POLL: Public breastfeeding? I say no.

[MrPickins]

Originally posted by: CKent

Originally posted by: MrPickins

Originally posted by: CKent

And out it comes, I must be a troll since I'm not just like you. How could anyone disagree with You? You are God. You are infallible and perfect. Everyone else is wrong, and you'll prove it by calling them names! It would be funny if you were 12 years old, but as other posters have proven there are adults this stupid, and that's just depressing.

Ps. I've answered your questions and your polls show nothing other than that horny teens and oprah fans support it. That's hardly unbiased and objective. That you continue to hold them up like a cross when they've been shot down proves you haven't given the issue much thought.

No, you are a troll for failing to respond to anything constructive in my posts, and instead use the same unfounded logic over and over. I never said you had to agree with me, in fact it doesn't really matter to me if you do or not. I'll never meet you IRL.

What I would like, though is for you to answer my questions just as I have answered yours. You bash my evidence, yet you present none of your own. You are closedminded, and hypocritical. You do not care about an open discussion.

FWIW, I said you were either a troll or entrenched in a belief system, you decided troll fit better, not me.

Originally posted by: CKent
It is always entertaining to watch people get flustered and start calling names when someone disagrees with them.

Now who's flustered?

I figure if you don't understand the language of civil debate, you'll probably at least understand the language you've already spoken - that of unsupervised children given the gift of internet anonymity; namecalling. Since you can't speak my language, I'm speaking yours in a last ditch attempt to get some understanding going. But being a troll, you don't want that. You want to continue hating anyone wrong enough to disagree with You and calling them names. I've got something to do and it's likely your bedtime soon, so we're done, and good night.

:laugh:

You've just proven my point. Congratulations!

 

[savvy]

No.

 

[engineereeyore]

Originally posted by: CKent

The key difference is that my own comfort doesn't break social norms and potentially laws. Where did you come up with "most women are discreet about it"? Did you know that 73.8935% of statistics are made up on the spot? Why should having a kid exempt people from their obligations to society?

What social norms?? What obligations??

Whether you agree with the outcome of MrPickins stats is your deal, but at least he's supporting his idea. You're just calling something a social norm when there are no laws that prohibit breastfeeding, there are no restrictions about it that are widespread. You claim it to be the 'norm', yet provide absolutely no evidence to this fact.

Just because it's the norm to you, doesn't mean it the norm to everyone else.

And out it comes, I must be a troll since I'm not just like you. How could anyone disagree with You? You are God. You are infallible and perfect. Everyone else is wrong, and you'll prove it by calling them names! It would be funny if you were 12 years old, but as other posters have proven there are adults this stupid, and that's just depressing.

Ps. I've answered your questions and your polls show nothing other than that horny teens and oprah fans support it. That's hardly unbiased and objective. That you continue to hold them up like a cross when they've been shot down proves you haven't given the issue much thought.

Oh yeah, they're 'horny' teens because they don't agree with you. Didn't you just mock MrPickins for thinking 'how could anyone disagree with you'? Maybe you should think about that for a while.

By the way, the only person shooting them down is you, and you don't seem to have very good aim.

 

[FoBoT]

:camera:'s?

 

[Bryophyte]

Breastfeeding is specifically legal to do in public places in most states. Here is a site that lists each state and what the laws are: http://www.ncsl.org/programs/health/breast50.htm

 

[MrPickins]

Originally posted by: Bryophyte
Breastfeeding is specifically legal to do in public places in most states. Here is a site that lists each state and what the laws are: http://www.ncsl.org/programs/health/breast50.htm

Excellent info, thanks!

 

[jagec]

Originally posted by: CKent
You're linking a college entry poll and a poll answered by dr. phil viewers. Don't you think that's just a tad biased?

Which is a LOT more than you have linked. Everyone likes to think that society agrees with them, even after they're proven wrong

 

[Bryophyte]

Originally posted by: MrPickins

Originally posted by: Bryophyte
Breastfeeding is specifically legal to do in public places in most states. Here is a site that lists each state and what the laws are: http://www.ncsl.org/programs/health/breast50.htm

Excellent info, thanks!

I just want to add to this that these laws are written not to make public breastfeeding legal, but to clarify the fact that women have the right to breastfeed anywhere that they are legally allowed to go. Just because there are no laws in a few states specifying that breastfeeding in public is legal, that does not mean that doing so is illegal.

