Poll: Is the Geforce FX a flop?

[Spicedaddy]

Originally posted by: Xentropy

Originally posted by: gregor7777

Originally posted by: Xentropy


Just to clarify why my only listed options are nVidia, ATi is, to me, not an option due to driver incompatibility issues. (Don't tell me about how they've "fixed them over the past few months". That's not true in my experience. I LAN game with several people with 9700 Pro's who have to install different drivers for each game we play due to problems. I vastly prefer the nVidia "install the latest and you're set" driver paradigm.)

That's just BS and you know it.

What your friends are doing is upgrading their drivers because ATi puts out new releases so frequently.

Uh, no, it's upgrading for this game then downgrading for another game then back up to some midrange driver version for a third. If they don't, their system freezes within an hour or so, or they get visual artifacts, or some other issue. It's not like nVidia drivers, you can't just install 3.0a catalysts and walk away. You need v2 catalysts for this and v3 for that and v1 for another and pre-Catalysts for yet another. It's rather annoying because it adds like 30 minutes setup time between each game we play for the ATi graphics card users to get their systems working. Gives the rest of us time to eat some chips and salsa or something I guess.

This is as close to personal experience as it gets for me since I won't put an ATi card in my own system. I'm afraid I trust my personal friends, and my own eyes, at LAN parties more than ATi fanbois on forums.

Sorry for being harsh, but you flamethrow at me, I fire back. BS, indeed, Troll.

Well, I'll trust my own experience of having the card in my system 3 feets from me, running Catalyst 3.0 since they were out and not having any problems with 1 single game I've tried. (NHL 2003, Madden 2003, Fifa 2003, F1 2002, NOLF2, Sim City 4, Warcraft 3, NFS Hot pursuit 2, Age Of Mythology, UT2003, Jedi Knight 2, and a few more I don't play anymore)

You call people fanboys, and you're the one bashing a product you've never even used? Pretty funny...

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: Xentropy

Originally posted by: gregor7777

Originally posted by: Xentropy


Just to clarify why my only listed options are nVidia, ATi is, to me, not an option due to driver incompatibility issues. (Don't tell me about how they've "fixed them over the past few months". That's not true in my experience. I LAN game with several people with 9700 Pro's who have to install different drivers for each game we play due to problems. I vastly prefer the nVidia "install the latest and you're set" driver paradigm.)

That's just BS and you know it.

What your friends are doing is upgrading their drivers because ATi puts out new releases so frequently.

Uh, no, it's upgrading for this game then downgrading for another game then back up to some midrange driver version for a third. If they don't, their system freezes within an hour or so, or they get visual artifacts, or some other issue. It's not like nVidia drivers, you can't just install 3.0a catalysts and walk away. You need v2 catalysts for this and v3 for that and v1 for another and pre-Catalysts for yet another. It's rather annoying because it adds like 30 minutes setup time between each game we play for the ATi graphics card users to get their systems working. Gives the rest of us time to eat some chips and salsa or something I guess.

This is as close to personal experience as it gets for me since I won't put an ATi card in my own system. I'm afraid I trust my personal friends, and my own eyes, at LAN parties more than ATi fanbois on forums.

Sorry for being harsh, but you flamethrow at me, I fire back. BS, indeed, Troll.

FUD ***CONFIRMED****

I hope you enjoy your (to paraphrase a former Nvidiot "wit"): GeForce Floppage Extreme.

 

[Orbius]

I dunno, the test results on anandtech and the the test results on Tom's Hardware Guide are totally opposite... whats the deal... who to believe??? Tom's always been trusted in the past.. He makes the GFFX look like a good card and andantech makes it look like crap....

I have trouble believing a review that has no screenshots in it(Toms Hardware) this is a video card review right? Also Anands article seems more indepth, they point out Nvidia's deceptiveness in their 2x AA settings, they're honest about the noise of the thing, to any enthusiast that is a big issue!!!
Also Anands review shows more of how the card would be used real-world, no ones going to get one of these high end cards and not crank up Ansiotropic at least, thats why Anands benches are more relevant than Tom's.

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: Orbius

I dunno, the test results on anandtech and the the test results on Tom's Hardware Guide are totally opposite... whats the deal... who to believe??? Tom's always been trusted in the past.. He makes the GFFX look like a good card and andantech makes it look like crap....

