[POLL] Do You Support Socialized Food?

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MySoS

Senior member
Dec 7, 2004
490
0
0
Originally posted by: Amused
Originally posted by: MySoS
Originally posted by: Amused
Originally posted by: MySoS
Originally posted by: Amused
Originally posted by: MySoS
Yes I do countless people are starving to death in the U.S through no fault of their own.

Really? Proof?

Homeless people, a lot of homeless people are physically and/or mentally disabled. These people can't work, thus they can't buy food, thus they starve to death. Example a 22 year old woman has Juvenile Multiple sclerosis, she is too sick to work, thus she has no insurance to get treatment to make her feel better, making it impossible for her to get work. Thus with no work she starves to death before the disease kills her.

The problem is, charity, and now the governemnt has fed these people.

I asked for proof, and you provided me with a fable.

The fact is, no one is starving in the US. No one was starving in the US before Welfare, Food Stamps and the rest of the "Great Society" socialist nightmare was passed in the 60s.

Nope the goverment tells sick people like her to just die. The goverment doesn't feed sick people like her. charity doesn't feed everyone who needs it, it helps but it isn't enough.

Again, you have come to me with a fable.

If she is disabled, charity and now the government will provide Medicare and/or Medicaid. Charity, and now the government will also provide food and even housing.

When you have any "real stories" come back.

Take a clue: If people were really starving on the streets, the media would be all over it. The fact is, you cannot find stories of it because it just isn't happening (with the exception of the VERY rare case of a mentally ill person locking themselves in a house and starving themselves or their kids to death).


Nope I have read about sick people who have went to the goverment to ask for help. One girl had sever case of juvenile arthritus so bad she couldn't walk for more than 10 min at a time. She begged the goverment for help, they just laughed at her. Another one is about a guy with CVID he went and ask the goverment for help in paying for his treatment. The goverment laughed at him too. With out help and medication these people can't work. The goverment won't do anything for them. When i read it, it said they both don't have enough money to eat any more. Very sad story.
 

Amused

Elite Member
Apr 14, 2001
56,062
14,774
146
Originally posted by: MySoS
Originally posted by: Amused
Originally posted by: MySoS
Originally posted by: Amused
Originally posted by: MySoS
Originally posted by: Amused
Originally posted by: MySoS
Yes I do countless people are starving to death in the U.S through no fault of their own.

Really? Proof?

Homeless people, a lot of homeless people are physically and/or mentally disabled. These people can't work, thus they can't buy food, thus they starve to death. Example a 22 year old woman has Juvenile Multiple sclerosis, she is too sick to work, thus she has no insurance to get treatment to make her feel better, making it impossible for her to get work. Thus with no work she starves to death before the disease kills her.

The problem is, charity, and now the governemnt has fed these people.

I asked for proof, and you provided me with a fable.

The fact is, no one is starving in the US. No one was starving in the US before Welfare, Food Stamps and the rest of the "Great Society" socialist nightmare was passed in the 60s.

Nope the goverment tells sick people like her to just die. The goverment doesn't feed sick people like her. charity doesn't feed everyone who needs it, it helps but it isn't enough.

Again, you have come to me with a fable.

If she is disabled, charity and now the government will provide Medicare and/or Medicaid. Charity, and now the government will also provide food and even housing.

When you have any "real stories" come back.

Take a clue: If people were really starving on the streets, the media would be all over it. The fact is, you cannot find stories of it because it just isn't happening (with the exception of the VERY rare case of a mentally ill person locking themselves in a house and starving themselves or their kids to death).


Nope I have read about sick people who have went to the goverment to ask for help. One girl had sever case of juvenile arthritus so bad she couldn't walk for more than 10 min at a time. She begged the goverment for help, they just laughed at her. Another one is about a guy with CVID he went and ask the goverment for help in paying for his treatment. The goverment laughed at him too. With out help and medication these people can't work. The goverment won't do anything for them. When i read it, it said they both don't have enough money to eat any more. Very sad story.

When you can come to me with documented proof that they starved to death, I'll capitulate.

Until then, you're just telling stories.
 

Vic

Elite Member
Jun 12, 2001
50,420
14,322
136
Originally posted by: BigLouis
So you're going to assert that absolutely not one person was starving in the USA and even to this day there is not one.

