Poll: Was the Republican attempt to gerrymander blacks in Alabama into 1 district racist?

[HomerJS]

Just a little background. Blacks in Alabama represent 27% of the population. Republicans in their gerrymander attempt would have reduced black representation to 14%

SCOTUS did allow Alabama to use the single district map for the 2022 election which could have prevented Republicans from taking the House. We will know that when the new map is redrawn with 2 black districts.

Supreme Court Protects Voting Rights In Racial Gerrymandering Case

The court sided with plaintiffs who argued that Alabama’s district maps were an unconstitutional racial gerrymander.

news.yahoo.com

Question: Was this an overt display of racism by Republicans in Alabama under the guise of "race neutral" districts?

 

[UNCjigga]

Just for context, even 3/5 compromise would give blacks 16%…not 14%. So technically what the Alabama GOP did is WORSE than the 3/5 compromise.

So yeah, RACIST.

 

[skyking]

not even thinly disguised.

 

[HomerJS]

I'm curious how the black people in Alabama are at least equally responsible for the racism levied against them as some people in this forum love to say.

 

[Pens1566]

Pure, unadulterated, nothing but racism.

 

[cytg111]

Technically it doesnt have to be racist.
Motive. Here is a group of people who votes diametrically in opposition to my aspirations of power, thus I will wall them in and negate their power.
At the very least its anti democratic fascist and corrupt.
I suppose along the lines of executing such a scheme it’s impossible for Racism not to creep, specially with fascisms focal point of scapegoating a minority as leverage.
But the act itself of disenfranchising a minority doesnt have to be racist. Which when you think about it is a good thing, it means that whats going on in Alabama is not just the concern of those who monitors racism but should be the concern of everyone not anti democratic not fascist not corrupt…. and that should encompass everyone else regardless of creed and color.

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

Technically it doesnt have to be racist.
Motive. Here is a group of people who votes diametrically in opposition to my aspirations of power, thus I will wall them in and negate their power.
At the very least its anti democratic fascist and corrupt.
I suppose along the lines of executing such a scheme it’s impossible for Racism not to creep, specially with fascisms focal point of scapegoating a minority as leverage.
But the act itself of disenfranchising a minority doesnt have to be racist. Which when you think about it is a good thing, it means that whats going on in Alabama is not just the concern of those who monitors racism but should be the concern of everyone not anti democratic not fascist not corrupt…. and that should encompass everyone else regardless of creed and color.

Accidentally racist is still racist.

 

[Jaskalas]

So the notion of gerrymandering, is that these voters would have had more elected officials in office before the change?
Would they have actually been a majority while split up into multiple districts, would they have won elections?
Is the result of these changes actually a decrease in Black or Democrat representatives holding office?

It seems to me, there is also a possibility where concentrating people together allows them to vote for and send their representative to office. Where if I were going to gerrymander, I would split them up where each fraction is a minority of their new district. Ensuring no one is actually represented.

It's all rather complicated and messy. And the actual solution is probably proportional representation instead of winner takes all. It may be that our election system / representative Republic itself is flawed beyond repair.

 

[cytg111]

Accidentally racist is still racist.

Isnt it in the intent?

 

[HomerJS]

Isnt it in the intent?

Yes for overt. However in the case of systemic racism even if not directly intended racist outcome is built in. Example treatment of blacks by the medical community. Studies have shown for numerous reasons we get desperate treatment. Criminal justice blacks are assumed guilty even if the facts suggest otherwise.

A black man with a criminal record has an equal chance of landing a job vs a white male felon. These are outcomes baked into the system.

 

[SMOGZINN]

It seems to me, there is also a possibility where concentrating people together allows them to vote for and send their representative to office. Where if I were going to gerrymander, I would split them up where each fraction is a minority of their new district. Ensuring no one is actually represented.

Yes, you can gerrymander either way. You can put all the people that vote X into one district guaranteeing them the one representative, but also guaranteeing your team wins in all the others. Or you can split them up into a lot of districts that you control, but your control will be much less firm on those districts. Both are valid, and serve different purposes.

The thing to remember is that one representative means little if you have rigged it so they can never get a majority, so they often give away one district so as to secure several safe districts that they do not have to spend much campaign time and money on.

