Phenom II x4 960T Zosma Bottlenecking AMD Radeon HD 7850 OC for Gaming?

[AtenRa]

Plus I can pretty much attack the credibility of his personal blog all I want.

minitron, you getting it too personal.

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=60552

1) No trolling, flaming or personally attacking members. Deftly attacking ideas and backing up arguments with facts is acceptable and encouraged. Attacking other members personally and purposefully causing trouble with no motive other than to upset the crowd is not allowed.

This is my final warning, next time i will report you.

Please just use the report feature in the future, rather than using it as a threat (there were several reports though, generated from others.) Though, thanks for posting a link to the rules to him. I'm sorry none of us was available to clean this thread up sooner. -Admin DrPizza

 

[SlowSpyder]

So apparently nobody can provide even one benchmark from a legitimate review site where the Phenom II, overclocked or not, beats the i3-21xx in any game? I guess that's to be expected.

It's also against the TOS to post things that are inaccurate:
Someone should go on vacation for posting biased garbage.

Plus I can pretty much attack the credibility of his personal blog all I want.

You don't even have to leave AT to find that. I just searched the i3 2100 vs. the PhII 965 (hardly the fastest PhII). In AT's own bench the PhII is a bit faster in a few of the games tested. It isn't too hard to imagine BF3 MP, which likes cores, would be faster on a true quadcore (or hex core) compared to the i3.

 

[KingFatty]

I think minitron is making a contribution to this thread. But sometimes he may get a little enthusiastic in his position, and so maybe he succumbs to using logical fallacies like ad hominem attacks, failure to understand burden of proof, and others. So I don't want to see him stifled just because he gets too enthusiastic/emotional when defending his position.

But, maybe just if he gets good feedback to see how to sharpen up how to state his position without being illogical or other fallacies. [group hug]

 

[Hatisherrif]

I think minitron is making a contribution to this thread. But sometimes he may get a little enthusiastic in his position, and so maybe he succumbs to using logical fallacies like ad hominem attacks, failure to understand burden of proof, and others. So I don't want to see him stifled just because he gets too enthusiastic/emotional when defending his position.

But, maybe just if he gets good feedback to see how to sharpen up how to state his position without being illogical or other fallacies. [group hug]

Let's agree to disagree.

 

[frozentundra123456]

BF3 FX performance? There you go:

Even Athlon II X4 @ 3.1Ghz is better than i3 2120. This is with GTX 580 (second fastest GPU on the market) so GPU is not a bottleneck.

How can you say it is not GPU bottlenecked when the fastest to slowest CPU varies by only a couple of frames per second. I dont care what the card is, that is the classic pattern of a GPU bottleneck.

 

[minitron]

minitron, you getting it too personal.

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=60552



This is my final warning, next time i will report you.

Let me make this very clear. Your blog is absolute crap and is purposely misleading.

You don't even have to leave AT to find that. I just searched the i3 2100 vs. the PhII 965 (hardly the fastest PhII). In AT's own bench the PhII is a bit faster in a few of the games tested. It isn't too hard to imagine BF3 MP, which likes cores, would be faster on a true quadcore (or hex core) compared to the i3.

1-2 fps does not count. I have shown multiple instances where the i3 is significantly faster than Phenom II in gaming. I have yet to see one bench from a credible review site that shows the Phenom II is significantly faster in any game, overclocked or not.

Let me make this very clear. Personal attacks are not permitted here. Since you've received two warnings in the past 4 days, I'm issuing a 24 hour "vacation" from posting here. When you're again able to post, please pay attention to the rules about personal attacks, thread-derailing, and flame-baiting. Thank you. edit: 23h20m, close enough.
-Admin DrPizz

 

[CKXP]

Anand's forums have become such a complete joke, I guess thread crapping and derailing are acceptable.

They are not acceptable. Apologies in any delay in addressing it in this thread. We're not all on 24/7. -Admin DrPizza

 

[Hatisherrif]

Anand's forums have become such a complete joke, I guess thread crapping and derailing are acceptable.

The fake passport spam is much better than this.