I have trouble believing a review that has no screenshots in it(Toms Hardware) this is a video card review right? Also Anands article seems more indepth, they point out Nvidia's deceptiveness in their 2x AA settings, they're honest about the noise of the thing, to any enthusiast that is a big issue!!!
Also Anands review shows more of how the card would be used real-world, no ones going to get one of these high end cards and not crank up Ansiotropic at least, thats why Anands benches are more relevant than Tom's.

Tom's review shows MAJOR misgivings about the card despite it being declared a "winner".

However, its lead is only slight, especially compared to the distance that ATI put between its Radeon 9700 PRO and the Ti 4600

The GeForceFX 5800 Ultra is irrefutably the fastest card in most of the tests - but at what price? The power of the FX relies on high clock speeds, which in turn require high voltages and produce an enormous amount of heat. The consequence is that extensive (and expensive) cooling is necessary. Add to that the DDR-II memory, the price of which is quite high, due to the small production numbers. Even the 12-layer board layout is complex and expensive.

It will be difficult for NVIDIA to push its GeForceFX 5800 Ultra. Radeon 9700 PRO cards are only slightly slower, and, because they've been out on the market for months now, they're much less expensive. Also, because they deliver 3D performance with much slower clock speeds, they do not require extensive cooling - and that's nice for your pocketbook as well as your ears

It's surprising that the GeForceFX GPU, clocked at 500 MHz, only gains a small lead over the R300 GPU (VPU), which is modestly clocked at 325 MHz in comparison.

EDIT: From a Rage 3D thread:

Remember that Tom himself no longer does the reviews for exactly this reason. He was getting blasted for the biased reviews of his staff, in this case:
NVIDIA GeForceFX: Brute Force Attack Against the King
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Created:
January 27, 2003
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
By:
Lars Weinand
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Category:
Graphics Cards

 

[gregor7777]

Originally posted by: Xentropy

Originally posted by: gregor7777

Originally posted by: Xentropy


Just to clarify why my only listed options are nVidia, ATi is, to me, not an option due to driver incompatibility issues. (Don't tell me about how they've "fixed them over the past few months". That's not true in my experience. I LAN game with several people with 9700 Pro's who have to install different drivers for each game we play due to problems. I vastly prefer the nVidia "install the latest and you're set" driver paradigm.)

That's just BS and you know it.

What your friends are doing is upgrading their drivers because ATi puts out new releases so frequently.

Uh, no, it's upgrading for this game then downgrading for another game then back up to some midrange driver version for a third. If they don't, their system freezes within an hour or so, or they get visual artifacts, or some other issue. It's not like nVidia drivers, you can't just install 3.0a catalysts and walk away. You need v2 catalysts for this and v3 for that and v1 for another and pre-Catalysts for yet another. It's rather annoying because it adds like 30 minutes setup time between each game we play for the ATi graphics card users to get their systems working. Gives the rest of us time to eat some chips and salsa or something I guess.

This is as close to personal experience as it gets for me since I won't put an ATi card in my own system. I'm afraid I trust my personal friends, and my own eyes, at LAN parties more than ATi fanbois on forums.

Sorry for being harsh, but you flamethrow at me, I fire back. BS, indeed, Troll.

Back under the bridge with you sir.

I call you on your BS. The overwhelming majority of people who own the 9500/9700 series of cards (including myself, so I speak from direct expierence) have not had to replace sets of drivers like you would have us believe.

Sure, there may be a visual anomoly every now and then, but is this not to be expected from bleeding edge hardware? On a correctly set up system, there is ABSOLUTELY NO NEED to switch drivers as you described.

And yes, I have many of the newest games and play them, or at least quite a bit of them, regularly.

 

[Xentropy]

Originally posted by: apoppin
I hope you enjoy your (to paraphrase a former Nvidiot "wit"): GeForce Floppage Extreme.

Reading comprehension not your strong suit? I don't plan on getting a GFFX due to noise issues.

Which means there has yet to exist a card to complement the 3.06Ghz system I'm buildling. I'm extremely disheartened. And I'm far from an nVidia fan. I had very high hopes for the Parhelia. And I have hopes for ATi, too; they just haven't fixed their problems yet. nVidia is just the only game in town, and that sucks for the consumer because competition is wonderful for the end user.

