POLL: Public breastfeeding? I say no.

[MrPickins]

Here is Stephen Colbert's take on this topic:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UtjTt8RriTA

Go to 2:35 or so in the video. :laugh:

 

[engineereeyore]

What I don't understand is this. 99% of the time, I can see more of a woman's breast by her walking around in a halter-top than I can by her breastfeeding. Why aren't you complaining about that?

Sure, there are women who are doing it for attention also. So by criticizing them, all you're doing is paying attention to them and encouraging them to do it even more.

Plus, there's the main fact to consider. You're the one who has the problem with it, not them. It's not their fault you view the breast as a sexual object and can't get around the fact that it has a very important purpose other than just giving you something to squeeze during sex. Those are your issues, not theirs. Rather than harp on them, why don't you look at yourself for a change. If you think their is something sexually arrousing about watching a baby breastfeed, you have some serious issues.

I mean seriously. I have seen more from science books or from walking through the women's section at Wal-Mart. Leave the women alone and let them feed their children. It's not their fault you can keep you eyes to yourself.

 

[MrPickins]

I know I said I was done, but I really wanted to add this.

Ckent, you easily dismiss the ATOT poll, and claim that most people feel your way.
Can you dismiss these polls? The one from Dr Phil is very large.

http://www.drphil.com/shows/show/593/

Do you think it's OK to breast-feed in public?
63% 34442
It's OK with me, anywhere, anytime.

32% 18133
I don't mind as long as mother's breast and feeding child are covered.

5% 2808
It should be allowed -- but only in a restroom or private area.

0% 425
Breast-feeding should be done only in the home.

Total:
55808

http://urbanlegends.about.com/library/blpoll-breastfeeding.htm

Is there anything wrong with breast-feeding in public?

Yes, it shouldn't be allowed. (3932)
31%

No, it's perfectly natural. (8292)
67%

I can't decide. (148)
1%

Total Votes: 12372

http://www.aroundrr.com/Poll/ArchiveResults.asp?QID=1144

Is breast feeding in public appropriate? Read CNN article
(63.3%)Yes

(32.2%) No

(4.5%) Unsure

Total Votes: 668

http://fpb.case.edu/NewStudents/archives.shtm

5.3% (N=2) I don't believe public breastfeeding is necessary. Mothers should use bottles to feed their infants when they are in public areas.


55.3% (N=21) I don't really mind it when a woman is breastfeeding in public, but she should make sure she does so as discreetly as possible.


39.5% (N=15): Breastfeeding is every mother's right and obligation. Feeding her baby in public should never be considered shameful or embarrassing, whether she is discreet about it or not.

Clearly you are wrong about which side public opinion is on.

 

[CKent]

You're linking a college entry poll and a poll answered by dr. phil viewers. Don't you think that's just a tad biased? The store owner in question rightly asked the woman to leave, and I think most would. Further, it's illegal under public decency/nudity laws. Find a private area, it isn't difficult.

Originally posted by: engineereeyore
What I don't understand is this. 99% of the time, I can see more of a woman's breast by her walking around in a halter-top than I can by her breastfeeding. Why aren't you complaining about that?

Sure, there are women who are doing it for attention also. So by criticizing them, all you're doing is paying attention to them and encouraging them to do it even more.

Plus, there's the main fact to consider. You're the one who has the problem with it, not them. It's not their fault you view the breast as a sexual object and can't get around the fact that it has a very important purpose other than just giving you something to squeeze during sex. Those are your issues, not theirs. Rather than harp on them, why don't you look at yourself for a change. If you think their is something sexually arrousing about watching a baby breastfeed, you have some serious issues.

I mean seriously. I have seen more from science books or from walking through the women's section at Wal-Mart. Leave the women alone and let them feed their children. It's not their fault you can keep you eyes to yourself.

Hint: don't post if you didn't read a thread. With the really long ones, assume your seat of the pants wisdom about the issue has been gone over a hundred times (it has) from both sides of the fence. You don't have to read the thread, just don't post.

 

[djheater]

Originally posted by: MrPickins

Clearly you are wrong about which side public opinion is on.

Hey good info, though obviously the polls are not true statistics. I would say that the society has come to favor public breastfeeding, unfortunately there is a disconnect between this encouragement and the perceived sexuality of the breast in our culture.

