Please have a look at my lifting routine and lifestyle

Aristotelian

Golden Member
Jan 30, 2010
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Dear all,

I'm not sure whether or not this is kosher, but I'd like to ask for your help understanding my lifting routine (gains, and lack thereof), lifestyle, and general place in life as I edge towards what I think will be 'mid life'.

Here is what my lifting looks like - I started in December of 2016 and I am a 36 year old male, 183 cm tall and I weigh roughly 82 kilograms. I am using the Westside for Skinny Bs (3) routine:

Monday: Dynamic Effort Lower Body
(i) Vertical Jump training - about 5 sets of 3 jumps where I basically jump as high as I can and try to have good landing form (my gym does not have boxes for the jumps onto boxes)
(ii) Bulgarian split squats - front leg elevated. I use 6kg of weight in each hand and perform 3 sets of 10 squats for each leg. This is one of my most challenging exercises and I take a decent break between each set because I feel my heart rate skyrocketing during this exercise (it feels harder than deadlifts - more on that later).
(iii) 45 degree hyperextensions - I do 3 sets of 10 repetitions holding a 20kg plate for added difficulty.
(iv) sit-up variations - right now I'm doing 3 sets of about 20 normal sit-ups - I find myself quite tired by this point and the situps are definitely not something I put a lot of effort into because I don't have much left.

Tuesday: Maximum Effort Upper Body
(i) Bench press - I work up through 5 sets roughly like this: 5xbar; 5x bar + 5kg; 5x bar + 7.5 kg; 4x bar + 10kg; 3x bar + 12.5 kg (this is my current maximum). I feel incredibly weak in the bench press in terms of looking at my lifts as a whole, and it takes me quite a while to see gains here.
(ii) incline dumbell bench press (palms out, 30 degree incline): 2 sets of max reps, first set 16 x 10kg (in each hand); second set around 12 x 10kg in each hand.
(iii) Superset - horizontal pulling/rear delt:
I do seated cable rows pulling 50 kg x 10 for 4 sets; and I couple this with seated db power cleans with 8kg x 8 reps for 4 sets. Comment: I've seen big gains in the rows since I started.
(iv) DB Shrugs - I do 4 sets of 10 reps with 18kg in each hand
(v) Zottman curls - I do 4 sets of 10 reps with 8kg in each hand (I find it very hard to increase weight in this exercise)

Thursday: Maximum Effort Lower Body
(i) Deadlifts - I work up to my maximum lift like this: 5x 40kg (plus bar); 5x 50kg; 5x 60kg; 4x 70kg; 3x 80kg. The 80kg feels like quite a limit to me and it's actually hard on my hands, I feel the calloused areas form in the max lift specifically
(ii) Bulgarian split squats - I do 3 sets of 10 reps holding 12.5kg in each hand. As with the dynamic effort lower body day, this seems to really wreck me quickly - and is much harder for me as a movement than deadlifts (unsure if this is normal, or it's because I've just deadlifted...)
(iii) 45 degree hyperextensions - I do 3 sets of 10 reps holding a 20kg plate.
(iv) situps - again, not much to talk about here, 3 sets of around 15 each set. I'm normally gassed completely by this point and the hyperextensions seem to tank my abs too.

Friday: Repetition Upper Body
(i) Chin-ups: I do 3 sets of 10, with 30kg HELP from a plate that my knees rest on.
(ii) Superset - lateral pulldowns + seated db power cleans. I do 4 supersets of 10 reps with 40kg on the lateral pulldown (behind my head) and 8 reps or so with 8kg for the seated db power cleans.
(iii) DB lateral raise - I do 4 sets of about 9 reps each with 4kg in each hand - I find these very difficult
(iv) Traps/Arms superset: DB Shrugs + Zottman curls: I do 4 sets of 10 reps, with 18kg for the shrugs, and 8kg for the Zottman curls. On days where I lower the assistance for chinups, I have to drop the weight for the Zottman curls, e.g. it was to 6kg the first time I did chin-ups with only 30kg help, from the 35kg help I had before.

I don't do the grip training because my grip is already tired from the deadlift day the day before.