Here is a site (granted, a pro-breastfeeding site) that spells out the legislation even more clearly: http://www.lalecheleague.org/Law/summary.html

Interestingly, CKent's own state (assuming his profile is correct) was the first to enact laws pertaining to public nursing, and has some of the strongest. New York specifically says that it is a civil right, that women have an absolute right to breastfeed in public.

 

[CKent]

Originally posted by: Bryophyte

Originally posted by: MrPickins

Originally posted by: Bryophyte
Breastfeeding is specifically legal to do in public places in most states. Here is a site that lists each state and what the laws are: http://www.ncsl.org/programs/health/breast50.htm

Excellent info, thanks!

I just want to add to this that these laws are written not to make public breastfeeding legal, but to clarify the fact that women have the right to breastfeed anywhere that they are legally allowed to go. Just because there are no laws in a few states specifying that breastfeeding in public is legal, that does not mean that doing so is illegal.

Here is a site (granted, a pro-breastfeeding site) that spells out the legislation even more clearly: http://www.lalecheleague.org/Law/summary.html

Interestingly, CKent's own state (assuming his profile is correct) was the first to enact laws pertaining to public nursing, and has some of the strongest. New York specifically says that it is a civil right, that women have an absolute right to breastfeed in public.

New York is nice, but like anything, it's not perfect. At least the right to breastfeed doesn't override public indecency laws here, according to your first link (it only does in 15 states), so women exercising their right by letting it all hang out here could face legal trouble.

Thanks for the links, I have to concede this to you - I didn't realize it was quite this widely accepted. I was arguing on principle; while I'd rather not see it, it's a good thing I don't feel particularly strongly about it (and have an iron stomach regardless).

 

[imported_michaelpatrick33]

Originally posted by: scott

It's so weird that society accepts constant saturation through TV & movies & rap "music"

of killing, cheating, & other violence,

then objects to a mother nursing a baby,

the most natural, and sweetest, thing in the world.

I sympathize with young mothers breastfeeding infants

at a bus stop or in some park

while suffering stares from idiots who jump reflexively

to prurient thoughts at the sight, even at the mere thought, of a mother's loving breast.

Sweetest most natural thing in the world.

In finding any trace of an objection in that act, society is upside down, off track, wrong.

Egocentric I am for the sun will scour the earth some day
Walk do I beneath it and to it I owe one death
But dear daughters of Eve how dare you show a breast

The breast is my temptation so I shall misconstrue
Dress all up and be uncomfortable for I am better than you
Take years (millions they be) and wrap them around norms of temporal society
Defecation is equal because you are bacteria ridden and spraying your milk at me

I would claim offense at the daughters of Eve who "whip it out" :roll:
The daughters of Eve that do, I say are as egocentric
As the one's who are egocentric against (egocentric X 2 = self centered moral majority pout)


I don't get it? Why does a human breast create an offense for someone especially when they don't see it for the most part? If a woman "whips its out" then she is simply demonstrating egocentric behavior (look at me, look at me, look at me)and as such should be ignored. To penalize the "milk of human kindness" because of the inconsiderate acts of egocentric individuals makes no sense.

How dare I presume to legislate an act between mother and child that has occurred for millenia because of temporal societal norms. Are our eyes somehow being physically damaged by the brief sight of the breast? I have read breast feeding compared/correlated (symbolically and literally) with defecation and urinating in previous posts. I was unaware that breast feeding caused potentially harmful bacteria and diseases to build up/enter an environment. I was unaware of my personal body becoming harmed by the proximity of a breast feeding woman. Last time I checked close proximity to defecation could potentially have physical harmful effects.

Social norms (in America where I live) seem to indicate breast feeding is acceptable with discretion. Sounds like a wise and well adjusted course of social reason to me. I personally voted yes and think of nothing but joy (and hope) at the sight of the most wondrous of human connections taking place.

But I would be the first to defend those who voted "no" because it is in that disagreement can growth occur. When I grow uncomfortable in a discussion (or with new information) then I know new information is about to enter my domain and I must be open minded to it (yes or no).

 

[jagec]

Originally posted by: CKent
Thanks for the links, I have to concede this to you - I didn't realize it was quite this widely accepted. I was arguing on principle; while I'd rather not see it, it's a good thing I don't feel particularly strongly about it (and have an iron stomach regardless).

"iron stomach"?:laugh:

Man, your sig is so cruelly ironic, and you don't even see it.

 

[supastar1568]

suck on some titaaayyys!!!