I think that the dissonance created by these conflicting perceptions causes some of the negative views of breastfeeding displayed in this thread.

 

[MrPickins]

Originally posted by: djheater

Originally posted by: MrPickins

Clearly you are wrong about which side public opinion is on.

Hey good info, though obviously the polls are not true statistics. I would say that the society has come to favor public breastfeeding, unfortunately there is a disconnect between this encouragement and the perceived sexuality of the breast in our culture.

I think that the dissonance created by these conflicting perceptions causes some of the negative views of breastfeeding displayed in this thread.

While I agree that these aren't quality statistical polls, it is obvious to me that every poll I have come across is in favor of discrete public breastfeeding. Every one.

I just wanted to point this out to Ckent, who began the claims of "societal norm" with absolutely no evidence that most people believe as he does.

I also completely agree with your assessment on breast's sexual vs nutritional roles.

Originally posted by: CKent
You're linking a college entry poll and a poll answered by dr. phil viewers. Don't you think that's just a tad biased? The store owner in question rightly asked the woman to leave, and I think most would. Further, it's illegal under public decency/nudity laws. Find a private area, it isn't difficult.

If you don't like the resources I have found, provide your own that back your opinion. Until then, I feel my point stands.

I also believe the store owner was well within their rights to tell the woman to leave. I wouldn't, due to bad publicity, but it was the owner's desicion.

Show me one law prohibiting breastfeeding, or one case where it has been prosecuted under decency laws. Most women do not want people to see their breasts, and thus will do it discretely. Why do you choose to ignore this and focus on extremes?

Again you bring up difficulty. The least difficult thing for everyone in this situation is for you to ignore it. It should be a non-issue.

 

[cKGunslinger]

Originally posted by: engineereeyore
What I don't understand is this. 99% of the time, I can see more of a woman's breast by her walking around in a halter-top than I can by her breastfeeding. Why aren't you complaining about that?

Seriously, has anyone from the "ZOMG! Breastfeeding is like a public blumpkin!" camp addressed this issue yet? I see a lot more breast area (a good portion of it undesireable) from women's day-to-day shopping/dining wardrobe than I ever have from a woman breastfeeding in public.

 

[SilthDraeth]

I say yes.

Read the public restroom thread. But basically you can't obviously believe it is right to force a woman with a baby to stay at home. You can't obviously believe that bottle feeding, through formula, or pumped breast milk is the best option.

Breast feeding is natural. You, the OP, and whoever else are prudes. That is all there is to it.

Chances are the woman feeding her kid, doesn't want some googley eye teenager with a hard-on looking at her feeding her kid.

And if you are an older man, the same applies to you. If the baby is hungry feed it. They have more immediate needs than a 1 year old and up. Otherwise, if you want to ban public breast feeding, then you better damned well be ready to pay the taxes, and campaign, for making it mandatory for every store that has a public restroom, to include a section for women to breast feed.

See how well that will go over. I could bet you $100 that a store would rather allow a woman to breast feed in it, than have a law signed in, that banns the act, and forces them to spend a ton of money to compensate, by building private breast feeding booths. Not to mention the amount of bad press it would generate.

 

[CKent]

Originally posted by: MrPickins
If you don't like the resources I have found, provide your own that back your opinion.

There's no need, only those favoring change need to craft a compelling argument for said change. With reasoning like "you're an idiot", "you're a pig", "you need 2 gro up liek look @ urope they r so kewl" and "z0mg b00b13z!!1111", it's no wonder it still mostly isn't allowed in our society. But keep trying!

 

[topslop1]

I love breast feeding in public. I'm the kid that stops and gets a long gaze before I keep walking.

 

[halik]

Originally posted by: Hyperblaze
So who has something against one of the most natural acts of nature?

Next thing I know, you'll be saying to let the poor baby starve to death because YOU find breasts offensive.

PS: are you gay?

Unless you wouldn't mind to watch me take a dump (again a "natural act of nature"), your argument is void.

 

[DivideBYZero]

Originally posted by: Babbles

Originally posted by: MrCodeDude

Originally posted by: djheater
Some people will make a nuisance of themselves regardless of whether they're writing a check at the grocery or nursing in public.
I favor discreet nursing becasue it's polite, that being said there are a lot of impolite fvckers out there and they have the same rights I do.