I'm glad that people around here have managed to get their 9700 Pro's working. I'll point my friends (yet again) at these and other forums, though they've already tried just about every suggestion I've seen (most of them WHILE I WAS RIGHT THERE HELPING, to dispell those of you who have said I have "no personal experience" with the 9700 Pro; I don't have to have it in my system to have a lot of personal experience with it, I LAN game for 12 hours weekly, plus I'm kind of the "PC fixer" of the group, they always come to me with their problems so I see what hardware has the worst probs quickly), and have yet to find a solution other than having four to six driver revisions sitting on their desktop for easy changing. When (and I do mean when, not if; I have faith that ATi can improve eventually, even if they have only barely improved for 6 years) ATi's driver stability improves, bam, they'll be a contendor, and hell, if they released Catalyst 4 tomorrow, and even 3 out of 4 friends reported every game was rock solid with those drivers, I'd be in line to buy a 9700 Pro this weekend. But for now, there's no stable and quiet card above Ti4600 grade, and this SUCKS as someone who wants something faster.

Christ, post a criticism of the GFFX and I get flamed for being an nVidiot. By about ten separate people. That's new. Though I used to get flamed as a "fanBOi" for saying ATi's drivers might improve one day. I guess you ATi fans are just trying to "get nVidiots back" for years of being persecuted, but reverse discriminiation just hurts your cause, especially when using it in false accusations.

 

[Xentropy]

Originally posted by: gregor7777Back under the bridge with you sir.

I call you on your BS.

I apologize for my harsh tone, since we're both just speaking from our own personal experiences and they will obviously vary. But, I'm sorry, calling me a liar just because you refuse to believe other people's experiences may differ from your own is, in my opinion, out of line. This is the last I'll say on that subject with you, since I don't like lowering myself to responding to trollbait.

 

[vash]

Nvidia's FX isn't a flop, if anyone believes that -- you are a fool. There will be plenty of people purchasing this card, reguardless of the loss of one PCI slot, the loud noise, etc.

We all have to look at what the FX really is. The FX is showing off the muscle of the Nvidia chip designers and the fab process in making these chips. Sure, the ATI is almost as fast and is quieter than the FX, but the FX is built off newer technology that will allow the chip to scale much faster than the ATI part.

Remember how AMD was in the driver seat for while for the performance of the chips and how Intel introduced some slower P4 that would scale much faster? The P4 have scaled and are ahead of AMD for performance because of their significant investment in newer technology. Sure, Intel had egg on their face for a little bit there, but now look at them, they are back on top!

Also, none of these benchmarks show how fast the card can run Cg apps. Sure, this Radeon 9700pro can push a lot of FPS in UT2k3, but how fast can it push all those polys for players AND show their facial hair AND their hair waving while running? Sure, these technologies aren't out NOW for games, but when we look to the future of what gaming can be, we are looking at some of the technologies the FX brings.

I'm not a hardcore Nvidia, I hae an ATI 8500 and a GF3 Ti500 at home. From my experiences, the TI500 is definitely a solid good, a good performer and predictable with everything I've thrown at it. For the Radeon, I haven't been as happy with the overall performance of the card, the lack of refresh-fixer apps that WORK (RefreshLock works, the rest don't work for me, even with CAT 3.0s and a clean install of WinXP). I am, however, a believer of competition and technology. If it wasn't for ATI bringing us fast cards, Nvidia may not have pushed the FX out!

Nvidia isn't going the way of 3DFX, they are a long way from falling into what 3Dfx stepped into.

vash

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: Xentropy

Originally posted by: apoppin
I hope you enjoy your (to paraphrase a former Nvidiot "wit"): GeForce Floppage Extreme.

Reading comprehension not your strong suit? I don't plan on getting a GFFX due to noise issues.

Which means there has yet to exist a card to complement the 3.06Ghz system I'm buildling. I'm extremely disheartened. And I'm far from an nVidia fan. I had very high hopes for the Parhelia. And I have hopes for ATi, too; they just haven't fixed their problems yet. nVidia is just the only game in town, and that sucks for the consumer because competition is wonderful for the end user.