 

[Phynaz]

Let me make this very clear. Your blog is absolute crap and is purposely misleading.

1-2 fps does not count. I have shown multiple instances where the i3 is significantly faster than Phenom II in gaming. I have yet to see one bench from a credible review site that shows the Phenom II is significantly faster in any game, overclocked or not.

Can a mod take out the trash please?

 

[inf64]

Maybe mods are on a summer break so minitrol is taking the advantage of this XD.

 

[SlowSpyder]

Let me make this very clear. Your blog is absolute crap and is purposely misleading.

1-2 fps does not count. I have shown multiple instances where the i3 is significantly faster than Phenom II in gaming. I have yet to see one bench from a credible review site that shows the Phenom II is significantly faster in any game, overclocked or not.

Great! Then I have satisfied your requirments and your new, edited requirements above. L4D is 5FPS difference. It is 5FPS with a moderate 3.4GHz PhII 965, not a hexcore, not a higher clocked part, not a part with an overclocked NB/L3. The gap will only widen with a faster PhII.

I did my part, so can you please provide benches of an i3 beating a PhII quad or hexcore in BF3 MP? You have claimed that is the case, but provided zero data to back that up. Myself and other posters have given you data that shows BF3 MP likes more than two cores. You have been provided data that shows a PhII can be faster in a gaming situation than the i3 (by more than 1-2FPS). Now, it is on you to show an i3 being faster than the PhII in BF3 MP as you have claimed, if you cannot provide this than you are just spreading fud.

 

[AtenRa]

Although the same FrostBite 2 engine is used as in BF3, the final build may have different CPU scaling. But i will just leave this here for now.

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2258302

Im sure it will be dismissed because it is an "alpha" and not from a reputable site

 

[infoiltrator]

Both the FX-4100 and the 960T can be found for $110. Looking harder the I3 2120 can be found for $110.

Basically the FX-4100 or 960T (FOR gaming) stop there. they have gaming history at this point but (for gaming) the upgrade path is not very good.

When you reach the I5 2400 at $180 there is no comparison. I am not seeing 980 or comparable chips for all that much less.

Piledriver is due shortly, but so is/are I3 Ivy Bridge.

Many people are happy gaming with Phenoms/ FX chips (dare I say Athlons?).
There have been enough adjustments to/for FX use that they are not bad, just second place.
Your reasons are your own. Benchmarks are not gaming.
I prefer the upgrade path of I3 to any imediate advantage of FX-4100.
but. I see no reason not to enjoy an FX-4100 and overclocking it (just be aware of the "hidden cost" of an aftermarket cooler to achieve high overclocks).

 

[Mallibu]

Although the same FrostBite 2 engine is used as in BF3, the final build may have different CPU scaling. But i will just leave this here for now.

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2258302

Im sure it will be dismissed because it is an "alpha" and not from a reputable site

According to this, a Phenom II 955 is 30% faster than i5 760.
Seems legit ().

 

[SlowSpyder]

According to this, a Phenom II 955 is 30% faster than i5 760.
Seems legit ().

The 955 has four hundred MHz on that i5. And my math does not show 132 FPS to be 30% faster than 107 FPS...

 

[SlowSpyder]

Looking at benches of the i5 760, it isn't impossible to see a Phenom being as fast or faster in some games. The 1055t is only 2.8GHz (though a hexcore) and seems to sit around the same speed at the i5 760 in SOME games.

http://www.hardwareheaven.com/revie...nd-ecs-p55h-ak-review-aliens-vs-predator.html

Don't get me wrong, I am confident that the i5 760 is a better overall processor and going to be generally faster than a PhII in gaming. But seeing how close the PhII is in some games, it isn't too hard to imagine a game in the alpha stage being faster on a higher clocked PhII.

 

[Hatisherrif]

A Phenom II 955 is a great processor that nobody should regret buying. I certainly don't. Considering the circumstances at the time when the Phenom was popular, even if the first gen i5 was better in some things, the Phenom was a MUCH better overall CPU. The i5 had a socket of its own with no upgrade path and cost a bit more when you take the motherboard into account.