 

[MrPickins]

Originally posted by: CKent

Originally posted by: Bryophyte

Originally posted by: MrPickins

Originally posted by: Bryophyte
Breastfeeding is specifically legal to do in public places in most states. Here is a site that lists each state and what the laws are: http://www.ncsl.org/programs/health/breast50.htm

Excellent info, thanks!

I just want to add to this that these laws are written not to make public breastfeeding legal, but to clarify the fact that women have the right to breastfeed anywhere that they are legally allowed to go. Just because there are no laws in a few states specifying that breastfeeding in public is legal, that does not mean that doing so is illegal.

Here is a site (granted, a pro-breastfeeding site) that spells out the legislation even more clearly: http://www.lalecheleague.org/Law/summary.html

Interestingly, CKent's own state (assuming his profile is correct) was the first to enact laws pertaining to public nursing, and has some of the strongest. New York specifically says that it is a civil right, that women have an absolute right to breastfeed in public.

New York is nice, but like anything, it's not perfect. At least the right to breastfeed doesn't override public indecency laws here, according to your first link (it only does in 15 states), so women exercising their right by letting it all hang out here could face legal trouble.

Thanks for the links, I have to concede this to you - I didn't realize it was quite this widely accepted. I was arguing on principle; while I'd rather not see it, it's a good thing I don't feel particularly strongly about it (and have an iron stomach regardless).

Again I ask, who lets it all hang out? Are you still thinking about that? That scenario is mostly in your head.

And while it may not override public decency laws, New York still gives mothers the absolute right to breastfeed in public. What happened to your unfounded claims of illegality? Is this why you refused to do any research to back your claims?

Notwithstanding any other provision of law, a mother may breast feed her baby in any location, public or private, where the mother is otherwise authorized to be, irrespective of whether or not the nipple of the mother's breast is covered during or incidental to the breast feeding

Actually, it sounds like they do bypass decency laws, considering breastfeeding women are allowed to show a nipple.

You may have been arguing principal, but you made many blatantly false claims, and ignored any evidence presented against you until the facts became so obvious that nobody could deny it. That is not a sign of an open mind.

 

[djheater]

Originally posted by: MrPickins

Originally posted by: CKent

Originally posted by: Bryophyte

Originally posted by: MrPickins

Originally posted by: Bryophyte
Breastfeeding is specifically legal to do in public places in most states. Here is a site that lists each state and what the laws are: http://www.ncsl.org/programs/health/breast50.htm

Excellent info, thanks!

I just want to add to this that these laws are written not to make public breastfeeding legal, but to clarify the fact that women have the right to breastfeed anywhere that they are legally allowed to go. Just because there are no laws in a few states specifying that breastfeeding in public is legal, that does not mean that doing so is illegal.

Here is a site (granted, a pro-breastfeeding site) that spells out the legislation even more clearly: http://www.lalecheleague.org/Law/summary.html

Interestingly, CKent's own state (assuming his profile is correct) was the first to enact laws pertaining to public nursing, and has some of the strongest. New York specifically says that it is a civil right, that women have an absolute right to breastfeed in public.

New York is nice, but like anything, it's not perfect. At least the right to breastfeed doesn't override public indecency laws here, according to your first link (it only does in 15 states), so women exercising their right by letting it all hang out here could face legal trouble.

Thanks for the links, I have to concede this to you - I didn't realize it was quite this widely accepted. I was arguing on principle; while I'd rather not see it, it's a good thing I don't feel particularly strongly about it (and have an iron stomach regardless).

Again I ask, who lets it all hang out? Are you still thinking about that? That scenario is mostly in your head.

And while it may not override public decency laws, New York still gives mothers the absolute right to breastfeed in public. What happened to your unfounded claims of illegality? Is this why you refused to do any research to back your claims?

Notwithstanding any other provision of law, a mother may breast feed her baby in any location, public or private, where the mother is otherwise authorized to be, irrespective of whether or not the nipple of the mother's breast is covered during or incidental to the breast feeding

Actually, it sounds like they do bypass decency laws, considering breastfeeding women are allowed to show a nipple.

You may have been arguing principal, but you made many blatantly false claims, and ignored any evidence presented against you until the facts became so obvious that nobody could deny it. That is not a sign of an open mind.

It could certainly be considered to be an indication of a coping mechanidm for internal discomfort caused by conflicting views about breastfeeding. Many people who would otherwise agree that it's a good practice (and I don't believe even CKent, for example, has said it is not) feel uncomfortable witnessing it. This discomfort resolves itself through a condemnation of the act rather than an examination of the source of discomfort.

