Possible coup in Turkey

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Oric

Senior member
Oct 11, 1999
888
61
91
Trolled means "I am trolled". Only a defeated soul would interpret this as a means to continue personal attacks.

My original post was a question "Is this valid". you certainly don't read the posts.
 

Jaskalas

Lifer
Jun 23, 2004
33,576
7,637
136
Is this news about Trump correct ?

http://awdnews.com/political/trump-cia-officers-helped-turkey-coup-attempt,-evidence-available

You were asking me evidence. Now ask him !

There is nothing in the past week with the words Turkey, or Coup from his twitter feed.
Why was there no display or link to the tweet? Because it does not exist.

Here is an interview last month where Trump praised Turkey's quick resolution to the coup and cautioned us against lecturing Turkey on the actions that followed. No mention of the subject you raised.
 

brycejones

Lifer
Oct 18, 2005
26,689
25,000
136
Trolled means "I am trolled". Only a defeated soul would interpret this as a means to continue personal attacks.

My original post was a question "Is this valid". you certainly don't read the posts.

Dude you've been trolled so hard.
 

werepossum

Elite Member
Jul 10, 2006
29,873
463
126
Trolled means "I am trolled". Only a defeated soul would interpret this as a means to continue personal attacks.

My original post was a question "Is this valid". you certainly don't read the posts.
Recognizing crazy is not a personal attack, it's just recognizing reality.

Unless zombies have gotten a lot more attractive, anyway.
 

werepossum

Elite Member
Jul 10, 2006
29,873
463
126
I wonder at this point if anyone still believes there was an attempted coup. Just another Islamic asshole setting up himself as a dictator, at his people's expense.
 

Oric

Senior member
Oct 11, 1999
888
61
91

This guy is a well known Gülenist.

He was educated (brain washed) in Gulen schools in Azerbaijan.
He was deported from Turkey in 2014, long before all these ...

I wonder at this point if anyone still believes there was an attempted coup. Just another Islamic asshole setting up himself as a dictator, at his people's expense.

If you are referring to the above messages. It is the outcry of the Assholes Organizations of an Epic Degree.

We are talking about people who really believe that Gulen is the Messiah. At least Erdogan supporters don't claim of his.
 
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bshole

Diamond Member
Mar 12, 2013
8,315
1,215
126
Turkey filed the required documentation regarding Gulen. I hope this information is shared with the American people.

Turkey has asked Washington to arrest a US-based religious leader and businessman for allegedly masterminding a failed attempt to overthrow the government, according to state media.

The Turkish justice ministry formally demanded that US authorities arrest Fethullah Gulen on charges of "ordering and commanding the attempted coup", the state-run Anadolu news agency reported on Tuesday.

President Recep Tayyip Erdogan and other top Turkish officials have repeatedly appealed to the US government to extradite Gulen, sending them documents which allegedly show evidence of his involvement in the failed coup attempt on July 15.

A delegation of US officials visited Ankara late last month to hold talks over Turkey's request for Gulen's extradition.

The development marked the first concrete and public sign of progress in Turkey's efforts to get him returned to the country.

When US Vice President Joe Biden visited Ankara several weeks later, he said he understood the "intense feeling" in Turkey over Gulen.

The US has "no interest whatsoever in protecting anyone who has done harm to an ally. None," he said.

"But we need to meet the legal standard requirement under our law," he added.

'Parallel state'
Turkey says that supporters of Gulen within the army carried out the failed coup attempt, claiming that they had been running "a parallel state" within the civilian and military bureaucracy that followed the US-based cleric's orders. Gulen denies the claims.

The US has previously asked the Turkish government for evidence of Gulen's involvement, saying that the extradition process must be allowed to take its course.

In a statement to Al Jazeera in late August, Yasin Aktay, the deputy chairman of the ruling Justice and Development Party, said that Washington's reluctance to return Gulen to Turkey, or arrest him, was unacceptable.

"It is bizarre for us that they [the US] have not been convinced, considering the scope of evidence we presented to them," Aktay said.

"The testimony of the suspects who were arrested red-handed and documents we gave them are clear. If you add the statements of Gulen regarding the goal of his organisational movement, we believe there is nothing to question. Strong American intelligence should be well aware of who he really is."

Gulen has had court cases pending against him for several years and Turkey has been demanding his extradition well before the failed coup attempt.

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2016/...-gulen-ordering-coup-bid-160913141519446.html
 

bshole

Diamond Member
Mar 12, 2013
8,315
1,215
126
And you believe Erdogan because?