1st gen I7s did beat the four core Phenoms quite easily in almost everything but gaming, but don't tell me that Phenom wasn't a decent competitor to the i5 at the time.

According to this, a Phenom II 955 is 30% faster than i5 760.
Seems legit ().

Yes, yes it does.

 

[alexruiz]

I cannot believe all the garbage I just missed, which might not be bad after all.
Did minitrol get a vacation? Unfortunately, a lot of regular members are not that far off his attitude, I guess that is why some of us are posting less and less.

But, it is not entirely their fault, Anand and other reviewers are the ones causing this blind fanatism when they boldly proclaim "according to our 800 x 600 low detail benchmarks, this CPU is much better than this one for gaming..." If the reviewers truly want to make a good job highlighting a better "gaming" CPU, they should be finding exactly how much those CPU are affecting gameplay at real life in game settings. I don't care for framerates at 640 x 480, I care about the framerates at the settings that the game will be played... Yeah, like anyone with a GTX680 is going to be pairing it with an i3 and gaming at 800 x 600 low detail "because Anand said it is a better gaming CPU, and I want to take advantage of that!"

Minitrol might be on vacation, but he will be back; and like him, many newer (and veteran) posters will keep trolling "that CPU brand is garbage for gaming" like they already do because the "benchmarks" show so. Thanks Anand and the others for those "reviews"...

 

[tulx]

All this flaming and the occasional valid discussing made me test my setup.
I use an unlocked 960t 6x @ 4GHz paired with two XFX 5870's, slightly OC'ed. I benchmarked BF3 and I'm having 40-60 FPS (64 players, Strike at Karkand, Wake Island, 64 player, all max without AA (don't use it to save VRAM, the cards have 1GB. I don't notice the aliasing too much on a 24'' display)) with one card and 60-120 FPS with two cards.

 

[minitron]

Find me any gaming bench from a legitimate where the 960T is superior to the i3 in any game. You can't seem to do this simple task when there's millions of benchmarks out there for millions of games.

i3 > Phenom II, butthurt?

*Waits for more garbage reviews that says the Phenom II 955 is 30% faster than the i5-760*

Minitron, we've already had a discussion with you about personal attacks and yet here you are again. I have no option but to put you on a new, longer vacation, and to ban you from this thread.
-ViRGE

 

[KingFatty]

Could you clarify your parameters for what constitutes "legitimate"? I believe that is ambiguous enough to enable rampant goalpost moving ("moving the goalposts" is a type of logical fallacy)

 

[minitron]

Could you clarify your parameters for what constitutes "legitimate"? I believe that is ambiguous enough to enable rampant goalpost moving ("moving the goalposts" is a type of logical fallacy)

Anand's, TPU, Tom's, [H], G3D, Xbit, cnet, HWC.

Anything on the first page of Google search.

As in something not obscure or garbage blogs.

 

[tulx]

Find me any gaming bench from a legitimate where the 960T is superior to the i3 in any game. You can't seem to do this simple task when there's millions of benchmarks out there for millions of games.

i3 > Phenom II, butthurt?

*Waits for more garbage reviews that says the Phenom II 955 is 30% faster than the i5-760*

You're missing the point in this discussion - it's about the possibility of a 960t bottlenecking a 7850OC in games. And all sources have proven that that won't happen.
The point is: in gaming, it does not matter if you spend 100€ or 600€ on your CPU. Your GPU will be the weakest link.

 

[minitron]

You're missing the point in this discussion - it's about the possibility of a 960t bottlenecking a 7850OC in games. And all sources have proven that that won't happen.
The point is: in gaming, it does not matter if you spend 100€ or 600€ on your CPU. Your GPU will be the weakest link.

So now there isn't a difference between the 960T and a 3930K.

 

[tulx]

So now there isn't a difference between the 960T and a 3930K.

I said "in gaming, it does not matter if you spend 100€ or 600€ on your CPU."
The OP can pair his 7850OC with a 960t or a 3930K and they'll perform identically in games.