On the lifestyle, ever since I started lifting I find I need WAY more sleep. I was asleep last night at 21:30 hours and woke up at 06:25 to get ready for work and it's always a struggle - always. Even with about 9 hours of sleep it always feels like I need more, and I do sleep much more during weekends (if I go to sleep at 22:00 on a Friday night I wake up at 09:00 on Saturday morning naturally without an alarm). Should I be alarmed at the amount of sleep I seem to need?

I do smoke, and I know I should stop. I smoke roughly 4 cigarettes a day, more if I go out drinking during the weekend with buddies.

I try to eat well: on workout days I have a protein shake with 4 tablespoons of organic free range grass fed whey isolate + a bit of magnesium powder, mixed with a chopped plum and half milk/water (I puree it). I have this 1 hour before I work out (lunch time, at 12:30 hours). I eat lunch around 14:00 hours and try to get quality quinoa salads with broccoli, chili, peas, etc from a local vegetarian restaurant, and then try to have a good dinner around 19:00 hours. On my rest days (wednesday, saturday and sunday I am not very active but I do go for hikes with my wife sometime, and I'm more liberal in my diet and do eat cinnabons sometimes or brownies for dessert, or pasta, fried chicken, etc).

I have always been a 'skinny fat' guy with disgusting manboobs, belly fat, and skinny arms. It's something I am trying to change now as I head towards old age, though it's a bit late.

So, this is roughly where I am now guys and gals. If you have any suggestions about the way I'm lifting or living my rather sedentary life please have at it.

Thanking you in advance,
Aristotelian
 

Ancalagon44

Diamond Member
Feb 17, 2010
3,274
202
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So.... first question, what are your goals? Better health in general? Fat loss? Muscle gain?

Second, what sort of advice or comments would you like on your routine/lifestyle?

The reason I ask this is that a lot of routine and lifestyle decisions are personal. For example, you might be a vegetarian. No point in me telling you that you need to eat more meat.

One comment I'll make is that I think it would be better for you to measure the amount of whey protein rather than just using four tablespoons. The reason is, you need to know how much protein you are getting from your whey, otherwise you are wasting your time. Maybe you aren't eating enough protein?

Are you skinny fat now? 83KG is a decent weight for someone your height - depends on much muscle you are carrying though.

As for your sleep, I wouldn't be worried about how much sleep you need, I'd be more worried if you said you were tired the next day. You say you struggle to get out of bed - that's normal, isn't it? Are you tired? Do you feel fatigued?

I'd also be concerned you might be accidentally undereating. Can you do calorie counting for a couple of days? I don't recommend calorie counting in general, but I think its a useful tool to eyeball whether you are eating enough for your needs.
 

Murloc

Diamond Member
Jun 24, 2008
5,382
65
91
How long did you sleep before? Do you make snoring or wheezing or any weird sounds at nights?

Struggling to get out of bed is one thing, but after getting up, washing your face, having breakfast and commuting to work, are you energetic or are you a zombie like some undisciplined people are in the mornings?

I second the idea of making sure you have enough food and energy as a first step to fix your issues. My energy crashes within 1 hour if I skip breakfast and it doesn't recover even if I eat, I'm shit all day.

If there are other reasons for the sleep-but-tired thing, they're usually related to respiration and lack of oxygen at night. So stopping with the cigarettes is a good idea.
If you eliminate systemic issues that keep you unhealthy, a doctor can become much more helpful in identifying the specific issues if it comes to that.
 

snarfbot

Senior member
Jul 22, 2007
385
38
91
youre doing pretty advanced stuff for someone who is so weak, i think your time would be better spent doing a regular ppl routine. for example.

push day:

flat bench, 3 sets, 8-10 reps
overhead dumbbell press, 3 sets, 8-10 reps
body weight dips, 3 sets as many reps as possible.

pull day:

dead lift, 3 sets 8-10 reps
bent over row, 3 sets 8-10 reps
chin ups, 3 sets amrap.

leg day:
squats, 3 sets 8-10 reps
calf raises, 3 sets 8-10 reps
leg curls, 3 sets 8-10 reps.

test your 1 rep max every month or so and keep adding weight to your major lifts until you are benching/squatting/deadlifting 200+ lbs. then you can make your own workout or add some other accessory work.
 

Ancalagon44

Diamond Member
Feb 17, 2010
3,274
202
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Also....

If you ask 100 different body builders on the subject whether to use high weight and low reps, or low weight and high reps, you will get 100 different answers. Sometimes 101.