Ok.
You misunderstand completely. He says that not one person starves against their will. We provide abudant opportunities by which those who have need can receive assistance if they choose to. In fact, government and charities in the US have so much food to give away that they generally run a surplus and are forced to throw away quite a bit. I know this for fact.
That some people choose to starve themselves because they choose not to seek aid is not a problem for charities to solves, but a medical problem as those persons generally have mental illnesses. Regardless, no amount of charity, government intervention, or outright socialism will ever allow us to save everyone. That is simply impossible.

Now... if you're complaing that poor people don't eat the same as rich people, well... you can go to Hell.
 

biostud

Lifer
Feb 27, 2003
18,450
5,025
136
Originally posted by: Amused
Originally posted by: biostud
Originally posted by: Amused
[
Providing a common defense is one of the few things our Constitution charters our government to do.

So some taxes are needed to provide saftey and freedom. We just differ on how much and what we should spend it on. And no matter where you put this limit some will say it's wrong, IMHO there's no universal point of right and wrong. It's probably best if it moves back and forwards from time to time, so more get happy at some time.

No. The difference is all equally benefit from a common defense. All do NOT equally benefit from sin taxes, welfare and socialized medicine.

When 100% are obese 100% will benefit from sin taxes

Maybe it would be better to do something before that happens.
 

MySoS

Senior member
Dec 7, 2004
490
0
0
Originally posted by: Amused
Originally posted by: MySoS
Originally posted by: Amused
Originally posted by: MySoS
Originally posted by: Amused
Originally posted by: MySoS
Originally posted by: Amused
Originally posted by: MySoS
Yes I do countless people are starving to death in the U.S through no fault of their own.

Really? Proof?

Homeless people, a lot of homeless people are physically and/or mentally disabled. These people can't work, thus they can't buy food, thus they starve to death. Example a 22 year old woman has Juvenile Multiple sclerosis, she is too sick to work, thus she has no insurance to get treatment to make her feel better, making it impossible for her to get work. Thus with no work she starves to death before the disease kills her.

The problem is, charity, and now the governemnt has fed these people.

I asked for proof, and you provided me with a fable.

The fact is, no one is starving in the US. No one was starving in the US before Welfare, Food Stamps and the rest of the "Great Society" socialist nightmare was passed in the 60s.

Nope the goverment tells sick people like her to just die. The goverment doesn't feed sick people like her. charity doesn't feed everyone who needs it, it helps but it isn't enough.

Again, you have come to me with a fable.

If she is disabled, charity and now the government will provide Medicare and/or Medicaid. Charity, and now the government will also provide food and even housing.

When you have any "real stories" come back.

Take a clue: If people were really starving on the streets, the media would be all over it. The fact is, you cannot find stories of it because it just isn't happening (with the exception of the VERY rare case of a mentally ill person locking themselves in a house and starving themselves or their kids to death).


Nope I have read about sick people who have went to the goverment to ask for help. One girl had sever case of juvenile arthritus so bad she couldn't walk for more than 10 min at a time. She begged the goverment for help, they just laughed at her. Another one is about a guy with CVID he went and ask the goverment for help in paying for his treatment. The goverment laughed at him too. With out help and medication these people can't work. The goverment won't do anything for them. When i read it, it said they both don't have enough money to eat any more. Very sad story.

When you can come to me with documented proof that they starved to death, I'll capitulate.

Until then, you're just telling stories.


When you see homeless people on the streets who can't walk, why do you think they are beggin for money because they are starving. They are homess because they are disabled and no one will help them.
 

Originally posted by: MySoS
Originally posted by: Amused
Originally posted by: MySoS
Originally posted by: Amused
Originally posted by: MySoS
Originally posted by: Amused
Originally posted by: MySoS
Originally posted by: Amused
Originally posted by: MySoS
Yes I do countless people are starving to death in the U.S through no fault of their own.

Really? Proof?

Homeless people, a lot of homeless people are physically and/or mentally disabled. These people can't work, thus they can't buy food, thus they starve to death. Example a 22 year old woman has Juvenile Multiple sclerosis, she is too sick to work, thus she has no insurance to get treatment to make her feel better, making it impossible for her to get work. Thus with no work she starves to death before the disease kills her.

The problem is, charity, and now the governemnt has fed these people.

I asked for proof, and you provided me with a fable.

The fact is, no one is starving in the US. No one was starving in the US before Welfare, Food Stamps and the rest of the "Great Society" socialist nightmare was passed in the 60s.