I'm glad that people around here have managed to get their 9700 Pro's working. I'll point my friends (yet again) at these and other forums, though they've already tried just about every suggestion I've seen (most of them WHILE I WAS RIGHT THERE HELPING, to dispell those of you who have said I have "no personal experience" with the 9700 Pro; I don't have to have it in my system to have a lot of personal experience with it, I LAN game for 12 hours weekly, plus I'm kind of the "PC fixer" of the group, they always come to me with their problems so I see what hardware has the worst probs quickly), and have yet to find a solution other than having four to six driver revisions sitting on their desktop for easy changing. When (and I do mean when, not if; I have faith that ATi can improve eventually, even if they have only barely improved for 6 years) ATi's driver stability improves, bam, they'll be a contendor, and hell, if they released Catalyst 4 tomorrow, and even 3 out of 4 friends reported every game was rock solid with those drivers, I'd be in line to buy a 9700 Pro this weekend. But for now, there's no stable and quiet card above Ti4600 grade, and this SUCKS as someone who wants something faster.

Christ, post a criticism of the GFFX and I get flamed for being an nVidiot. By about ten separate people. That's new. Though I used to get flamed as a "fanBOi" for saying ATi's drivers might improve one day. I guess you ATi fans are just trying to "get nVidiots back" for years of being persecuted, but reverse discriminiation just hurts your cause, especially when using it in false accusations.

Send your friends to the Rage3D Forums. ATI techs regularly monitor their forums and give helpful advice. So far - it appears from my own reading - only about 3% of 9700Pro users are unable to solve all their video problems. You might just be perceived by Radeon owners as making your OWN "false accusations".

You are possibly right about one thing - the fanATIcs just might be 'trying to "get nVidiots back" for years of being persecuted'. After all, we're only human.

As to a "cause" being hurt - no way. It's just a day to ridicule Nvidia's marketing hype and their rather bitter fanboyz.


. . . sorry . . . I guess . . . if I offended anyone (like anyone has ever apologized here about hurting my "feelings" re: videocard choice) . . .

 

[Actaeon]

I am non biased, my last 4 cards have been Nvidia, and I am with ATi on this. Though ATi have been known for driver problems in the past, I do not believe its such an big issue anymore. I have seen issues about drivers in threads, but it isn't as bad as Nvidia fanboys make it seem. Its just as bad as AMD processors "frying up" because of "heat problems". A rare occurance. In my opinion, the drivers should not be an issue in this discussion, but rather performance and price.

I believe R9700 was a significant leap from the DX8 cards, and the GF FX barly pulls ahead in performance. Though the trade offs between the cards, price, performance, and noise. ATi is cheaper, while even beating the GF FX in many benchmarks. Without taking up the extra PCI slot (though, I don't consider this a big issue as most people wouldn't use the 1st PCI slot anyway), and the extra noise. I believe ATi has beat Nvidia this and last round. And R350 will definatly put a hurt on the GFFX.

In no way am I exclaiming the doom of Nvidia, they are still big competition to ATi, and Nvidia is still a favorite among AMDers for the Nforce board, and OEMs. I do await matured drivers for NV30 before I can come up with a final conclusion of NV30. But until then, what I've written above, is my first impression.

Good luck Nvidia, and Good Job ATi.

Jonathan

EDIT: ATi isn't a card, but R9700 is.

 

[element]

I can't believe Nvidia went with a 128 bit memory architecture. That's like putting wooden cartwheels on a Ferrari. It may have a powerful engine, but it ain't goin nowhere.

Let me just say that I've been an Nvidia fan for a long time, almost every card I've owned was by them and I've enjoyed their great driver support and solid performance. But I am not paying $400 for this monstrosity.

Nvidia missed the mark on this one make no mistake about it. The only fool here is the tard that pays $400 for a card that performs only slightly better than a card that costs less.

I do however look forward to the next iteration of this card which should come out with a 256 bit memory architecture which will best make use of the rest of the high technology in this card (ie. 0.13 micron process, high clockspeed, DDR-II, etc...)

 

[chizow]

Originally posted by: apoppin

You are possibly right about one thing - the fanATIcs just might be 'trying to "get nVidiots back" for years of being persecuted'. After all, we're only human.

As to a "cause" being hurt - no way. It's just a day to ridicule Nvidia's marketing hype and their rather bitter fanboyz.


. . . sorry . . . I guess . . . if I offended anyone (like anyone has ever apologized here about hurting my "feelings" re: videocard choice) . . .

LoL....confusing a buying choice with emotions. Maybe thats part of your problem in taking the abuse personally over the years. I guess thats one of the downsides of being a male cheerleader, of computer parts no less.

