Porsche Tycan Turbo Vs Tesla S Plaid

[bigi]

Nice to see folks stacking them against each other now.

View Here

 

[ponyo]

It's not even fair. Plaid is just ridiculous. Tesla is using some alien technology in the Plaid.

Based on the specs, even the updated Model S long range should now beat Taycan Turbo. That's $85k car that's faster and has lot longer range than Taycan Turbo which costs more than 2x. I am so impressed with the new Model S. I don't even need the Plaid. Long Range Model S is plenty for me and better car than pretty much anything out there. Tesla engineering is insane.

 

[maluckey1]

1/4 mile aside, it's really good that Teslas are being road raced. The more they're raced, the better the cars will get, and the more aftermarket support will come. I'd not be surprised in a couple of years to see race series where Teslas are winning overall points

That's a win/win for everyone!

 

[repoman0]

1/4 mile aside, it's really good that Teslas are being road raced. The more they're raced, the better the cars will get, and the more aftermarket support will come. I'd not be surprised in a couple of years to see race series where Teslas are winning overall points

That's a win/win for everyone!

Heh, I wish people actually raced them. Out of god knows how many track and autocross days I’ve attended over the last few years, I’ve never seen a Tesla in attendance, and they’re pretty plentiful around here. I have seen one Taycan at an Autox. It was hilarious in two ways … first, watching the perfect, smooth and silent initial takeoff compared to everyone else’s loud, rubber burning launches. Second, looking at times for the day and realizing how insanely slow the driver was around the course compared to literally everyone else. Like +30 seconds on a 1:30ish course for a decent driver.

The acceleration specs on a Model S or Taycan are for bragging rights. No one actually cares about drag races and none or very few of the owners use the car to its potential on a closed course, though that goes for pretty much any performance car sold these days. I want people to track them so I can go head to head with my 20 year old dinosaur burner lol, but all I ever see is them putting around at 5 under the speed limit.

 

[maluckey1]

Heh, I wish people actually raced them. Out of god knows how many track and autocross days I’ve attended over the last few years, I’ve never seen a Tesla in attendance, and they’re pretty plentiful around here. I have seen one Taycan at an Autox. It was hilarious in two ways … first, watching the perfect, smooth and silent initial takeoff compared to everyone else’s loud, rubber burning launches. Second, looking at times for the day and realizing how insanely slow the driver was around the course compared to literally everyone else. Like +30 seconds on a 1:30ish course for a decent driver.

The acceleration specs on a Model S or Taycan are for bragging rights. No one actually cares about drag races and none or very few of the owners use the car to its potential on a closed course, though that goes for pretty much any performance car sold these days. I want people to track them so I can go head to head with my 20 year old dinosaur burner lol, but all I ever see is them putting around at 5 under the speed limit.

I totally agree that much of the hype is marketing.

To an extent, the car is selling on "cool" factor, and not necessarily practicality or value (in it's category), and marketing "speed" adds "cool" to the mix. I'm not surprised that Tesla is using it. Marketing hype? Or is it Marketing genius? Either way, it sells.

One of the big issues with Tesla going road racing is that range is dismal (at best) compared to even a supercharged Mustang. Road & Track tested a Model 3 Performance at Lime Rock and found that after 3 laps, the car went into protection mode, and could only manage more or less 45 miles on a full charge. It was designed that way. I'm certain that with time, this will be addressed but right now, it's not a great showing. This is the reason that drag racing and Time Trials are about the only racing that Tesla can currently manage a good showing (short duration and distance).

 

[repoman0]

I totally agree that much of the hype is marketing.

To an extent, the car is selling on "cool" factor, and not necessarily practicality or value (in it's category), and marketing "speed" adds "cool" to the mix. I'm not surprised that Tesla is using it. Marketing hype? Or is it Marketing genius? Either way, it sells.

One of the big issues with Tesla going road racing is that range is dismal (at best) compared to even a supercharged Mustang. Road & Track tested a Model 3 Performance at Lime Rock and found that after 3 laps, the car went into protection mode, and could only manage more or less 45 miles on a full charge. It was designed that way. I'm certain that with time, this will be addressed but right now, it's not a great showing. This is the reason that drag racing and Time Trials are about the only racing that Tesla can currently manage a good showing (short duration and distance).

I wasn’t aware that the range decreases by that much — no wonder I never see them at track events. I thought the 7.4mpg I managed for the day this past Saturday was bad — that’s 118 miles per tank at least though, so one quick trip to fill up towards the middle or back end of a typical event. It’d be a real bummer to sit there charging through half the sessions.

 

[maluckey1]

For now at least, Teslas will be limited time trials and drag-racing. I Wouldn't be surprised to see local event auto-x though, given that there's not enough time to set it into protection mode. The exception would be if there are only a few participants and you are virtually "hot-lapping".