Certainly I'm no psychologist, but I'm very interested in cognitive disonance as a lay-person.

Once again going back to what Dug said, one has to wonder why any reasonable rational person would oppose what is best for a child. Why are people who are offened by breast feeding offended?

 

[CKent]

Originally posted by: djheater
It could certainly be considered to be an indication of a coping mechanidm for internal discomfort caused by conflicting views about breastfeeding. Many people who would otherwise agree that it's a good practice (and I don't believe even CKent, for example, has said it is not) feel uncomfortable witnessing it. This discomfort resolves itself through a condemnation of the act rather than an examination of the source of discomfort.

Certainly I'm no psychologist, but I'm very interested in cognitive disonance as a lay-person.

Once again going back to what Dug said, one has to wonder why any reasonable rational person would oppose what is best for a child. Why are people who are offened by breast feeding offended?

Couldn't let it rest without more insults? :laugh: Diapers are bad for children, they tend to trap moisture, both from perspiration and other sources, causing diaper rash or worse. So parents taking their children out in public shouldn't use them, right? Hey, it's all about Baby. If unsuspecting people get crap all over them that's cool, what's more important, their comfort or Baby's?

Originally posted by: MrPickins
Again I ask, who lets it all hang out? Are you still thinking about that? That scenario is mostly in your head.

Originally posted by: bluemax
Discretion. I worked in a store where the woman plopped herself down in the middle of the floor by the ink cartridges, whipped her shirt up and proceeded to let her 3-to-4-year old nurse while dancing around. I was horrified.
...
Dancing.... I still can't believe it....

You'd think someone embracing hard data so heartily wouldn't say "most" women are discreet and leave it at that even when called on it. But you trolls tend to be hypocrites.

Actually, it sounds like they do bypass decency laws, considering breastfeeding women are allowed to show a nipple.

From the first link:

"Fifteen states exempt breastfeeding from public indecency laws (Alaska, Florida, Illinois, Michigan, Montana, Nevada, New Hampshire, North Carolina, Oklahoma, Rhode Island, South Dakota, Utah, Virginia, Washington and Wisconsin).""

 

[WA261]

I think it is fine if a blanket is used to cover up. But when you see a chick just whip it out...not cool. And it is not becuse it shocks me to see a tit, but I dont need to see some nasty enlarged nipple with a baby attached. The other day we were at Boondocks (a kids play place) and this woman sits down and and starts to feed her baby. No blanket or anything. So many little kids were staring at her...it was just not cool.

 

[djheater]

Originally posted by: CKent

Originally posted by: djheater
It could certainly be considered to be an indication of a coping mechanidm for internal discomfort caused by conflicting views about breastfeeding. Many people who would otherwise agree that it's a good practice (and I don't believe even CKent, for example, has said it is not) feel uncomfortable witnessing it. This discomfort resolves itself through a condemnation of the act rather than an examination of the source of discomfort.

Certainly I'm no psychologist, but I'm very interested in cognitive disonance as a lay-person.

Once again going back to what Dug said, one has to wonder why any reasonable rational person would oppose what is best for a child. Why are people who are offened by breast feeding offended?

Couldn't let it rest without more insults? :laugh: Diapers are bad for children, they tend to trap moisture, both from perspiration and other sources, causing diaper rash or worse. So parents taking their children out in public shouldn't use them, right? Hey, it's all about Baby. If unsuspecting people get crap all over them that's cool, what's more important, their comfort or Baby's?

I and others have asked you to state specifically where I have personally insulted you. I haven't made a mark against you (in fact I initially defended you) yet you continue to insult me. While annoying, I don't think it reinforces your position and I fail to see why you feel the need to, out of all the people attacking your position, focus on me, who has been nothing but polite.
Are you so thin-skinned that you take my curiosity about what I take to be your justifications for unfounded assumptions to be personal insults? You've been cornered in an irrational argument, your only support is your personal point of view, which you certainly are entitled to, however wrong it may be.
A typical response of people in your position is to attempt to change the focus of the argument, but at this point with you it's not even an argument it's just an opportunity for your continued ranting.

 

[FoBoT]

why is this thread so long?

 

[djheater]

Originally posted by: FoBoT
why is this thread so long?

We're on a roll.

 

[WA261]

I think it's funny that no matter what the topic is people will find some way to bitch and moan at one another.