I will say that, from what I've read, it doesn't matter too much, but using high weight and low reps is generally more time efficient. So, in cases where you are going to 16 or 18 reps, consider dropping to 10 reps but using heavier weights to compensate.

Also, what is the point of doing lateral pull downs after doing chin-ups? Do weighted chin-ups if you need more challenge, don't bother with lat pull-downs.

EDIT: More experienced weight-lifters than me might have a better answer, but if you want to increase bench press weight, lift the heaviest weight you can even if it is for less reps. In other words, I would not bother with the pyramid training where you do 5 reps with just the bar, then 5 reps with bar plus weight, etc etc. Just do a warm set or two - some say do one light warm up set and one warm up set with nearly full load.

I use dumbbells only since I don't have space for barbells. For benchpress, I start with incline benchpress, using 15kg per arm as a warm up. After that, I go to 25kg per arm, as many as I can (currently about 6). After 3 sets of that, I switch to flat dumbbell bench press, where I do another 4 sets of 8 x 25kg per arm.

I used to only be able to do 15kg per arm - took a while to increase, but this routine seems to work for me.
 
Last edited:

desy

Diamond Member
Jan 13, 2000
5,439
211
106
Your doing something, the most important part, your 36 not as much test as if you were 16 so it could take longer, your natural genetics biggest factor here skinny is skinny.
I agree with snarf that you could simplify, good ole 3x10 of the basic heavy lifts until you build a base, should take 2-3 months then tinker.
Otherwise congrats on making a lifestyle change, don't get discouraged
 

purbeast0

No Lifer
Sep 13, 2001
52,931
5,802
126
KISS - keep it simple stupid.

You're trying to do stuff that is way too targeted for where you are in your weight lifting. As mentioned, just go back to basics with basic exercises like bench press, squats, deadlifts, and pullups.

Also pretty much everyone I know who has trouble gaining weight who says they are eating so much food but when they really look at it they aren't and simply eating more puts on size. This is coming from someone who used to say that too and couldn't put on weight, until I actually started trying correctly and eating more.
 

Aristotelian

Golden Member
Jan 30, 2010
1,246
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Thanks a lot for the feedback everyone. I tried using the multi quote capability here to clearly reply but I keep getting an error in the system, so I'll go through them in order:

@Ancalagon44: The goal is to become stronger. Ideally I will melt fat away in the process and look and feel fit. More specifically, and arbitrarily, I'd like to be able to bench my body weight easily; deadlift twice my body weight easily; easily do chinups (even with a weighted vest), jump high, have a basic level of athleticism. I say 'arbitrary' because I've never reached the goals I've just mentioned so I don't know how hard that will be.

I am skinny fat now - I have visible belly rolls and man-boobs, though they are most certainly much smaller since I started this workout plan. I have always had visible belly rolls and man-boobs, even at this height when I weighed 68kg and I ran a marathon (but when I ran the marathon I had no appreciable muscle mass, which is why this workout plan appealed to me - it's designed for skinny weaklings to build overall strength and athleticism).

@Ancalagon44 + Murloc - I've felt 'tired' for a while. I had a brutal 4 year work contract (which was extremely lucrative, at least) where I'd work from around 0800 to 0200 the next morning, barely sleep, drink lots of coffee and smoke at least a pack a day. The cigarettes were a crutch, and a really bad way to make myself feel energetic. I had lots of work stress, conflicts, and existential crises, and my doctor (at that time, when I said I was close to a burnout) stated that I'm sleep deprived and that I shouldn't beat myself up for 'catching up with sleep' since I deprived my body of that for years.

@cbrunny - you're absolutely right. I know how toxic cigarettes are, and it's not like I binge drink but after a day where I do say, lower body max effort, if I go for a beer or two after work it really seems to wreck me. And I'm wondering if, when people take their physical training really seriously, they try to give up alcohol (almost completely, barring a glass of red wine with a nice dinner), sleep a lot more, never smoke, never go for a cinnabon - because this is the way to feed your body and make it know that you're trying to transform it into a performance machine rather than a...skinny fat guy.