So now that you've seen the results, are you gonna put your money where your mouth is and buy one? Or would it be too much trouble to unwrap your lips from around the 9700pro's PCB and actually put it into your computer?

Chiz

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: element®
I can't believe Nvidia went with a 128 bit memory architecture. That's like putting wooden cartwheels on a Ferrari. It may have a powerful engine, but it ain't goin nowhere.

Let me just say that I've been an Nvidia fan for a long time, almost every card I've owned was by them and I've enjoyed their great driver support and solid performance. But I am not paying $400 for this monstrosity.

Nvidia missed the mark on this one make no mistake about it. The only fool here is the tard that pays $400 for a card that performs only slightly better than a card that costs less.

I do however look forward to the next iteration of this card which should come out with a 256 bit memory architecture which will best make use of the rest of the high technology in this card (ie. 0.13 micron process, high clockspeed, DDR-II, etc...)

I am extremely curious as to your brand "loyalty" IF the "new iteration" (also) has it's butt owned to by the "new" 98 or 9900Pro.

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: chizow

Originally posted by: apoppin

You are possibly right about one thing - the fanATIcs just might be 'trying to "get nVidiots back" for years of being persecuted'. After all, we're only human.

As to a "cause" being hurt - no way. It's just a day to ridicule Nvidia's marketing hype and their rather bitter fanboyz.


. . . sorry . . . I guess . . . if I offended anyone (like anyone has ever apologized here about hurting my "feelings" re: videocard choice) . . .

LoL....confusing a buying choice with emotions. Maybe thats part of your problem in taking the abuse personally over the years. I guess thats one of the downsides of being a male cheerleader, of computer parts no less.

So now that you've seen the results, are you gonna put your money where your mouth is and buy one? Or would it be too much trouble to unwrap your lips from around the 9700pro's PCB and actually put it into your computer?

Chiz

Recognizing sarcasm isn't your strong point is it?

So you seem to be stuck between a rock and a hard place. You aren't able to get your own 9700Pro working properly and the GF-Floppage Extreme is a noisy & overpriced disappointment. What are YOU going to do?

Me: I am quite satisfied with my current videocard. It plays all the games I like with acceptable detail and framerates. When I feel the need to upgrade, it will likely be a 9700 or 9700Pro. I wouldn't keep the Nvidia Dusbuster if it were a GIFT.

 

[Actaeon]

Now now, no need to insult each other. Both of you have earned my respect on these boards, no need to tarnish your reputation over a videocard.

I think both of you are making a bigger deal of ATi's and Nvidia's problems with there own cards/drivers/whatever, than it actually is.

 

[Nemesis77]

Regarding the noise: do a simple comparison. Listen to the mp3 with FX booting up. Compare it to the one with 9700 booting up. The difference is HUGE! There's no way in hell I would get a vid-card with a fan like that!

 

[Nemesis77]

Originally posted by: Xentropy
Ignore the "perf aniso" results from the 9700 because those are not a fair comparison to the FX's "bal aniso". It's comparing the low quality anisotropic filtering from the 9700 to the high quality from the FX.

Even though the image-quality on both is apparently identical?

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: Actaeon
Now now, no need to insult each other. Both of you have earned my respect on these boards, no need to tarnish your reputation over a videocard.

I think both of you are making a bigger deal of ATi's and Nvidia's problems with there own cards/drivers/whatever, than it actually is.

Are you referring to moi? Insulting?

Being insulting isn't my intention. I was simply replying to the accusation of being a "male cheerleader for a computer part". I am not although I prefer ATI over Nvidia.

Reputation? What reputation? (Thank-you!)
I have always spoke my mind (here) and although I sometime hold back, I'm just really proud of my (stupid) opinion.

 

[chizow]

Originally posted by: apoppin

Originally posted by: chizow

Originally posted by: apoppin

You are possibly right about one thing - the fanATIcs just might be 'trying to "get nVidiots back" for years of being persecuted'. After all, we're only human.

As to a "cause" being hurt - no way. It's just a day to ridicule Nvidia's marketing hype and their rather bitter fanboyz.


. . . sorry . . . I guess . . . if I offended anyone (like anyone has ever apologized here about hurting my "feelings" re: videocard choice) . . .

LoL....confusing a buying choice with emotions. Maybe thats part of your problem in taking the abuse personally over the years. I guess thats one of the downsides of being a male cheerleader, of computer parts no less.