 

[djheater]

Originally posted by: WA261
I think it's funny that no matter what the topic is people will find some way to bitch and moan at one another.

Opinions are like a$$holes, everybody has one, and most of them stink.

 

[CKent]

Originally posted by: djheater
asked you to state specifically where I have personally insulted you

It could certainly be considered to be an indication of a coping mechanidm for internal discomfort caused by conflicting views about breastfeeding. Many people who would otherwise agree that it's a good practice (and I don't believe even CKent, for example, has said it is not) feel uncomfortable witnessing it. This discomfort resolves itself through a condemnation of the act rather than an examination of the source of discomfort.

Certainly I'm no psychologist, but I'm very interested in cognitive disonance as a lay-person.

Once again going back to what Dug said, one has to wonder why any reasonable rational person would oppose what is best for a child. Why are people who are offened by breast feeding offended?

Just one example, I'm tired of this and don't really care enough to hunt down the others. It's a step up from calling me names, but that's the only difference. Again, it doesn't bother me anymore than a kid calling me a "stupidhead". It's just telling that personal attacks are the only argument the pro-feeders have. It's also depressing that people like you are having kids and instilling your hypocrisy, selective memory and sense of entitlement to impose on others into them. I read the news every day and wonder what the world is coming to... then I take note of the fact you have three kids (if I remember), and there are billions of people like you out there.

I've tried logic, but you've ignored it because you could only concede... and you'd never do that. Most notably, and I'm saying this for the 4th time or so, I feel perfectly comfortable with using the restroom, but wouldn't want to do it in public nor see others doing it. Selective memory must be great, someday you're going to have to teach me to ignore anything which I disagree with but can't argue against.

 

[CKent]

Originally posted by: jagec

Originally posted by: CKent
Thanks for the links, I have to concede this to you - I didn't realize it was quite this widely accepted. I was arguing on principle; while I'd rather not see it, it's a good thing I don't feel particularly strongly about it (and have an iron stomach regardless).

"iron stomach"?:laugh:

Man, your sig is so cruelly ironic, and you don't even see it.

It's a song lyric... if you weren't so wet behind the ears as to support this only because you want to see breasts for the first time, you might have even heard it. It's regarded as a classic.

 

[djheater]

Originally posted by: CKent

Originally posted by: djheater
asked you to state specifically where I have personally insulted you

It could certainly be considered to be an indication of a coping mechanidm for internal discomfort caused by conflicting views about breastfeeding. Many people who would otherwise agree that it's a good practice (and I don't believe even CKent, for example, has said it is not) feel uncomfortable witnessing it. This discomfort resolves itself through a condemnation of the act rather than an examination of the source of discomfort.

Certainly I'm no psychologist, but I'm very interested in cognitive disonance as a lay-person.

Once again going back to what Dug said, one has to wonder why any reasonable rational person would oppose what is best for a child. Why are people who are offened by breast feeding offended?

Just one example, I'm tired of this and don't really care enough to hunt down the others. It's a step up from calling me names, but that's the only difference. Again, it doesn't bother me anymore than a kid calling me a "stupidhead". It's just telling that personal attacks are the only argument the pro-feeders have. It's also depressing that people like you are having kids and instilling your hypocrisy, selective memory and sense of entitlement to impose on others into them. I read the news every day and wonder what the world is coming to... then I take note of the fact you have three kids (if I remember), and there are billions of people like you out there.

I've tried logic, but you've ignored it because you could only concede... and you'd never do that. Most notably, and I'm saying this for the 4th time or so, I feel perfectly comfortable with using the restroom, but wouldn't want to do it in public nor see others doing it. Selective memory must be great, someday you're going to have to teach me to ignore anything which I disagree with but can't argue against.

I wouldn't think anyone would consider such a generalized statement as a personal insult. I am applying a general principle principle to people who take your position, which I disagree with, in an attempt to understand the rationale for the position.

I hope I've made myself clear, though it doesn't seem likely.

If you wish, restate your current arguments so we can review them.

BTW, Your current tenor of response attempts to bait me by pulling my kids and parenting into it. That's pretty low IMO.

 

[RadiclDreamer]

Originally posted by: TheNinja

Originally posted by: Bryophyte

Originally posted by: TheNinja
As long as I can get BJs in public, I say yes to breast feeding in public too.

What does feeding an infant have to do with public sexual acts?

They both involve body parts hung out in public getting sucked on.....seems like the same ballpark at least (if not the same ballgame) to me.

You are an idiot.