@desy - thanks for the words of support. This is what my wife says: that my major failure has always been a lack of consistency and that it's ridiculous for me to think I should be easily adapting to this kind of lifting when I've been doing it properly for a maximum of 2 months (in my life, as a 36 year old 'executive city boy' is what she terms it). So far, I went from max lifts like:

Deadlift (60kg) and so sore I could feel it for days, to (today) Deadlift 80kg, with no soreness the next day at all really.
Bench press: from the bar and 15kg (7.5kg on each side) maximum to the bar and 25kg (12.5kg on each side)
Cable rows: from 30kg x 10 reps for 4 sets to 50kg x 10 reps for 4 sets.

Meaning, I do see improvement; I do see appreciable gains (physically too, I can actually see muscles moving under the layers of fat), but the workouts are quite tiring, and I'm not sure - should I be coming out of there feeling fresh? Sometimes I do, but again this seems to largely depend on my sleep cycle.

Generally: on the diet - I tend to have a protein shake; a buckwheat or quinoa salad for lunch; and a chicken breast with stir fried vegetables for dinner. This has been a problem because sometimes, before I go to bed, I get hit with a sugar craving and I eat a 200g cadbury fruit and nut bar in about 15 seconds (according to google one of these has 246 calories, 13.2g fat, 7.2g saturated; 27g sugar; and 0.1 g salt - so yeah, they're trash) and I know that this is not helpful in terms of making progress. So if this happens now I'm just eating another portion of dinner - basically, trying to make sure that what I eat is actually good fuel.

@purbeast0 I'm not actually trying to become 'bigger' but I guess that's inevitable if I want to become much stronger.

The point is to get stronger, develop athleticism, and enjoy the process - optimising where I can. This is meant to be a lifestyle choice that I've discussed with my wife and we have agreed upon - if things play out right in the place we bought I'll be able to build a home gym (in the future) so there'll be no excuse at all not to train.

On the positive note in all this I feel 'great' in the sense that, barring fatigue or muscle soreness etc, I don't feel any 'pain'. Deadlifts feel great to do, so do squats (though my heart rate seems to skyrocket here like I said) so do the chinups etc. Others in the gym say that my form is good too.

Thanks again everyone.
 

Ancalagon44

Diamond Member
Feb 17, 2010
3,274
202
106
It all sounds good Aristotelian. It sounds like you are getting there - as long as you realize it will take time. As you said, you spent 4 years abusing your body, and unfortunately there is a price to pay. That doesn't mean you have to have bad health for the rest of your life.

In general I'd say you are on the right track. One thing I would ask is, how do you view this transformation you are going for? What does it mean to you?

The significance of that question is twofold. The first thing is, do you think of it as a temporary thing, or as a permanent thing? Are you happy to live like this for the rest of your life? If not, what would you want to change?

The second thing is, is it all about appearance (ie less fat more muscle), or is it about health? If its primarily about appearance at this point (which is natural), I recommend starting to think about it in terms of overall health. Building muscle and losing fat will be easier if all of the right building blocks are in place. Those building blocks include lower stress levels (cortisol, a stress hormone, makes it more difficult to lose fat and gain muscle), better sleep (which you already have a handle on), the right diet, and sunlight exposure. Not only does sunlight exposure make your skin look tanned, its also very important for mood. The vitamin D that you get from the sun is vitally important to just about all body processes. If you live in a city where sunlight is difficult to obtain, you should definitely look at supplementing vitamin D. Its actually the only supplement I take.

Regarding food - the sugar craving/chocolate craving is interesting. The next time you feel it, pay attention to it. Is it a psychological habit? Do you feel anxious at the time? Do you feel extremely hungry? Light headed?

246 calories from 200g of chocolate? That sounds quite low.

So, the first thing I'd say is, don't be hard on yourself when that happens. If you are hard on yourself, you will feel guilty about it, and that will make the habit harder to change. Allow it to happen if it must, don't beat yourself up about it, pay attention to it, and see if you can change it. To change it, you need to understand it.

Try the following: eat a 200g slab of Fruit and Nut, but eat it earlier in the evening, just after dinner. Eat the entire thing slowly, having one piece at a time. Does the craving still occur later?

Try dark chocolate instead of milk chocolate - if you are going to eat chocolate, you might as well eat real chocolate, which has a lot of beneficial compounds in it.

