Points from Obama's speech

[Vic]

Originally posted by: halik
Wow so far it's right now... excellent speech imo.
I liked the shout out to McCain.

And yes if you choose not to carry insurance, you either A) need to pay in via fines etc. B) agree that hospitals don't have to take you w/o insurance.

I don't have a problem with (B), but I do have a serious problem with (A). Health insurance is a product, sold commercially for profit.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: sandorski

Originally posted by: spidey07
Scare tactics? Unyielding ideological views?

You're describing yourself Barrack. The time for bickering is over? So the debate is "over" in your mind?

I think this thread undermines your position on this point.

Yes, yes, by all means continue to attack the messenger, attempt to discredit and disregard the points made.

Sucks to be treated like you treat others, doesn't it?

 

[halik]

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: eits

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: eits
by the way, i wanna know who that piece of shit was who shouted out and called obama a liar during the speech. have some fucking decency and let the man finish his speech, then go and find the transcript or video clip that you had issue with and prove that it was a lie to the media. don't be a cock and embarrass yourself and your party by acting like the dumbasses who shoued out fake anger at town hall meetings.

Umm, I hope you know the only folks in this address are reps/senators (justices? I didn't pay much attention) and the press.

? yeah, i know. i don't understand how you were confused about my knowledge of this.

"acting like the dumbasses who shouted out fake anger..."

that implies that they, the legislators, need to compose themselves and not act like the dumbasses who shouted out fake anger at the town hall meetings.

it's not cool to shout out "lie" at the president in the middle of his speech, regardless of who the president is and who shouts it.

When he is flat out lying, you call his ass on it. Patriot.

God you're dumb.

 

[eits]

Originally posted by: Brainonska511

Originally posted by: GTaudiophile

Originally posted by: eits
by the way, i wanna know who that piece of shit was who shouted out and called obama a liar during the speech. have some fucking decency and let the man finish his speech, then go and find the transcript or video clip that you had issue with and prove that it was a lie to the media. don't be a cock and embarrass yourself and your party by acting like the dumbasses who shoued out fake anger at town hall meetings.

Wrong. That "liar" comment was a brief reminder of what true, public debate should be like. I am sure any "Founding Father" would more than agree.

A brief glimpse of what life could be like beyond a "pussified" PC world like ours.

True public debate should be debate - not windbags spouting nonsense with nothing backing their word.

True public debate is waiting for one side to finish and then provide a rebuttal.

exactly, which, by the way, was what i said... i guess gt skipped that part

 

[Ozoned]

Originally posted by: eskimospy
This thread has been pretty interesting to read, the same 3 retards going back and forth patting each other on the back, saying nonsensical statemtents.

Glad to see the trailer trash finally showed up to critique.

 

[halik]

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: halik
Wow so far it's right now... excellent speech imo.
I liked the shout out to McCain.

And yes if you choose not to carry insurance, you either A) need to pay in via fines etc. B) agree that hospitals don't have to take you w/o insurance.

I don't have a problem with (B), but I do have a serious problem with (A). Health insurance is a product, sold commercially for profit.

Well its one or the other. Current law says hospitals can't reject you, which means you shouldn't be allowed to go w/o insurance.

If you want to risk it, it should be set up like in africa and other developing countries. No monies = No ER.

 

[Modelworks]

"act when it is hard"
Those last lines were clearly written by a speech writer.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: Paratus
But but but no health care without malpractice reform.


So what reason will the Repubs use to oppose it now?

They'll keep doing what they do now, make up some laughably phony and easily-disprovable lie and keep repeating it over and over again in the belief that their endless bleating will drown out all other arguments.

I swear to God, I wake up every morning and pray for a viable 3rd party to emerge.

 

[eits]

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: eits

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: eits
by the way, i wanna know who that piece of shit was who shouted out and called obama a liar during the speech. have some fucking decency and let the man finish his speech, then go and find the transcript or video clip that you had issue with and prove that it was a lie to the media. don't be a cock and embarrass yourself and your party by acting like the dumbasses who shoued out fake anger at town hall meetings.

Umm, I hope you know the only folks in this address are reps/senators (justices? I didn't pay much attention) and the press.

? yeah, i know. i don't understand how you were confused about my knowledge of this.

"acting like the dumbasses who shouted out fake anger..."

that implies that they, the legislators, need to compose themselves and not act like the dumbasses who shouted out fake anger at the town hall meetings.

it's not cool to shout out "lie" at the president in the middle of his speech, regardless of who the president is and who shouts it.

When he is flat out lying, you call his ass on it. Patriot.

sure, that's fine... please do... but wait until he's done.

 

[fskimospy]

Originally posted by: Ozoned

Originally posted by: eskimospy
This thread has been pretty interesting to read, the same 3 retards going back and forth patting each other on the back, saying nonsensical statemtents.

Glad to see the trailer trash finally showed up to critique.

Huh?

 

[miketheidiot]

Originally posted by: glenn1
No more incentives to quit smoking, or lose weight, or anything else.

if you think cheaper medical bills are a major reason that people do (or don't do) those things, then you are a fool.