And some people brought liquids on planes with the intent to blow them up.

If everyone in America was considerate and polite, we wouldn't need laws. You're right, it's the inconsiderate ones that paint a bad picture for everyone. But it's easier to ban public breastfeeding than it is to ban idiots from breastfeeding.

Nice, went from comparing breast feeding with public sex up to comparing breast feeding with terrorism.

Tits on a plane?

 

[engineereeyore]

Originally posted by: CKent

Hint: don't post if you didn't read a thread. With the really long ones, assume your seat of the pants wisdom about the issue has been gone over a hundred times (it has) from both sides of the fence. You don't have to read the thread, just don't post.

Hint: I have read the thread, and I'm still waiting for you to come up with a good argument.

Edit: By the way, you still haven't answered the question of why "they" need to find a "private place" because you can't control your eyes.

 

[MrPickins]

Originally posted by: CKent

Originally posted by: MrPickins
If you don't like the resources I have found, provide your own that back your opinion.

There's no need, only those favoring change need to craft a compelling argument for said change. With solid reasoning like "you're an idiot", "you're a pig" and "you need 2 gro up liek look @ urope they r so kewl", it's no wonder it still mostly isn't allowed in our society. But keep trying!

What change are you talking about? Women have been breastfeeding in public since the dawn of mankind. You are the one making claims, not I. Claims you have failed to prove.

Do not attribute any of those insults to me. I have been completely civil to you this entire discussion, but I'm getting tired of this. You claim to be a proponent of logic and reason, yet your position is based soley on how something makes you feel. You dismiss any evidence or reasonable questions asked, and instead focus on your belief that most people feel the way you do.

I am beginning to believe that you were being honest when you said "At this point the thread is pure entertainment." Are you trolling, or would you like a reasonable discussion?

 

[DivideBYZero]

Originally posted by: halik

Originally posted by: Hyperblaze
So who has something against one of the most natural acts of nature?

Next thing I know, you'll be saying to let the poor baby starve to death because YOU find breasts offensive.

PS: are you gay?

Unless you wouldn't mind to watch me take a dump (again a "natural act of nature"), your argument is void.

Feeding a child = taking a crap?

Grow up.

 

[FelixDeCat]

Originally posted by: DaShen

Originally posted by: djheater
I've been trying to think of a way to express this in a manner that would be engaing and inoffensive, but I don't think it's possible to do so.
Your position implies a lot of hangups about bodily functions which most of the world doesn't share and you're unwilling to be objective about it.
Breastfeeding is not an activity which should be concealed or privatized, there is no breach of privacy occuring on either end of the experience, yours or the mother's.

Good luck with that.

Question: djheater, Would you be comfortable watching your mom or your sister breast feed? I wouldn't, but that is just me.

The tard probably wouldnt, because its not a sexual thing. But I sure wouldnt stare, thats for sure.

 

[CKent]

Originally posted by: MrPickins

Originally posted by: CKent

Originally posted by: MrPickins
If you don't like the resources I have found, provide your own that back your opinion.

There's no need, only those favoring change need to craft a compelling argument for said change. With solid reasoning like "you're an idiot", "you're a pig" and "you need 2 gro up liek look @ urope they r so kewl", it's no wonder it still mostly isn't allowed in our society. But keep trying!

What change are you talking about? Women have been breastfeeding in public since the dawn of mankind. You are the one making claims, not I. Claims you have failed to prove.

Do not attribute any of those insults to me. I have been completely civil to you this entire discussion, but I'm getting tired of this. You claim to be a proponent of logic and reason, yet your position is based soley on how something makes you feel. You dismiss any evidence or reasonable questions asked, and instead focus on your belief that most people feel the way you do.

I am beginning to believe that you were being honest when you said "At this point the thread is pure entertainment." Are you trolling, or would you like a reasonable discussion?

Laws against public indecency are there in most locales. In some areas, and depending on the mood and temperment of any police coming across it, they may not be enforced. I don't "feel" these laws exist, they do. It's fact.

It is always entertaining to watch people get flustered and start calling names when someone disagrees with them. I'm not talking about you specifically, as you said you've been one of the few able to exercise some restraint. But there's no better way to make the other side's argument than acting like a child. People in this thread have made it easy on me

ps. Go through the thread and look at just how many "zomg boobz!!1" posts there are. Assume each of those posters voted yes and subtract their estimated number from the 'yes' answer.