Nope the goverment tells sick people like her to just die. The goverment doesn't feed sick people like her. charity doesn't feed everyone who needs it, it helps but it isn't enough.

Again, you have come to me with a fable.

If she is disabled, charity and now the government will provide Medicare and/or Medicaid. Charity, and now the government will also provide food and even housing.

When you have any "real stories" come back.

Take a clue: If people were really starving on the streets, the media would be all over it. The fact is, you cannot find stories of it because it just isn't happening (with the exception of the VERY rare case of a mentally ill person locking themselves in a house and starving themselves or their kids to death).


Nope I have read about sick people who have went to the goverment to ask for help. One girl had sever case of juvenile arthritus so bad she couldn't walk for more than 10 min at a time. She begged the goverment for help, they just laughed at her. Another one is about a guy with CVID he went and ask the goverment for help in paying for his treatment. The goverment laughed at him too. With out help and medication these people can't work. The goverment won't do anything for them. When i read it, it said they both don't have enough money to eat any more. Very sad story.

When you can come to me with documented proof that they starved to death, I'll capitulate.

Until then, you're just telling stories.


When you see homeless people on the streets who can't walk, why do you think they are beggin for money because they are starving. They are homess because they are disabled and no one will help them.
Are you ever going to stop your clueless trolling?
 

MySoS

Senior member
Dec 7, 2004
490
0
0
Originally posted by: SampSon
Originally posted by: MySoS
Originally posted by: Amused
Originally posted by: MySoS
Originally posted by: Amused
Originally posted by: MySoS
Originally posted by: Amused
Originally posted by: MySoS
Originally posted by: Amused
Originally posted by: MySoS
Yes I do countless people are starving to death in the U.S through no fault of their own.

Really? Proof?

Homeless people, a lot of homeless people are physically and/or mentally disabled. These people can't work, thus they can't buy food, thus they starve to death. Example a 22 year old woman has Juvenile Multiple sclerosis, she is too sick to work, thus she has no insurance to get treatment to make her feel better, making it impossible for her to get work. Thus with no work she starves to death before the disease kills her.

The problem is, charity, and now the governemnt has fed these people.

I asked for proof, and you provided me with a fable.

The fact is, no one is starving in the US. No one was starving in the US before Welfare, Food Stamps and the rest of the "Great Society" socialist nightmare was passed in the 60s.

Nope the goverment tells sick people like her to just die. The goverment doesn't feed sick people like her. charity doesn't feed everyone who needs it, it helps but it isn't enough.

Again, you have come to me with a fable.

If she is disabled, charity and now the government will provide Medicare and/or Medicaid. Charity, and now the government will also provide food and even housing.

When you have any "real stories" come back.

Take a clue: If people were really starving on the streets, the media would be all over it. The fact is, you cannot find stories of it because it just isn't happening (with the exception of the VERY rare case of a mentally ill person locking themselves in a house and starving themselves or their kids to death).


Nope I have read about sick people who have went to the goverment to ask for help. One girl had sever case of juvenile arthritus so bad she couldn't walk for more than 10 min at a time. She begged the goverment for help, they just laughed at her. Another one is about a guy with CVID he went and ask the goverment for help in paying for his treatment. The goverment laughed at him too. With out help and medication these people can't work. The goverment won't do anything for them. When i read it, it said they both don't have enough money to eat any more. Very sad story.

When you can come to me with documented proof that they starved to death, I'll capitulate.

Until then, you're just telling stories.


When you see homeless people on the streets who can't walk, why do you think they are beggin for money because they are starving. They are homess because they are disabled and no one will help them.
Are you ever going to stop your clueless trolling?


It is not clueless trolling it is facts. Don't you see cripple people on the streets begging for money, I do all the time.
 

K1052

Elite Member
Aug 21, 2003
47,317
35,449
136
Originally posted by: MySoS
Originally posted by: SampSon
Are you ever going to stop your clueless trolling?


It is not clueless trolling it is facts. Don't you see cripple people on the streets begging for money, I do all the time.

I do and they are still there year after year. They haven't starved to death.
 

Amused

Elite Member
Apr 14, 2001
56,062
14,774
146
Originally posted by: MySoS


When you see homeless people on the streets who can't walk, why do you think they are beggin for money because they are starving. They are homess because they are disabled and no one will help them.