 

[Ozoned]

Low cost Health care for all. It is indeed a noble goal, but Obama won't be the closer on this one anytime soon.

 

[Baked]

Way to clear up all the lies by the GOP and fear mongering right wing media.

Originally posted by: Modelworks
"act when it is hard"
Those last lines were clearly written by a speech writer.

So? Everybody knows Obama used a recent college grad as his speech writer during his campaign, no reason to believe he doesn't have one now.

 

[eits]

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: Paratus
But but but no health care without malpractice reform.


So what reason will the Repubs use to oppose it now?

They'll keep doing what they do now, make up some laughably phony and easily-disprovable lie and keep repeating it over and over again in the belief that their endless bleating will drown out all other arguments.

I swear to God, I wake up every morning and pray for a viable 3rd party to emerge.

thumbsup

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: halik

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: halik
Wow so far it's right now... excellent speech imo.
I liked the shout out to McCain.

And yes if you choose not to carry insurance, you either A) need to pay in via fines etc. B) agree that hospitals don't have to take you w/o insurance.

I don't have a problem with (B), but I do have a serious problem with (A). Health insurance is a product, sold commercially for profit.

Well its one or the other. Current law says hospitals can't reject you, which means you shouldn't be allowed to go w/o insurance.

If you want to risk it, it should be set up like in africa and other developing countries. No monies = No ER.

The current law was put in place because of racism/discrimination. Hospitals would reject patients even when they did have the means. There's no reason why we can't have a system that still stops discrimination while not forcing people to purchase a commercial product as a condition of citizenship. I'll just ignore the Africa straw man, thank you.

 

[feralkid]

Originally posted by: spidey07
but...but...but bush.

You fucking liar Obama. You are a fucking LIAR. "tax cuts for the wealthy"

You fucking liar.

Enough, Spidey. You lie here all the time; how could you even tell the difference?

 

[miketheidiot]

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: sandorski

Originally posted by: spidey07
Scare tactics? Unyielding ideological views?

You're describing yourself Barrack. The time for bickering is over? So the debate is "over" in your mind?

I think this thread undermines your position on this point.

Yes, yes, by all means continue to attack the messenger, attempt to discredit and disregard the points made.

if you made points, that would be a start.

 

[spidey07]

Originally posted by: miketheidiot

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: sandorski

Originally posted by: spidey07
Scare tactics? Unyielding ideological views?

You're describing yourself Barrack. The time for bickering is over? So the debate is "over" in your mind?

I think this thread undermines your position on this point.

Yes, yes, by all means continue to attack the messenger, attempt to discredit and disregard the points made.

if you made points, that would be a start.

Read the damn OP.

 

[blackangst1]

Things I liked:

Medicare wont be touched.
Wont be paid for by increasing taxes.
Elimination of pre-existing conditions.
Elimination of lifetime caps.
Focus on the insurance industry on reducing waste and fraud.
Eluded to liability reform.

Things I didnt like:

Requirement to have insurance.
Will create more government beuracracies.
Eluded to letting Bush tax cuts expire.
No specific mention of encouragement of healthy lifestyle choices by way of lower premiums.

Overall I think it was decent.

 

[miketheidiot]

Originally posted by: Ozoned
Insurance companies are evil (again)

do you disagree?

 

[halik]

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: halik

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: halik
Wow so far it's right now... excellent speech imo.
I liked the shout out to McCain.

And yes if you choose not to carry insurance, you either A) need to pay in via fines etc. B) agree that hospitals don't have to take you w/o insurance.

I don't have a problem with (B), but I do have a serious problem with (A). Health insurance is a product, sold commercially for profit.

Well its one or the other. Current law says hospitals can't reject you, which means you shouldn't be allowed to go w/o insurance.

If you want to risk it, it should be set up like in africa and other developing countries. No monies = No ER.

The current law was put in place because of racism/discrimination. Hospitals would reject patients even when they did have the means. There's no reason why we can't have a system that still stops discrimination while not forcing people to purchase a commercial product as a condition of citizenship. I'll just ignore the Africa straw man, thank you.

It's not a strawman and I didn't mean to attach any sort of stigma to the system. It's pay-to-play and it is the standard for developing world. It's not inherently a bad thing - if you never need ER coverage, going that route will save you money.

It's still the same issue - your "choice" of not getting health insurance is just a transfer of risk on the tax payers. For someone that makes that "choice" saves $150/mo for 5 years till he/she needs emergency surgery for whatever, the savings are bourne by the individual and costs are mostly bourne by other insured.

 

[miketheidiot]

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: shadow9d9


Nope.

1-4 isn't available today. My wife was denied every insurance carrier by the state of Florida.

Go F yourself.

So move.

you don't want socialized medicine

So move.

 

[piasabird]

If you are not allowed to purchase health care accross state lines then this bill will do nothing to lower costs.

 

[miketheidiot]

Originally posted by: spidey07
I love the body language - people shaking their heads "you fucking idiot"

seeing and hearing want you want to here (as always)

 

[spidey07]

Originally posted by: miketheidiot


you don't want socialized medicine

So move.

meh, I'll keep using my representative gubment on a county/state/federal level instead to defeat this.