Try eating a bigger meal at supper. Add a baked potato perhaps, or another helping of vegetables and protein.
 

cbrunny

Diamond Member
Oct 12, 2007
6,791
406
126
Alcohol is a very bad thing to drink after a workout. I don't lift but I am a triathlete, and workout at least twice a day almost every day. When in season, I can't drink because when I do I don't recover from the workouts. Strongly recommend doing some googling on alcohol and its effects on your metabolism. In our society, I think we are brainwashed to think alcohol is harm-free, when it actually goes far beyond even liver problems and the common weight/cardiac problems associated with alcohol. It's far worse on a day-to-day basis than we think it is.
 

mike8675309

Senior member
Jul 17, 2013
507
116
116
Calisthenics can make you stronger but not significantly bigger, you don't need weights for that. You really should start tracking your macros at least for a couple weeks. Then use what you find to make adjustments to your diet. I feel like you may not be eating enough on your workout days, and you are eating too much on your rest days . All based on the effort you are expending.

The benefit of the compound lifting movements is that they engage the whole body. Squat, Deadlift, Bench when done correctly will strengthen your whole body including your core. I'm not sure why you are focusing on vertical jump. I personally wouldn't worry about that until you have achieved your initial goals. Then you can focus on something more specific like that.

Cigarette smoking has a negative impact on your workout progress as the impacts on your body mean your body spends time dealing with that and not building muscle. It can be very hard to stop for some people, but it is well worth the effort. If you can get into vaping, you can slowly reduce the nicotine content over time eventually down to zero nicotine which can help people wean off cigarettes.

The alcohol should be included in your macro tracking and you'll need to adjust your drinking to meet your eventual macro goals.

Ideally you are able to get most of your dietary protein needs from whole foods. Look into beans and lentils.

Linear Progression is a good way to get started.
https://www.reddit.com/r/Fitness/comments/37ylk5/a_linear_progression_based_ppl_program_for/
 

Aristotelian

Golden Member
Jan 30, 2010
1,246
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Thanks a lot for the advice ladies and gentlemen. One of my biggest weaknesses in life has been 'consistency' because, for example, I ran a marathon in 2010 and then started to push for ultras, but I injured my left leg (fracturing a metatarsal after acute tendinitis development) and then began smoking (at the age of 30) which was a huge mistake because I find it so difficult to stop. I'm down to about 5 cigarettes a day and, with working out like I have been these past weeks, I really do feel it.

So the plan basically is to: be consistent and keep up the workouts; try to sleep more and not punish myself for needing more sleep; perhaps try to wean off coffee a bit because I do use it as a crutch in the mornings to feel more energetic; eat more of the great food I eat and satisfy cravings less by downing a cinnabon or a bar of chocolate. All within the 'keep it simple, stupid' mentality.

If that's alright with this sub-forum I plan to keep this thread as a living one where, once in a while I'll update my lift amounts (as a log) and I'll probably add a 'before' photo that I hope to update this August with an 'after' photo which, should show a significant tan difference along with some slight musculature differences.

Last night (yesterday was max effort lower body day) I ate a large amount of stir fried veggies with a chicken breast, and a bit of couscous. I wasn't hungry at all when I went to bed, so no chocolate binge ensued. The idea here is if I'm training my muscles and I feel hungry the silly thing to do is feed myself with things that do not help my body recover. I took good note of the comments on alcohol and the nicotine and, well, Rome wasn't built in a day so I'll be doing my best to stick with this as a lifestyle choice.

Just to clarify something about muscle growth: I read the 'solutions for the skinny fat ectomorph' by Anthony Mychal and a lot of what he wrote made a lot of sense to me. I'm not expecting to go from spaghetti arms to bulging biceps within a year, but the point I want to reiterate is that I want to be strong - the kind of guy that can lift his wife like a sack of potatoes, or easily carry furniture when needed (I carried our 80 Litre water heater up the stairs by myself recently, rar!), and in general - be more fit. The vertical jumps are being done because my gym doesn't have boxes for box jumps, and I do want to develop that explosive athleticism in the legs and other parts that those jumps develop.

Again - thanks everyone.
 

mike8675309

Senior member
Jul 17, 2013
507
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Worry about building some muscle before you worry about explosive athleticism. You need to be athletic first. Think of your workouts this way. You have a certain amount of time to devote to the workout. Do you want to do things that move you towards your goal, or those things that slow your move toward your goal?