I never said or implied that. I would like to see the evidence that Turkey submitted shared with the American people so that we can know if it is legit or not. Just because Erdogan says Gulen was involved does not mean that Gulen was not involved.
 

justoh

Diamond Member
Jun 11, 2013
3,686
81
91
Just because Erdogan says Gulen was involved does not mean that Gulen was not involved.

It's probably more the point that it was organized by Erdogan himself. This seems to suggest non Gulen involvement.
 

Oric

Senior member
Oct 11, 1999
888
61
91
It's probably more the point that it was organized by Erdogan himself. This seems to suggest non Gulen involvement.

This must be a real eye opener to spot how non-acurate information you are being fed by your "trusted" media.

It is like there is a car accident, a drunk driver hits a child on a bicycle, all of us bystanders see the accident with our eyes. We know the man has a history with alcohol, the police tests him later with a breathalyzer and he checks positive. You read the accident in the paper as "Cyclist hits a sober man in the curb". Poor man, shame on you child !
 

bshole

Diamond Member
Mar 12, 2013
8,315
1,215
126
This must be a real eye opener to spot how non-acurate information you are being fed by your "trusted" media.

It is like there is a car accident, a drunk driver hits a child on a bicycle, all of us bystanders see the accident with our eyes. We know the man has a history with alcohol, the police tests him later with a breathalyzer and he checks positive. You read the accident in the paper as "Cyclist hits a sober man in the curb". Poor man, shame on you child !

Well we will see won't we? If the evidence is indeed compelling, I am confident Gulen will be extradited. I am very curious to see the documentation that was supplied to the American government. At this point, I am 50% convinced that Gulen was directly involved and 50% convinced that he was not.


Gülen and Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdoğan are former political allies, and members of the Gülen movement helped populate the state bureaucracy following the 2002 election victory of the ruling Justice and Development Party, or AKP. For a decade, the AKP and the Gülenists cooperated and, indeed, the movement was an integral part of the burgeoning AKP political, media, academic, and business establishment. The alliance helped both the AKP and the Gülen movement, allowing them to erode the control of traditional military and secular elites in Turkey; there is strong evidence that Gülenists in the police and judiciary collaborated with the AKP government to purge military officers and secular rivals in two massive—and manufactured—cases against supposed coup plotters in 2008 and 2010. But Gülenist prosecutors turned on the AKP in December 2013, opening major corruption cases against senior party leaders and their families. Gülenists are believed to have leaked—or, Erdoğan supporters say, manufactured—tapes implicating Erdoğan and his family in widespread corruption, possibly in a bid to swing upcoming elections. Erdoğan and the AKP decried the corruption cases as a coup attempt and declared open political war with the Gülen movement, seizing businesses and closing media outlets and schools associated with the movement.
 

norseamd

Lifer
Dec 13, 2013
13,990
180
106
This must be a real eye opener to spot how non-acurate information you are being fed by your "trusted" media.

It is like there is a car accident, a drunk driver hits a child on a bicycle, all of us bystanders see the accident with our eyes. We know the man has a history with alcohol, the police tests him later with a breathalyzer and he checks positive. You read the accident in the paper as "Cyclist hits a sober man in the curb". Poor man, shame on you child !

Not once, NOT ONCE, have I seen any mention of any evidence that Turkey is providing. They have only formally filed an extradition request. That will not be accepted on its own. Only evidence that is proof of involvement by Gulen will possibly lead to an extradition.

In the meantime, I suggest you take any fascist fundamentalist bullshit you want to spew, and shove it up your asshole.

Please better attempt to temper your language, even here. This is just an advisory.

Perknose
Forum Director
 
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norseamd

Lifer
Dec 13, 2013
13,990
180
106
Well we will see won't we? If the evidence is indeed compelling, I am confident Gulen will be extradited. I am very curious to see the documentation that was supplied to the American government. At this point, I am 50% convinced that Gulen was directly involved and 50% convinced that he was not.

Even if he had connections to any of those generals, that alone does not mean he had any role in the coup. He is only guilty if he had a direct role in planning the attempted coup.
 

bshole

Diamond Member
Mar 12, 2013
8,315
1,215
126
Even if he had connections to any of those generals, that alone does not mean he had any role in the coup. He is only guilty if he had a direct role in planning the attempted coup.

Aren't Gulen's actions kind of like Lenin's though? I believe Lenis fomented the Russian Revolution while he resided in Germany, safely out of the grasp of the Tsar. I am highly suspicious of Gulen due to his past history in Turkey. I would not be surprised if he was actively involved. Like I said, it would be interesting to see the documentation. If the evidence was overwhelming, Turkey would have released it to the world. That has not happened. For me it is a coin flip. I don't trust the accuser and I don't trust the accused.