So now that you've seen the results, are you gonna put your money where your mouth is and buy one? Or would it be too much trouble to unwrap your lips from around the 9700pro's PCB and actually put it into your computer?

Chiz

Recognizing sarcasm isn't your strong point is it?

So you seem to be stuck between a rock and a hard place. You aren't able to get your own 9700Pro working properly and the GF-Floppage Extreme is a noisy & overpriced disappointment. What are YOU going to do?

Me: I am quite satisfied with my current videocard. It plays all the games I like with acceptable detail and framerates. When I feel the need to upgrade, it will likely be a 9700 or 9700Pro. I wouldn't keep the Nvidia Dusbuster if it were a GIFT.

Sarcasm? Figured it was just brutal honesty from a fanboy stepping out of the Emotionally Battered closet.

I'm going to do as I said all along: Wait for reviews, check the online pricing when the card becomes available and make a decision (emotion doesn't factor in anywhere in MY buying decisions lol). Review sites will be revisiting the card when it hits retail, probably with revised drivers. I don't think a driver revision will make up for its lackluster performance, but again, anything within +/- 10% of the 9700pro with AA and AF for me is worth the upgrade to get my rig fully functional again. In the meantime, I'll have to pray ATI releases a driver revision b/c their CS is totally unresponsive.

Yah, I'm sure you'll be hyping up the R400 starting tomorrow, in hopes that you'll own one in 2010.

Chiz

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: chizow

Originally posted by: apoppin

Originally posted by: chizow

Originally posted by: apoppin

You are possibly right about one thing - the fanATIcs just might be 'trying to "get nVidiots back" for years of being persecuted'. After all, we're only human.

As to a "cause" being hurt - no way. It's just a day to ridicule Nvidia's marketing hype and their rather bitter fanboyz.


. . . sorry . . . I guess . . . if I offended anyone (like anyone has ever apologized here about hurting my "feelings" re: videocard choice) . . .

LoL....confusing a buying choice with emotions. Maybe thats part of your problem in taking the abuse personally over the years. I guess thats one of the downsides of being a male cheerleader, of computer parts no less.

So now that you've seen the results, are you gonna put your money where your mouth is and buy one? Or would it be too much trouble to unwrap your lips from around the 9700pro's PCB and actually put it into your computer?

Chiz

Recognizing sarcasm isn't your strong point is it?

So you seem to be stuck between a rock and a hard place. You aren't able to get your own 9700Pro working properly and the GF-Floppage Extreme is a noisy & overpriced disappointment. What are YOU going to do?

Me: I am quite satisfied with my current videocard. It plays all the games I like with acceptable detail and framerates. When I feel the need to upgrade, it will likely be a 9700 or 9700Pro. I wouldn't keep the Nvidia Dusbuster if it were a GIFT.

Sarcasm? Figured it was just brutal honesty from a fanboy stepping out of the Emotionally Battered closet.

I'm going to do as I said all along: Wait for reviews, check the online pricing when the card becomes available and make a decision (emotion doesn't factor in anywhere in MY buying decisions lol). Review sites will be revisiting the card when it hits retail, probably with revised drivers. I don't think a driver revision will make up for its lackluster performance, but again, anything within +/- 10% of the 9700pro with AA and AF for me is worth the upgrade to get my rig fully functional again. In the meantime, I'll have to pray ATI releases a driver revision b/c their CS is totally unresponsive.

Yah, I'm sure you'll be hyping up the R400 starting tomorrow, in hopes that you'll own one in 2010.

Chiz

Now you know - it was sarcasm.

I don't think you can second-guess me as to what I will be hyping next. I have said all along (for months) that the NV30 would be a bitter disappointment - especially for Nvidiots - the signs were unmistakeable.

I don't feel the need to live on the bleeding edge of technology like you appear to. For me - an expensive videocard that is years ahead of the games I play - is a waste. I fully expect to upgrade my video this year . . .

And have you checked the Rage3D forums as was suggested many times before? I really think they can help even you with your 9700Pro "issues".

 

[Chad]

I looked at the pictures HardOCP back to back. I opened 2 different windows, each with a screen shot using full AA. To be quite honest, the gffx looked a hell of alot better. You guys should try it, you'll see what I mean. If you notice, the 9700 makes 3d images at a distance look blurry. I think they do this because it makes 3d objects look more realistic. It's my opinion ofcourse, but I like things to look sharp and crisp with full color. That's what the FX chip is doing in those screen shots.