The fact is, most "homeless" people you see on the streets are ones who have, for one reason or another refused, or been expelled from government programs or private charities.

Another fact is, you don't see any starving to death, do you?

You need to grow up and look at reality.

Come back when you have verifiable evidence of people starving to death in the US.
 

Amused

Elite Member
Apr 14, 2001
56,062
14,774
146
Originally posted by: biostud
Originally posted by: Amused
Originally posted by: biostud
Originally posted by: Amused
[
Providing a common defense is one of the few things our Constitution charters our government to do.

So some taxes are needed to provide saftey and freedom. We just differ on how much and what we should spend it on. And no matter where you put this limit some will say it's wrong, IMHO there's no universal point of right and wrong. It's probably best if it moves back and forwards from time to time, so more get happy at some time.

No. The difference is all equally benefit from a common defense. All do NOT equally benefit from sin taxes, welfare and socialized medicine.

When 100% are obese 100% will benefit from sin taxes

Maybe it would be better to do something before that happens.

What makes you think 100% will be obese?
 

Feldenak

Lifer
Jan 31, 2003
14,093
2
81
Definately not. There are many bloated government "sacred cows" I would like to see eliminated.
 

Vic

Elite Member
Jun 12, 2001
50,420
14,322
136
I always find socialists amusing. They always claim the most wonderful of altruistic reasons for wanting to mandate government charity, but the reality is that they are selfish and suffer from a mental insecurity that I call "looking down". In other words, they're more concerned about failing in life, and making sure that others are there to protect them from their failures, than they are about making honest, concerted efforts into succeeding in life. They don't look up to a potential rosy future for themselves, they look down at the possibility of failure and are filling with horror.
Now I understand that the reason for this is that most socialists tend to be of high school or college age and are very concerned about their future in the big scary REAL world, which is why I am occasionally glad that that group never votes.

Look at my sig to the last words of FDR, the champion of American liberalism. A cripple (sorry, disabled person) who overcame his disabilities to become one of America's greatest presidents (something most liberals would say is impossible), his attitude up to the moment of his death reflects the optimism that made his success possible. "The only limit to our realization of tomorrow will be our doubts of today. Let us move forward with strong and active faith."
If you think you will fail and begin to plan for that failure, then you will fail. Regardless of your abilities. That some people choose to do so is not something we can prevent, though I agree that we should discourage them. But there simply is no way to save a person who refuses to be saved from themselves.
 

biostud

Lifer
Feb 27, 2003
18,450
5,025
136
Originally posted by: Amused
Originally posted by: biostud
Originally posted by: Amused
Originally posted by: biostud
Originally posted by: Amused
[
Providing a common defense is one of the few things our Constitution charters our government to do.

So some taxes are needed to provide saftey and freedom. We just differ on how much and what we should spend it on. And no matter where you put this limit some will say it's wrong, IMHO there's no universal point of right and wrong. It's probably best if it moves back and forwards from time to time, so more get happy at some time.

No. The difference is all equally benefit from a common defense. All do NOT equally benefit from sin taxes, welfare and socialized medicine.

When 100% are obese 100% will benefit from sin taxes

Maybe it would be better to do something before that happens.

What makes you think 100% will be obese?


ok maybe 98-99%, but those in prison are probably not to keen of police and military either, specially those on deathrows.
 

Originally posted by: K1052
Originally posted by: MySoS
Originally posted by: SampSon
Are you ever going to stop your clueless trolling?


It is not clueless trolling it is facts. Don't you see cripple people on the streets begging for money, I do all the time.

I do and they are still there year after year. They haven't starved to death.
Facts? You've been mindlessly spewing crap in so many threads. You will never, and should never be taken seriously.

Lots of people that beg for money make a substantial amount. Then they go to the homeless shelter and get fed and have a place to stay. I've lived in nyc and toronto, I've never seen a dead homeless person, ever.