Start with getting stronger, gaining muscle and then you can add in acceleration and explosiveness.
 

Aristotelian

Golden Member
Jan 30, 2010
1,246
11
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Dear all,

Thanks again for your help and advice. I thought it would be useful to provide another update.

I am getting stronger, but the process is rather slow (perhaps this is normal for a 37 year old in a sedentary lifestyle that has not attempted lean muscle gains for nearly his entire life aside from sporadic attempts).

I can:

(i) bench bar + 30kg (50kg) now for 3 reps;
(ii) deadlift bar + 80kg (100kg) now for 3 reps;
(iii) single leg squat (bulgarian) holding 12kg in each hand (10 reps per leg);
(iv) jump much higher (I followed a Joe Defranco tutorial on how to do vertical jumps + static stretching);
(v) cable row 55 kg or so for 10 reps (4 sets)

That is where I have seen the most progress. On lateral pulldowns I find it very hard to move past around 40kg (the next step up with the plate is MUCH harder). Same with DB lateral raises (I increased to 6kg having started at 4kg a while ago). Same with seated DB power cleans (now at 8kg but it is a challenge). Perhaps where I am most lacking in progress is situps, and here's why I think it is the case:

my core is very weak. I do 3 sets of 15 situps (traditional) for my ab training but this program calls for weighted high volume situp routines. Question: should I be trying situps with a plate (say 5kg) and aim for 3 sets of 10 situps? Or keep trying the 3 sets of 15 normal situps until this is easy? It doesn't seem to get any easier. This is similar to zottman curls where, by the end of my workout my arms feel trashed and I can't do more than 10kg in each hand.

Question: in weightlifting routines is it normal to improve on major lifts but then struggle to improve on the supplementary ones?

I have significantly changed my diet now and find that my body is absolutely craving high amounts of protein. Yesterday I had a protein shake for breakfast (3 large tablespoons of organic whey isolate with milk and a few strawberries). Then a steak salad (with mixed greens, pickles etc) for lunch with some mango juice. Last night I had an evening function where I focused on braised meats and some potatoes. And when I got home at 10pm I was starving, and ate 3 fried chicken thighs with a whole head of spinach.

I am trying to take diet as seriously as lifting - one thing that remains still is that I can comfortably sleep 9 hours a day. I got a hormone test done by a doctor and he said every marker (especially testosterone) is completely normal and that if I need more sleep I shouldn't beat myself up over it.

The smoking is still an issue - one that I am working on with my wife. But the more I train I find the less I can smoke, so hopefully the training will reinforce the quitting.

I still see myself as a skinny fat guy - my wife is seeing gains in my legs saying they are growing rapidly. I am seeing some muscle curvature in my upper body (bicep, shoulders, lats especially). My belly is decreasing. My weight is staying the same so presumably if I am getting stronger at the same weight I am putting on muscle while losing fat.

After some workouts (like the deadlift day tomorrow) I will eat potatoes with some steak and salad and I'm trying to treat myself to those sorts of carbs to avoid crashing in an evening and ordering (like I did two weeks ago) an entire KFC bucket (I had no idea these things had almost 4000 calories - I can eat a bucket in a few minutes).

One issue that is cropping up now is a sort of stinging in my left wrist. I'm doing some stretches online but find that I have to crack my left wrist a lot and it feels 'tight' a lot in anything but a completely neutral position. I am hoping this doesn't develop into something that will slow my progress because I have been taking the program seriously for a few months now and am seeing some gains that I do not want to stop. I know I have to watch my form but it is curious that my right wrist is completely fine and my left has this issue. (Queue the jokes about my right wrist being much stronger for obvious rapid movement reasons).

I am living in a place with pool access and am thinking I should add 'active rest days' - on Wednesday Saturday and Sunday where I don't lift. I tend to walk a good 45 minutes a day and my area is rather hilly, but I think I could do a bit more and have been reading that light cardio helps blood flow on rest days and does help with recovery.

I would like to highlight that this isn't a project in vanity for the most part - I want to be strong, fast, to be able to jump high, and have a good level of general athleticism. However, I have had manboobs my entire life and - well - if I can significantly drop my body fat and they remain that'll be an issue to look at in the future.

Cheers from a skinny fat desk jockey who is trying to change his life. Grateful for any and all comments.