Wow, I thought you were making stuff up, so I checked it out. In particular, I looked at these two...

image GeForce

image Radeon


Something's definately not right here! There's no way the GeForce FX can look THAT much better. Is there?

EDIT: Found the delio out. Excerpted from HardOCP:

One interesting thing to note in this game is that the fog doesn?t seem to appear in it on the GeForceFX. Compare the 9700 Pro pictures to the GeForceFX, see how on the 9700 Pro there is a gray fog in the background, but on the GeForceFX it isn?t present at all. This could simply be a driver issue to be worked out though and not a hardware issue.

Heh, so it appears the Radeon is rendering the image "correctly" even though it looks worse! As an aside, I *HATE* fog in games, I personally think it makes an image blurry and washed out and should never EVER be used. To me, not doing fog on a video card could be considered a "feature".

 

[Actaeon]

Originally posted by: Chad

I looked at the pictures HardOCP back to back. I opened 2 different windows, each with a screen shot using full AA. To be quite honest, the gffx looked a hell of alot better. You guys should try it, you'll see what I mean. If you notice, the 9700 makes 3d images at a distance look blurry. I think they do this because it makes 3d objects look more realistic. It's my opinion ofcourse, but I like things to look sharp and crisp with full color. That's what the FX chip is doing in those screen shots.

Wow, I thought you were making stuff up, so I checked it out. In particular, I looked at these two...

image GeForce

image Radeon


Something's definately not right here! There's no way the GeForce FX can look THAT much better. Is there?

The GFFX is using 8xS AA. Radeon is using 6x. Thats probally why the GF FX looks alot better in that picture.

 

[Chad]

The GFFX is using 8xS AA. Radeon is using 6x. Thats probally why the GF FX looks alot better in that picture.

Actually, it is prevelant in all the pictures and at any FSAA mode. Read my above post again which I edited which has an explanation.

 

[chizow]

Originally posted by: apoppin

And have you checked the Rage3D forums as was suggested many times before? I really think they can help even you with your 9700Pro "issues".

Yep, sure have. Became pretty clear to me early on that the FanATicboys here have no f'in clue about the products they hype up, they're only good for a good 'nef, troll, and the occasional cheer.

The fanboys over at Rage3D actually know their stuff and own the video cards they hype, but alas, none of their suggestions fixed the video capture/overlay/directdraw problems. And am I still on the bleeding edge? I bought the 9700pro thinking it was a mature card (5 months old) with driver issues solved with the Catalysts, was I wrong to assume that?

Chiz

 

[jbond04]

Originally posted by: Viper GTS

Originally posted by: GTaudiophile
DOA. Bring on R350 and RV350!

You are starting to sound a lot like imtim83's evil (not that he isn't) twin brother.

The first generation of a significantly different product is frequently slammed.

When the P4 came out everybody hated it. I said wait & see what happens, it's going to be fast.

Revive this thread in a couple months & see how you feel.
Viper GTS

Viper GTS brought up a good point regarding the GeForce FX...the card in it's current incarnation may not be all that it's cracked up to be, but it's architecture may hold a great deal of promise. I can't help but draw parallels to one of nVIDIA's earlier releases.

If you look at the GeForce 3 launch two years ago, it suffered from a similar problem...it held very advanced technology, but its performance wasn't much greater than that of the GeForce 2 Ultra. nVIDIA had just finished battling with TSMC to get their .15um process finished, the drivers for the GeForce 3 were functional...but not outstanding, and their was little to no potential for overclocking with the GeForce 3 core. 12 months down the road, that same GeForce 3 architecture was reincarnated into the GeForce 4, which, much like the Radeon 9700, absolutely destroyed all competition at the time, with no immediate response from ATi.

The Pentium 4 example is another good one...AMD fans everywhere laughed at the high clockspeed, low IPC approach. I don't hear much laughter anymore....

At any rate, what I'm trying to say is that the GeForce FX may only be the beginning of a graphics card line that holds far more potential than is currently forseeable by any of us (unless you're an nVIDIA hardware engineer). Oh, and GTaudiophile, after all of the imtim83 bashing that you participated in, you are turning into his ATi equivalent...