How many dead bodies of homeless people that have starved to death have you seen? I'm guessing none.
 

artikk

Diamond Member
Dec 24, 2004
4,172
1
71
Wow, this thread has sure become controversial and defensive.:Q
EDIT In US there are a lot of homeless but it don't think that anyone of them will ever die . They all have low incomes and that's their only problem + SOMETIMES they are physically challenged. The gov't needs to do something about those poor invalids.
The "proof" of deaths of homeless in US isn't very reliable to be considered the evidence in this case.
 

biostud

Lifer
Feb 27, 2003
18,450
5,025
136
Originally posted by: russianpower
Wow, this thread has sure become controversial and defensive.:Q

I already stated in my first post this should probably be in P/N
 

MySoS

Senior member
Dec 7, 2004
490
0
0
Originally posted by: SampSon
Originally posted by: K1052
Originally posted by: MySoS
Originally posted by: SampSon
Are you ever going to stop your clueless trolling?


It is not clueless trolling it is facts. Don't you see cripple people on the streets begging for money, I do all the time.

I do and they are still there year after year. They haven't starved to death.
Facts? You've been mindlessly spewing crap in so many threads. You will never, and should never be taken seriously.

Lots of people that beg for money make a substantial amount. Then they go to the homeless shelter and get fed and have a place to stay. I've lived in nyc and toronto, I've never seen a dead homeless person, ever.

How many dead bodies of homeless people that have starved to death have you seen? I'm guessing none.

I havn't been spweing crap. What I said has been true. Just because you don't believe it doesn't make it crap.

 

K1052

Elite Member
Aug 21, 2003
47,317
35,449
136
Originally posted by: SampSon
Originally posted by: K1052
Originally posted by: MySoS
Originally posted by: SampSon
Are you ever going to stop your clueless trolling?


It is not clueless trolling it is facts. Don't you see cripple people on the streets begging for money, I do all the time.

I do and they are still there year after year. They haven't starved to death.
Facts? You've been mindlessly spewing crap in so many threads. You will never, and should never be taken seriously.

Lots of people that beg for money make a substantial amount. Then they go to the homeless shelter and get fed and have a place to stay. I've lived in nyc and toronto, I've never seen a dead homeless person, ever.

How many dead bodies of homeless people that have starved to death have you seen? I'm guessing none.

LOL

I think you misquoted.
 

Feldenak

Lifer
Jan 31, 2003
14,093
2
81
Originally posted by: MySoS
Originally posted by: SampSon
Originally posted by: K1052
Originally posted by: MySoS
Originally posted by: SampSon
Are you ever going to stop your clueless trolling?


It is not clueless trolling it is facts. Don't you see cripple people on the streets begging for money, I do all the time.

I do and they are still there year after year. They haven't starved to death.
Facts? You've been mindlessly spewing crap in so many threads. You will never, and should never be taken seriously.

Lots of people that beg for money make a substantial amount. Then they go to the homeless shelter and get fed and have a place to stay. I've lived in nyc and toronto, I've never seen a dead homeless person, ever.

How many dead bodies of homeless people that have starved to death have you seen? I'm guessing none.

I havn't been spweing crap. What I said has been true. Just because you don't believe it doesn't make it crap.

Try backing up your statements with fact. Give us some figures that we can check for ourselves...a website, government document, etc... Until you pony up with some substance behind your accusations, you are just spewing sensationalistic garbage.
 

MySoS

Senior member
Dec 7, 2004
490
0
0
Originally posted by: Feldenak
Originally posted by: MySoS
Originally posted by: SampSon
Originally posted by: K1052
Originally posted by: MySoS
Originally posted by: SampSon
Are you ever going to stop your clueless trolling?


It is not clueless trolling it is facts. Don't you see cripple people on the streets begging for money, I do all the time.

I do and they are still there year after year. They haven't starved to death.
Facts? You've been mindlessly spewing crap in so many threads. You will never, and should never be taken seriously.

Lots of people that beg for money make a substantial amount. Then they go to the homeless shelter and get fed and have a place to stay. I've lived in nyc and toronto, I've never seen a dead homeless person, ever.

How many dead bodies of homeless people that have starved to death have you seen? I'm guessing none.

I havn't been spweing crap. What I said has been true. Just because you don't believe it doesn't make it crap.

Try backing up your statements with fact. Give us some figures that we can check for ourselves...a website, government document, etc... Until you pony up with some substance behind your accusations, you are just spewing sensationalistic garbage.


The goverment is hidding the the fact that people are starving to death just like the hide the fact that people are dropind dead from curable and treatable diseases. It is happening but the proof is being kept secret.
 

K1052

Elite Member
Aug 21, 2003
47,317
35,449
136
Originally posted by: MySoS


The goverment is hidding the the fact that people are starving to death just like the hide the fact that people are dropind dead from curable and treatable diseases. It is happening but the proof is being kept secret.