True story! I did a standing-mile event a couple years back, that on day 2, as soon as you picked up your time-slip at the shack, you were staged either first or second for another pass! I got 13 passes, almost back to back before I figured that enough was enough. The car never protested, and even with a leaking exhaust manifold, it handled the torture well. I just had to add an butt-ton of fuel to correct the lean mixture above 3200 RPM.....good times!!

 

[RichieZ]

I totally agree that much of the hype is marketing.

To an extent, the car is selling on "cool" factor, and not necessarily practicality or value (in it's category), and marketing "speed" adds "cool" to the mix. I'm not surprised that Tesla is using it. Marketing hype? Or is it Marketing genius? Either way, it sells.

One of the big issues with Tesla going road racing is that range is dismal (at best) compared to even a supercharged Mustang. Road & Track tested a Model 3 Performance at Lime Rock and found that after 3 laps, the car went into protection mode, and could only manage more or less 45 miles on a full charge. It was designed that way. I'm certain that with time, this will be addressed but right now, it's not a great showing. This is the reason that drag racing and Time Trials are about the only racing that Tesla can currently manage a good showing (short duration and distance).

Back in 2011 I was at Laguna Seca for a track day and there was a session of just EVs (i think?), the Tesla factory was out there (notice the manufactures plates). No protection mode on the roadsters that I could see but probably didn't get great range

 

[maluckey1]

Back in 2011 I was at Laguna Seca for a track day and there was a session of just EVs (i think?), the Tesla factory was out there (notice the manufactures plates). No protection mode on the roadsters that I could see but probably didn't get great range

Never been to Laguna Seca, though I'd like to some day. I don't get out west all that often.

Jeremy Clarkson stated that the Tesla Roadster had poor range during the Top Gear, Tesla episode. He DID like the handling and power.

Knowing how Tesla likes to control marketing and the narrative, and given that it's a factory car, and factory driver, the car pictured above, may not have had any protection mode enabled (great advertising!). Put a "ringer" on the track, and it's good for product visibility. Many(likely most) car manufacturers do it. Major marques also fund underground racing teams and "shadow" racing teams (GM being notorious for it) to drive development and sales. Frankly, I'd be surprised is Tesla WASN'T doing it.

 

[ponyo]

Plaid is whole different ballgame. All the reports I've read is that Plaid doesn't stop pulling and can run nonstop lap after lap until the juice runs out.

 

[maluckey1]

I'm not a believer in marketing. I'll believe it when I see it at the track.

Don't get me wrong, because I like Teslas. I'm just holding out until they can do road racing (not just time trials). When they do, and they're competitive, I'll pony up and buy one, because at that time there would be no reason to by a petrol powered car.

 

[RichieZ]

Never been to Laguna Seca, though I'd like to some day. I don't get out west all that often.

Jeremy Clarkson stated that the Tesla Roadster had poor range during the Top Gear, Tesla episode. He DID like the handling and power.

Knowing how Tesla likes to control marketing and the narrative, and given that it's a factory car, and factory driver, the car pictured above, may not have had any protection mode enabled (great advertising!). Put a "ringer" on the track, and it's good for product visibility. Many(likely most) car manufacturers do it. Major marques also fund underground racing teams and "shadow" racing teams (GM being notorious for it) to drive development and sales. Frankly, I'd be surprised is Tesla WASN'T doing it.

LOL I am a huge top gear fan but everything is dramatized on that show. Tesla gets telemetry from their cars and they know it didn't go under 20% state of charge.

Tesla sues Top Gear over 'faked' electric car race

Car-maker to sue BBC for libel and malicious falsehood as faked race continues to be shown uncorrected on repeats and DVD

www.theguardian.com

Back to the topic at hand though, I own and track a 911 and don't think I'd buy either a Taycan or a Model S plaid. EVs aren't there yet, mainly too heavy.

Feedback from actual owners here:

https://rennlist.com/forums/taycan/1256869-is-taycan-still-fun-as-a-weekend-car.html

 

[maluckey1]

Nice! The 911 is a perennial favorite of mine for track cars . It'll be quite awhile before you'll need look elsewhere for fun. I'm still looking to build an early 1980's 911 if I ever get the time. I always liked the body style and the simplicity of those.

Regardless of Jeremy's shenanigans, the lawsuit was thrown out, and the appeal was also dismissed. The first judge stated "as any reasonable motorist knows, a manufacturer's statement about the range of a motor vehicle is always qualified by a statement as to the driving conditions under which that range may be expected." It makes sense that a family sedan isn't intended or track use. Also makes sense that the EPA range tests for EV don't include track time as part of the certification.

 

[manly]

Ars' Jonathan Gitlin wrote the Taycan 4S is his favorite BEV, but he'll have to win the lottery to buy one.

The Porsche Taycan 4S: Better than a 911? Believe it

The Taycan 4S is the sweet spot for Porsche's electric four-door sports car.

arstechnica.com