Aristotelian
 

mike8675309

Senior member
Jul 17, 2013
507
116
116
Dear all,

I can:

(i) bench bar + 30kg (50kg) now for 3 reps;
(ii) deadlift bar + 80kg (100kg) now for 3 reps;
(iii) single leg squat (bulgarian) holding 12kg in each hand (10 reps per leg);
(iv) jump much higher (I followed a Joe Defranco tutorial on how to do vertical jumps + static stretching);
(v) cable row 55 kg or so for 10 reps (4 sets)

That is where I have seen the most progress. On lateral pulldowns I find it very hard to move past around 40kg (the next step up with the plate is MUCH harder). Same with DB lateral raises (I increased to 6kg having started at 4kg a while ago). Same with seated DB power cleans (now at 8kg but it is a challenge).

You are doing pretty good. Not sure what your expect but every body is different in where the muscle growth focuses. For me it is much harder to gain chest strength vs back or leg strength. Are you running a program or just lifting. If you want to have real progression in strength you should run a program. It makes it much easier to see the progress and can help you be motivated.
Here is one program that gives you an idea of how they work. There are many others out there for free.
https://www.reddit.com/r/Fitness/wiki/phraks-gslp
Another useful program to help your confidence would be a pull up program. If you are having issues with getting a pull-up you can try this program that works on negatives to help build the necessary lat muscles to complete a pull-up.
https://strongstrongfriends.com/col...s/strong-strong-friends-first-pull-up-program

Perhaps where I am most lacking in progress is situps, and here's why I think it is the case:
my core is very weak. I do 3 sets of 15 situps (traditional) for my ab training but this program calls for weighted high volume situp routines. Question: should I be trying situps with a plate (say 5kg) and aim for 3 sets of 10 situps? Or keep trying the 3 sets of 15 normal situps until this is easy? It doesn't seem to get any easier. This is similar to zottman curls where, by the end of my workout my arms feel trashed and I can't do more than 10kg in each hand.

Situps are a bit of a wasted effort for core strength. Focus on crunches more than situps. Incline crunches without weight are a good start. As soon as you can do 10-16, start adding weight. Hold the weight on your chest, plate weights work best. Volume is key to core, so if you can only do 6 or 7 reps, do more sets. Much more to core than just front ab work. Knee Ups, Side Bends, Planks, plank push ups, Russian twists. All sorts of stuff you can do to work all around your core.

Question: in weightlifting routines is it normal to improve on major lifts but then struggle to improve on the supplementary ones?

I have significantly changed my diet now and find that my body is absolutely craving high amounts of protein. Yesterday I had a protein shake for breakfast (3 large tablespoons of organic whey isolate with milk and a few strawberries). Then a steak salad (with mixed greens, pickles etc) for lunch with some mango juice. Last night I had an evening function where I focused on braised meats and some potatoes. And when I got home at 10pm I was starving, and ate 3 fried chicken thighs with a whole head of spinach.
Your body is craving calories, and because of your previous diet the only thing you equate that to is protein. Watch your macros and don't overdue protein. Excess macro's (Fat, Carbs, Protein) all end up turned into fat. So make sure you keep a good balance for the work you put in so as not to deprive your body of the things it needs while giving it too much of others.

I am trying to take diet as seriously as lifting - one thing that remains still is that I can comfortably sleep 9 hours a day. I got a hormone test done by a doctor and he said every marker (especially testosterone) is completely normal and that if I need more sleep I shouldn't beat myself up over it.
Sleep is a good thing. Exercise isn't the time when your body benefits the most. It is the recovery period when all the good stuff is happening inside your body. Most people will also go into ketosis during sleep which causes the body to start burning stored fat. This is why intermittent fasting is becoming popular as the theory is you can extend the fat burning period.

I still see myself as a skinny fat guy - my wife is seeing gains in my legs saying they are growing rapidly. I am seeing some muscle curvature in my upper body (bicep, shoulders, lats especially). My belly is decreasing. My weight is staying the same so presumably if I am getting stronger at the same weight I am putting on muscle while losing fat.
Have your wife help you take measurements and start running a program. That will help you see the changes. They do not come instant, but if you stay consistent, get your macros dialed in, you should see steady improvement.