Ladies and gentlemen, please don your tinfoil hats.
 

Amused

Elite Member
Apr 14, 2001
56,062
14,774
146
Originally posted by: MySoS

The goverment is hidding the the fact that people are starving to death just like the hide the fact that people are dropind dead from curable and treatable diseases. It is happening but the proof is being kept secret.

This is just sad.
 

BigLouis

Senior member
Nov 17, 2004
200
0
0
Originally posted by: Feldenak
Originally posted by: MySoS
Originally posted by: SampSon
Originally posted by: K1052
Originally posted by: MySoS
Originally posted by: SampSon
Are you ever going to stop your clueless trolling?


It is not clueless trolling it is facts. Don't you see cripple people on the streets begging for money, I do all the time.

I do and they are still there year after year. They haven't starved to death.
Facts? You've been mindlessly spewing crap in so many threads. You will never, and should never be taken seriously.

Lots of people that beg for money make a substantial amount. Then they go to the homeless shelter and get fed and have a place to stay. I've lived in nyc and toronto, I've never seen a dead homeless person, ever.

How many dead bodies of homeless people that have starved to death have you seen? I'm guessing none.

I havn't been spweing crap. What I said has been true. Just because you don't believe it doesn't make it crap.

Try backing up your statements with fact. Give us some figures that we can check for ourselves...a website, government document, etc... Until you pony up with some substance behind your accusations, you are just spewing sensationalistic garbage.

I'm not seeing much on any front in this regard, how about you follow your own advice?
 

Feldenak

Lifer
Jan 31, 2003
14,093
2
81
Originally posted by: MySoS
Originally posted by: Feldenak
Originally posted by: MySoS
Originally posted by: SampSon
Originally posted by: K1052
Originally posted by: MySoS
Originally posted by: SampSon
Are you ever going to stop your clueless trolling?


It is not clueless trolling it is facts. Don't you see cripple people on the streets begging for money, I do all the time.

I do and they are still there year after year. They haven't starved to death.
Facts? You've been mindlessly spewing crap in so many threads. You will never, and should never be taken seriously.

Lots of people that beg for money make a substantial amount. Then they go to the homeless shelter and get fed and have a place to stay. I've lived in nyc and toronto, I've never seen a dead homeless person, ever.

How many dead bodies of homeless people that have starved to death have you seen? I'm guessing none.

I havn't been spweing crap. What I said has been true. Just because you don't believe it doesn't make it crap.

Try backing up your statements with fact. Give us some figures that we can check for ourselves...a website, government document, etc... Until you pony up with some substance behind your accusations, you are just spewing sensationalistic garbage.


The goverment is hidding the the fact that people are starving to death just like the hide the fact that people are dropind dead from curable and treatable diseases. It is happening but the proof is being kept secret.

Wow. So you know all these "facts" that the government is hiding? Did Elvis and JFK tell you these things or did some sort of other psychic connection come to you while wearing your tinfoil hat? My opinion is that you are just a wannabe troll who can't even troll or flame properly.
 

Feldenak

Lifer
Jan 31, 2003
14,093
2
81
Originally posted by: BigLouis
Originally posted by: Feldenak
Originally posted by: MySoS
Originally posted by: SampSon
Originally posted by: K1052
Originally posted by: MySoS
Originally posted by: SampSon
Are you ever going to stop your clueless trolling?


It is not clueless trolling it is facts. Don't you see cripple people on the streets begging for money, I do all the time.

I do and they are still there year after year. They haven't starved to death.
Facts? You've been mindlessly spewing crap in so many threads. You will never, and should never be taken seriously.

Lots of people that beg for money make a substantial amount. Then they go to the homeless shelter and get fed and have a place to stay. I've lived in nyc and toronto, I've never seen a dead homeless person, ever.

How many dead bodies of homeless people that have starved to death have you seen? I'm guessing none.

I havn't been spweing crap. What I said has been true. Just because you don't believe it doesn't make it crap.

Try backing up your statements with fact. Give us some figures that we can check for ourselves...a website, government document, etc... Until you pony up with some substance behind your accusations, you are just spewing sensationalistic garbage.

I'm not seeing much on any front in this regard, how about you follow your own advice?

Either you misquoted or you think I said something I did not.
 
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