 

[MrPickins]

Originally posted by: CKent

Laws against public indecency are there in most locales. In some areas, and depending on the mood and temperment of any police coming across it, they may not be enforced. I don't "feel" these laws exist, they do. It's fact.

It is always entertaining to watch people get flustered and start calling names when someone disagrees with them. I'm not talking about you specifically, as you said you've been one of the few able to exercise some restraint. But there's no better way to make the other side's argument than acting like a child. People in this thread have made it easy on me

ps. Go through the thread and look at just how many "zomg boobz!!1" posts there are. Assume each of those posters voted yes and subtract their estimated number from the 'yes' answer.

Quit sidestepping the issue. I asked you several posts ago:

Show me one law prohibiting breastfeeding, or one case where it has been prosecuted under decency laws.

Nobody is claiming that there are no decency laws. I ask you to show me one time breastfeeding has been labeled in court to be indecent. You chose to ignore any reasonable question still.

Again, you are showing neither reason nor logic.

 

[CKent]

I thought it was pretty obvious, but I'll spell it out for you. If finding a private area is far too difficult, it stands to reason that being properly discrete is. More than a few people in this thread have borne witness to that. Show too much skin or a nip and it's public indecency. Got any other questions? A burning curiosity as to which religion the Pope follows? Perhaps an insatiable desire to know what color grass is? :laugh:

 

[MrPickins]

Originally posted by: CKent
I thought it was pretty obvious, but I'll spell it out for you. If finding a private area is far too difficult, it stands to reason that being properly discrete is. More than a few people in this thread have borne witness to that. Show too much skin or a nip and it's public indecency. Got any other questions? A burning curiosity as to which religion the Pope follows? Perhaps an insatiable desire to know what color grass is? :laugh:

We agree that women should be discreet, but you ignore the fact tham the vast majority of women are discreet when they breastfeed. You ignore this question which has been asked of you by a lot of people, including me:

Originally posted by: engineereeyore
By the way, you still haven't answered the question of why "they" need to find a "private place" because you can't control your eyes.

How about answereing how your comfort is more important than the mother's and child's?
Last time you called it "parental entitlement." I call it equality. You are no more entitled than they are. To say otherwise is selfish and egotistical.

What my seem obvious to you seems like only a matter of opinion to me. But, in the court's decision, and they are the ones who decide what is indecent, public breastfeeding is acceptable. Every poll I have found shows the majority of society finds it acceptable. You are in the minority, whether you believe it or not.

In the end, though, it doesn't matter, because either you are a troll, or you are so set in your belief system that you refuse to even answer questions that might upset it. In both cases, I'm just wasting my time.

Good day.

 

[CKent]

Originally posted by: MrPickins

Originally posted by: CKent
I thought it was pretty obvious, but I'll spell it out for you. If finding a private area is far too difficult, it stands to reason that being properly discrete is. More than a few people in this thread have borne witness to that. Show too much skin or a nip and it's public indecency. Got any other questions? A burning curiosity as to which religion the Pope follows? Perhaps an insatiable desire to know what color grass is? :laugh:

We agree that women should be discreet, but you ignore the fact tham the vast majority of women are discreet when they breastfeed. You ignore this question which has been asked of you by a lot of people, including me:

Originally posted by: engineereeyore
By the way, you still haven't answered the question of why "they" need to find a "private place" because you can't control your eyes.

How about answereing how your comfort is more important than the mother's and child's?
Last time you called it "parental entitlement." I call it equality. You are no more entitled than they are. To say otherwise is selfish and egotistical.

What my seem obvious to you seems like only a matter of opinion to me. But, in the court's decision, and they are the ones who decide what is indecent, public breastfeeding is acceptable. Every poll I have found shows the majority of society finds it acceptable. You are in the minority, whether you believe it or not.

In the end, though, it doesn't matter, because either you are a troll, or you are so set in your belief system that you refuse to even answer questions that might upset it. In both cases, I'm just wasting my time.

Good day.

The key difference is that my own comfort doesn't break social norms and potentially laws. Where did you come up with "most women are discreet about it"? Did you know that 73.8935% of statistics are made up on the spot? Why should having a kid exempt people from their obligations to society?

