and motivation than just pulling a trigger. It's also quite a bit harder to use against someone who's running, or even fighting back. Guns have only one purpose. In its recreational use, most of the thrill comes from that power to kill-- the destruction. Definitely enjoyable, but not dangerous? Don't kid yourself.
Yeah, that went straight over your head.
Stop. Take a deep breath, and read what he wrote again.
Originally posted by: the unknown
Originally posted by: nkgreen
Originally posted by: the unknown
Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
...
Finally, a firearm, in and of itself, presents no danger to anyone. The danger only exists in how the firearm is used. Used irresponsibly (e.g. an Uzi in the hands of an 8 year old) they are dangerous. Used responsibly, they are not. Just like kitchen knives.
...
ZV
How is a gun not inherently more dangerous that a knife? A knife is a tool, used to eat. When you miss with a knife, you cut your finger, not seriously injure or kill yourself. With intent, a knife definitely takes more work and motivation than just pulling a trigger. It's also quite a bit harder to use against someone who's running, or even fighting back. Guns have only one purpose. In its recreational use, most of the thrill comes from that power to kill-- the destruction. Definitely enjoyable, but not dangerous? Don't kid yourself.
Yeah, that went straight over your head.
Stop. Take a deep breath, and read what he wrote again.
Yes, a lot of what I said does agree with him. However, when reading it again, specifically the bolded points, I think my argument still stands.
Originally posted by: Atheus
Originally posted by: pontifex
true, a child should never need to fire a gun, but we don't live in fairyland, now do we?
What?
besides, guns aren't just about killing. thats the thing that you anti-gun nuts don't get. shooting guns at targets is a very fun hobby.
I've shot plenty. Yea it's fun. So that means kids should fire uzis does it?
Originally posted by: the unknown
In its recreational use, most of the thrill comes from that power to kill-- the destruction.
Originally posted by: pontifex
Originally posted by: Atheus
Originally posted by: pontifex
true, a child should never need to fire a gun, but we don't live in fairyland, now do we?
What?
besides, guns aren't just about killing. thats the thing that you anti-gun nuts don't get. shooting guns at targets is a very fun hobby.
I've shot plenty. Yea it's fun. So that means kids should fire uzis does it?
wow...you talk about people taking your comments out of context and what not, but yet you post this???
Originally posted by: the unknown
Originally posted by: nkgreen
Originally posted by: the unknown
Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
...
Finally, a firearm, in and of itself, presents no danger to anyone. The danger only exists in how the firearm is used. Used irresponsibly (e.g. an Uzi in the hands of an 8 year old) they are dangerous. Used responsibly, they are not. Just like kitchen knives.
...
ZV
How is a gun not inherently more dangerous that a knife? A knife is a tool, used to eat. When you miss with a knife, you cut your finger, not seriously injure or kill yourself. With intent, a knife definitely takes more work and motivation than just pulling a trigger. It's also quite a bit harder to use against someone who's running, or even fighting back. Guns have only one purpose. In its recreational use, most of the thrill comes from that power to kill-- the destruction. Definitely enjoyable, but not dangerous? Don't kid yourself.
Yeah, that went straight over your head.
Stop. Take a deep breath, and read what he wrote again.
Yes, a lot of what I said does agree with him. However, when reading it again, specifically the bolded points, I think my argument still stands.
Originally posted by: the unknown
The thrill. Yes developing a skill generated a deep sense of accomplishment, especially achieving very good results. But to a 8 year old kid, its just a cheap thrill now isn't it?
Originally posted by: Atheus
Originally posted by: pontifex
Originally posted by: Atheus
Originally posted by: pontifex
true, a child should never need to fire a gun, but we don't live in fairyland, now do we?
What?
besides, guns aren't just about killing. thats the thing that you anti-gun nuts don't get. shooting guns at targets is a very fun hobby.
I've shot plenty. Yea it's fun. So that means kids should fire uzis does it?
wow...you talk about people taking your comments out of context and what not, but yet you post this???
I responded on the same level as your own post - you made a fatuous comment about 'fairlyand' and claimed I was an 'anti-gun nut' whos never fired a shot in his life, which I am not.
My point is that nothing you've said in any way justifies the weapon being given to the child. I bet you wouldn't give an uzi to an eight year old yourself right? You're just giving stock responses to a steriotype you wrongly believe I embody.
Originally posted by: pontifex
Originally posted by: Atheus
Originally posted by: pontifex
Originally posted by: Atheus
Originally posted by: pontifex
true, a child should never need to fire a gun, but we don't live in fairyland, now do we?
What?
besides, guns aren't just about killing. thats the thing that you anti-gun nuts don't get. shooting guns at targets is a very fun hobby.
I've shot plenty. Yea it's fun. So that means kids should fire uzis does it?
wow...you talk about people taking your comments out of context and what not, but yet you post this???
I responded on the same level as your own post - you made a fatuous comment about 'fairlyand' and claimed I was an 'anti-gun nut' whos never fired a shot in his life, which I am not.
My point is that nothing you've said in any way justifies the weapon being given to the child. I bet you wouldn't give an uzi to an eight year old yourself right? You're just giving stock responses to a steriotype you wrongly believe I embody.
i would say stop posting before you make yourself look like a dumbass, but it's way too late for that.
i never claimed any of those things. i never once said an 8 year old should be handed an uzi, nor do i think it was right either. you should take a look at what you post before you accuse other people of doing the same thing.
true, a child should never need to fire a gun, but we don't live in fairyland, now do we?
Originally posted by: pontifex
guns aren't just about killing. thats the thing that you anti-gun nuts don't get. shooting guns at targets is a very fun hobby.
Originally posted by: the unknown
Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
...
Finally, a firearm, in and of itself, presents no danger to anyone. The danger only exists in how the firearm is used. Used irresponsibly (e.g. an Uzi in the hands of an 8 year old) they are dangerous. Used responsibly, they are not. Just like kitchen knives.
...
ZV
How is a gun not inherently more dangerous that a knife? A knife is a tool, used to eat. When you miss with a knife, you cut your finger, not seriously injure or kill yourself. With intent, a knife definitely takes more work and motivation than just pulling a trigger. It's also quite a bit harder to use against someone who's running, or even fighting back. Guns have only one purpose. In its recreational use, most of the thrill comes from that power to kill-- the destruction. Definitely enjoyable, but not dangerous? Don't kid yourself.
edit: And clearly, that power to kill should not be given to anyone that doesn't even have the mental capacity to make fully rational decisions. I'm fairly sure at 8 most of the moral and higher abstract thinking development is not completed. I think that's important to have before choosing for your kid to fire a gun. Let him go through that metal process so he can decide whether its cool and fun or not; instead of having the father choose for him.