There was a coup attempt and Gulenists were involved in it, that is something that I have a high degree of confidence in. The rest is just speculation to me at this point. That being said, if the evidence just provided to the American government shows that Gulen was directly involved, he should and will be extradited.

PS. Turkey spent the last month or so smearing the United States to it's own population. That is reprehensible given that only this week did they make their formal request for extradition backed up with documentation. They used us as a foil for political gain. That is simply indefensible on any level.
 

justoh

Diamond Member
Jun 11, 2013
3,686
81
91
We won't see what was submitted as "evidence," because it would be ridiculed. It could only be ridiculous, since there was never any real coup attempt, and I don't see the US willingly releasing such embarrassing information, as it would worsen relations.
 

werepossum

Elite Member
Jul 10, 2006
29,873
463
126
Aren't Gulen's actions kind of like Lenin's though? I believe Lenis fomented the Russian Revolution while he resided in Germany, safely out of the grasp of the Tsar. I am highly suspicious of Gulen due to his past history in Turkey. I would not be surprised if he was actively involved. Like I said, it would be interesting to see the documentation. If the evidence was overwhelming, Turkey would have released it to the world. That has not happened. For me it is a coin flip. I don't trust the accuser and I don't trust the accused.

There was a coup attempt and Gulenists were involved in it, that is something that I have a high degree of confidence in. The rest is just speculation to me at this point. That being said, if the evidence just provided to the American government shows that Gulen was directly involved, he should and will be extradited.

PS. Turkey spent the last month or so smearing the United States to it's own population. That is reprehensible given that only this week did they make their formal request for extradition backed up with documentation. They used us as a foil for political gain. That is simply indefensible on any level.
At this point I don't believe there was any real coup attempt, just a false flag operation where a lot of junior officers and enlisted are thrown to the dogs to provide an excuse to purge Turkish society of secular and tolerant observant Muslims. Consider this: Erdogan has charged a third of all Turkish military generals and admirals as part of the coup, yet it lasted about three hours and Erdogan was free to fly about the city the whole time. Erdogan is also purging the entirety of Turkish society of secular and tolerant Muslims - literally tens of thousands of them. Can they all be plotters? No way that passes the smell test.

I hope Obama has the balls to get us the hell out of Turkey and cut off relations.
 

norseamd

Lifer
Dec 13, 2013
13,990
180
106
Aren't Gulen's actions kind of like Lenin's though? I believe Lenis fomented the Russian Revolution while he resided in Germany, safely out of the grasp of the Tsar. I am highly suspicious of Gulen due to his past history in Turkey. I would not be surprised if he was actively involved. Like I said, it would be interesting to see the documentation. If the evidence was overwhelming, Turkey would have released it to the world. That has not happened. For me it is a coin flip. I don't trust the accuser and I don't trust the accused.

There was a coup attempt and Gulenists were involved in it, that is something that I have a high degree of confidence in. The rest is just speculation to me at this point. That being said, if the evidence just provided to the American government shows that Gulen was directly involved, he should and will be extradited.

PS. Turkey spent the last month or so smearing the United States to it's own population. That is reprehensible given that only this week did they make their formal request for extradition backed up with documentation. They used us as a foil for political gain. That is simply indefensible on any level.

If he actively created a network for the explicit goal of overthrowing the government, then yes. If he only created a network of friends or political/ideological companions, then no.
 

bshole

Diamond Member
Mar 12, 2013
8,315
1,215
126
At this point I don't believe there was any real coup attempt, just a false flag operation where a lot of junior officers and enlisted are thrown to the dogs to provide an excuse to purge Turkish society of secular and tolerant observant Muslims. Consider this: Erdogan has charged a third of all Turkish military generals and admirals as part of the coup, yet it lasted about three hours and Erdogan was free to fly about the city the whole time. Erdogan is also purging the entirety of Turkish society of secular and tolerant Muslims - literally tens of thousands of them. Can they all be plotters? No way that passes the smell test.

I hope Obama has the balls to get us the hell out of Turkey and cut off relations.

God that can't be true. I simply can't believe in a country of millions that there are only 10's of thousands of secular and tolerant Muslims.
 

werepossum

Elite Member
Jul 10, 2006
29,873
463
126
God that can't be true. I simply can't believe in a country of millions that there are only 10's of thousands of secular and tolerant Muslims.
Oh, I'm sure there are a few million. Erdogan is removing those in government, media, and education - a classic dictatorial purge. As long as they can have no societal influence, they can safely be left to be dealt with later.
 
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