And out it comes, I must be a troll since I'm not just like you. How could anyone disagree with You? You are God. You are infallible and perfect. Everyone else is wrong, and you'll prove it by calling them names! It would be funny if you were 12 years old, but as other posters have proven there are adults this stupid, and that's just depressing.

Ps. I've answered your questions and your polls show nothing other than that horny teens and oprah fans support it. That's hardly unbiased and objective. That you continue to hold them up like a cross when they've been shot down proves you haven't given the issue much thought.

 

[MrPickins]

Originally posted by: CKent

The key difference is that my own comfort doesn't break social norms and potentially laws. Where did you come up with "most women are discreet about it"? Did you knwo that 73.8935% of statistics are made up on the spot? Why should having a kid exempt people from their obligations to society?

Ignore, ignore, ignore....

Did I quote statistics to you? My evidence is personal experience. "I thought it was pretty obvious, but I'll spell it out for you." Normal women do not swing their boobs around in public, breastfeeding or not. Otherwise it would be an issue in the courts. Obviously it is not. How often do you personally encounter this type of thing yourself? (nevermind, you won't answer any of this)

Again, give some proof of this "social norm," or quit using it as a point of debate. Just because it offends you does not make it against the norm, or against the law.

Your feelings do not dictate societal responsibility.

 

[MrPickins]

Originally posted by: CKent

And out it comes, I must be a troll since I'm not just like you. How could anyone disagree with You? You are God. You are infallible and perfect. Everyone else is wrong, and you'll prove it by calling them names! It would be funny if you were 12 years old, but as other posters have proven there are adults this stupid, and that's just depressing.

Ps. I've answered your questions and your polls show nothing other than that horny teens and oprah fans support it. That's hardly unbiased and objective. That you continue to hold them up like a cross when they've been shot down proves you haven't given the issue much thought.

No, you are a troll for failing to respond to anything constructive in my posts, and instead use the same unfounded logic over and over. I never said you had to agree with me, in fact it doesn't really matter to me if you do or not. I'll never meet you IRL.

What I would like, though is for you to answer my questions just as I have answered yours. You bash my evidence, yet you present none of your own. You are closedminded, and hypocritical. You do not care about an open discussion.

FWIW, I said you were either a troll or entrenched in a belief system, you decided troll fit better, not me.

Originally posted by: CKent
It is always entertaining to watch people get flustered and start calling names when someone disagrees with them.

Now who's flustered?

 

[CKent]

Originally posted by: MrPickins

Originally posted by: CKent

And out it comes, I must be a troll since I'm not just like you. How could anyone disagree with You? You are God. You are infallible and perfect. Everyone else is wrong, and you'll prove it by calling them names! It would be funny if you were 12 years old, but as other posters have proven there are adults this stupid, and that's just depressing.

Ps. I've answered your questions and your polls show nothing other than that horny teens and oprah fans support it. That's hardly unbiased and objective. That you continue to hold them up like a cross when they've been shot down proves you haven't given the issue much thought.

No, you are a troll for failing to respond to anything constructive in my posts, and instead use the same unfounded logic over and over. I never said you had to agree with me, in fact it doesn't really matter to me if you do or not. I'll never meet you IRL.

What I would like, though is for you to answer my questions just as I have answered yours. You bash my evidence, yet you present none of your own. You are closedminded, and hypocritical. You do not care about an open discussion.

FWIW, I said you were either a troll or entrenched in a belief system, you decided troll fit better, not me.

Originally posted by: CKent
It is always entertaining to watch people get flustered and start calling names when someone disagrees with them.

Now who's flustered?

I figure if you don't understand the language of civil debate, you'll probably at least understand the language you've already spoken - that of unsupervised children given the gift of internet anonymity; namecalling. Since you can't speak my language, I'm speaking yours in a last ditch attempt to get some understanding going. But being a troll, you don't want that. You want to continue hating anyone wrong enough to disagree with You and calling them names. I've got something to do and it's likely your bedtime soon, so we're done, and good night.

 

[Eos]

Originally posted by: CKent
You're linking a college entry poll and a poll answered by dr. phil viewers. Don't you think that's just a tad biased? The store owner in question rightly asked the woman to leave, and I think most would. Further, it's illegal under public decency/nudity laws. Find a private area, it isn't difficult.

Not everywhere. I posted earlier of just such a city where female topless nudity is not illegal.