 

[Captante]

Yes. Blatant and obvious.

Time to call these trash wannabe Confederates what they are.

 

[dainthomas]

Technically it doesnt have to be racist.
Motive. Here is a group of people who votes diametrically in opposition to my aspirations of power, thus I will wall them in and negate their power.
At the very least its anti democratic fascist and corrupt.
I suppose along the lines of executing such a scheme it’s impossible for Racism not to creep, specially with fascisms focal point of scapegoating a minority as leverage.
But the act itself of disenfranchising a minority doesnt have to be racist. Which when you think about it is a good thing, it means that whats going on in Alabama is not just the concern of those who monitors racism but should be the concern of everyone not anti democratic not fascist not corrupt…. and that should encompass everyone else regardless of creed and color.

"I'm a corrupt, anti-democratic fascist, but I'm not a racist corrupt anti-democratic fascist." Not much of an improvement.

Except they are all those things. Even Boof could see that through his alcohol-induced stupor.

 

[Jaskalas]

Yes, you can gerrymander either way.

That is true, depending on the situation.
Only true solution I can come up with, is we need to dispense with the "winner take all" style of elections for representation in this country. Proportion needs to be given.

 

[Greenman]

Blacks are always politically treated as a single homogenous block. I would assume that diluting that would be a good idea from a republican prospective.

 

[brycejones]

Blacks are always politically treated as a single homogenous block. I would assume that diluting that would be a good idea from a republican prospective.

So republicans being racist is something you think is a good idea?

Or you know the GOP could adopt positions that appeal to those voters.

 

[HomerJS]

So republicans being racist is something you think is a good idea?

Or you know the GOP could adopt positions that appeal to those voters.

How about not associating with white nationalists for a start?

Too much to ask from them, I guess.

 

[dainthomas]

So republicans being racist is something you think is a good idea?

Or you know the GOP could adopt positions that appeal to those voters.

They've repeatedly shown they'll abandon democracy before they abandon their wildly unpopular positions.

 

[Captante]

This forum really can be a amusing place sometimes .... but not for the reasons some folks think.

 

[Paratus]

Yes for overt. However in the case of systemic racism even if not directly intended racist outcome is built in. Example treatment of blacks by the medical community. Studies have shown for numerous reasons we get disparate treatment. Criminal justice blacks are assumed guilty even if the facts suggest otherwise.

A black man without a criminal record has an equal chance of landing a job vs a white male felon. These are outcomes baked into the system.

A few quick changes above for what I think you were going for.

 

[Gardener]

Blacks are always politically treated as a single homogenous block. I would assume that diluting that would be a good idea from a republican prospective.

The general rule is to dilute below a safe threshold, and where they can't feasibly dilute they concentrate the democrats into a handful of districts.

This is why states need non-partisan redistricting commissions. Here's a nice quote from the American Bar Association.

In general, when Democrats control state governments, they create independent redistricting commissions. When Republicans control state governments, they push through Republican gerrymanders. It cannot be that only blue states have independent redistricting processes while red states draw whatever lines they want. All states together must adopt uniform redistricting reforms.

source: redistricting

 

[Greenman]

The general rule is to dilute below a safe threshold, and where they can't feasibly dilute they concentrate the democrats into a handful of districts.

This is why states need non-partisan redistricting commissions. Here's a nice quote from the American Bar Association.

In general, when Democrats control state governments, they create independent redistricting commissions. When Republicans control state governments, they push through Republican gerrymanders. It cannot be that only blue states have independent redistricting processes while red states draw whatever lines they want. All states together must adopt uniform redistricting reforms.

source: redistricting

Non-partisan is the operative term. I don't believe such a thing exists. Politically, non partisan means a compromise that no one is happy with.

 

[SMOGZINN]

Non-partisan is the operative term. I don't believe such a thing exists. Politically, non partisan means a compromise that no one is happy with.

Maybe we should ask ChatGPT to draw district lines for us? Kidding, not-kidding.

 

[A///]

golden rule with republicans is if you must ask the answer is always a resounding yes.

 

[MovingTarget]

Yes. Racist. There is nothing "accidental" about structural racism in Alabama. See our 1901 constitution. Until that is ripped out by the root, these kinds of affects are going to happen. It was the whole point.