One issue that is cropping up now is a sort of stinging in my left wrist. I'm doing some stretches online but find that I have to crack my left wrist a lot and it feels 'tight' a lot in anything but a completely neutral position. I am hoping this doesn't develop into something that will slow my progress because I have been taking the program seriously for a few months now and am seeing some gains that I do not want to stop. I know I have to watch my form but it is curious that my right wrist is completely fine and my left has this issue. (Queue the jokes about my right wrist being much stronger for obvious rapid movement reasons).
It wouldn't hurt to see a doctor. Your wrist shouldn't feel "tight" It is possible the stress from your push workouts has created a slight fracture. Note you can do as little as 60% of your 1 rep max and still see benefits in your workouts. So if necessary cut your weight, increase your reps on your push days to give your wrist a break. Adding wrist curls to your workout routine isn't a bad idea either.

I am living in a place with pool access and am thinking I should add 'active rest days' - on Wednesday Saturday and Sunday where I don't lift. I tend to walk a good 45 minutes a day and my area is rather hilly, but I think I could do a bit more and have been reading that light cardio helps blood flow on rest days and does help with recovery.

Swimming, biking, running all are good cardio workouts. Pick your poison.
 
Last edited:

Aristotelian

Golden Member
Jan 30, 2010
1,246
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Thanks folks. I am doing a workout plan - Westside for Skinny Bastards 3. Here are my numbers for this week (all mass includes the bar where applicable):

1. Max Effort Upper Body (Monday)

(i) barbell bench press: 5x 20kg; 5x 30kg; 5x 35 kg; 5x 40 kg; 3x50 kg;
(ii) incline dumbell bench press: 16x 12.5kg (in each hand); 13 x 12.5kg
(iii) Superset (cable rows + seated db power cleans): 8x52 kg + 9x8kg (in each hand), for four reps (with a rep or so variance sometimes, the last set of 8x52kg was really challenging on the row)
(iv) DB shrugs - 4 sets of 10 reps with 18kg in each hand;
(v) Zottman curls - 4 sets of 8 reps with 10kg in each hand (the last set I had to pause to recover during the set in order to eke out 8 - by far the most challenging exercise)

2. Dynamic Effort Lower Body (Tuesday)

(i) vertical jumps (I used the Joe Defranco tutorial here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0hSZgaZA0LE ) with my first jump I flew much higher than I normally do and had difficulty landing. I did 5 sets of 2-3 jumps each set. My legs honestly felt trashed (the posterior part) after doing this exercise properly and after weeks and weeks of doing jumps I was shocked at how challenging this was (doing it right)

(ii) bulgarian split squats - front leg elevated, 3 sets of 8 reps each leg, holding 10kg in each hand. I always gas with these, feel my heart rate really racing, so I take it nice and slow.

(iii) 45-degree hyperextensions, 3 sets of 10 reps holding a 20kg kettlebell

(iv) situps - been over these above, struggled to complete 3 sets of 15 normal situps.

3. Reptition Upper Body (Thursday)

(i) barbell bench press - 3 sets. 12x35kg; 12x35kg; 10x35kg (failure)

(ii) superset: lateral pulldowns + db power cleans - 4 sets: 8x42kg + 8-9 reps with 8kg in each hand

(iii) db lateral raises - 4 sets of 9 reps or so with 6kg in each hand.

(iv) superset: db shrugs + zottman curls, 3 sets. 10 reps with 16kg in each hand; 3 sets of 8 curls - the last two reps in the 3 set were death, again, form started to fail so I stopped.

4. Max Effort Lower Body (Friday - today)

(i) barbell deadlift: 5x 60kg; 5x 70kg; 5x 80kg; 3x 90kg; 3x100kg - comment here is that my abdominals felt so weak, I felt the upper abs trembling in my last rep in the same way as if I push too many situps.

(ii) bulgarian split squats, 3 sets of 8 (each leg) holding 14kg in each hand.

(iii) 45 degree hyperextensions: 3 sets of 10 reps holding a 20kg kettlebell (I may try to find a 25kg kettlebell next week)

(iv) incline crunches - I did these based on feedback, and managed 12, then 10, then 6 or so. They were harder than the normal situps for me and my abs still felt really weak after the deadlift.


So these are my numbers. I'm going to watch my macros and keep pushing a bit this weekend with some swimming for some easy cardio.

Thanks again guys and gals.
 
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